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GMC Forum _ CHILL OUT _ Not Guitar Related: No Petrol Cars Uk 2030?
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 24 2021, 04:53 AM
I just found out that as of 2030, in the UNITED KINGDOM, cars running on GAS/petrol, will no longer be available as new vehicles. Yup. You can buy a used car that runs on gas, but as of 2030, you can't buy a new car that runs on gas in the UK. Wow. I had no idea we were that close to banning new gas cars in any country, much less that is was less than a decade away. Don't get me wrong, I think it's a positive step. Still, it won't make "petrol heads" very happy I don't think. This means that sports cars using gas, like your average Porsche, Mustang, etc. are going away in terms of new models being sold.
The value of performance cars running gas is about to spike up IMHO in the UK. The used market is about to get very competitive. Have any of you in the UK heard about this?
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Posted by: AK Rich May 24 2021, 05:53 AM
And then there's this as well.
https://www.motorious.com/articles/news/uk-government-classic-car-buyers/
I also recently read about a new tax or fee for older cars that are driven x amount of hours per week or something to that effect somewhere in Europe.
Posted by: Phil66 May 24 2021, 07:24 AM
Yes, we know about it, personally I can't see them getting the infrastructure in place by then, the transition period will be a long one. Are the moment most car parks only have a couple of E charging points.
Ford have an electric Mustang out that is nothing like the "real" one https://www.ford.co.uk/cars/mustang-mach-e
Porsche have one out that by all accounts is brilliant https://www.porsche.com/uk/models/taycan/taycan-models/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI2uvb7dbh8AIVkdxRCh1sAQRrEAAYASAAEgJ0yfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
Jaguar have the iPace https://www.jaguar.co.uk/jaguar-range/i-pace/index.html?utm_medium=cpc&utm_source=Google&utm_campaign=X590_C/UK/GB/JAG/03523683-001_CONVER-GET_MY19_1704-3112_ENG_JaguarBrand_BG_ALON_BMM_(OLD)_Retail_New&utm_term=jaguar%20i%20pace&utm_content=&cm_mmc=PPC_Google-_-Retail-I%20PACE-_-X590_C/UK/GB/JAG/03523683-001_CONVER-GET_MY19_1704-3112_ENG_JaguarBrand_BG_ALON_BMM_(OLD)_Retail_New-_-&gclsrc=aw.ds&
All the above are fully electric, there are others, particularly in the smaller hatchback sector.
I'm gonna miss the induction and exhaust music of performance cars 
Posted by: PosterBoy May 24 2021, 11:56 AM
I'll miss not hearing a car coming up behind me when I cycling. Got quite a shock when a BMW i8 overtook me silently the other day
Posted by: Caelumamittendum May 24 2021, 12:08 PM
That's a good point. While I do check by sight as well if there are any cars, I do use my ears too a lot, and cyclists can be easily startled if a car is noiseless.
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 25 2021, 04:54 AM
I was flat out shocked to be honest. I know there are a LOT of "Petrol heads" in the UK, after all TOP GEAR is a BBC production. That show is gonna be a different thing after 2030. I doubt the UK will be the only country to make this drastic change.
The good news is, older cars are "grandfathered" in. So you will still be able to buy a Porsche or what not. it's just that there won't be ANY new gas powered cars coming in after 2030 which is hard to get one's head around. sure, I new it was going this way, but not quite this quickly. It's a HUGE change and will require a MASSIVE amount of infrastructure to make this work and not a lot of time to make it happen.
The changes to the entire culture are going to be enormous and I don't think that has been accounted for to be honest. It's not just changing one thing, it's changing everything relating to vehicle ownership and maintenance. The knock on effects are wide reaching. I applaud them for leading the way. It will serve as a template for the rest of the world as we all make this change. However, I can't see it happening that quickly over here. Folks love their FULL SIZE TRUCKS and SPORTS CARS. We will make the change, but it won't be quick or quiet.
NOT TO MENTION: Phill your company is based on performance parts for petrol cars right?
Will this kill off gasoline based racing? Is that to be banned as well? is it all going to be electric car racing? F1 to be battery powered? It's just hard to see.
TAXES FOR OLD CARS:
I saw that link about a 30 PERCENT TAX FOR OLD GAS BURNING CARS. Ouch!!! So basically, only well off folks will be members of various car clubs which are popular in the UK? so the MG owners club, along with all the others is about to see some big changes. Getting involved now has a much greater barrier to entry and eventually even getting gasoline will be expensive and difficult as gas stations switch to electric.
Here is a video talking about some of the upcoming issues. not least of which is that the UK POWER GRID is not even close to being able to handling a nation of electric cars, not near enough chargers, etc. A huge amount of change is coming. The way the UK navigates it will be a lesson for the world.
Posted by: Mertay May 25 2021, 08:23 AM
To me it seemed like they see the obvious trend of the future and to have a role in this industry (worldwide), forcing their way in staring by changing their own rules.
Considering England was once big in the car industry this is a huge chance for them to re-live those glory days. If they manage to get the infrastructure ready in such a short time, private firms will invest big time in England giving them a chance to compete with EU.
Posted by: Phil66 May 25 2021, 08:26 AM
The knock on effect will be HUGE eventually. Think of all the little independent garages that service cars, petrol stations will decline, the engine supply chain will be gone, hundreds of thousands of jobs, they can't all be replaced with battery making jobs.
I haven't heard about racing bans yet, the majority of our business is based on engines being rebuilt for performance, fast road, track days, racing etc, we're not involved in F1 any more. We had a big drop in work when the BTCC went from unlimited engines per year down to three. We supplied three teams, we used to make 120 parts three or four times a year for each team, now that's down to 12 components at the beginning of the year for each team. That had a hit on turnover so imagine the big supply companies, the raw material industries, oem component manufacturers etc.
I seriously can't see the infrastructure being sorted. Even things like holiday home parks will need charging points for every home, they also need to address range and charging time, people don't want to be stopping for three hours on their journey to top up the battery.
Lots to think about and I don't think the government have thought about it enough.
Posted by: Caelumamittendum May 25 2021, 08:38 AM
I think it's the right step to take, but whether it can be done by 2030 I'm less sure of. But I do like to see things like this being planned out, so we can care more about the planet. In my opinion we have nothing to lose as humans by caring more about the planet, instead of exploiting it. I think we need to be even better about that - from forest burnings to fossil fuel.
Posted by: Steve Gilfield May 25 2021, 11:28 AM
Take the train to France or fly to Ireland.
Buy a new petrol car.
Drive it to the UK.
Nevertheless, going green is the future. In October there will be a car show on EVs from almost every car manufacturer.
Electric is the future/trend now.
Posted by: Phil66 May 25 2021, 12:03 PM
I agree 100% with looking after the planet more but the lithium industry isn't all that good for the environment https://www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/renewable/the-environmental-impact-of-lithium-batteries/#:~:text=Lithium%20extraction%20harms%20the%20soil,livestock%20and%20for%20crop%20irrigation.
There is a fuel that is very green, and when burnt the only emission is water, it's called hydrogen. There are problems with storage as it is highly flammable https://www.energy.gov/eere/fuelcells/hydrogen-fuel-basics I saw a program recently and a scientist has developed a hydrogen paste cartridge that is safe and you could exchange at a garage (service station) as easily as putting petrol in. I can't remember the whole concept though, or production costs but that would be a great way to go.
Posted by: klasaine May 25 2021, 03:29 PM
It's obviously the way of the future and we've known that for at least the last 40 years.
Out here in Cali we've been talking about 'green' energy since I was in elementary school.
When they get the battery distance to 400 miles (644 km) or some seriously fast charging, I'm in. *I need to be able to make it to San Francisco (from L.A.) in 6 to 8 hours.
Two years ago I bought what I'm assuming will be my last completely gas powered vehicle.
Posted by: Caelumamittendum May 25 2021, 05:20 PM
Out here in Cali we've been talking about 'green' energy since I was in elementary school.
When they get the battery distance to 400 miles (644 km) or some seriously fast charging, I'm in. *I need to be able to make it to San Francisco (from L.A.) in 6 to 8 hours.
Two years ago I bought what I'm assuming will be my last completely gas powered vehicle.
Yup! I agree that there are still a lot of work to be done for it to be a viable option, which it isn't yet. But hopefully we can slowly move towards a better future for the planet before it's too late
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 25 2021, 07:31 PM
Being an Englishman, and being a member of the industry yourself, that is based on petrol, you are uniquely placed imho to weigh in on this discussion so I"m glad that you are.
It seems you are spot on in every way imho. The knock on effects seem to be being underestimated if the timeline of 2030 is to be believed. As you mention, the roll out of charging stations, nation wide, to every single corner of the country would need to have been started a bit back if this deadline is going to work.
secondly, the elimination of an entire industry of jobs is going to be a huge shock to the economy imho. Certainly new jobs will be created, this too is a huge challenge in that the change will be happening as new schools/training centers are being built to train the people needed to work on new types of vehicles etc.
The entire UK economy is on the brink of a massive shift due to this change. I dare say the entire culture is about to undergo a huge change. The good news is, if it's done well, it will me cleaner air and potentially a leading position for the UK on the world stage. The UK could be a world leader in making the transition away from petrol and the entire planet could come to England for consulting on how to do this. Experts from the uk will be in demand all over the globe. So it could be the start of English dominance of an entire sector of the world economy that we haven't seen since the days when the sun never set on England as the Empire was just that huge.
However, if they drop the ball on this, it will cripple the country's economy and it may never recover. This is a huge gamble it seems. If they pull it off, the future is bright indeed.
As a member of the industry that will be directly impacted, I wanted to ask if you are going to start making changes to your business???
I haven't heard about racing bans yet, the majority of our business is based on engines being rebuilt for performance, fast road, track days, racing etc, we're not involved in F1 any more. We had a big drop in work when the BTCC went from unlimited engines per year down to three. We supplied three teams, we used to make 120 parts three or four times a year for each team, now that's down to 12 components at the beginning of the year for each team. That had a hit on turnover so imagine the big supply companies, the raw material industries, oem component manufacturers etc.
I seriously can't see the infrastructure being sorted. Even things like holiday home parks will need charging points for every home, they also need to address range and charging time, people don't want to be stopping for three hours on their journey to top up the battery.
Lots to think about and I don't think the government have thought about it enough.
Pay 30 percent in tax when you go to register the car to get a plate.
Buy a new petrol car.
Drive it to the UK.
Nevertheless, going green is the future. In October there will be a car show on EVs from almost every car manufacturer.
Electric is the future/trend now.
Posted by: Caelumamittendum May 25 2021, 08:02 PM
You probably won't believe this but the registration tax for a purchase of a new vehicle (car) here in Denmark is 150%, only recently lowered from 180%. At least for cars over €26000 or so.
"The registration tax applied to new cars in Denmark is value-based and amounts to 85% of the car's taxable value up to DKK 197,700 (€26,500), and 150% for the value above, according to the ACEA 2020 Tax Guide. The parties have agreed that an extra tier will be introduced, whereby a lower 25% tax rate will be applied to the car’s value up to DKK 65,000 in 2021. The 85% tax rate will then be applied up to the slightly higher value of DKK 202,200 in 2021, with the 150% rate above that level."
https://www.thelocal.dk/20151120/whats-the-deal-with-denmarks-car-registration-tax/
Posted by: Phil66 May 25 2021, 08:04 PM
I really don't think there will be an industry for small manufacturers of batteries, they will be mass-produced oem supplied and replaced. There wouldn't be any way that we could be world leaders as we are now known, the processes will be the same for all batteries.
I'm hoping that there will be classic motorsport based on the internal combustion engine for many years to come. The impact on the environment will be negligible once all of the petrol/diesel cars are off the road.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/weekend-debate-what-is-future-for-f1-as-world-moves-towards-ban-on-petrol-cars/3221786/
I can only think that we would have to go into general sub contract engineering but that would be a huge financial investment and a lot of wasted machinery like our in-house designed 600 ton forging press, all of our bespoke fixtures, jigs etc with many machines being modified by the manufacturer to hold the fixtures before being delivered to us. We can always revert them but as said, ££££££££
I'm pretty sure internal combustion engines will be providing us with an income for a long time yet.
Posted by: AK Rich May 26 2021, 04:25 AM
I wouldn't be at all surprised to see that 2030 deadline pushed out as far as 2050. And in this country, it ain't happening in a long long time. Heck, we are in a new muscle car era at the moment and have been for a while. They are very popular. I've never even seen a car that is fully electric.
Posted by: klasaine May 26 2021, 03:54 PM
Come to my neck of the woods
Posted by: Caelumamittendum May 26 2021, 03:57 PM
I'm pretty sure we have a lot here too, and especially nurses or similar who drive around to people's homes all day seem to use these (although they're paid for by the job/state/municipality or whatever of course). I'm not totally knowledgable on cars though. Never had a big interest or even have a license.
Posted by: liveOASISforever May 26 2021, 06:51 PM
Completely agree with Phil.
I can never see the UK going all electric by 2030. Infrastructure cannot be put in place for this. I love engines and the thought of going away from that saddens me.
Also how much greener is it mass producing big batteries and disposing of them.
With the euro regulations manufacturers have to comply with and are regularly updating engines to meet the standards meaning cleaner for the environment. Am fine with this but getting rid of fuelled engines is not the right thing to do.
For the greener thing to work it would need the full world involved. Again dont think that would be possible. The UK is a very small footprint compared to the rest of the world.
I could definitely see alot more accidents happening with going all electric. Pedestrians crossing the road because they dont hear anything coming. Also with electric motorbikes filtering through traffic and some one pulling out on them because they dont hear them. Seen it already in big cities like London.
Posted by: jstcrsn May 26 2021, 11:35 PM
my In-laws build custom rods, I can't even imagine going down the road without the roar of these engines
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 27 2021, 12:21 AM
WOW!!!! That is staggering. So it costs the price of the car, plus another half the cost of the car to buy a new car? Egad!!! I thought we had some high taxes. At least it's not quite as bad for cheaper cars.
"The registration tax applied to new cars in Denmark is value-based and amounts to 85% of the car's taxable value up to DKK 197,700 (€26,500), and 150% for the value above, according to the ACEA 2020 Tax Guide. The parties have agreed that an extra tier will be introduced, whereby a lower 25% tax rate will be applied to the car’s value up to DKK 65,000 in 2021. The 85% tax rate will then be applied up to the slightly higher value of DKK 202,200 in 2021, with the 150% rate above that level."
https://www.thelocal.dk/20151120/whats-the-deal-with-denmarks-car-registration-tax/
Sadly, it's something we will all have to get used to at some point.
I know how big motorsport is in the UK and I can't see it just switching over to battery powered race cars to be honest. "Petrol Head" culture is deeply embedded, as it is here. The entire world will be watching to see how this rolls out.
I'm pretty sure internal combustion engines will be providing us with an income for a long time yet.
It's a HUGE goal to set to be sure. It's going to be very tough to meet that deadline. Maybe they will have to push it back at some point. As of now, it's the law and it's on the books. It's going to be a template for the rest of the world as they roll out electric cars. I do hope it serves to support the economy and not to destroy it.
Posted by: Caelumamittendum May 27 2021, 12:26 AM
Generally the public transportation is very good here in Denmark, from busses to metro to trains. And in shorter distances (like up to 5-6 miles a lot of people just ride bicycles, some even further distances). Of course we still have many people riding cars, don't get me wrong.
Then the prices for gas. A gallon is about 5,8 USD here, I believe. I think that's fairly higher than in the US too, right?
EDIT: Also electrical battery powered bicycles with assisting motors are becoming a popular thing here too. They assist you, but you still have to use the pedals, but the motor helps you ride faster with less resistance, so it's good for longer distances. They're a bit expensive though. I have one too, which looks like this:
The motor is in the crank and the battery is in the frame.
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 28 2021, 10:56 PM
Thats very clever indeed! One more bit of news President Biden has a plan to get rid of ALL FOSSIL FUEL IN THE ELECTRIC GRID BY 2035! This would be a HUGE change and would require enormous amounts of new construction. It would mean a lot of jobs but also a lot less money for big oil companies. It's controversial but I hope it works out
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/bidens-infrastructure-plan-would-make-electricity-carbon-free-by-2035/
Then the prices for gas. A gallon is about 5,8 USD here, I believe. I think that's fairly higher than in the US too, right?
EDIT: Also electrical battery powered bicycles with assisting motors are becoming a popular thing here too. They assist you, but you still have to use the pedals, but the motor helps you ride faster with less resistance, so it's good for longer distances. They're a bit expensive though. I have one too, which looks like this:
The motor is in the crank and the battery is in the frame.
Posted by: jstcrsn May 28 2021, 10:56 PM
I can never see the UK going all electric by 2030. Infrastructure cannot be put in place for this. I love engines and the thought of going away from that saddens me.
Also how much greener is it mass producing big batteries and disposing of them.
With the euro regulations manufacturers have to comply with and are regularly updating engines to meet the standards meaning cleaner for the environment. Am fine with this but getting rid of fuelled engines is not the right thing to do.
For the greener thing to work it would need the full world involved. Again dont think that would be possible. The UK is a very small footprint compared to the rest of the world.
I could definitely see alot more accidents happening with going all electric. Pedestrians crossing the road because they dont hear anything coming. Also with electric motorbikes filtering through traffic and some one pulling out on them because they dont hear them. Seen it already in big cities like London.
it is not greener . We saw what would happen when we lost power and could not get "natural" electricity due to snow/weather. Germany loves telling the world they are completelty green whilst buying Nuclear power from france. The only way to get that much is coal powered or Nuclear (which no one wants) not to mention sources of travel that electricity can't handle (planes , trains, boats), the time it would take to recharge at a station when everyone else is in line to do the same and then the "power" station goes down and no one has alternatives. I believe something else will come along well before electricity is capable enough, if we have not already passed up natural gas which powers better and is not as harsh on the environment.
Posted by: AK Rich May 28 2021, 11:19 PM
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/bidens-infrastructure-plan-would-make-electricity-carbon-free-by-2035/
And monkeys might fly out of my butt. That is a pipe dream without some kind of new energy source or going fully nuclear. Wind and solar simply cannot substitute fossil fuels in generating power, period, full stop, end of story and that's all she wrote. And do you know how many acres of wind or solar farms it takes to equal what one coal fired plant can produce? It's not even remotely close to equal.
Then there is the problem with disposing of old solar panels which are toxic waste.
Posted by: Caelumamittendum May 28 2021, 11:57 PM
At least it's an act to try to improve our use of energy and a search of finding a viable source of energy rather than draining the earth of a finite source and messing up the climate (if you believe that, which I do), right?
Posted by: AK Rich May 29 2021, 12:40 AM
I can appreciate that, the sentiment, but that time frame simply isn't feasible with the alternatives we have now, even when you add existing hydroelectric and such.
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 29 2021, 02:02 AM
The good news is that TESLA is doing large battery backups of solar grids in Australia and soon in the states. So that the next time we have one of those storms in texas, the battery backups will come online and prevent the same kind of tragedy. It's a battery backup for a solar farm. They are already using it full stop end of story. It scales to the Terawatt/Hr range. So yeah, it's already a viable system. We are just slow on the uptake. BTW the law is already on the books in England. They are going to beat us to the punch by quite a bit.
Posted by: jstcrsn May 29 2021, 03:49 AM
lets not forget about by products of solar feilds =Global Warming on steroids
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2560494/Worlds-largest-solar-farm-SCORCHING-BIRDS-fly-it.html
https://phys.org/news/2016-11-solar-island-effect-large-scale-power.html
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 30 2021, 05:14 AM
If we start looking to the daily mail for scientific advice we are already doomed While a few birds will get scorched, it hardly outweighs the benfits. Also the "heat effect" is limited to about 100 yards around the solar farm so not a big deal. Just more hype. Here is a quote from your article.
the added heat dissipates quickly and can't be measured 100 feet away from the power plants.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2560494/Worlds-largest-solar-farm-SCORCHING-BIRDS-fly-it.html
https://phys.org/news/2016-11-solar-island-effect-large-scale-power.html
Posted by: Todd Simpson Aug 15 2021, 06:22 AM
Thought I'd ad this to the thread. There is a NEW COUNTACH!! And it's a HYBRID!! yup. More than 800 horses and it has a battery with a 12 cylinder. As if the 12 cylinder engine wasnt enough Also classic scissor doors. if this is the future of cars im a happy guy I think it would be allowed in the UK as it's a hybrid, i mean after the 2030 ban takes place but i'm not sure.
Posted by: Phil66 Aug 15 2021, 09:49 AM
Also classic scissor doors. if this is the future of cars im a happy guy I think it would be allowed in the UK as it's a hybrid, i mean after the 2030 ban takes place but i'm not sure.After 2030 you would be able to buy that awesome beast in the UK until 2035, then all hybrib car sales are banned.
Going on what we've been chatting about Todd, it might be an idea for manufacturers to have a suitable external soundtrack to match the looks and performance of electric cars,, on performance models there could be a lovely sonorous performance induction and exhaust sound track, on town cars it could be just a normal exhaust sound this would help with pedestrian and cyclist safety too
Posted by: Todd Simpson Aug 16 2021, 03:16 AM
Evidently the "piped in fake sound" thing is very controversial? Been reading wads of angry folks saying how horrible and lame it is to pipe in fake sound. I didn't think people would be so upset by this? I thought it was just a feature and would be expanded in the future as in in car purchase. To make your car sound like a ferrari etc. when there is no engine noise as a car might be electric. Seems some folks really hate this idea. Have you run across this?
I was watching a rally of old lambos on youtube and it was kinda funny when the support lambo started spewing smoke and 4 cars went down and had to be repaired before they got where they were going. So one good thing for lambo owners could be reliability when they switch to all battery
The guy making the video was the only car to make it the entire way 
Going on what we've been chatting about Todd, it might be an idea for manufacturers to have a suitable external soundtrack to match the looks and performance of electric cars,, on performance models there could be a lovely sonorous performance induction and exhaust sound track, on town cars it could be just a normal exhaust sound this would help with pedestrian and cyclist safety too
Posted by: Phil66 Aug 16 2021, 07:07 AM
Most petrol heads don't like the piped in sound in the cabin, me included, it's not overpowering and people I;ve had in my car don't really notice it, they don't even notice the exhaust not change when switching to sport mode but petrol heads are a different breed and notice everything 
Posted by: PosterBoy Aug 16 2021, 08:36 AM
Piped in Fake sound argument = Modellers vs tube amps
Posted by: Phil66 Aug 16 2021, 10:34 AM
Except the piped in sound isn't as good as a modeller
Posted by: Todd Simpson Aug 16 2021, 06:41 PM
I didn't realize it was such a controversial topic. Some petrol heads feel very strongly about this issue. it seems a minor thing to me but I guess I'm not a full on "petrol head" If I were, evidently I'd be on one side or the other screaming, from the look of it.
it seems a small thing though? if one wants it, great, if not, just turn it off right? It can be turned off yes?
I think it will get better with time like we talked about. I do see "in car purchase" of Ferrari engine noise for one's electric car in the future
Posted by: Phil66 Aug 16 2021, 07:40 PM
I haven't found a way to turn mine off yet 
If I'm ticking over in sport mode I get a throbbing sound like a V8 is behind me, I think the pitch of the piped in sound at tickover is very close to the actual engine sound that it gives that effect like when you're running up to the next string and get close, it kinda wobbles, I don't know what it's technically called.
Peace
If I were, evidently I'd be on one side or the other screaming, from the look of it. it seems a small thing though? if one wants it, great, if not, just turn it off right? It can be turned off yes?
Posted by: Todd Simpson Aug 18 2021, 06:00 AM
In the tesla you can not only pick your engine sound but you can select your own horn sound!!! It can be just about anything including APPLAUSE and this is heard outside the cabin at full volume as the cars horn sound. Yup. it's only a matter of time until the "in app purchase" finds its way in to tesla and every other vendors infotainment system. I'm surprised it's not already available.
*This is one of the fastest cars ever built for the road. 2.0 sec 0 to 60. You can beat that if you have millions to spend though.
If I'm ticking over in sport mode I get a throbbing sound like a V8 is behind me, I think the pitch of the piped in sound at tickover is very close to the actual engine sound that it gives that effect like when you're running up to the next string and get close, it kinda wobbles, I don't know what it's technically called.
Peace
Posted by: AK Rich Aug 18 2021, 08:35 AM
The Tesla is actually 6th according to this 1st list. Some of the cars haven't actually been proven yet as far as I know. They are still claims by the manufacturers, this includes that Tesla S Plaid. Interestingly enough, the fastest ones are also EV's and they don't go very far on a charge. Some can only do a couple or a few laps at Nurburgring. I was only able to find 1 list of cars where the Tesla was ranked 1st 0 to 60.
https://fastestlaps.com/lists/top-fastest-cars-0-to-60-mph
https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/best-cars-vans/99404/fastest-accelerating-cars-worl
https://www.hotcars.com/ranking-quickest-cars-arriving-on-the-market-in-2021/
Slightly different criteria but lists some cars faster than 2 second 0 to 60.
https://www.carfax.com/blog/fastest-cars
There is also some potentially bad news for Tesla recently.
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/tesla-investigation-ev-cras
Posted by: Todd Simpson Aug 18 2021, 09:49 AM
Maybe Tesla should have said fastest 0 to 60 under a HALF A MILLION DOLLARS Some very fast cars available about half a million plus Of course, you have to get on the wait list for these often, even if you have the money. Tesla has been saying "fastest 0 to 60 ever in a production car" with the plaid and the press has picked it up as well. it seems they were boasting a bit but not by much and not at their price point. Next best bet looks to be the ferrari at just under half a million
One bad thing i've come across is folks saying battery packs live about 10 years. I'm sure this varies, but if a car goes out of warranty and the battery goes back, it can make the car a write off, depending on costs of course.
https://fastestlaps.com/lists/top-fastest-cars-0-to-60-mph
https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/best-cars-vans/99404/fastest-accelerating-cars-worl
https://www.hotcars.com/ranking-quickest-cars-arriving-on-the-market-in-2021/
Slightly different criteria but lists some cars faster than 2 second 0 to 60.
https://www.carfax.com/blog/fastest-cars
There is also some potentially bad news for Tesla recently.
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/tesla-investigation-ev-cras
Posted by: AK Rich Aug 18 2021, 07:20 PM
$130,000 starting price for a Tesla S Plaid isn't exactly a bargain either, especially if the batteries are only good for 10 years. Even the cheapest Model 3 Tesla starts at about $42,000 and has a range of 263 miles. I have a $40,000+ gas powered car but it's fully loaded and not baseline. I have the extended lifetime warranty (which I highly recommend for any new car purchase) and take really good care of it, so I expect to get 300,000 miles out of it. Also, those batteries don't do so well in cold climates like where I live. 40% less range it is said on average. To me, EV's aren't much more than a novelty at this point. Probably best to wait 5 or 10 years before considering them.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Aug 18 2021, 07:35 PM
They are still finding their footing to be sure They are quickly taking over though. Most of the car builders are planning to switch to hybrid/ev as time goes forward. The UK has already put that law on the books banning petrol cars by 2030. It's all moving toward EV/Hybrid but I do will not be jumping ship quite yet. Like you I have a gas powered car and I don't plan on getting rid of it or switching to EV any time soon. Many folks, especially younger folks, are way in to it and do plan to switch. It's the future, but yeah i'm gonna keep my gas car for now.
Here is the rimac (3 million) racing the Tesla. the rimac is a limited production run hypercar. It's a great example of what can be done on batteries. Bit pricey though. For a bit over 100k the tesla is amazingly fast.
Posted by: AK Rich Aug 19 2021, 01:28 AM
Have you heard about the Devel Sixteen? It's powered by a Quad turbo 5000 hp 16 cylinder engine aiming to be the fastest production car ever built.
https://www.motorbiscuit.com/dont-blink-miss-5000-hp-devel-sixteen-hypercars-ridiculous-test-video/
https://develmotors.com/m/
Posted by: Todd Simpson Aug 19 2021, 06:24 AM
Ive heard of it for years but nobody seems to ever drive it on a speed run? So far, one of the Veyron variants looks like the fastest confirmed thing. The SSC speed run was fake so they don't count anymore and the DEVEL has never done a verified run that I know of. of course, once the EVs start focusing on top end, they will probably take over just like they have done with zero to sixty in cars people can actually afford.
https://www.motorbiscuit.com/dont-blink-miss-5000-hp-devel-sixteen-hypercars-ridiculous-test-video/
https://develmotors.com/m/
Posted by: AK Rich Aug 19 2021, 07:34 AM
Yeah, it's been in development for 4 or 5 years I think. Sounds like they are about ready to go after that Bugatti's top speed. We shall see.
PS: On paper but unconfirmed, there already are some really fast top end EV's. These are from the 1st list I shared above.
But it doesn't mean much if they can only go MAYBE 60 miles before they need a recharge.
https://fastestlaps.com/models/aspark-owl
https://fastestlaps.com/models/rimac-c-two
Posted by: Todd Simpson Aug 19 2021, 10:24 PM
Yeah those are gonna be fast but yeah probably not long distance cruiser. Everybody talks about beating the veyron but so far it's just talk.
quote name='AK Rich' date='Aug 19 2021, 02:34 AM' post='791674']
Yeah, it's been in development for 4 or 5 years I think. Sounds like they are about ready to go after that Bugatti's top speed. We shall see.
PS: On paper but unconfirmed, there already are some really fast top end EV's. These are from the 1st list I shared above.
But it doesn't mean much if they can only go MAYBE 60 miles before they need a recharge.
https://fastestlaps.com/models/aspark-owl
https://fastestlaps.com/models/rimac-c-two
[/quote]
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 15 2022, 10:17 AM
Looks like europe is still planning on a complete ban on gas powered cars by 2035. I don't know how this will be possible to be honest. It's just not that far away and it seems like there is so much work left to do in terms of infrastructure to support moving to an all electric fleet. Time will tell
ANY GMCers FROM EUROPE STARTING TO SEE CHANGES?
https://www.reuters.com/business/retail-consumer/eu-proposes-effective-ban-new-fossil-fuel-car-sales-2035-2021-07-14/
In terms of Motorsports, it should be a fun time though Here is a Tesla spanking the pants off of a brand new C8 corvette.
NEVER FEAR!!! The Vette will be competitive again and able to spank the battery cars, since the next vette will probably be HYBRID! It will add electric motors to it's v8 and will take back it's rightful place from these four door, grocery getting Teslas
https://www.motor1.com/news/555113/chevrolet-corvette-eray-hybrid-spied/
Posted by: PosterBoy Feb 15 2022, 01:05 PM
One of the biggest issues I see here for electric cars is charging.
So many people are renting houses, are landlords going to have to install charging points
Houses without parking, Apartment blocks etc
I work for one of the world's biggest companies in the electrical industry, our site has just under 200 employees and has only just got 2 parking spaces for electric cars.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 15 2022, 08:26 PM
Agreed!! I've heard all sorts of plans, but it just seems a bit of a challenge to get enough charging stations out there to support an entire country of electric cars in just a decade or so? Seems nearly impossible. Of course, if they let folks use hybrid and not full EV then the entire thing could probably work as folks in apartment blocks/high rises etc. won't have a handy way to charge but they could use a hybrid and not need to plug in since the gas engine can charge the motor Sadly, it looks like new Hybrid car sales (not used) will be BANNED just five years after gas cars. So gas ban 2030 hybrid ban 2035.
Also, a new law in the UK requires ALL new housing construction to have a built in car charger.
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-59369715 This won't help folks who don't own single family homes though. Those folks will just have to sort it any way they can.
I've heard some plans to replace one petrol pump in each and every gas station in the UK so that there is more coverage but charging still takes half an hour or so. If youhave a few people waiting, all of the sudden it's a jam up.
Some more info.
CALIFORNIA PLANS TO JOIN IN
Yup. California plans to try to do something similar along the same timeline as what is planned in the UK. It's the most aggressive plan of any state in the union so far.
On the flipside, please to enjoy the "Unicorn Stripper Spec" ultra rare symbol of automotive crazy that is the 1 of 1 2009 LP640 Coupe with a Manual Transmission and rear wheel drive.
So many people are renting houses, are landlords going to have to install charging points
Houses without parking, Apartment blocks etc
I work for one of the world's biggest companies in the electrical industry, our site has just under 200 employees and has only just got 2 parking spaces for electric cars.
Posted by: klasaine Feb 16 2022, 06:52 AM
I bought my last gas powered car 3 years ago. When it's done, I'll go all electric most likely.
My wife just got a new hybrid. A Hyundai Ioniq.
Plenty of charge stations out here.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 16 2022, 08:17 PM
As you know, Mr Newsom is leading the charge towards renewables and the large tax base in California (fueled by silicon valley/entertainment industry) is making it possible for amazing advances infrastructure that will make the transition smoother.
It's the rest of the country that will have to do a bit of catching up. it may take federal spending to help make the transition smooth. The charge infrastructure will need to be built ahead of the actual needs so that it's in place when the need becomes standard. Tesla has been building out charge stations for years but I suspect it will take more spend than the vehicle industry can support, at first. In Florida, I've yet to see a single charge station. I'm sure there are some around, they are just off the beaten path i'm guessing.
My wife just got a new hybrid. A Hyundai Ioniq.
Plenty of charge stations out here.
Posted by: jstcrsn Feb 17 2022, 03:27 AM
It's the rest of the country that will have to do a bit of catching up. it may take federal spending to help make the transition smooth. The charge infrastructure will need to be built ahead of the actual needs so that it's in place when the need becomes standard. Tesla has been building out charge stations for years but I suspect it will take more spend than the vehicle industry can support, at first. In Florida, I've yet to see a single charge station. I'm sure there are some around, they are just off the beaten path i'm guessing.
well . I can't imagine getting stuck in a snow storm and having your all electric vehicle run out of a charge, you know back here in the land where we have to catch up.. Rich might understand .. we are suppose to get 7 to 12 inches tomorrow so don't look down on colder climates to much.
I don't know if this has been discussed , but since solar and wind only acount for 5 percent of electricity have we discussed where all this electricity will come from if everybody is driving electric
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 17 2022, 05:40 AM
nobody is looking down on anyone or anything as far as I can tell. Also, electric vehicles are not just street cars. JEEP have embraced electrification as has every other builder of off road vehicles, so no worries there. Also, running out of juice in a snow storm isn't that different from running out of gas imho. The big dif is that you can keep a gallon of gas in a can in the trunk where as you can't do that on an all electric vehicle. The key there is, just like with a gas car, don't run out of fuel
Thats a great question about where the juice will come from. It's controversial as well. Right now, tons of electricity is being made the old fashioned way, by burning carbon based fuels. That's one of the big hurdles that will have to be crossed. If we are all going to go electric at some point, the grid will need to seriously increase it's capacity and we will have to improve the way we generate electricity. It's coming, either way.
I don't know if this has been discussed , but since solar and wind only acount for 5 percent of electricity have we discussed where all this electricity will come from if everybody is driving electric
Posted by: jstcrsn Feb 17 2022, 05:50 PM
this is the problem .. Any smart business would not get started not knowing how they will do everything , but for some reason , people are trusting the government that says 'we will handle that when we get there'.. I thought we knew the government was trouble and the rich that run it with them are not to be trusted ?.. Make it make sense
Posted by: Caelumamittendum Feb 17 2022, 10:51 PM
I think the problem is that we'll be running out of our current ways too at some point, and we can't just let that happen either. If we're out of oil in 50 years, then it's going to get more expensive as we get less of it, and all of a sudden we're down to the last drop, and then it's better to figure something else out of course. Now, "we'll handle that when we get there" isn't a good plan either of course, but I think looking at alternatives to a source that's naturally gonna run out is a good idea in itself. Certain energy forms will not run out in the same way. But of course we'd need a plan of how to cope with it all one way or the other.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 17 2022, 11:33 PM
Well said Whether we trust the govt or not, they are moving forward with this change towards renewable energy and away from fossil fuels. Regardless of what we think about it, every govt on the planet is moving this direction. this is something that is going to happen. It's up to us to try to integrate these changes in to our lives as smoothly as possible.
As you mention, we have reached "Peak Oil" and it's getting harder to find more of it each year. Its a FINITE resource after all. There are only so many dead dinosaurs that we can extract as Fossil fuel. When it runs out, it's just gone.
Even the military in the U.S. has mandated moving to renewable fuel vehicles.
https://www.defensenews.com/land/2021/04/22/us-army-picks-6-companies-to-tackle-how-to-power-electric-combat-vehicles-in-the-field/
I am always suspicious of the govt and of politicians. However, things are moving forward despite that.
Todd
Posted by: Caelumamittendum Feb 17 2022, 11:46 PM
Whether we trust the govt or not, they are moving forward with this change towards renewable energy and away from fossil fuels. Regardless of what we think about it, every govt on the planet is moving this direction. this is something that is going to happen. It's up to us to try to integrate these changes in to our lives as smoothly as possible. As you mention, we have reached "Peak Oil" and it's getting harder to find more of it each year. Its a FINITE resource after all. There are only so many dead dinosaurs that we can extract as Fossil fuel. When it runs out, it's just gone.
Even the military in the U.S. has mandated moving to renewable fuel vehicles.
https://www.defensenews.com/land/2021/04/22/us-army-picks-6-companies-to-tackle-how-to-power-electric-combat-vehicles-in-the-field/
I am always suspicious of the govt and of politicians. However, things are moving forward despite that.
Todd
Yup. Regardless of how we twist and turn it, our current ways with oil and fossil fuel is coming to an end, so we're gonna have to move "forward" in some direction. Whether wind energy for instance is the best way can be discussed, but there's a discussion to be had about energy and how we get that energy, and I'm glad it's a thing that's happening. Something's gotta change from the way it has been, otherwise we run out
Wind, solar power and such will always be there (well, for a long time) - then we need to look at how we harvest it best possible and store it etc. I'm sure there are some clever folks out there in the world that can come up with something.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 18 2022, 12:59 AM
Well said yet again It's happening whether we want it or not. Might as well try to make the best of it. I think it will be a positive thing in the long run. Non renewable energy is a finite resource and it's a dirty way to get energy. Using it releases carbon and we don't need any more of that in the atmosphere.
I"m not a huge electric car fan. I drive a gas powered VW with a turbo. I love that car and plan to keep it til the wheels fall off
Wind, solar power and such will always be there (well, for a long time) - then we need to look at how we harvest it best possible and store it etc. I'm sure there are some clever folks out there in the world that can come up with something.Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 19 2022, 10:21 AM
I wanted to share a video just for the love of cars. This is a visit with the guy who designed the legendary Lamborghini Miura. The guy doing the interview is well known to car guys as a restorer who works in the UK. I'm guessing PHIL knows exactly who he is. He's the guy that did the restoration on Harry's Garage Lambo Espada.
Here is is talking with the designer of the Miura about how he came up with the design. His answers certainly surprised me. This type of thing is what petrol cars are likely to become. Very specialized labors of love.
SKIP TO THE MIDDLE to see the interview. In the first part of the vid, the restorer shows how to manually calibrate, by ear, all 12 carbs on a Miura.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 21 2022, 08:33 PM
The closer we get to the impending death of gas powered cars, the more interested I seem to get in ancient cars that influenced the "Golden Age" of the super car. After all, now that any punter can buy a Tesla with 1000 horsepower that can outrun just about any supercar it's likely to meet on the road, what does super car mean?
Anyhoo, this is a car called the SILHOUETTE by Lamborghini that we never got here in the states. There are about 50 of them in total. later on in the 80s, it got a refresh as the JALPA. It's got design cues that lived on to find their way in to the legendary Countach. it's sort of an muscle car from italy. The guy in the vid fixes harrys garage cars and had one featured in the most recent top gear special.
Posted by: Caelumamittendum Feb 21 2022, 08:58 PM
Some of the Lambourghini's are beautiful I'm not a big car guy, but I used to play Gran Turismo a lot when the first and second game came out back in the day. I actually also played a bit of Forza Horizon 4 not long ago and enjoyed that.
One of my favorite cars is the Ford GT40.
I did have a few different "car crushes" throughout the years, at least when I was a kid. Mid 90's, as a young kid, had me thinking I wanted a Toyota Celica when I grew up. Then the Ford GT, the Porsche 911 is another looker. I used to have a model car of that blue Dodge Viper with the white stripes. Chevrolet Corvette ZR1.
All more or less 90's, it seems But I kinda stopped caring too much about cars after that.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 21 2022, 09:52 PM
I had the same experience and I"m guessing a lot of other folks dis as well Those car games were about as close as I was likely to get to those cars unless it was at a car show. These days, things like "Cars and Cofee" are a thing, and these cars seem to more common. This was not the case in the 90s.
The GT was also a car crush of mine and I was sorta let down when the new one came out with a v6. I hate to sound like 'that guiy" (should have had a v8) but whaddya do? For me, these cars are more art objects than things I want to actually own. They seem a bit of a pain to be honest.
here is youtube car legend Doug Demuro talking about buying his own For GT
I'm not a big car guy, but I used to play Gran Turismo a lot when the first and second game came out back in the day. I actually also played a bit of Forza Horizon 4 not long ago and enjoyed that.One of my favorite cars is the Ford GT40.
I did have a few different "car crushes" throughout the years, at least when I was a kid. Mid 90's, as a young kid, had me thinking I wanted a Toyota Celica when I grew up. Then the Ford GT, the Porsche 911 is another looker. I used to have a model car of that blue Dodge Viper with the white stripes. Chevrolet Corvette ZR1.
All more or less 90's, it seems
But I kinda stopped caring too much about cars after that.Posted by: Caelumamittendum Feb 21 2022, 10:47 PM
Some of these cars are just incredible low. I always forget about that. When he's standing next to it, it's quite incredible. Not sure I'd ever get in one of those, let alone get out of it again 
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 22 2022, 07:03 AM
Im with ya there They are so low that it would be just hard to get in and out of them. They are wonderful to look at, and fun to play in a video game, but in real life they are sort of a pain
Posted by: klasaine Feb 22 2022, 04:37 PM
I was never too much of a car guy.
I did have a 1971 Dodge 'Dart' for a brief moment but I just had to keep putting money and time into it.
This isn't it but pretty much exactly the same car ...
One car I've always loved was the short lived and almost completely forgotten AMC 'AMX Javelin'. Here's one at an Auto show in Reno Nevada probably back in 2006 (Hot August Nights).*The girl is mine. 
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 22 2022, 07:28 PM
This thread has almost 18,000 views at this point which shocked me a bit.
AMX! I'd almost forgotten about them. They made some great hot rods. The Javelin is a very rare bird indeed. You see a lot of old mustangs and camaros but these are rare as hens teeth. It's just a beautiful car and I've always wanted to take a spin in one. A neighbor of mine had one in a tow trailer that he would take out on sundays to wax. sounded amazing when he would start it up. Here is a classic example on Jay Leno's Garage.
I did have a 1971 Dodge 'Dart' for a brief moment but I just had to keep putting money and time into it.
This isn't it but pretty much exactly the same car ...
One car I've always loved was the short lived and almost completely forgotten AMC 'AMX Javelin'. Here's one at an Auto show in Reno Nevada probably back in 2006 (Hot August Nights).*The girl is mine.
Posted by: Caelumamittendum Feb 22 2022, 07:34 PM
That AMX Javelin looks great too
Posted by: klasaine Feb 22 2022, 09:26 PM
My wife says "Grazie!".
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 23 2022, 01:03 AM
I've never been a huge Mustang fan but I like the look of the 350 in original spec and in new spec. If i was gonna ever get a mustang, this would be on the list of contenders.
If you won the lottery, what would you be driving?
Posted by: Caelumamittendum Feb 23 2022, 06:49 AM
My bicycle still. I don't have a driver's license
In all seriousness though, I'd buy (get built) something like this first and drive around Europe/the world. I've mentioned this before in another thread of course
I could see myself going for an electric (or new tech) car if we're talking "normal" cars and not a van. I have never driven a car really, so I don't have that gasoline in my blood stream and I don't get a kick out of the sound of it, so I don't have an incentive from that nostalgic feeling etc. to go for an old school car - however much I like the look of some of them.
I'm not really sold on the looks of the newer electric sports cars though. Perhaps I'd go for something like the Porsche Taycan 4S. A combination of sport-ish looks, electric, functionality in being a sedan and so on and still relatively unspectacular enough to not cause an uproar.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 23 2022, 08:01 AM
Two cars! After all we are talking lottery I'd buy that van studio as well and go on "walk about" and hit every state in the union and come back on route 66. Then I'd get one of these. They share the same platform (since Audi and Porsche are both owned by VW) as the Porsche Taycan and are very similar cars. I do like the look of it Not to mention it's way faster that just about everything that runs on petrol.
,
Posted by: Caelumamittendum Feb 23 2022, 08:41 AM
Yes, that Audi is nice too! I remember seeing that as well, and it was between that and the Porsche, but the bit of nostalgia from liking Porsche's as a kid won me over to the Porsche side
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 24 2022, 05:40 AM
They are almost the same car Same platform, same parent company. The porsche is a bit sexier to be sure. The tech is evolving so fast that driverless modes are already almost here on the TESLA and on the hypercar EV rimac, and this peugot which has retro styling. I have to question taking the driver out of the driving experience to some degree though? I get that it can be safer and all, and handy for long trips. Just still strikes me as a bit odd. Then again, i'm probably just old school and the next generation of drivers will have no desire to drive their own cars
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 27 2022, 04:40 AM
"The last of the V8s" is a line from the original MAD MAX film. It's coming true though This maybe the very last V8 muscle car that these guys put out. it's the last hurrah for a series of muscle cars that redefined what a muscle car could do. these will probably be worth huge money some day. I'd like to take one for a spin
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 28 2022, 06:36 AM
PHIL: Do you make parts that would work in some of HARRY's (harrys garage) engine rebuilds? He is always having some exotic ancient car brought back to life. I would love to see him mention your shop on his show! He started mentioning the Tyrell classic car shop as he has his restorations done there and now they have a huge youtube following with enough traction to generate real income.
Do you know of Ian Tyrell btw? Only started on youtube a few months ago and bam, halo effect from harrys garage pushed it over 100k subscribers.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Feb 28 2022, 11:53 PM
Well, the MUSTANG IS DEAD and it's replacement doesn't look anything like a Mustang. Such is life in the big city eh? Here is the MUSTANG MACH E. Purely electric of course. Seems like blasphemy.
Posted by: jstcrsn Mar 1 2022, 12:18 AM
I am not against E cars what so ever , but we buy cars cause we like their styling , why in the heck are they not similar to what they have been selling , mustang people would be more likely to buy them if they looked like a Mustang.. This confuses the Hell out of me
Posted by: Todd Simpson Mar 1 2022, 02:22 AM
EXACTLY!! IF they are gonna call it a Mustang, why the heck not make it look like a MUSTANG????? Instead it looks like a family crossover. Family crossovers are fine, but they are not Mustangs. The visual langauge of the Mustang is quite unique and has evolved in the same direction for decades. Then bam. They kill it. If it looked like a new version of the Mustang, that would be great IMHO. Or just call it something else. I think this was a bad stumble by ford.
Posted by: Phil66 Mar 1 2022, 09:52 PM
We most definitely do and Harry's Garage most definitely know about us BUT, we can't make one of batches, they will want them for free and set-up time over run-off time is cost inhibitive for us, unfortunately. I think a similar show called us a couple of years ago and fortunately, we had a spare set on the shelf that they used. I can't remember the name of the show though.
We do make a lot of one-off sets for this company https://hallandhall.net/ but obviously they pay and also have a very good reputation so they spread the word, their voice carries weight. Check out their stock list
Cheers
Do you know of Ian Tyrell btw? Only started on youtube a few months ago and bam, halo effect from harrys garage pushed it over 100k subscribers.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Mar 2 2022, 03:16 AM
Nice! I think I want this one 
We do make a lot of one-off sets for this company https://hallandhall.net/ but obviously they pay and also have a very good reputation so they spread the word, their voice carries weight. Check out their stock list
Cheers
Posted by: Todd Simpson Mar 2 2022, 07:21 AM
If there was one car Id like a ride in, it would have to be this one.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Mar 13 2022, 10:55 PM
Are "BIO FUELS" The way to save the non electric car?
Posted by: Todd Simpson Mar 26 2022, 09:31 AM
The last Aston V12. Aston Martin is making one last V12 car before they go loudly in to the cold night and start making battery powered crossovers like everybody else. I'll never own or drive one of these, but I do appreciate it
Posted by: Caelumamittendum Mar 29 2022, 02:23 PM
It's interesting, because that roaring sound of an engine... I never liked it Maybe that's another reason why I like EV cars and bicycles. They're nice and quiet and doesn't make scary noises
Posted by: Todd Simpson Mar 29 2022, 11:29 PM
You are not alone. There is an entire generation coming up that is never really gonna know about engine roar or that already doesn't care for it. Especially in europe where personal car ownership is less. Also, young folks here are more interested in taking UBER it seems than in having their own cars. Still, there are plenty of young folks here who want vehicles, but never before have we had this switch to young folks not wanting to have a car or buy a home. There is a huge chunk of our population of young folks who see those things as a burden.
its so different as to be shocking and incomprehensible to the older segment of our society. It's just so vastly different that how my generation grew up.
Maybe that's another reason why I like EV cars and bicycles. They're nice and quiet and doesn't make scary noises Posted by: Todd Simpson Mar 30 2022, 02:27 AM
LOTUS is making an SUV. Yup. It's the end of everything The apocalypse has com for us. All the other builders sure, but Lotus? Who swore up and down that they don't do suv or wagons. They do sports cars. Well guess what. It's change or die time and the sports car snoots at Lotus are making an SUV!! Next up, Ferrari, yes, Ferrari, will debase themselves and join the fray of the suv world.
Posted by: Phil66 Mar 30 2022, 10:02 AM
Here is the Ferrari Purosangue
https://youtu.be/x8_y-ZZGDVU
Posted by: Todd Simpson Mar 30 2022, 10:13 PM
That one is actually a CG mockup thats been picked up by wads of folks. It does look very similar to the real one though. Just a bit different front and headlights.
here is their instagram with the new pix
https://www.instagram.com/p/Cbc1qnHsXiV/?utm_source=ig_embed&utm_campaign=loading
Yup a Ferrari SUV folks.
https://youtu.be/x8_y-ZZGDVU
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 4 2022, 03:54 AM
Super cars are going away from the look of things. Soon it will all be battery powered crossovers. This could be one of the last real supercars with an actual engine. Even lambos are going electric.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 8 2022, 10:44 PM
Jaguar, nearly dead, plans to retool entirely. They are barely selling any cars and circling the drain. The plan is to kill off their entire line and start from scratch on EVs. so no more petrol cars of any kind from Jaguar as of 2025. Like most builders, they are prepping for the EURO 7 regs which will ban gas cars in the UK. They are considered a "UK" brand despite many hands having owned them over the years. So it's time to do what everyone else is doing and start making EV crossovers. Uggh.
So really, it's all going to EV crossovers. It's just a matter of what badge you want on the front.
Posted by: liveOASISforever Apr 9 2022, 09:19 PM
UK car manufacturers have being dying for years. The amount of times a have heard over the years with these companies laying workers of for financial difficulties. The only reason they are going electric is because they are forced to its not because of choice
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 10 2022, 03:42 AM
Certainly looks that way It seems we are re entering an era of "Coach Building", where drive train is almost beside the point since drive trains are becoming so numbingly similar. This could save much of the British badge car industry. After all, it's mostly down to styling and interior now that cars/crossovers are all some variant on a ev skateboard.
Clever design might finally gain some traction and allow Jaguar and Lotus and others to actually compete against their European rivals. Time will tell
This car is a great example of this future trend. It's basically a RIMAC car with a body and interior designed by the folks who design Ferraris.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 10 2022, 09:23 PM
What is it like to drive a 3 MILLION DOLLAR Hyper car? The CHIRON is one of the last Hyper cars that will ever be built using a traditional engine, a W16 quad turbo, and it does make a glorious noise. Anyone ever seen a real Bugatti in the flesh? British motoring youtube legend Harry Metcalfe gives us his thoughts. if you watch top gear, you've probably seen his Countach and Testarosa as the boys use Harry's cars since he has one of the few working examples of these in England.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 13 2022, 09:20 PM
Tyrell's Classic Workshop is a great youtube channel if you dig vintage super cars. Harry Metcalfe from Harry's Garage got Tyrell started on youtube and it's exploded. This is a video where he drives a vintage lambo through the hills of Italy. Tough gig
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 18 2022, 06:29 AM
Will synthetic fuel save petrol burning engines? With all of the major car builders swearing off of gas burning engines and moving to batteries soon, can this new clean fuel be a way to save actual engines being used in cars?
If not, will cars like this "M" Electric BMW be accepted as sports cars by petrol heads? What does the M badge mean on a battery car? Then again what does TURBO mean now that Porsche is using it on it's EVs!
Posted by: Phil66 Apr 24 2022, 08:27 PM
Maybe that's another reason why I like EV cars and bicycles. They're nice and quiet and doesn't make scary noises Well I've found this out just for you buddy
This is early prototype testing of the Ducati Desmosedici Moto GP bike at Mugello in 2002. I played this to Hiro Kaneda when he came to visit us, Hiro was ex Honda F1 design chief. He listened, and said "Play again please", he listened again and had a huge smile on his face and said "Ahhhhhhh V8? Yes?" I said "Nope, it's a V4 one litre revving to 19,000 rpm", he said "No no no, play again please" and he just kept laughing at the sound this awesome 1 litre V4 going past the pits at Mugello.Turn it up loud
I've hear this so many times and it still brings a smile to my face and sends shivers down my spine, I'm proud to have been a part of it all and the fact that they won a World Championship with our product is great. I put it onto a CD for my dad and he drove my step mom mad by keep playing it It's doing about 350Kph as it goes past the mic!
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 25 2022, 12:26 AM
Now that is a thing of beauty to be sure I hope these sounds still remain as battery powered SUVs take over.
This is early prototype testing of the Ducati Desmosedici Moto GP bike at Mugello in 2002. I played this to Hiro Kaneda when he came to visit us, Hiro was ex Honda F1 design chief. He listened, and said "Play again please", he listened again and had a huge smile on his face and said "Ahhhhhhh V8? Yes?" I said "Nope, it's a V4 one litre revving to 19,000 rpm", he said "No no no, play again please" and he just kept laughing at the sound this awesome 1 litre V4 going past the pits at Mugello.Turn it up loud
I've hear this so many times and it still brings a smile to my face and sends shivers down my spine, I'm proud to have been a part of it all and the fact that they won a World Championship with our product is great. I put it onto a CD for my dad and he drove my step mom mad by keep playing it It's doing about 350Kph as it goes past the mic!
Posted by: Storm Linnebjerg Apr 25 2022, 01:02 AM
It's interesting, because it mostly makes me anxious and wanting to jump out of the way in fear that it comes crashing through my room. And now my heart is racing in a panicky way
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 26 2022, 10:52 PM
Thats the reaction such a noise generates Imagine driving that thing?
I saw this today, it's a teaser for an electrified corvette. They are gonna keep the huge V8 (Saints be praised) and just add an electric motor to the front wheels to create an all wheel drive corvette thats got the electric motor for instant torque. Now that is a "green" car that I want to try.
Posted by: Storm Linnebjerg Apr 27 2022, 12:11 AM
Imagine driving that thing?I can't say I like that kinda loud noise. Scares me more that anything
Posted by: Phil66 Apr 27 2022, 05:55 AM
Imagine driving that thingYes, over 200mph on TWO wheels, awesome, Moto GP is the Motorcycle equivalent of F1 but more exciting, no arranged pit stops and just thirty or so laps, balls to the wall from start to finish.
Watch this two man battle at Laguna Seca, the Ducati of Stoner has our pistons in. This is one hell of a battle. It's only a few minutes as it's an edited version of the race.
Ben, if you watch it, close your eyes
This is the best link but it's set to not play on other sites as it's official.https://youtu.be/JY9mrKR5SkA
Here is a similar one, same race, same riders just not as good an edit and a bit shorter.
https://youtu.be/sfPM77TsGaA
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 27 2022, 08:37 PM
Moto GP is the one place that I"ve not seen hop on to electrification and I hope they don't. Hopefully we can still have some motor sports where we have actual gas burning motors making horrendously joyful noises
I saw a bit about an off road EV (extreme E) series but the vehicles can only run for 15 minutes before a recharge. That seems sorta pointless in endurance rally racing doesn't it? Endurance races with a 15 minute run time? What's the point? Imagine the Baha rally with 15 minute timeout. The crew has to set up every 10 or 20 miles and rush to the car to charge it. A race is 2 laps, about 10 miles. Silly
https://www.extreme-e.com/
Watch this two man battle at Laguna Seca, the Ducati of Stoner has our pistons in. This is one hell of a battle. It's only a few minutes as it's an edited version of the race.
Ben, if you watch it, close your eyes
This is the best link but it's set to not play on other sites as it's official.https://youtu.be/JY9mrKR5SkA
Here is a similar one, same race, same riders just not as good an edit and a bit shorter.
https://youtu.be/sfPM77TsGaA
Its an acquired taste to be sure. Also easy to go deaf if you hang around race tracks with no hearing protection
Posted by: Storm Linnebjerg Apr 27 2022, 08:47 PM
Watch this two man battle at Laguna Seca, the Ducati of Stoner has our pistons in. This is one hell of a battle. It's only a few minutes as it's an edited version of the race.
Ben, if you watch it, close your eyes
This is the best link but it's set to not play on other sites as it's official.https://youtu.be/JY9mrKR5SkA
Here is a similar one, same race, same riders just not as good an edit and a bit shorter.
https://youtu.be/sfPM77TsGaA
Sounds like that and videos with speed like that does not give me an adrenaline kick, but rather just makes my heart race in a panick way
I barely like being in regular traffic, as it feels unsafe and something I'm not in control of to the extent I'd like to be. I've had some close calls where people have run a red light, not seen me on my bicycle etc., even though I'm always very careful. I'm the kinda guy who signals on my bicycle even if no one is around and it's 1 AM. Or the kinda guy who'll stand waiting 2 minutes at a pedestrian crossing for red, though it's midnight and no car is around at all.I can appreciate it in video games, and I don't mind driving games, but these are real life people making it a bit different to my perception. A bit like how I can appreciate (without liking it too much) games that include roof jumping and extreme parkour, but seeing some of those real life dare devils is almost instantly a "nope, not watching anymore of that"
Posted by: Phil66 Apr 27 2022, 09:41 PM
I saw a bit about an off road EV (extreme E) series but the vehicles can only run for 15 minutes before a recharge. That seems sorta pointless in endurance rally racing doesn't it? Endurance races with a 15 minute run time? What's the point? Imagine the Baha rally with 15 minute timeout. The crew has to set up every 10 or 20 miles and rush to the car to charge it. A race is 2 laps, about 10 miles. Silly
https://www.extreme-e.com/
Have a look at Formula E, hardly any spectators, racing just ain't the same without the noise, it's less going to see Manowar with all amps on 1.
Their skill level is something else, I've seen Stoner with the rear wheel spinning up and the bike sliding around a bend at around 170mph in full control.
https://youtu.be/t8mRFF2BQ24
Posted by: Storm Linnebjerg Apr 27 2022, 09:52 PM
Their skill level is something else, I've seen Stoner with the rear wheel spinning up and the bike sliding around a bend at around 170mph in full control.
https://youtu.be/t8mRFF2BQ24
I can appreciate their skills, 100%
Still makes me a bit anxious though
Posted by: Phil66 Apr 28 2022, 07:05 AM
Still makes me a bit anxious though You won't be wanting any passes for any races then?
Posted by: Storm Linnebjerg Apr 28 2022, 09:28 AM
Haha, I remember once or twice going to the speedway as a kid. I did watch that a bit when I was very young. My dad likes Formula 1 and Moto GP though.
Posted by: Phil66 Apr 28 2022, 10:42 AM
In the 80s 90% of the world's speedway engines had our pistons in
Posted by: klasaine Apr 28 2022, 06:55 PM
I worked on the soundtrack of a Valentino Rossi documentary many years ago - "Faster".
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0368721/
I even co-wrote one of the songs ...
http://antebellumrecords.org/audio/Heroic.mp3
Posted by: Phil66 Apr 28 2022, 07:36 PM
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0368721/
I even co-wrote one of the songs ...
http://antebellumrecords.org/audio/Heroic.mp3
Sweet
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 29 2022, 01:38 AM
Thats very cool. Dig the music as well. Any other cool projects auto related or otherwise? could be a cool thread topic as well.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0368721/
I even co-wrote one of the songs ...
http://antebellumrecords.org/audio/Heroic.mp3
I actually linked to EXTREME E in the post you responded to
And mentioned how silly a 15 minute two lap endurance race was. It seems like a good way to kill motor sport in converting it all electric. Who knows, maybe it will catch on and every race will be only 2 laps Their skill level is something else, I've seen Stoner with the rear wheel spinning up and the bike sliding around a bend at around 170mph in full control.
https://youtu.be/t8mRFF2BQ24
Posted by: Phil66 Apr 29 2022, 03:05 AM
And mentioned how silly a 15 minute two lap endurance race was. It seems like a good way to kill motor sport in converting it all electric. Who knows, maybe it will catch on and every race will be only 2 laps Yes, I know, I couldn't even click on the link, electric road cars, okay, I can begrudgingly accept but electric motorsport vehicles, nope, not watching it
, let's hope that at least all of the the classic motorsport series are kept alive, my business depends on it.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 29 2022, 04:06 AM
I hear ya It just seems silly beyond all measure. To reduce endurance rally to 10 minutes? Honestly?
I think classic motorsports will have an audience for quite some time to come. It's core audience are folks who have been watching it for decades. I think the problem arises when thinking about the distant future of motorsport where the next generation of fans just doesn't get it and doesn't care to. I think you'll be long out of the game before then though
, let's hope that at least all of the the classic motorsport series are kept alive, my business depends on it.Posted by: Todd Simpson May 9 2022, 05:59 AM
If this is the future of EV motoring, I can get behind it Whaddya think?
BTW this thread is about 21k views now, making it one of the most popular threads in the chill out section. Massive traction on this thread. Wow.
Posted by: liveOASISforever May 11 2022, 08:36 AM
Whaddya think?BTW this thread is about 21k views now, making it one of the most popular threads in the chill out section. Massive traction on this thread. Wow.
A have to admit that is one good looking car. Crazy money though even before the the extras were added on.
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 11 2022, 04:39 PM
Agreed! That is an amazing looking Ferrari imho Also, 1,000 HP making it the most powerful road going Ferrari ever and elctric motors on top of it's twin turbo v8 make is staggeringly fast. It's a MONSTER.
That options list made my eyes pop out of my head. Every option, even small things, cost huge amounts. Cup holders? 2 thousand bucks, apple car play? 2 thousand bucks, carbon fiber extras? 30 thousand bucks, etc Along those lines. Car is half a MILLION with options. Ouch
He used to own a Pagani Zonda.
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 13 2022, 04:09 PM
You could have put money down on a TESLA ROADSTER, or you could have $4,000,000 if you would have used that deposit to just buy tesla stock. WOW. Seems like one has to be a bit of a sucker to put a deposit down on a tesla car that doesn't exist? It's been years and the roadster still doesn't exist and just putting hte $250k deposit in to their stock would allow you to be a MILLIONAIRE at this point.
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 25 2022, 11:10 PM
Here is the type of car that is going to die very soon and will be sorely missed by yobos everywhere
Yup, they don't really sell these cars in the UK. It's hard to believe, but it's true!! They don't sell full size trucks either!! Seems very odd indeed, given how common full size trucks and muscle cars are here in the states. However, I understand they would not fit on many roads in the UK and be impossible to park.
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 29 2022, 08:12 AM
New Regs require even tire noise reduced. Wow. It's not petrol engines, it's Tire noise?
Posted by: Todd Simpson Jun 8 2022, 07:24 AM
THE LAST LOTUS:
If you are fan of sports cars, you may know the LOTUS brand. Sadly they, like everyone are ditching gas powered cars. This is the Last real lotus. They finally got it right, just before going to battery powered everything. I hope I get to drive one.
Anyone ever driven a Lotus car?
Posted by: FreePizza Jun 8 2022, 04:18 PM
My new ride:
21-speed mountain e-bike with 65km of range (or much farther using its 5-speed pedal assist) and grip throttle. It'll do up to 20 mph on throttle which seems good enough for me . Full charge in under 3 hours. I added a suspension seat post and gel seat to add some comfort (not shown in picture). It's an entry/budget model but I'm fairly impressed so far. Sorry if it's offtopic, but I thought I could slide in some relevance with the whole shift from petrol to EV thing.
Posted by: Storm Linnebjerg Jun 8 2022, 04:21 PM
21-speed mountain e-bike with 65km of range (or much farther using its 5-speed pedal assist) and grip throttle. It'll do up to 20 mph on throttle which seems good enough for me
. Full charge in under 3 hours. I added a suspension seat post and gel seat to add some comfort (not shown in picture). It's an entry/budget model but I'm fairly impressed so far. Sorry if it's offtopic, but I thought I could slide in some relevance with the whole shift from petrol to EV thing.Nice!
I got an e-bike too that I use all the time
https://archiv.cube.eu/sk/2019/230300
Posted by: FreePizza Jun 8 2022, 08:32 PM
I got an e-bike too that I use all the time
Sweet, that is a nice model. I like it! My next bike will definitely be mid-drive with a 500 or 750. My latest guitar purchase put me in the budget e-bike zone
, which is a pretty lonely market. My son recently learned how to ride his bike and I wanted to take him on the local trails. I had been seeing a lot about the e-bikes online and thought I'd look into it. Really glad that I did. It was a great decision all around.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Jun 9 2022, 04:13 AM
Thanks for the reply Seems perfectly relevant as the car posts are about to switch to all EV posts. So sure thing! Your new EV looks quite spiff as does Ben's! "PEV" (personal electric vehicles) are really getting to be a serious things. Here are some of the options.
, which is a pretty lonely market. My son recently learned how to ride his bike and I wanted to take him on the local trails. I had been seeing a lot about the e-bikes online and thought I'd look into it. Really glad that I did. It was a great decision all around.Posted by: Todd Simpson Jun 28 2022, 08:17 AM
This thread remains one of the most popular on GMC despite having nothing to do with guitar. Odd, but ok
This is "The Last Corvette". The subsequent model will be some sort of battery powered lady shaver, as Jeremy Clarkson says.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Jun 30 2022, 12:20 AM
NEW ELECTRIC DELOREAN!!!
Yup, BACK TO THE FUTURE is making it's way back to the present day. These will be made in Italy, about 88 units (of course) and will have gull wing doors just like the original.
Posted by: jstcrsn Jun 30 2022, 07:38 PM
Posted by: Todd Simpson Jul 1 2022, 01:45 AM
Thanks for posting
Posted by: Todd Simpson Jul 18 2022, 08:05 PM
THE LAST HELLCAT 2023
Looks like 2023 is the last year for the Hemi powered, supercharged Hellcat drive train cars from Dodge. 2023 could well be the last year for muscle cars in general. After that, regulations and impending restrictions will make it just impractical to create these vehicles. This is probably not a big deal in Europe since these cars are really only designed for use in the states. Our roads here are wide and straight and track days are usually drag strip based. I'm very sorry to see the death of the muscle car as it is something that has been part of our culture for a long time. Such is life.
Posted by: klasaine Jul 19 2022, 07:30 AM
I will miss them too, but ...
"He Not Busy Being Born Is Busy Dying" - Bob Dylan.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Sep 15 2022, 04:37 AM
FINALLY A USE FOR "NFT"?
The new Alfa Romeo hybrid crossover thing is the first car to officially come with it's own NFT. (Non Fungible Token) basically a picture that lives on the block chain that can store other data as well.
The clever bit is that it will allow the owner to declare mileage and service history in a way that can't be forged/faked etc. So when it's sold on to the next buyer, the NFT will have a permanent record of it's entire service history and miles. It's a clever use of NFT which may start to pop up doing similar things for other car vendors. In an age of digital currency, using the block chain to track stuff like this is a clever idea imho. Just hope it works.
FERRARI SUV IS HERE
The end must be near. Ferrari have done what they said they would never do. They have finally built a crossover thing. It's just a vehicle type that folks want which is why every builder now has one. Ferrari held out til last but even they are not immune to markets. So they finally did it. Eventually, the engine will go and it will be just another battery powered crossover that happens to have a Ferrari badge. It's not meant for off road use, as none of these style vehicles are. But it does have back seats and room for groceries.
Lambo and Aston make half of their money on horrible crossover things that are not really in line with their ethos. Ferrari isn't like that. They make money no matter what. However, all the high end builders are now worried that Ferrari is coming for their best customers.
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