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Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Jul 19 2010, 12:42 PM

Those of you have been following the development of MTP (Mentored Training Program) know that we have been experimenting back and forth with it.

As interest for the program grew - we ended up with a situation where we had to enforce restrictions in order to afford it. That is the reason we introduced the three month cycle and well as assignments/REC requirements. As a result many students were unhappy with the program.

Starting from today we introduce a new program called Private Lessons. With private we basically mean personal lessons - we chose this name because it fits the gap we are trying to fill at GMC, as well as the direction we want it to take.

This program will cost 30 usd per month and is completely separated from the normal GMC subscription. This means that if you want access to GMC videos and Private Lessons you will have to pay two separate fees.

The program will work very similar to the mtp program - however: You will be able to choose your own pace of progress. If you want lots of assignments you will get it - if you want a softer approach that is fine as well. No REC requirement. No three month limit - you can keep getting Private Lessons for an unlimited time. The idea is that you and your instructor find the ideal learning plan which works best for you - and helps you with your own style and direction.

Just as with the mtp program we will do our best to match you up with your desired instructor and/or style. More about the program and sign up http://www.guitarmasterclass.net/private-lessons/.

Those of you who are currently doing MTP will of course be able to finish the three month cycle as planned without any additional fees.

I will do my best to answer your questions and feedback here!

Posted by: maharzan Jul 19 2010, 12:48 PM

Great!

What about the normal GMC fee? remains the same as before? That would kinda suck.

Oh and it looks like I can only sign up for 6 months in advance. Is that so?

Posted by: Praetorian Jul 19 2010, 12:54 PM

Kris,

This sounds awesome! A little confused about how it works though. Will we be assigned existing video lessons to learn like in the MTP? Or will we be assigned tasks that are created just for the student by the instructor?

Ben

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Jul 19 2010, 12:59 PM

The normal GMC fee will unfortunately remain the same ( mtp was never included in there). We have been running mtp as a test feature form the start never letting it affect the GMC fee - since we didn't know if the program was here to stay.


Yes!



It is completely up to you how you want to do it! I suggest you go for what feels most motivating for you.

As soon as you have been assigned an instructor you will have a discussion on how to structure your learning program. You can of course change this later on if you want to try a new approach.

Posted by: superize Jul 19 2010, 01:02 PM

This sounds farely reasanable

Posted by: maharzan Jul 19 2010, 01:06 PM

Okay, I initially signed up because of MTP and thought it was included with the price.

Posted by: Fran Jul 19 2010, 01:08 PM

Wow this is big news!
Sounds great Kris, this opens a bunch of possibilities in 1on1 interaction with our instructors for those wishing to take their practice time and playing to a new level

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Jul 19 2010, 01:13 PM

Yes we did offer mtp for people who signed up for a GMC subscription. However as announced on the open boards we have decided to discontinue mtp (and launch a final mtp round which is currently running).

Posted by: maharzan Jul 19 2010, 01:22 PM

Aren't you guys considering keeping 3 months option? What happens if instructor has to leave in between or has a tour or something? or even students for that fact. Just would be more flexible.

Posted by: ruben_mcn Jul 19 2010, 02:08 PM

Can we just pay for the Private lessons ?? and not pay gmc normal fee ???

Posted by: maharzan Jul 19 2010, 02:12 PM

I would guess yes.. but I am sure you will be referred to lessons at GMC for which you will have to pay.

Posted by: Adrian Figallo Jul 19 2010, 02:13 PM

good stuff going on here!

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Jul 19 2010, 02:16 PM

Yes!



You decide what to do with your instructor, if you don't want to use GMC lesson material you don't have to. (or you could use the free parts of GMC)

Posted by: ruben_mcn Jul 19 2010, 02:20 PM

OK .. that would be preatty cool .. and if an instructor assings somthing from a lesson on GMC can we see them ??( if we are just payn the private lssons fee )

Posted by: NoSkill Jul 19 2010, 02:44 PM

Are the lessons, "Private," or will there be open forum discussions regarding the lessons as with MTP? That is, will there be an area where student and instructor communicate that is just seen by the person paying the fee? Or will it be like MTP, where people can follow along with their assignments and their progress?

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Jul 19 2010, 02:49 PM

In the beginning the lessons will have the same format as the current mtp. However if there is an interest in more "closed" discussions that is something we are open for.

The basic idea is that if this feature works out - we will build a new solution for it so that we no longer need to use the forum. This will make it a lot easier to implement your requests and easier to use for students.

Posted by: maharzan Jul 19 2010, 02:50 PM

What about 3 month option Kris or just even monthly? I saw it not practical mainly because, say I took my first 6 months and then just decided learn few more things in next month or 3 months. So, just asking...

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Jul 19 2010, 02:57 PM

No, you will always need to be a GMC subscriber to view member videos.



We haven't come that far in the planning yet. The reason the payment is set to 6 month is because all payments will be handled manually + your instructor will likely spend most time with you during the first phase (getting to know you personally, your goals, current level and weaknesses).

However if it turns out this feature is here to stay we might very well be able to offer more payment alternatives.

Posted by: maharzan Jul 19 2010, 03:01 PM

Very cool.. Thanks.

Posted by: Marek Rojewski Jul 19 2010, 03:09 PM

I would be really interested which instructors are going to be available (also most probably one instructor will only have few spots open?).

Posted by: purple hayes Jul 19 2010, 03:13 PM

My interest level will go up a lot if the payment plan wasn't set at 6 months up front. That's a lot to invest in something without getting to try it out.

Posted by: Praetorian Jul 19 2010, 03:19 PM

In my opinion, if you are on this site and using any aspect of it (getting advice from instructors on forums, taking part in competitions and possibly winning prizes etc.) then you should be paying a membership fee. Period.

Posted by: Gitarrero Jul 19 2010, 04:10 PM

Hmm, not quite what I was hoping for. The additional fee is just too high for me at this moment, especially if you have to pay for 6 months in advance. I actually liked the mtp and still wonder why seemingly so many students had problems with it.
To be honest, since the "private" lessons will be public in the forum at first I'll follow them silently and will decide later this year if I will also do it.

Posted by: SirJamsalot Jul 19 2010, 04:30 PM

I'm still a little confused. What exactly does the monthly membership get us if we still have to pay to view the video lessons? Or am I reading what you wrote incorrectly?



I visited the link, and there is nothing more to read about the program - only a license agreement link and a form to submit payment.

Thanks,
Christian A.

oh, wait - I see the "and" between vidoes AND private lessons - so the monthly covers being able to view the already recorded lessons - the fee is there only for private lessons. I think it would be better worded by excluding the "videos and" from that sentence. I almost had a heart-attack

If that's the case, I'll remind readers that instructors, at least in U.S.A. generally pay about $30 per half hour for 1 on 1 instruction, so this is still a bargain by any stretch, if you use your 6 month membership wisely.

Posted by: kaznie_NL Jul 19 2010, 04:31 PM

Of course, that's logical, but now we'll have to pay twice!

Kris, IMO this kind of interferes with your views on teaching guitar. You once told me it wasn't about the money, but about the experience of showing other people how to play guitar, but then why make it so expensive!

Will there be any way of winning this? Wiki'writers 50% off? haha

I truly hope this will work, because the mtp we have now is really cool, but not always practical! This will not be for me (to expensive), but I wish everyone the best to try!!

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Jul 19 2010, 04:31 PM

You will get the mtp program - but with better planning, continuity and individual teaching (since we no longer have the restrictions). Those who have had mtp mentoring should know what I am talking about - if you haven't you can check out the different instructors mtp sub boards http://www.guitarmasterclass.net/guitar_forum/index.php?showforum=42.

Posted by: kaznie_NL Jul 19 2010, 04:33 PM

But why not the way it used to be? I can recall my first mtp round with Monte (Lcdssd) which was really cool! There were no restrictions and I really loved it

Posted by: Marek Rojewski Jul 19 2010, 06:00 PM

I don't think that admins would have anything against one of the members starting few topics in which he would "tutor" some "students".

Posted by: carminemarotta Jul 19 2010, 06:36 PM

Kris
sorry but like somebody else I still have not understood how it works. It is quite expensive, so before committing 6 months will be nice to have better explanations.

Thanks
Carmine

Posted by: Gitarrero Jul 19 2010, 06:45 PM

I am wondering about one thing, maybe I am one of the few students here for whom this may be important:
Right now, I am having a bass mtp with Bogdan. I also had (and still have) a guitar mtp with Lian.
So, if I want provate lessons for guitar and bass, does that mean I would have to pay 60 USD per month? Or can I learn both in private lessons for the single price of 30 USD?
As I said, this might be a special situation...

Posted by: MirkoSchmidt Jul 19 2010, 06:49 PM

yeah, its really expensive... im sure most of the members here are not able to join that (like me)
i mean how much do you earn in southamerica? im not sure but isnt 29$ pretty much money for someone from there?

im very happy with the mtp, i did two great month with daniel realpe and now i have a cool time with adrian! i cant see problems with mtp... but i can see a pssibility to earn much money there for sure...
im not really happy with that...

Posted by: Marek Rojewski Jul 19 2010, 07:03 PM

Guys remember few things. For example - MTP takes instructors time. As being an instructor here is a JOB (of course it is also many other things as well), they most probably would like to get paid for the hours committed to MTP. So now there are two possibilities:
1. instructors don't get any money for the MTP now - this isn't a good thing
2. Kris pays them for the MTP, and students that are mentored aren't paying anything extra, they are paying the same cash that other members pay without having the MTP - I don't see a reason for such situation. Kris isn't the one that should sponsor ones teaching.

Of course I may be wrong, and the instructors are willing to give private lessons for free to us all, but I doubt it.

Posted by: Praetorian Jul 19 2010, 07:30 PM

I am paying $25 per hour for lessons here in my town. A one hour lesson almost covers the cost of a month of personal teaching here? That doesn't sound bad to me. I would like more detail into what I am buying however as others have stated. It is a little confusing as to how this will be $90 better than the 3 month rotation of MTP which was free. Will there be webcam interaction with the instructor? Will it be forum posts open and available to all members to read? If so, then I can see a situation where one student is paying for the lesson...and many others are following the topic and getting the same benefit without paying anything. I think private lessons should be just that - private.

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Jul 19 2010, 08:12 PM

I will do my best to clarify some more.

The new Private Lessons program is no new magic formula. It is the same thing as the old mtp which you previously got for "free".

So why do we charge you extra for this program now? Because providing the old one for "free" was not sustainable - it was threatening gmc's economy and forced us into restrictions which no one liked. The old mtp program was the result of a feature test which got more and more and popular until we couldn't manage it any longer.

The reason the mtp program got so expensive is because we reward our instructors for their time & work in the community - that is one of the reasons we can keep such a high level of knowledge on the site.

Having said this - I do see many ways this new program will turn out to be a much more effective learning tool than the old one, but only time will tell!

Posted by: carminemarotta Jul 19 2010, 08:16 PM

I completely agree with Praetorian

Posted by: Staffy Jul 19 2010, 08:20 PM

Well, I dig this, and I dont think the prize isn't unfair either - but maybe there should be a "trial" month or so, You cant really tell if this way of learning/the instructors will suit You in particular. Pay for six months in advance seems to be a little too much if You're not sure of this method of learning. Another issue will be on the teacher side - what if the student thinks that the teacher doesn't put enough effort in the private lessons? Can You get the money back then ? Also, I would like to see some more instructors participate, right now we have the rock & metal teachers (nothing wrong with that), but what about teachers in other styles???

//Staffay

EDIT: Btw. Im a big fan of the old system where students teaches students, there are a lot of skill amongst the students as well. If this can run at the same time, I think it will be great. (heard me Monte.. ) If anyone is interested in learning some jazz theory, basic rock/jazz I will be happy to help !

Posted by: carminemarotta Jul 19 2010, 08:20 PM

In my opinion, $30 for what was free untill yesterday is too expensive. I thought that there were some extra features.

Carmine

Posted by: SirJamsalot Jul 19 2010, 08:46 PM

Kristofer,

Perhaps if you list what features are available for monthly subscribers, that would help make things clearers.

Am I correct in assuming the following are still included in the monthly fee?

1. Access to video lessons under the "Guitar Lessons Tab"
2. Instructor led Collaborations
3. REC program whereby students can still be graded for submissions based on lessons?
4. Instructor led video chat.

And the only thing that is changing is an added fee for Private Lessons, which is replacing the MTP program?

Thanks,
Christian A.

Posted by: Praetorian Jul 19 2010, 08:50 PM

From what I understand, that sounds correct. Everything seems to be the same except the MTP program is now called Private Lessons and is a "pay to play" program. Also, the Private Lessons seem to be more streamlined to each student's needs instead of a lesson per month, with a mandatory REC take at the end type of format. If they need two months of just perfecting scales, or chords etc. then that is what they will get. I defer to Kris if I have it incorrect however!

I am interested in this...but I really have a problem with everyone being able to follow your "private" lesson. It doesn't seem right that someone can get the same benefit from reading the thread for free, and take advantage of the paying member. It should be a seperate thread for the instructor and student only...maybe a password?

Posted by: ruben_mcn Jul 19 2010, 08:53 PM

Wow I would love if you could teach me that specially cause its summer and i have a lot of free time .. and I want to learn has much as I can now, cause next year I´m going to college and i fear that the time that i have for music will be very limited ...

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Jul 19 2010, 10:09 PM

I agree with you - in retrospect we should have done it differently from the start. As a customer I would not enjoy paying for something I have previously received for free.

I do however find the price $30/month for a personal learning plan and GMC instructor to be very competitive.



If you are unhappy with your instructor but want to continue with the program you would switch to another instructor!


We should have most styles covered - as an example I have been contacted today by Jerry, Gera and Stephane who said they are available. You can expect more information on available instructors to appear.



It would of course be absolutely awesome if you would want to mentor people on the forum. I have said it before - but often you will get the best advice from people who are still learning, because they are in a similar learning phase as you.



That is correct (we list member features http://www.guitarmasterclass.net/signup/ - but perhaps the page should be more specific)




I have asked the techs for a suggestion on how we can achieve this! I will get back.

Posted by: SirJamsalot Jul 19 2010, 10:24 PM

oh! It is listed there! wasn't sure if it changed and because the sign-up link is way at the bottom, it didn't dawn on me to check

Christian A.

Posted by: lcsdds Jul 19 2010, 11:19 PM

I think this is a great thing. I really enjoyed doing MTP.....both learning and teaching. This is something that I will hopefully be able to participate in in the future as a student. I really enjoyed the teaching as well......and I agree that there are a lot of students on this site who would be great teachers.......such as Staffy, Zakk Wylde, MarcMaiden etc.

Hopefully this works out really well for everybody here.

I also agree with praetorian that private lessons should be private........not sure how to accomplish this but it would be nice.

Posted by: wrk Jul 20 2010, 11:27 AM

BRAVO GMC !! I honestly think that this is the best approach to to deal with the MTP/Private Lessons. IMO the extra rates are complete valid and i will for sure subscribe when my actual mess concerning time is back in order ..

Yeah, to lower the standard subscription rate a tiny little bit would have been great (pure customer view ofc), but out of experiences i know, to keep a service like GMC running is really expensive. With fast, mirrored servers in the US and europe, a whole bunch of qualified instructors and constant developments to add/improve new features to the site. Maybe if Kris would one day start a forum topic like "Kris's Gear Purchase of the week" i would start to wonder, but up to then ... fair enough !! ..

Oh btw .. i really appreciate that Kris is doing the communicate himself concerning the MTP/Private Lessons ... something i have missed a bit in the past.

Andy

Posted by: superize Jul 20 2010, 11:44 AM

Will the current MTP continue untill the end

Posted by: maharzan Jul 20 2010, 12:33 PM

Yes Superize. We will be able to complete our last MTP session -> End of August.

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Jul 20 2010, 07:41 PM

Update:

We have now tweaked with permissions so that the Private Lessons mentoring will be 100% closed. You will notice that the correspondance between Adrian and his first Private Lessons student is no longer visible.

Posted by: Praetorian Jul 21 2010, 01:39 AM

Outstanding! You just got another customer!

Posted by: Sollesnes Jul 21 2010, 01:44 AM

I guess Ill post a post here aswell. Its good to see GMC evolving, and in a good direction.

Posted by: maharzan Jul 21 2010, 04:00 AM

Wow.. now theres some secret going on..

Posted by: Fusar Jul 21 2010, 10:21 AM

I think this will be great. I think if people give money, both instructor and student will work more seriously.
Unfortunately atm, I don't have money neither for a GMC subscription, nor for 6 month of Private Lessons. Maybe you could shorten the time on 1 month, 3 and 6 months?
Furthermore, I'd really appreciate to see one thread of these Private Lessons. I understand why people want to have this closed if they pay for it, but for hesitating members, this would be great to see what's going on. Or the students could write a review...

And Kris, I really appreciate your work! GMC is the friendlist (and competent) (music)community I've ever found! I hope you will in the future work on GMC like you did the last years

Posted by: Fre Jul 21 2010, 11:32 AM

I would really love to learn some stuff of you Staffy (Jazz)! You have a lot of expierience (more than me) and I like your style.
Other than ruben_mcn I don't have much time during summer. I will have time starting in september.
How do you think of it? Will it be like the private lessons but not with an instructor?

Posted by: Staffy Jul 21 2010, 11:41 AM

I wanna learn some KGB-licks!!!

//Staffay



Thats cool with me in september, I'm thinking of running it like the MTP was with assignments every week, or at the pace desired. Since this will be free, its gonna be like ordinary forum posts in a particular thread - just as the MTP was. I think its more fun when everyone can follow whats going on.

//Staffay

Posted by: Fre Jul 21 2010, 12:12 PM

I'm excited to learn! I agreed that it is more fun when others can follow. I learned a lot from other members Mtp's.
Is it ok for you if it's free? Thanks in progress Staffy!

Posted by: Staffy Jul 21 2010, 12:29 PM

Yeah, I dont mind sharing my knowledge - for what its worth... I dont make a living on music anymore, so I have no bills to pay by doin some teaching/coaching. But I will also tell that its a tough life beeing a musician, and I do think that the instructors here are worth every penny for the private lessons - even that it might look expensive. (which its in fact not imo.)

//Staffay

Posted by: Marek Rojewski Jul 21 2010, 01:13 PM

Well there is a reason why most of our instructors are from poorer countries like mine, and members mostly from the richer ones...
Some people have not much more than 30$ per month for all their "entertainment", other spend more every day. This is one of the reasons why the option of "buying" a single lesson was a nice idea. For me 30$ isn't cheap, but I know it is a fair price to pay.

Posted by: Fre Jul 21 2010, 09:08 PM

I would like to 'buy' the private lessons from instructors, but as I'm still in high school I don't have much money from my own. I wouldn't be able to combine my current subscription with another monthly payment. So your offer is a really great alternative. And I think you already have the skills and expierience like an instructor.

Posted by: Staffy Jul 21 2010, 11:51 PM

Hmmm, I see... well, its perfectly OK for me, just give me an PM, when You like to start and we make a thread for You!

//Staffay

Posted by: Gitarrero Jul 23 2010, 03:57 PM

Kris, it would be really great to have a list of available teachers here or on the sign-up page. This would make the decision whether to take the private lessons or not much easier!

Posted by: Adrian Figallo Jul 23 2010, 08:48 PM

glad to announce that i'm running the program with two students now!!
i'm very excited about this!

also if anyone is interested i got room for more students .

Posted by: Fusar Jul 24 2010, 12:00 AM

I'd really like to Adrian, but I'm waiting that one can apply for 3 months, 'cause I can't afford 6 months at once

Posted by: Praetorian Jul 24 2010, 01:26 AM

Adrian - as I stated in my PM, as soon as I complete my MTP I am signing up with you!

Posted by: Adrian Figallo Jul 24 2010, 01:29 AM

cool man!, maybe kris have something to say here




that will rock dude! looking forward!

Posted by: maharzan Jul 26 2010, 10:11 AM

Will Muris be available for this? I am eager to learn from him as he has been my idol here at GMC.

Posted by: Praetorian Jul 26 2010, 06:33 PM

I don't know if he is still active on the site...haven't seen him around in awhile. Muris, or Emir!

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Jul 28 2010, 08:58 AM

Here are the list of available instructors so far - you can expect more to be added to the list.

Adrian Figallo
Stephane Lucarelli
Daniel Realpe
Ivan Milenkovic
Jerry Arcidiacono
Bogdan Radovic
Gerardo Siere
Dejan Farkas
Ramiro Delforte
Laszlo Boros
Vasilije Vukmirovic
Attila Voros

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Aug 6 2010, 02:32 PM

And some more instructors:

Santiago Diaz Garces
Juan Cortez
Sergio Dorado
Máté Nagy

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Aug 13 2010, 11:29 AM

I have got the question whether there's any point for those who are interested to subscribe to start just yet. My answer is:

You can start whenever you want - the reason we haven't made more noise about the program yet is because the guys who help us with design, coding etc are on vacation. So far the only place we are informing about the program is in this thread.

Posted by: Fran Aug 13 2010, 04:28 PM

There's info about it on the Knowledge base main page & GMC Journal too!

Posted by: carminemarotta Aug 17 2010, 08:05 PM

Am I suppose NOT to be able to see Private Lessons Forum? I was browsing the forum and I could access Private Lessons (Adrian) from the instructor Adrian Figallo. I thought these forums should be locked.

Thanks
Carmine

Posted by: Kristofer Dahl Aug 18 2010, 09:28 AM

Thanks for reporting this - the bug is fixed and you should now only be able to see your own private lessons board!

Posted by: audiopaal Aug 18 2010, 11:37 AM

This is great in my opinion

I see on the sign-up page that Gabriel Leopardi is listed, but not on your list in this thread..
Is he available?
If so I might have to sign up next month

Posted by: playaxeman Aug 18 2010, 12:53 PM

I think this private lesson - which is same like MTP but now paid for and really private- is a good tool for being better in guitar playing. I have done the MTP program and this is a very structured way of studing rather that just doing some randowm rock, blues, or whatever GMC lesson. With MTP you can asked questions, and you will get feedback on what you do which is rather important.

Like being said already I agree the price ($30 a month) is reasonable; (competitive to 1 to 1 private lesson which are more expensive).
I suppose it is not limited in any way?

I would like it more if you could take privat lesson just for one month instead of 6 months. I think I will sign up then just to see how i goes for 1 month and decide then if I will continue.

I also like the idea of being mentored by more senior GMC buddies for those guys who can't affort the $30.

Posted by: alvaroshredd Sep 2 2010, 01:20 PM

I´m new at this type of program, never tryed the MTP as well. My question is about how the lessons are done, by Web Cam?, i mean , you watch and hear the instructor playing and viceversa or you only watch him playing and ask questions by the forum.
Thanx.really looking forward to subscribe one day into private lessons with one of all the great instructors here
Cheers!

Posted by: maharzan Sep 2 2010, 01:41 PM

alvaroshredd,

for that there is a video chat session that instructors do time and again. You will have to be lucky to watch one of them. Todd usually runs a video chat session Saturdays 2pm EST. Pedja does a few time and again. Ramiro is also doing some. I think there are threads of times in Chill Out Room Forum.

Posted by: alvaroshredd Sep 2 2010, 02:08 PM

thanx for reply Maharzan, what im willing to learn more if i take private lessons is theory because all the technique one needs here is at the video lessons. but for theory i will need a boost. i will read the theory grimoire first and hope it teaches me what i need!