0 0

 
Reply to this topicStart new topic
> Scale Shapes, Correlating pentatonic and diatonic shapes
Satchstet
post Sep 6 2011, 02:17 AM
Post #1


GMC:er
*

Group: Members
Posts: 31
Joined: 19-June 11
Member No.: 13.152










So I'm wanting to get even better at knowing where I am on the fingerboard and how to play over key changes......like E Ionian to E Lydian for example. I've been thinking a lot about how to approach this and i have discovered something. The pentatonic shapes and diatonic shapes as I have learned them don't mesh very well thanks to the interval between the G and B string. Sooooooo......to compensate for this I have decided to modify the diatonic scale shapes. They will be 3 nps on the E A D strings and then 2 nps on the B string and then back to 3 nps on the B and E strings. This makes it to where I can then "overlay" the diatonic shape on the pentatonic shape and i don't have to shift "out of position" when I play the straight 3 nps shapes. Pretty damn handy I think. It makes it A LOT easier to slip in and out of pentatonic and diatonic playing when doing this.

I've never seen diatonic scales taught like this. I've only seen them taught 3nps with the position shift on the B and E strings and I've seen the CAGED method where there are only 5 positions taught....even though there are 7 notes in the diatonic scale. The CAGED system also has 2nps on inconsistent strings as well.....sometimes on the B string sometimes on the A string etc......no consistency. Anyways just a little revealation I had when trying to switch between the diatonic and pentatonic scale. It makes it easier to stick to the "safe" notes of the pentatonic scale but know quickly where the "color" notes of the diatonic scale is so you can spice up your playing........ smile.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Michael AC
post Sep 6 2011, 02:35 AM
Post #2


Learning Apprentice Player
*

Group: Members
Posts: 342
Joined: 15-December 10
From: Newark, Ohio
Member No.: 11.817



QUOTE (Satchstet @ Sep 5 2011, 09:17 PM) *
So I'm wanting to get even better at knowing where I am on the fingerboard and how to play over key changes......like E Ionian to E Lydian for example. I've been thinking a lot about how to approach this and i have discovered something. The pentatonic shapes and diatonic shapes as I have learned them don't mesh very well thanks to the interval between the G and B string. Sooooooo......to compensate for this I have decided to modify the diatonic scale shapes. They will be 3 nps on the E A D strings and then 2 nps on the B string and then back to 3 nps on the B and E strings. This makes it to where I can then "overlay" the diatonic shape on the pentatonic shape and i don't have to shift "out of position" when I play the straight 3 nps shapes. Pretty damn handy I think. It makes it A LOT easier to slip in and out of pentatonic and diatonic playing when doing this.

I've never seen diatonic scales taught like this. I've only seen them taught 3nps with the position shift on the B and E strings and I've seen the CAGED method where there are only 5 positions taught....even though there are 7 notes in the diatonic scale. The CAGED system also has 2nps on inconsistent strings as well.....sometimes on the B string sometimes on the A string etc......no consistency. Anyways just a little revealation I had when trying to switch between the diatonic and pentatonic scale. It makes it easier to stick to the "safe" notes of the pentatonic scale but know quickly where the "color" notes of the diatonic scale is so you can spice up your playing........ smile.gif


Would mind putting up an example? Maybe use the scale generator? Thanks.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Satchstet
post Sep 6 2011, 03:40 PM
Post #3


GMC:er
*

Group: Members
Posts: 31
Joined: 19-June 11
Member No.: 13.152



QUOTE (Michael AC @ Sep 6 2011, 01:35 AM) *
Would mind putting up an example? Maybe use the scale generator? Thanks.

Here are the scale shapes in the key of G major. Nothing revolutionary but I've never seen diatonic scales presented like this.....I've only seen the straight 3nps and CAGED shapes. These to me are just much more handy when using them in conjunction with the pentatonic shapes......especially on the B and high E strings....... cool.gif


Attached image(s)
Attached Image Attached Image
 
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Daniel Realpe
post Sep 6 2011, 03:49 PM
Post #4


Instructor
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 5.655
Joined: 11-October 09
From: Bogota
Member No.: 7.694



I think the CAGED system is good for knowing your fretboard and know where you are so to speak. But for technical suitability it's good to know the 3nps patterns, then you realise both converge,


--------------------
Visit my:
INSTRUCTOR PROFILE

"If a composer could say what he had to say in words he would not bother trying to say it in music."
Gustav Mahler


Subscribe to my Youtube Channel here
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Satchstet
post Sep 6 2011, 03:58 PM
Post #5


GMC:er
*

Group: Members
Posts: 31
Joined: 19-June 11
Member No.: 13.152



QUOTE (Daniel Realpe @ Sep 6 2011, 02:49 PM) *
I think the CAGED system is good for knowing your fretboard and know where you are so to speak. But for technical suitability it's good to know the 3nps patterns, then you realise both converge,

I never realized the converging part....... tongue.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Ivan Milenkovic
post Sep 6 2011, 09:39 PM
Post #6


Instructor
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 25.396
Joined: 20-November 07
From: Belgrade, Serbia
Member No.: 3.341



That's a very interesting discovery mate, keep practicing that one, it should be useful no doubt! smile.gif


--------------------
- Ivan's Video Chat Lesson Notes HERE
- Check out my GMC Profile and Lessons
- (Please subscribe to my) YouTube Official Channel
- Let's be connected through ! Facebook! :)
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Michael AC
post Sep 7 2011, 02:34 AM
Post #7


Learning Apprentice Player
*

Group: Members
Posts: 342
Joined: 15-December 10
From: Newark, Ohio
Member No.: 11.817



QUOTE (Satchstet @ Sep 6 2011, 10:40 AM) *
Here are the scale shapes in the key of G major. Nothing revolutionary but I've never seen diatonic scales presented like this.....I've only seen the straight 3nps and CAGED shapes. These to me are just much more handy when using them in conjunction with the pentatonic shapes......especially on the B and high E strings....... cool.gif


I got it now, that is actually how I have been playing some exercises I as adapt things on my own...after I work on caged I try and find the notes that are shared between them and the pentatonic that I know...just still realizing how it all turns into phrasing...
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Gabriel Leopardi
post Sep 7 2011, 04:43 AM
Post #8


Instructor
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 21.236
Joined: 3-March 07
From: Argentina
Member No.: 1.289



It's a very good reasoning! There are many theories about how to learn the fretboard and scales for improvisation. It's great that you are working on your way and that it's giving good results. Keep on working!


--------------------
My lessons

Don't miss my New Guitar Session at VCHAT,
this Wednesday at 20 hs (London Time).

Do you need a Guitar Plan?
Join Gab's Army

Check my band:Cirse
Check my compositions at:Soundcloud

Please subscribe to my:Youtube Channel
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
zoom
post Sep 7 2011, 06:51 AM
Post #9


Learning Roadie
*

Group: Members
Posts: 635
Joined: 23-March 07
From: Australia
Member No.: 1.403



I might have to run over these and check them out. Looks good! rolleyes.gif

Cheers Satchstet
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

Fast ReplyReply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 


RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 24th October 2014 - 09:31 AM