Hi Muris,

As you might have seen my other thread in the gear forum, I have been looking for a good small amp. I don't have access to any tube amps so don't have any idea which would be the best. I have been looking for a good amp for quite a while and can't decide which one to get. I have some cash now and really want to get one great tube amp which I can use for home practice and recording. If not amp, I am also ready to get any preamps or such like the triaxis. You have all sorts of experiences so I would love to hear yours. I am sure you might have done quite a lot of research when you got your triaxis too.

What were your preferences? I am asking this because I like your tone in your records.

Thanks so much.

Hi.

Thing with my recordings, I haven't used Triaxis for those.
My first album was done with Rocktron Prophesy (which I still have)
and for all other stuff I record (GMC lessons included)
I use different things, depending of what I'm looking for.
I used Korg Pandora PX4D A LOT.
Now I use GR3 since I like the option to change the tone after I record my part.

Amp wise, I have Engl Souvereign 2x12 combo hooked with G-Force in FX loop.
I also still have Mesa Triaxis and 2:90 (with few cabs)
but this combo thing works better for me,
better attack and response, probably because of less cables.
It's a sweet amp, 4 channels, all tube, midi etc.
But it costs around 2300 euros.

Rocktron is good deal for buck imo.
I had Voodoo Valve years ago, very nice drives and cleans.
Effects are not top notch (at least not like G-Force)
but they DO the job, no doubt.
Triaxis is cool but pretty expensive and dry whatsoever,
you would need some extra FX unit to work with it.

It all comes down to your budget I'm afraid,
tell me how much money do you have and I can point you at some gear.

Great to hear your gear experiences. I am really not restricting myself on the bugdet right now. I want to get THE AMP and settle with it for a lifetime (hopefully) so I am thinking I can spend quite a bit. I want to have a list of amps and then look for the feasibility of them bringing home.

I will look into the amps you have mentioned.

Thanks Muris.

How about Marshall JCM 800 or 900 heads through speaker simulators?

apologies for butting in Muris - have a look at this site here maharzan, it contains mp3 sound clips and links to other sites of quite a lot of tube amps and simulators. Could be helpful in giving you at least an idea of what the various amps are like and so help narrow down your list.

One thing to think about for home practising...
Valve amps need to be run hot to get the best out of them. 50W/100W is extremely loud for home use and can produce spl that could cause you hearing problems. I would recommend that you get an attenuator at the same time as you get the amp. If you don't want to do this then you either need to get a non valve amp or a much smaller one (ie 5W or less) for home use.

If you get a preamp then this may not be an issue as some preamps include a built in speaker dummy load switch.

also try this link. Quite a few of links on the other one are out of date but this seems to work better.

Thanks Tony! appreciated.

will take a look.

Those are fine amps for sure.
I'm not huge fan of Marshall tho
but MANY players love it so I can't argue.
But Tony has a point, you don't need those
for home recording and practicing, too loud indeed.
As for myself, I use GR3 a lot for those purposes and I really can't complain a lot.
Of course GR cannot sound as real as tube amp
but there are many kudos, no need to carry it around, takes less (or no) space,
offers many options sound wise (effects, patches) etc.

And if you still really need tube sound with maybe some effects
for home recording and practicing only then
I would go for preamp with effects, it usually costs less money
than full amp and you can practice with headphones
without disturbing neighbors and everyone around you.
At the end, why would you pay for an amp (power section)
if you're going to use it with speaker simulators?

Rocktron Prophesy or Rocktron Voodoo Valve,
give them a try.

Thanks Muris. I have been thinking that as well. Preamps would be great I think. But I want to 'own' an amp as well (which I don't right now) and feel the sound. I am actually done with DSP. I am just not liking that digital sound you know. I have a DigiTech GNX4 and though it sounds cool and a lot of options, I have had enough of it. Similar with all VTS plugins. Thus looking more into actual warmth / punchy / tube sounds.

Roctron seems more like DSP though I liked the video demo on the Prophesy. I am looking into tube amps / preamps mostly for records I will be making in near future (which I want to do desparately). I have recorded with GNX4 and other digital pedals and I am hating the thin, sharp sounding tone. For practice, recording licks, GR3 is great.. easy / fast setup.

At one time earlier I was nearly going to get the Mesa Boogie Mark II amp only to reconsider because shipping was more expensive than the amp itself. I like the Mesa Boogie Tone too. From the other thread, many are recommending Blackstar HT-5 amps. I am looking into those as well.

I will look into the Voodu valve preamp.

Looking into this right now..



Just a quick question Muris: What exactly is a Triaxis? Is it like a tube preamp but also has a digital circuitry to store presets?

and What is 2:90 for? Is it a simulator or a power amp? can it connect directly to 2x12 cabs for example or to the computer for recording?

Sorry .. no idea and the desc on the mesa site isn't so clear to me.

Thanks.

Sorry for flooding but while I was searching I got into this also: Mesa Boogie Studio Preamp



Sounds like its antic now but sounds good. And a lot cheaper too (I think). Selling for around $500 used.. or less

Yeah, that one is pretty old,
my friend has it but I never played it enough tho.

Triaxis is a preamp, full tube preamp.
It does have implemented midi setup so you could store your presets.
That's just for storing, that digi part of the unit.
And 2:90 is a stereo power amp with 2 separate sections of 90watts.
So when you mix Triaxis and 2:90 you get ultra powerful amp head
cause that's what head is, preamp and amp section.
So you can go into any cab after 2:90, 2x12,4x12 etc.
For home recording you won't need 2:90 tho,
you use Triaxis for that since it has recording outputs.
Of course you can always mic your cab even for home recording.

Once again I strongly advise you to check out those 2 Rocktron preamps,
those are more than great to start your tube tone journey.
Digitech is very poor sound wise, I know how it feels
but believe me, Rocktron is something else.
You can get preamp only for now and it'll serve you great for recording.
Plus you can also use it for live through PA system.
Then you can buy a power amp and a cab latter on
to complete your rig.

There are many options, even Blackstar HT-5 you mentioned
but you REALLY need to know what do you need
and how much you're willing to spend, there are hardly any rules.

Thanks again Muris. That hurted a bit (about Digitech).. But I really want to get the 5 tubes thing and feel that world and never look back. I will need to save and find a way about shipping.

I meant no harm, I just shared my opinion.

Not a problem at all Muris. Learnt many things purchasing and trying out different amps. Never actually knew how tubes / analog were until I used that box.

Looking for triaxis - Found one on austrian site:

http://cgi.ebay.at/Mesa-Boogie-Triaxis-Pre...id=p3286.c0.m14

Looks good condition (need some translation though). But 1580 euro is like (little high). What do you think? Not many seem to sell the triaxis.

This one from the German site: http://cgi.ebay.de/Mesa-Boogie-Triaxis-2-1...4#ht_750wt_1167

Looks like European versions are expensive that US ones.. (shipping?)

Thanks Tony. I researched this after you post. Independent sellers make some decent ones now for $60 to a little over $100 now, that sound as good as the expensive ones you had to buy in the past. Basically either the TubeJuice or the Little Sucker. The former has a few more features, and they make bigger ones for 100 watt amps. But both get the same reviews, which are generally good. I am getting the $60 one, that is sufficient for up to 50 watts provided you don't go nuts with it, which is not my intent (God gave us Metal Zones for a reason). If for no other reason, most of us can't afford to blow amps periodically because we use them as a heavy distortion box.

Anyway thanks for your idea Tony.

edit: not that it is important to edit this, but it came up, so.....I am now leaning towards a Weber Mini 50W. They operate on a different principle that the above, and most seem to like it better. Costs $100 new. I heard a demo and it sounded pretty good. Decent. I don't want it to push the amp to max, just to crank it up some. To me it seems to improve tone is used in that fashion, tube amps need to be turned up some, maybe half way, to start sounding good. But for a lot of distortion, that is why God created Distortion pedals for.

Well yeah, brand new Triaxis costs around 2300-2500 euros in Europe, depends of store and country.
1580 euros for used one is pretty common tho,
you'll hardly find in below that price in Europe.

So, I am guessing it would be cheaper to get it from the US and then ship it (together). One of my friends shipped fender telecaster from US at $200 (shipping).. (now that was cheap ).. so even if it costs 1200 $ (looks like most of them sell on that range) I am ready to pay upto $500 on shipping which comes out cheaper than in Europe. Even the brand new one costs $2000 (cheaper than in used one in europe).

The only concern is the 110V issue (which I am sure I can ask the local electricians to convert to 220V) or just use a converter, if that doesn't damage anything. I have done that before as well.

I am thinking of shipping all 3 triaxis, 2:90, g-force at once to save some shipping fees.. but that really depends on if I can find them.

That would be probably the best solution
but be sure to check out customs at your country,
more gear would be more interesting to them to charge,
one at the time might go "under the radar"
or at least with lower customs.

Probably might need to bribe them (which is very common here).

Okay, I have searched GOOGLE and virtually found threads and sales and have also posted on two sites, jemsite and boogie forum but haven't yet found anyone selling. found very few in ebay. I might have to wait..

Ya.. probably, I will just try to get one at a time I guess. Can't seem to find all.

Ah, I found 2 items selling from the same guy at ebay.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Mesa-Boogie-Stereo-Sim...4#ht_1295wt_941

http://cgi.ebay.com/Mesa-Boogie-Triaxis-Ra...4#ht_1331wt_941

Muris, from your experience, what can you tell about the item and the seller? safe to buy? and items looks good too. What do you say? I asked a question yesterday but haven't received any answer yet.

Oh and i forgot to ask you... What is the PHAT mode on triaxis? Do I need to get one with that mode? I saw it was recommended on your thread. How do we know it has that mode?

These 2 items look ok for what I've seen,
some minor scratches which is usual with all used rack gear.
And seller seems to be ok too, lots of deal with 97% feedback, that is pretty good.

Phat mode on Triaxis affects Lead 1 Red channel only,
it gives more lows and punch, sort of speak.
I think every Triaxis made after 97 is Phat version.
Phat mode is another individual thing, some people like it, some don't.
Truth is, you'll be able to get amazing sounds with or without Phat
and Triaxis without Phat can be upgraded to Phat for 100-200$, no big deal.

Cool.. I am trying to contact the seller but he hasn't got back to me yet.. I asked if he can ship worldwide.. I guess he doesn't like that idea. will see.

Thanks Muris.

Yeah, it says shipping to US only.
There are some items on ebay with same shipping info
but seller also leaves a note to contact him for shipping out of US.
Unfortunately, I can't see that note for those 2 items...

Ok... we had a few conversations and he only ships to confirmed paypal address.. so will have to ask my friend in US to help me out.

Interestingly, all of his items have 0 bids ( only 2 items have 1 bids). What does that tell us?

Economic crisis maybe, those are pretty expensive units
and people are not so willing to buy those nowdays?

Hmm... If things go well, I should have them in a few weeks.. m so excited.

I have not yet completely understood how G-Force comes into play. I believe this is more like a digital effects unit like chorus, delay, reverb, octave, etc (without the distortion) 24-bit. How do we connect it?

Guitar, Triaxis -> G-Force -> 2:90 -> cab ? (in a live situation)?

and Guitar -> Triaxis -> G-Force -> Computer for recording?

For live, what pedal you to change between like clean tone and the dist channel, or say another chorus channel? MIDI controller?

I missed a GForce unit for $685. (but the reserve was not met so i guess he will resell again).

For changing channels or any MIDI commans, any MIDI foot controller can do the job.

cool.. thanks Ivan.. I am not into MIDI that much.. perhaps when I get the gear, will try to discover them.

Okay found out that the triaxis is version 1. Should I get it or wait for another sale of v2.0? heard 2.0 is better.. ..

Original version is version 1.

nevermind

nevermind this post as well

Regarding Triaxis versions,
version 2 comes with Phat mode,
version 1 doesn't have Phat by default
but it can be upgraded easily, as I said.
There is also version 3 out, I think.

How to connect?
Triaxis has FX Loop and best way to connect G-Force with it
is via FX Loop, that means that signal from Triaxis goes to G-Force,
effects are added and then the whole thing is sent back to Triaxis.
This type of connection is very good for recording since
Triaxis has Recording Outputs with some kind of speaker simulators ON.
You can use same connection for live gigs as well,
in that case you would use main outs from Triaxis to send signal
further to power amp and then to a cab.
Some people prefer connecting then in serial way,
Triaxis -> G-Force-> Power amp etc.
This is matter of personal preference tho.

And yeah, any midi controller would work to change presets on both Triaxis and G-Force.
I have Rocktron Midimate and it works just fine.
Tho you would would need one small midi cable to connect Triaxis and G-Force:
from midi controller to Midi IN on Triaxis, then from Midi OUT on Triaxis
to Midi IN on G-Force (with this small cable).
Triaxis also has phantom which can powers midi controller
straight through the midi cable so you won't need adapter on stage, very useful.

One possible place to find a used Triaxis are the various specialised forums. People often put up gear there that isn't sold on ebay/craigslist and so on.

The link I gave Muris for fretless guitars has a used gear section. One guy on there was selling quite a lot of high end amps. From memory there were some Mesa amps in his list. Similarly people often list high end stuff on the main Allan Holdsworth forum and also the various specialised high end guitar and guitar amp forums.

Best way to connect a G-Force to a triaxis:

Take the G-Force.
Photograph it.
Wrap in bubblewrap and put in box.
Put photo on E-Bay.
Sell G-Force.
Mail G-Force to new owner.
Buy Eventide.

Simples

(Only joking - G-force is a nice processor . Just couldn't resist.)

Thanks Muris for the clarification .. will help a lot when I get the gear.

Yep, I have googled and have emailed almost 10 of them.. There are actually not many listings in ebay.. only 2 as of today. All the listings in craiglist only dealt locally and on cash..

I have posted in various forums and one I am dealing now is this one: http://img406.imageshack.us/img406/6301/me...eflightcase.jpg

only the triaxis, 2:90's already sold as he says.. looking for UKP 900... v2 with phat mode. He is from the UK.

negotiating...

This is the site.. btw, if anyone has any experience on this site, let me know..

http://www.hugeracksinc.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=60442

I hope its genuine.. I see that guy has a lot of posts on the triaxis on the same forum.

Found another one as well on ebay!

http://cgi.ebay.com/Mesa-Boogie-Triaxis-2-...m#ht_500wt_1182

Looks good?

Okay, looks like the deal is going to be final.. just a few questions and a final nod...

V2 5800 serial so most probably it has PHAT mode, JJ tubes, volume knob scratchy?, says everything is working fine. USD 1050. US version so I will need a converter or jsut change the power supply myself.

What should I need to ask or know about the unit?

Okay.. got confirmation that he cleaned up the volume knob and no longer scratchy.. so its in really good condition as far as I have understood between our conversations.

Going to buy it today/tomorrow...

Any last things I need to be aware of? I hope the 100% positive feedback is not fraud or something on ebay. I am risking this as its my first purchase on ebay.

Thanks Muris!

100% feedback is great
tho he has had only 30 deals so far,
some people would buy from him without thinking, some wouldn't...
Anyway, use PayPal just in case, you never know what might happen!

Thanks Muris.. yep definitely will be using Paypal.

let us know how the bid went man. Good luck

Thanks. sure will do.. buying it today!

EDIT: YEAH!! Bought it!!!!!

EDIT: Got confirmation too.. will be shipping it tomm! Can;t wait to get that..

So, next on hunt....

TC G-Force!!!

Just a question Muris..

I am sure the G-Force is kind of pro equipment. I just wanted to know what would the difference between say using pedals like reverb, digital delay, chorus, etc and the G-Force.. aren't they like the same thing? apart from G-Force having many more settings..?

Congrats!!!!!!!



With pedals you surely wouldn't have that many options presets wise,
pedals take more space, more cables etc.
Another cool thing about G Force is that you can set order of effects the way you like it
and you can do it differently for every preset, with pedals you'd always have to
move pedals around to get desired effect chain which is pretty tough.
And ofc all those effects on G-Force are really high class, you can't go wrong with G-Force.
But if you don't have enough money for G-Force you could also try G-Major,
not the same thing, few less options but still good.

Thanks Muris. I am on your toe (2 years ago) pretty excited about it.

Cool.. so rack system be it...

Yep, I will definitely buy a used one once I get the triaxis cos, I need to see how it goes... shipping / customs.. but somehow I will definitely get the G-Force and the 2:90 at a later date. Like I mentioned, I don't want to be wasting money on some cheaper gears.. I want to sound like THE PRO..

Well with those units your sound will surely be a pro one.

However, you might want to check out Mesa 2:50 or some other poweramp
of that kind and power, there are Peavey's, Marshalls, VHTs etc.
2:90 is extremely loud and you'd pay a lot for it.
Ofc it has those 3 extra options (deep, half, modern)
to trigger them from Triaxis but I never used them,
I did try them once tho but that was it, 3 more cables for nothing special imo.

Hmm.. Is the 2:50 same as 2:90 except the wattage difference? But looks like triaxis goes well with 2:90.. If its the same then I think it would be better buying 2:50..

I will go look at mesa's site.. I also saw the 20/20.. need to find out more about it.

Thanks for the info Muris.

EDIT: Okay 2:90 is the Simul-Class.. what does that mean? not in 2:50?

There are some differences but nothing major tone wise imo,
main difference is price and wattage, at least for me.
I had Mesa 2:50 as well but I was kind a geek and so I bought 2:90,
it's more power and I never used it above 50% which is not smartest thing
with tube amps, then should be played at 80% or som to get the best from them.
But it's your call, 2:90 is great, if you really need it, you buy it.

Yep.. I did some looking over the net and many people recommend 2:90 over 2:50.. I guess 2:90 was actually made for the Triaxis, everywhere, in the manual too, its actually 2:90.

But I guess I will not get this amp anytime soon. I am not a gigger at the moment... I am a bedroom player (like the bathroom singer haha).. I will practice and try some own songs recording with the Triaxis / G-Force first and when I become a pro (in a year or two hopefully) and I start gigging around, I will get the 2:90 and a good 2x12 cab. My band is virtually dead atm so theres not point getting the 2:90 with no practice room in place.

That sounds like a good plan,
get power amp when you really need it,
in a meanwhile you'll have lot of fun with Triaxis and G-Force.

I will keep updating..

Cheers!!!