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El Fortinero
Hey guys, so long!

As we built a rehearsal room in our drummer's house, I leave all my equipment there. At home i play with a fender squier stratocaster and a zoom gfx 707 and damn I can feel the difference.. so I was wondering..... what is the importance of having a professional/good instrument for you?

Once I was told that "the sound (your sound)" is in your fingers...maybe..but all the greatest guitarrist use top level instruments tongue.gif
Dinaga
QUOTE (El Fortinero @ May 19 2012, 05:43 PM) *
Hey guys, so long!

As we built a rehearsal room in our drummer's house, I leave all my equipment there. At home i play with a fender squier stratocaster and a zoom gfx 707 and damn I can feel the difference.. so I was wondering..... what is the importance of having a professional/good instrument for you?

Once I was told that "the sound (your sound)" is in your fingers...maybe..but all the greatest guitarrist use top level instruments tongue.gif


Yeah, I wondered that too.
Well when you become one of the greatest you'll have top level instruments too biggrin.gif
Until then... fingers! laugh.gif

On a more serious note - I'd love to have lots of expensive guitars but since I can't really afford it, I'm pleased with a guitar which sounds good enough so I can improve my skills on it. It shouldn't detune much, it shouldn't sound like an industrial tube, and it shouldn't be impossible to play properly. And no floyd rose! biggrin.gif

Besides that, I'm fine. And with all the available guitar software out there, it's possible to create quite nice tone with an average guitar. My guitar costs about 800 $ and I'm quite pleased with its tone.
Cosmin Lupu
Indeed, a good instrument will improve your playing smile.gif because it looks, feels and sounds good! You will be more motivated to play, if you really love playing that is wink.gif if you don't really enjoy playing and your heart does not crave to progress and develop better means of self expression, the fact that you own a good instrument won't change anything.

Tone lies in the hands and the hands can get the best out of a good instrument smile.gif an 800 dollars guitar can be a good guitar. It's not compulsory to have a 4000 dollars custom shop Gibson Les Paul, to say that you have a good guitar, in my opinion. If the guitar is set up properly, it can be even better wink.gif

The conclusion is that if you really want to play and evolve, you can do it on a decent instrument as well smile.gif
Tangomouse
Interesting topic... I read this about a hour ago and i was begining to wonder what class's as a good instrument? and how good are mine. I own two really cheap guitars, a cheap Strat and a cheap Gould les paul but i also own another two that i would consider high end and those are a Crafter electric acoustic and wait for it... a Tokai les paul "Love rock". When i first saw this tokia i wanted it instantly and managed to get the shop owner to put it away for me..

The shop owner was also my guitar teacher and he told me that slash used to play tokai's but i haven't found any truth in that.

Would my tokai be classed as a good instrument? when i first read this post i went searching for any famous Tokai players and found one instantly and you'll never guess who.. Billy Gibbons. and there's is a video on youtube of him playing a Tokai loke rock model.
Ben Higgins
Having an instrument that is physically more comfortable to play will definitely keep your motivation up and make certain things easier for sure. The best guitar is the one that enables you to get your sound, whatever that may be smile.gif
jstcrsn
QUOTE (Ben Higgins @ May 20 2012, 08:00 PM) *
Having an instrument that is physically more comfortable to play will definitely keep your motivation up and make certain things easier for sure. The best guitar is the one that enables you to get your sound, whatever that may be smile.gif

I am more along this mindset, it does not matter how inexpensive a guitar is , if it is comfortable - hot rod the pick ups and it will sound just as good
Gabriel Leopardi
I agree with Cosmin's words about this and I would like to share this video where how important the fingers are.... biggrin.gif

Todd Simpson
Having a great instruments certainly can't hurt smile.gif It will honestly help. But honestly having a decent instrument will serve a player quite well. The practical difference between a "nice" guitar and a top level, hand built, Axe can be substantial but will only come in to play in ways you may not notice for years. It never hurts to have pro grade gear, but for the first several years of playing, having decent gear is just fine. For example, I still use a crappy old Ibanez RG560 with STOCK PICKUPS which were complete crap 20 years ago and have not gotten any better. Partially, I have not upgraded them just to keep the guitar as a stock build, but partially to show that you really don't "HAVE TO" have active EMG's or ROCKFIELD MAFIA pickups in order to get pinch harmonics, adequate gain, workable tone, etc.

In short, most of it really is in your fingers. But the better the instrument, the less you have to fight it. So don't stress is you play a $300 guitar. That's what I paid for my USED RG560 and I've used it on stage, studio, etc. And still use it every saturday in Video Chat Lessons.
Mudbone
QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ May 20 2012, 06:38 PM) *
Having a great instruments certainly can't hurt smile.gif It will honestly help. But honestly having a decent instrument will serve a player quite well. The practical difference between a "nice" guitar and a top level, hand built, Axe can be substantial but will only come in to play in ways you may not notice for years. It never hurts to have pro grade gear, but for the first several years of playing, having decent gear is just fine. For example, I still use a crappy old Ibanez RG560 with STOCK PICKUPS which were complete crap 20 years ago and have not gotten any better. Partially, I have not upgraded them just to keep the guitar as a stock build, but partially to show that you really don't "HAVE TO" have active EMG's or ROCKFIELD MAFIA pickups in order to get pinch harmonics, adequate gain, workable tone, etc.

In short, most of it really is in your fingers. But the better the instrument, the less you have to fight it. So don't stress is you play a $300 guitar. That's what I paid for my USED RG560 and I've used it on stage, studio, etc. And still use it every saturday in Video Chat Lessons.


I was under the impression that the RG560 is a killer guitar, with excellent build quality and a very comfortable fretboard. Supposedly it plays just as good as any expensive guitar, regardless of the price. But you should know that better than me laugh.gif The stock pickups may be crap, but that is easy to fix biggrin.gif The RG760 has upgraded DiMarzio pickups, and you can sometimes find those for cheap on eBay.

I actually just missed out on a killer deal sad.gif It was an RG560 with EMG's and sold on eBay for only $212.00! I was almost sure it was going to sell for more than that, so I didn't even bother bidding... oh well...

But as far as manufacturing precision is concerned, you can get some excellent guitars for a good price. Most of the supposed "extras" you find on guitars are marketing gimmicks. Theres no need to spend thousands to get a great guitar.
Mike RR24
I just wanted to put in my 2 cents. My wife and I have 6 guitars now and when we first bought the first one I paid $349.00 for a floyd rose Schecter It was a great guitar. I ended up giving that one to my son. I bought her a LTD-1000 at that time it was $849.00 and a great shredder with EMG's now she has dual 81's in it. Then I bought me a jackson RR24 for $1200, When I bought her the Gibson SG I wanted to come in a little better than entry so I spent $1400 on it. I noticed it had real high nitro on it and really nice binders etc.
When I bought my Les Paul recently I was going to spend $2200 on it and I started looking and said hold up a minute.
I bought a New 50's Tribute Les Paul Studio for $849.00 and I totally love it. Here's the difference I noticed. The difference between that 1400 SG and my 8XX les paul was that my Les Paul is kind of a stripped down Version. No gloss, no bindings, no pickup covers etc... I love the way the wood looks kinda natural. The gloss bothered me cause it smeared a lot. Anyway I took the 498T out of the Bridge and put a 500T, did not like it so I ordered a Seymour Duncan Invader and I love it. Got some chrome pickup covers and threw those on there. I love the way it feels and plays etc.. I know that a great guitar is not how much it is like I used to think in the beginning cause it's a personal preference between different users likes. I think that $800-$1000 will get you an awesome guitar that's good quality. It will out last me anyway. Thanks for letting me share dudes.
Gabriel Leopardi
QUOTE (Mudbone @ May 20 2012, 08:24 PM) *
I was under the impression that the RG560 is a killer guitar, with excellent build quality and a very comfortable fretboard. Supposedly it plays just as good as any expensive guitar, regardless of the price. But you should know that better than me laugh.gif The stock pickups may be crap, but that is easy to fix biggrin.gif The RG760 has upgraded DiMarzio pickups, and you can sometimes find those for cheap on eBay.

I actually just missed out on a killer deal sad.gif It was an RG560 with EMG's and sold on eBay for only $212.00! I was almost sure it was going to sell for more than that, so I didn't even bother bidding... oh well...

But as far as manufacturing precision is concerned, you can get some excellent guitars for a good price. Most of the supposed "extras" you find on guitars are marketing gimmicks. Theres no need to spend thousands to get a great guitar.



I don't know too much about the different Ibanez models but I had a RG520 (Is is a more expensive model compared to RG560?) and it was a really good guitar. I had to sell it because I needed a different guitar but sometimes I regret it.

It's true that there are really good guitars at a reasonable price... some examples are Schecters, PRS se and Fernandes. I have a Fernandes monterrey and I'm happy with it. You can check it here:

http://www.guitarmasterclass.net/ls/Indie-...IV-Sonic-Youth/
Cosmin Lupu
I agree with Gabe - the PRS SE, is among the best 'not so expensive but good quality' instruments out there! I recorded and gigged a LOT with my Paul Allender PRS SE and it never ever let me down smile.gif
casinostrat
Just wanted to give my take on this topic. The first electric guitar I ever owned was a 700 Dollar Epiphone LP. It was a good guitar, and after having it properly set up for me, it played and sounded great. Had P-90 pickups in it, and I played it happily for many years. Then one Christmas, which happens to be very close to my birthday as well, my family all got together and bought me a 1994 Gibson Custom Les Paul which I will say was over 3000 dollars. (Best Christmas I ever had, by the way!) First of all, I didn't need it set up, it was perfect right out of the box and somehow just felt better, smoother and easier to play than the epiphone did. After experimenting and playing both for a while I began to notice that I could play well on both the Epiphone and the Gibson, but when I was playing the Epiphone I had to work at it a little, whereas with the Gibson it all felt a little more effortless, smoother and just plain easier. Does that make sense? Anyway, it seemed in this case the more expensive instrument did make a difference, but then again couldn't you get this same type of thing with less expensive guitars, meaning could the expensive Gibson's excellent playability be attributed to how much it cost, or instead attributed to it just being the right guitar for me? What would happen if say another person were to try both these guitars, would they prefer the Gison or the Epiohone? I guess it all boils down to just choosing and using the best guitar that suits your needs, and price is not always the final determining factor.
Todd Simpson
QUOTE (Mudbone @ May 20 2012, 07:24 PM) *
I was under the impression that the RG560 is a killer guitar, with excellent build quality and a very comfortable fretboard. Supposedly it plays just as good as any expensive guitar, regardless of the price. But you should know that better than me laugh.gif The stock pickups may be crap, but that is easy to fix biggrin.gif The RG760 has upgraded DiMarzio pickups, and you can sometimes find those for cheap on eBay.

I actually just missed out on a killer deal sad.gif It was an RG560 with EMG's and sold on eBay for only $212.00! I was almost sure it was going to sell for more than that, so I didn't even bother bidding... oh well...

But as far as manufacturing precision is concerned, you can get some excellent guitars for a good price. Most of the supposed "extras" you find on guitars are marketing gimmicks. Theres no need to spend thousands to get a great guitar.


That's sorta my point here. You don't have to spend crazy money to get a decent guitar. I prefer my old RG560 to any guitar I"ve ever touched at any price BAR NONE. But that's just me smile.gif They just don't make guitar necks like that anymore. For good reason though as some just snapped under heavy gauge strings. But yeah, plays like a DREEEEEAAAAMMMM! And is a key ingredient for my entire approach to guitar. P.S. That would have been a KILLER dead for two Benjamins! RG560s usually go for $500 or so in ebay! See this link.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/IBANEZ-RG560-PN-19...#ht_1751wt_1165

And even with CRAP stock pickups, I manage to get pretty ripping tone using cheap software apps like overloud. So no expensive guitar, not even using an amp, and BINGO! So dont' think that just because you are not playing a hand made Jackson through a Triple Rectifier, that you are at a HUGE disadvantage. I run in to this with many students who feel they can't really sound good unless they spend several thousand dollars on gear. Paul Gilbert (my Hero) made this plain to me when he toured with Racer X using a honestly low end ibanez with truly crap pickups and he still sounded amazing.

Click to view attachment

QUOTE (Gabriel Leopardi @ May 21 2012, 02:17 AM) *
I don't know too much about the different Ibanez models but I had a RG520 (Is is a more expensive model compared to RG560?) and it was a really good guitar. I had to sell it because I needed a different guitar but sometimes I regret it.

It's true that there are really good guitars at a reasonable price... some examples are Schecters, PRS se and Fernandes. I have a Fernandes monterrey and I'm happy with it. You can check it here:

http://www.guitarmasterclass.net/ls/Indie-...IV-Sonic-Youth/


The RG520 is the guitar I sort of always wanted! Dual Humbuckers, great wood, etc. They go for $650 US or more often on ebay like this one.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1999-Ibanez-RG520Q...ht_22882wt_1398
Azzaboi
Todd makes a good point. Paul Gilbert is a great example, he would pick up stock guitars off the guitar store shelves, play them like they where worth thousands. People would then buy that same guitar and wonder if they got a lemon! It comes down a lot to talent.

However a really bad guitar which losts it's tuning and sounding like crap can make you give up even trying. You can feel the quality in a guitar, it's harder to find the feeling in cheaper ones but sometimes it's still there. It may also improve your finger strength and playing skills quicker as there's less sustain, etc?

Saying that, I still love some of the expensive ones and think they are well worth saving for. I'm however very picky.
PosterBoy
I'm blessed to have pretty damn good guitars, most guitarists on this site have far better technique than me... but my Tyler puts a grin on my face every time i play it, the tone and playability are 2nd to none, put that together with my Axe Fx Ultra and I sound much better than I actually am. The sound and playability motivate me to practice more, 1 because it inspires me and 2 because I know it's top of the range equipment and so anything lacking comes directly from me.


Was it Ledbelly that had a guitar with a warped neck that he had to bend the notes in tune, and when the record company gave him a new gold top he couldn't play it so he set it on a stand infront of him on stage so people could look at it because it was so pretty.
Cosmin Lupu
biggrin.gif nice story mate, but who was Ledbelly?
Todd Simpson
QUOTE (Cosmin Lupu @ May 22 2012, 05:42 PM) *
biggrin.gif nice story mate, but who was Ledbelly?


Legendary American Blues/Folk player.

Huddie William Ledbetter (January 20, 1888 – December 6, 1949) was an iconic American folk and blues musician, and multi-instrumentalist, notable for his strong vocals, his virtuosity on the twelve-string guitar, and the songbook of folk standards he introduced.

He is best known as Lead Belly. Though many releases list him as "Leadbelly", he himself spelled it "Lead Belly". This is also the usage on his tombstone,[1][2] as well as of the Lead Belly Foundation.[3] In 1994 the Lead Belly Foundation contacted an authority on the history of popular music, Colin Larkin, editor of the Encyclopedia of Popular Music, to ask if the name "Leadbelly" could be altered to "Lead Belly" in the hope that other authors would follow suit and use the artist's correct appellation.

Although Lead Belly most commonly played the twelve-string, he could also play the piano, mandolin, harmonica, violin, and accordion.[4] In some of his recordings, such as in one of his versions of the folk ballad "John Hardy", he performs on the accordion instead of the guitar. In other recordings he just sings while clapping his hands or stomping his foot.

The topics of Lead Belly's music covered a wide range of subjects, including gospel songs; blues songs about women, liquor and racism; and folk songs about cowboys, prison, work, sailors, cattle herding, and dancing. He also wrote songs concerning the newsmakers of the day.

In 2008, Lead Belly was inducted into the Louisiana Music Hall of Fame.
Cosmin Lupu
Haha biggrin.gif Thanks Todd!
Zoot
QUOTE (jstcrsn @ May 20 2012, 08:27 PM) *
I am more along this mindset, it does not matter how inexpensive a guitar is , if it is comfortable - hot rod the pick ups and it will sound just as good


Have to disagree with this. Just replaced the well set-up Les Paul knock-off which had after market Gibson pickups in it with a real Standard. The difference in playability and tone is night and day.

smile.gif Z.
Mike RR24
QUOTE (Zoot @ May 23 2012, 07:27 AM) *
Have to disagree with this. Just replaced the well set-up Les Paul knock-off which had after market Gibson pickups in it with a real Standard. The difference in playability and tone is night and day.

smile.gif Z.



Sounds like you meant you agree with this right?

Todd Simpson
Obviously at a certain point, there is a difference. We were all talking about mid range/used/cheap gear to be honest. I don't think anyone would suggest a cheap chinese les paul fake can compare to a real one.

My current fav guitar is an ancient Ibanez RG560 with stock pickups that I bought used. It's a great example of a fairly cheap, stock, non custom guitar that plays better most every other guitar I've ever touched and I"ve played LOTS of guitars. But everyone has their own thoughts and feeling on what "Good" means so of course there's WADS of room for interpretation.

The point of the thread was to say that you don't have to have / spend crazy money to get a nice axe that you can learn and gig with. Which is great news smile.gif

Todd

QUOTE (Zoot @ May 23 2012, 09:27 AM) *
Have to disagree with this. Just replaced the well set-up Les Paul knock-off which had after market Gibson pickups in it with a real Standard. The difference in playability and tone is night and day.

smile.gif Z.

SpaseMoonkey
QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ May 21 2012, 11:16 PM) *
And even with CRAP stock pickups, I manage to get pretty ripping tone using cheap software apps like overloud. So no expensive guitar, not even using an amp, and BINGO! So dont' think that just because you are not playing a hand made Jackson through a Triple Rectifier, that you are at a HUGE disadvantage. I run in to this with many students who feel they can't really sound good unless they spend several thousand dollars on gear. Paul Gilbert (my Hero) made this plain to me when he toured with Racer X using a honestly low end ibanez with truly crap pickups and he still sounded amazing.

Are you poking at me? laugh.gif

I almost sound like this very example, check my sig for my gear list. But Todd isn't lying at all. I have the gear, but I acquired an Ibanez S770 a few months ago. I did a trade in but the guitar was $900. The only reason it was a bit higher in price was the poplar wood finish, and that it was a H-S-H configuration. My friend owns a Ibanez S620 pretty much the same guitar I have just a different finish and its a dual humbucker setup. He paid about $300 less. They play pretty much the same once setup.

So its no lie, gear helps but you can find a great product at a cheaper price. I tend to look for used gear at stores, something I can go pick up and play. I've been thinking of going to check out a JEM7BLK, it has everything the higher end JEM's have minus the design on the neck. But for the price I don't think that little feature matters all the much.
JesseJ
Here is my take on the matter . My guitar mentor and teacher always says that a great guitarist can make any guitar sound good. Period. I always thought it was all in the player and the guitar didn't even matter. I have a played (not owned ) A bunch of different guitars PRS SE models Fenders in all there many shapes and styles , Gibson SG's and Les Paul's , Vox , Lot's of ibanez's and many others . All of these guitars were fun and I enjoyed playing them.

But It wasnt until I bought my first guitar that I saw and felt the difference that quality makes !! I own a PRS ( not an SE the real thing hand made in the states!!! ) I paid A pretty penny for it used $1,600 US . And for a PRS that is considered a great deal . I do not have any regrets spending that kind of cash. I see so many people with thousands and thousands of dollars in music equipment saying they wish they could afford a nice guitar .

everybody ready for this ..... I ONLY HAVE ONE GUITAR !! shocking I know smile.gif But that is because I found the perfect guitar seriously sell your entire collection and buy 1 killer guitar . You will never look back. I find having an exspensive guitar does not make you a good guitarist but it inspires you encourages you and makes you want to play like you wouldn't believe . I understand not everyone can afford it and luckly for me I am still A teenager living at home so I can . but just save your pennies, or like i said sell your whole quiver and trade it in for 1 beast !
Mike RR24
QUOTE (JesseJ @ Jun 10 2012, 10:30 PM) *
Here is my take on the matter . My guitar mentor and teacher always says that a great guitarist can make any guitar sound good. Period. I always thought it was all in the player and the guitar didn't even matter. I have a played (not owned ) A bunch of different guitars PRS SE models Fenders in all there many shapes and styles , Gibson SG's and Les Paul's , Vox , Lot's of ibanez's and many others . All of these guitars were fun and I enjoyed playing them.

But It wasnt until I bought my first guitar that I saw and felt the difference that quality makes !! I own a PRS ( not an SE the real thing hand made in the states!!! ) I paid A pretty penny for it used $1,600 US . And for a PRS that is considered a great deal . I do not have any regrets spending that kind of cash. I see so many people with thousands and thousands of dollars in music equipment saying they wish they could afford a nice guitar .

everybody ready for this ..... I ONLY HAVE ONE GUITAR !! shocking I know smile.gif But that is because I found the perfect guitar seriously sell your entire collection and buy 1 killer guitar . You will never look back. I find having an exspensive guitar does not make you a good guitarist but it inspires you encourages you and makes you want to play like you wouldn't believe . I understand not everyone can afford it and lucky for me I am still A teenager living at home so I can . but just save your pennies, or like i said sell your whole quiver and trade it in for 1 beast !


I have to say Jesse is right on the any guitar will sound good if a master is playing. I have seen it done. I once had this $100 squier and a buddy of mine made that thing sound like a million bucks. I thought WoW.... I remember thinking at the time I can't believe that guitar sounded like that. I never even knew it was capable of squealing like that !! Blew me away. Now I'm not saying rush out and buy a $100.00 Guitar but whatever you can afford will be good. I like to think that the money you put in your guitar is equal to the motivation you have to play. Just my 2 cents worth. Thanks Jesse for reminding me of that one.
ringmar
ALl you need is:

1. Setup to your liking?
2. Stays in tune?
3. Reasonable pickups?
4. Neck that is comfortable for your hands?

and most importantly:

5. MOTIVATES you to pick it up!

This can be had in any price range. #5 is a bit harder in the really lower end guitars for some people.

I am fortunate enough and have worked hard enough that I can afford some nice gear. Nicer gear than my level of playing. But it's pretty much my only diversion outside of work and family that I figure "why not?" I have a USA Jackson KING V hard tail, an Ibanez RG2560 (Japan version... got a crazy deal on it) and a I rent a gibson LP studio ($25 per month). Amp is a 50W EVH 5150III head into a EVH 4x12 cabinet. Getting a boss GT-10 for father's day.
Cosmin Lupu
QUOTE (Mike RR24 @ Jun 11 2012, 06:28 AM) *
I have to say Jesse is right on the any guitar will sound good if a master is playing. I have seen it done. I once had this $100 squier and a buddy of mine made that thing sound like a million bucks. I thought WoW.... I remember thinking at the time I can't believe that guitar sounded like that. I never even knew it was capable of squealing like that !! Blew me away. Now I'm not saying rush out and buy a $100.00 Guitar but whatever you can afford will be good. I like to think that the money you put in your guitar is equal to the motivation you have to play. Just my 2 cents worth. Thanks Jesse for reminding me of that one.


Precisely! smile.gif Well, I can tell you that the SE models are great axes and I wouldn't trade my Paul Allender guitar for anything. I also tried the new model, which by the way, sounds awesome biggrin.gif

Now, I agree that when your level of perception is in development, you may not know what's what with an axe, but the important elements have been stated below by ringmar! Have the guts to choose smile.gif you may go wrong once, maybe twice or maybe not at all, right?
thefireball
Thanks for this thread, guys. I still haven't found my dream guitar, so I have to deal with my two Ibanezes, a GIO and RG, and my Jackson SLSMG. I would like to upgrade my GIO, but the neck is not friendly. I can feel the cheap quality of it. It's hard to play stuff. But I can get a pretty good tone out of it, it's just not as clear.

If I just forget about all the latest doodads out there, it's a lot easier to be content with what I have. Half of me wants to sell my Ibanez GIO, and the other half doesn't. It was my first guitar. I probably wouldn't gain anything but more room. It's probably not worth anything.
Alex Feather
QUOTE (El Fortinero @ May 19 2012, 05:43 PM) *
Hey guys, so long!

As we built a rehearsal room in our drummer's house, I leave all my equipment there. At home i play with a fender squier stratocaster and a zoom gfx 707 and damn I can feel the difference.. so I was wondering..... what is the importance of having a professional/good instrument for you?

Once I was told that "the sound (your sound)" is in your fingers...maybe..but all the greatest guitarrist use top level instruments tongue.gif

I think it depends on you! I have seen people making a great recordings with cheap instruments and some making very bad with very expensive guitars! It's all in your mind not the instrument!
SirJamsalot
If you play good on a bad guitar, you'll be able to play good on a good guitar. If you play good on a good guitar, you might not be able to play good on a bad guitar smile.gif

Personally, I could care less what guitar I play on these days. The only up-side to a hot looking guitar is stage presence. The genre of music you play will often dictate the style of guitar you choose, not because of the sound/tone of the guitar, but because you'd look silly playing a flying V in a polka band. Or maybe not!

cool.gif
Mike RR24
QUOTE (SirJamsalot @ Jun 11 2012, 02:56 PM) *
If you play good on a bad guitar, you'll be able to play good on a good guitar. If you play good on a good guitar, you might not be able to play good on a bad guitar smile.gif

Personally, I could care less what guitar I play on these days. The only up-side to a hot looking guitar is stage presence. The genre of music you play will often dictate the style of guitar you choose, not because of the sound/tone of the guitar, but because you'd look silly playing a flying V in a polka band. Or maybe not!

cool.gif


That's funny Sirjamsalot I have a Inverted flying V Jackson and I'm getting a mental picture of that.
Of course I guess I'd use my LP fort that. biggrin.gif
Todd Simpson
QUOTE (Mike RR24 @ Jun 11 2012, 02:28 AM) *
I have to say Jesse is right on the any guitar will sound good if a master is playing. I have seen it done. I once had this $100 squier and a buddy of mine made that thing sound like a million bucks. I thought WoW.... I remember thinking at the time I can't believe that guitar sounded like that. I never even knew it was capable of squealing like that !! Blew me away. Now I'm not saying rush out and buy a $100.00 Guitar but whatever you can afford will be good. I like to think that the money you put in your guitar is equal to the motivation you have to play. Just my 2 cents worth. Thanks Jesse for reminding me of that one.


Yup smile.gif I agree 100 %. Paul Gilbert used to take the cheapest, trashed ibanez he could find off the wall during his clinics and make it sound amazing.

But the real thrust of this thead, was honestly just about not worrying about not being able to afford a crazy pricey guitar. Even if you are just starting out and can barely play, most any guitar will do for learning. Sure, it's always nice to have a better instrument and a Ferrari will feel better than a Buick Station Wagon, of course, just like a PRS will be nicer to play than say a guitar made from bailing wire. But extreme comparisons aside, it all starts and ends with the player. So don't think that just because you have a not so great guitar, that you are somehow at a huge loss.

QUOTE (SpaseMoonkey @ Jun 10 2012, 06:49 PM) *
Are you poking at me? laugh.gif

I almost sound like this very example, check my sig for my gear list. But Todd isn't lying at all. I have the gear, but I acquired an Ibanez S770 a few months ago. I did a trade in but the guitar was $900. The only reason it was a bit higher in price was the poplar wood finish, and that it was a H-S-H configuration. My friend owns a Ibanez S620 pretty much the same guitar I have just a different finish and its a dual humbucker setup. He paid about $300 less. They play pretty much the same once setup.

So its no lie, gear helps but you can find a great product at a cheaper price. I tend to look for used gear at stores, something I can go pick up and play. I've been thinking of going to check out a JEM7BLK, it has everything the higher end JEM's have minus the design on the neck. But for the price I don't think that little feature matters all the much.


You've got a nicer rig than I do by a long shot! And a much nicer Ibanez! Both of mine are quite old and were bought used with many miles already on them. But I do love em! smile.gif I think you nailed it on buying guitars. You really do have to actually go play what's available and see what your hands tell you about the instrument. Also, buying used gear gets you far more bang for you buck so I don't typically buy new instruments. The new instruments I do have were from Endorsements. Almost all the Axes I"ve paid for out of pocket are from Pawn Shops or Used from Music Stores.

I do spend money on the rest of the bits needed to record. So balancing ones spend is important. having a killer amp and guitar is an awesome thing. But if you run out of money and can't buy a decent audio interface, microhpones, software, monitors, decent music computer etc., then you still only most of the way there in terms of being able to write/record music. So plan each spend carefully.

maharzan
A good instrument really makes you polish your musical talents. I own 5 guitars. They are pretty expensive down here with a minimum $500 or so (for a $200ish guitar). And even though they are expensive they are very low quality. I owned a JEM as my first guitar but guess what, it detuned a lot, intonation issues and whenever I posted a take, everybody just commented about something is wrong with that guitar. With like 6-7 years with the same guitar, my ears obviously trained badly. I never knew about intonations. My bends are still struggling, things like that. So, I really recommend getting a really nice guitar before spending too many hours with it.
Todd Simpson
This is a GREAT point about intonation! Make SURE To get a guitar that will intonate properly. Yet another reason to buy, if at all possible, from a local shop where you can try it out, and even have it "Set Up" and intonated properly before you take it home for the first time. If you buy a guitar from a shop, have it intonated and it still isn't in tune above the 12th fret for example, DON"T TAKE IT HOME.

As many players are brand new, here is a SUPER QUICK AND DIRTY GUIDE TO INTONATION.

PIck up a guitar and tune it. Play a bar chord at the 5th, 9th, and 12th fret. Any chord will do so long as your first finger bars all the strings so you can move the chord around. It should sound "in tune" at every position. If you notice it sounds out of tune at the higher frets. the INTONATION IS PROBABLY WRONG.

You may be thinking that you can't really tell if a chord is in tune or not. At that point, you really need to ask the luthier/guitar tech at the shop (not the salesman typically unless they are very cool, as they might be on commission). Or bring someone with you, an instructor, band mate, friends, etc. who has more experience and can help you determine if the guitar is a keeper. Sort of like taking your Dad with you to buy your first car. Having someone with experience is helpful.

Of course, this won't be feasible for everyone. Some folks have told me they don't live near any music stores or pawn shops and that they have no musician friends close by so they have no choice but to buy site unseen from the internet. For someone starting out, this can have problems. Sometimes, it's fine. Sometimes, it's not.

The GMC family here can offer advice, but you really need to be able to touch/play an instrument you are buying, and learning how to tell if it's crap (won't tune/intonate properly, neck is warped, frets are worn, etc.) is a skill in itself and comes with time and experience about like playing guitar does smile.gif

Todd



QUOTE (maharzan @ Jun 12 2012, 01:54 AM) *
A good instrument really makes you polish your musical talents. I own 5 guitars. They are pretty expensive down here with a minimum $500 or so (for a $200ish guitar). And even though they are expensive they are very low quality. I owned a JEM as my first guitar but guess what, it detuned a lot, intonation issues and whenever I posted a take, everybody just commented about something is wrong with that guitar. With like 6-7 years with the same guitar, my ears obviously trained badly. I never knew about intonations. My bends are still struggling, things like that. So, I really recommend getting a really nice guitar before spending too many hours with it.

SirJamsalot
I second that - Good point about intonation issues. I have a very sensitive ear when it comes to +- cents out of tune instruments. The first turn off for a guitar is whether I can tune it in-store, play it and not have to re tune it. Nothing more harsh to my ears is a guitar falling out of tune mid-song. I've owned two guitars and two accoustics, and I rarely had/have to tune them once I get them dialed in. Not so with some other guitarists I play with... especially harsh on the ears when there's an instrumental clean-tone picking portion of a song and notes stop meshing pleasantly. ug!
maharzan
I wish I knew the sounds ( my ear is bad ) and it was my first ever guitar purchase. Didn't know nothing about neck / frets / body / pickups/ didn't know what whammy bars were. Of all the guitar I tried JEM felt comfortable although I m not really a vai fan nor I like that guitar hole. smile.gif Now, I know a lot about guitar. smile.gif
Mike RR24
I remember my first Electric Guitar I bought I went to Guitar Center and I picked out the LTD EC-1000 and they got it down from the wall and I played it but it was not in tune so I tuned it and it still kept losing tune. I took it home for $1069.00 with a case.
Then I got to learn what intonation was.. I had heard about it and that was about all. I searched the internet and did the intonation and tuning and it was perfect. Stayed in tune no problems. I noticed I had to offset the bridge and stop tail piece a little bit leaning to the right. Shortly there after I gave it to my wife and bought a Jackson Pro RR24 WoW a floyd rose Tremolo.
Never had a floating bridge before. Needless to say it took me 3.5 Hours to get it intonated and tuned the first time.
No I own 2 more with Floyd's and it's a piece of cake to tune and intonate. I wish I had known all the secrets in the beginning.
I will say though I have a Fender Strat Mexican version and it holds a tune like no other. Tune it up and intonate it and it never loses tune. Of course I don't use that tremolo bar on it at all. I ended up having to go back to guitar center to get the tools for my guitar and they gave me the wrong size allen so I had to go back again. The rest of my guitars were never from guitar center again. No BOX, no Tools, NO Manual. You live and learn. Now I swap out pickups and rewire and all kinds of stuff in a pretty short time but it took me a good deal of my time to learn all the tricks associated with guitars. I went overboard to the tune of $10,000.00 ohmy.gif on Equipment and Guitars. I think they call it "Gear Syndrome" I kept thinking if I only had this I could play better, it I only had that etc... etc....etc... little did I know to play good I had to practice like I meant it. Anyway I don't really regret it as I have everything to record and Voice Processors etc and I'll never need to buy anything else for a while. Yeah right!!! rolleyes.gif

Todd Simpson
I've seen "Gear Syndrome" quite a lot as an instructor where students think the same thing you are talking about. "If I just had this, and this, and this, I"d sound like a milliion bux!" Well, it's partly true. You'd sound like whatever level you play at, playing through really nice gear. It won't hurt, but time getting money, gear, together has to be weighed against time not spent actually getting better by practicing.

It's normal and natural to want great gear. I love gear smile.gif But just having gear (believe it or not) won't make you sound much better than you actually are, nor will it make you "want" to practice despite the fact that it seems like it would be "motivating". That usually lasts about a week. Then it gets hard again. So unless you can buy motivational gear each week, your motivation is going to have to come from within. That's the real secret to getting better smile.gif

QUOTE (Mike RR24 @ Jun 12 2012, 02:45 PM) *
I remember my first Electric Guitar I bought I went to Guitar Center and I picked out the LTD EC-1000 and they got it down from the wall and I played it but it was not in tune so I tuned it and it still kept losing tune. I took it home for $1069.00 with a case.
Then I got to learn what intonation was.. I had heard about it and that was about all. I searched the internet and did the intonation and tuning and it was perfect. Stayed in tune no problems. I noticed I had to offset the bridge and stop tail piece a little bit leaning to the right. Shortly there after I gave it to my wife and bought a Jackson Pro RR24 WoW a floyd rose Tremolo.
Never had a floating bridge before. Needless to say it took me 3.5 Hours to get it intonated and tuned the first time.
No I own 2 more with Floyd's and it's a piece of cake to tune and intonate. I wish I had known all the secrets in the beginning.
I will say though I have a Fender Strat Mexican version and it holds a tune like no other. Tune it up and intonate it and it never loses tune. Of course I don't use that tremolo bar on it at all. I ended up having to go back to guitar center to get the tools for my guitar and they gave me the wrong size allen so I had to go back again. The rest of my guitars were never from guitar center again. No BOX, no Tools, NO Manual. You live and learn. Now I swap out pickups and rewire and all kinds of stuff in a pretty short time but it took me a good deal of my time to learn all the tricks associated with guitars. I went overboard to the tune of $10,000.00 ohmy.gif on Equipment and Guitars. I think they call it "Gear Syndrome" I kept thinking if I only had this I could play better, it I only had that etc... etc....etc... little did I know to play good I had to practice like I meant it. Anyway I don't really regret it as I have everything to record and Voice Processors etc and I'll never need to buy anything else for a while. Yeah right!!! rolleyes.gif

Mike RR24
QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Jun 13 2012, 03:08 PM) *
I've seen "Gear Syndrome" quite a lot as an instructor where students think the same thing you are talking about. "If I just had this, and this, and this, I"d sound like a milliion bux!" Well, it's partly true. You'd sound like whatever level you play at, playing through really nice gear. It won't hurt, but time getting money, gear, together has to be weighed against time not spent actually getting better by practicing.

It's normal and natural to want great gear. I love gear smile.gif But just having gear (believe it or not) won't make you sound much better than you actually are, nor will it make you "want" to practice despite the fact that it seems like it would be "motivating". That usually lasts about a week. Then it gets hard again. So unless you can buy motivational gear each week, your motivation is going to have to come from within. That's the real secret to getting better smile.gif



Todd you could not have said it better. I don't regret the gear I have but It's hard again and I'm having to study because I want to get better and I have all the time available right now. When I start playing I want to play more and when I learn something I could not do before I really start loving it. I have to practice something everyday that I can learn. I have trouble with boring routines of scales and such. I have to see how technique works on the guitar itself. It does help my wife being a guitar player. We get to play together and it helps us with our timing. Otherwise we will play with backing tracks or the song.
awat
You are going to have to find a tone you like and can work with. I have played cheap guitars and got a good tone and played expensive ones and could not get a good tone. Try every guitar you can and amp and effects until you get the sound you are after.
I was trying to get a holdsworth tone. My instructor got it for me. He plays like Holdsworth and Gambale and knows how to get their tones.

Tony
snackajacks
QUOTE (Gabriel Leopardi @ May 20 2012, 08:41 PM) *
I agree with Cosmin's words about this and I would like to share this video where how important the fingers are.... biggrin.gif



haha when I saw this topic, I wanted to post this too smile.gif
I really like the vid
JesseJ
A few points I want to make.

I think we all agree that you do not need an expensive guitar to become good or sound good .
I also agree with what sirjamsalot said.

" if you have an expensive guitar you might not be able to make a cheap guitar
sound nice, but if you have a cheap guitar you will know how to make both a
cheap and a expensive guitar sound nice "


And when todd said that you should get your inspiration from within I believe he hit the nail on the head .

I went to a music store the other day and played a bunch of cheaper guitars and found I couldn't play as fast , had trouble getting the sound I wanted out of them , some of them didn't have a nice crunch sound when I was trying to palm mute .

And I also agree 100% with buying used equipment . you get much nicer equipment for a lower price smile.gif
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