Mtp Issues!, Let's have a discussion about it |
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Apr 26 2010, 07:23 PM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Apr 26 2010, 04:07 PM)  Thanks again for the opinions here. A returning question is "why did the mtp rules change"? The simple answer is to prevent GMC from going bankruptcy. We have misjudged who will want to do mtp, how long they will want to do it, along with a whole bunch of other things on the back end side. I am not that sad about it, because I know that the best (and only, sometimes) way to learn is to try. Now I don't understand this at all??? With the new 3 months MTP / 3 months not, people are dropping their membership. How can this rule be succesful in an economical perspective??? If this is the issue here, MTP should be organized in a way so that every member can participate 12 months a year. The same goes for the rules of REC etc. - why do You have to pass each month to continue? If everyone continues and stays as members, there will be most money in the pocket. Or am I wrong here? I do understand that all this this is pretty much "watch and learn", but I can't see any problem in that every instructor will have 4 students for instance, and then I think everone who wants to participate can. (however, I dont know if the teachers gets paid per student for the MTP, but as I see it, in order to be a teacher here - You SHALL do MTP's) Thats just my 2 cents for the moment. Ideas for alternative way's to do this has already been written by a lot of us, so I wont discuss it anymore here. //Staffay --------------------  Guitars: Ibanez AM-200, Ibanez GB-10, Fender Stratocaster Classic Player, Warmouth Custom Built, Suhr Classic Strat, Gibson Les Paul Standard 2003, Ibanez steel-string Amps: Fender Hot Rod Deluxe, Marshall JMP 2103, AER 60 Effects: BOSS DD-20, Danelectro Trans. Overdrive, TC-Electronics G-Major, Dunlop Wah-wah, Original SansAmp, BOSS DD-2 Music by Staffy can be found at: Staffay at MySpace |
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Apr 26 2010, 11:32 PM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Apr 27 2010, 12:07 AM) It sounds like you have misunderstood this Jafo, the rules say that vocal mtp:ers are required to submit a REC take just like guitar mtp. The only way I see this could happen was if the student chose a lesson containing both singing and playing, I believe we have one by Ivan Mihaljevic. Of course there wasn't any added rule one week before an assignment was due. I understand you are frustrated but stating things you have heard as facts doesn't really add to the discussion. Sure there have been lots of misunderstandings back and forth but that's hard to avoid when humans interact. Hey Kris, thanks for posting and making this a 2 way communication. Much appreciated. As mentioned above, that student was me. I can reasonably comprehend what is taught and communicated to me, and I try to leave no room for misunderstandings. Vocal mtp was merely quoted as an example here (but what was quoted was a fact) but let me clarify that the REC to be a take involving both vocals & guitars was introduced in the 3rd month of MTP (Read here). Sure the rule of REC was always in place but noone knew WHAT would make a REC for vocal mtp (since all vocal lessons are purely improvisations). There was a brief confusion of doing covers as REC which was quickly cleared due to backing track copyright issues etc. SO even if we were to believe for a second that the lesson by Ivan Mihaljevic (where he plays and sings) was the perfect one for REC, what happens after that? There are no more lessons like that. Vocal instructors do not play guitar while singing. The instructor was doing a great job in the first 2 months. I even submitted 8 assignments within those months (no other student did that in the batch). But after this rule, even the instructor seemed a bit tensed, confused and I was clearly upset and this caused it all to break down. FYI There was NO mis-communication between the instructor and myself. We were doing very well..... It was just not planned properly, but it was the first time (with vocal mtp) so we can hop on that for a while. Ah well, lets look at the brighter side, at least my instructors didn't disappear on me 3 times without any announcement. And my guitar mtp was a great great success. As Andy mentioned above, learning and frustration do not go well and I'm beginning to feel it now. I come here for education and fun and not to get frustrated. I know this has to be taken care of by myself only and no mtp or golden/magical lesson can help me but I was just trying to clarify the facts, so future mtp'ers don't go through the same experiences and this program can be strengthened. But once again I'm glad that you have decided to take an active part in this discussion. At least now we have some sort of assurance that the time spent here caring about this program and this site is not going to go to waste. This post has been edited by zen: Apr 26 2010, 11:34 PM -------------------- "If the need is deep, you WILL find a way , if it isn't, you'll find some excuse"
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Apr 27 2010, 02:39 AM
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I am monitoring the discussion carefully, and I think all sides have strong points in something, however there are weaknesses in all sides as well. I would like to point out something very obvious, and don't want to jump into any conclusions yet, I was hoping for everybody to think hard before posting anything, specially anything that concerns how GMC is doing business:
Here are the topics for discussion, be honest everybody: - If MTP is additionally charged, and members can sign in and stay as long as they want, then new members won't have the chance of getting signed up (since slots will be taken constantly? what do you think? - If MTP is lasting 3 months, more members can check out MTP, and instructor can test more people, but members (and probably instructors) loose interest in MTP after completion of MTP round. what do you think? - If MTP is NOT additionally charged, members don't have enough motivation to stick to rules of MTP. Since the membership covers the MTP expenses, they can drop out, not complete the tasks and do it "for free". If MTP was charged, almost everybody would rush to complete and take things a lot more seriously (Instructors too). what do you think? - If members who join MTP are not being able to follow the rules of MTP because of illness, travelling, or other obligations that are not affected by their decision making, how should their MTP programs be handled? Prolonging deadlines seems the only way to go, but for how long? what do you think? - Will MTP develop faster and better if members are additionally charged for it? I believe so. what do you think? -------------------- - Ivan's Video Chat Lesson Notes HERE
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MTP can start anytime (rather than fixed month) So, if anyone drops out, a new member from waiting list can definitely take part. He shouldn't be charged until he starts MTP though.
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Apr 27 2010, 07:03 AM
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QUOTE (Pedja Simovic @ Apr 27 2010, 02:17 AM) People who are interested in MTP and really want to work with specific instructor should pay separate fee just for MTP. They should be also given option (just brainstorming here) not to pay regular membership but to rather just pay MTP. There should be only time limit for that price (for example month of tutoring) and the assignments as well as workload should be handled individually from student to student. In other words, 100% personal approach with stress free and laid back work. If student requires specific program with weekly assignments, instructor should provide him/her that but if he/she can process information and work in different way, he/she should have ability to use that. +1 I can't do anything else than agree 100% here. Its really what I've tried to say the past time here, even that I do think that some "pressure" by doin Vids playing must be used on the students by recording themselves - and then the site also gets some great promotion stuff to get more people involved in the MTP. //Staffay -------------------- Guitars: Ibanez AM-200, Ibanez GB-10, Fender Stratocaster Classic Player, Warmouth Custom Built, Suhr Classic Strat, Gibson Les Paul Standard 2003, Ibanez steel-string Amps: Fender Hot Rod Deluxe, Marshall JMP 2103, AER 60 Effects: BOSS DD-20, Danelectro Trans. Overdrive, TC-Electronics G-Major, Dunlop Wah-wah, Original SansAmp, BOSS DD-2 Music by Staffy can be found at: Staffay at MySpace |
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Apr 27 2010, 08:59 AM
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QUOTE (Ivan Milenkovic @ Apr 27 2010, 03:39 AM) - If MTP is additionally charged, and members can sign in and stay as long as they want, then new members won't have the chance of getting signed up (since slots will be taken constantly? It depends on how the MTP is organized. I can't really see now problems in having everyone to participate, based on that ALL teachers will have at least a couple of students. Then we mus not confuse MTP with regular lessons. (see below) QUOTE - If MTP is lasting 3 months, more members can check out MTP, and instructor can test more people, but members (and probably instructors) loose interest in MTP after completion of MTP round. That will be no problem if everyone can participate. However, I think a time-limit of a year is far more realistic with the same teacher. I do think that only serious students shall be able to stay in the program (eg. the one's who fulfills their assignments) and hence, the drop-offs will make spots for new students. QUOTE - If MTP is NOT additionally charged, members don't have enough motivation to stick to rules of MTP. Since the membership covers the MTP expenses, they can drop out, not complete the tasks and do it "for free". If MTP was charged, almost everybody would rush to complete and take things a lot more seriously (Instructors too). Thats definitely true. As far as I can see, a lot of time have been spent on students that don't complete the program, and as far as I see, money will be the only motivation student-wise for completing the program. Eg. if You pay for the MTP - You will most likely fulfill Your obligations. That will left the "un-serious" out. As I said before, I will suggest a lower membership fee and an additional MTP-fee. QUOTE - If members who join MTP are not being able to follow the rules of MTP because of illness, travelling, or other obligations that are not affected by their decision making, how should their MTP programs be handled? Prolonging deadlines seems the only way to go, but for how long? I will say a month or maybe two, but thats depending on the case. But however, if a member have to drop the MTP because of outer circumstances, I think he shall be regarded as first in the line when a new spot is free. QUOTE - Will MTP develop faster and better if members are additionally charged for it? I believe so. Both Yes and No. It depends on what the purpose with the MTP is. (see also below) What I mean here is what really matters: Is the MTP going to produce a few FAR improved players or it is gonna produce MANY players improves just a little??? Or is the purpose to generate traffic an hence money to finance other activities??? Or pay the teachers fee's?  What a succesful MTP is, depends on the point of view, so I cannot really say anything here.MTP or Lessons As the title says here, I wanna discuss the purpose of the MTP. As I can see in many posts here, the majority looks at the MTP as some sort of private lessons, which might be good, but this is not "Mentorship" to me. The Instructors (or mentors) role here, shall rather be to point the student in the right direction, suggest lessons that already exists and have a conversation of the students playing. This is not a very hard task to accomplish in my point of view, and I will gladly take some beginners/intermediate players in both playing/theory myself. However, I think the program shall be easy for the teachers to manage, and the actual work shall be done by the students. There is no meaning of inventing the wheel again, since all who have played for some years knows what it takes to be a good player. Its rather to be a source of inspiration and support the student in the issues he/she faces. There's a lot of good material on the site that can be used in the MTP-program. If we are talking about private lessons, these can be made under some other name, and shall ofc. be charged. The point here is really to NOT confuse MTP with the lessons on the site or any private teaching. What do You think bout that guy's??? //Staffay -------------------- Guitars: Ibanez AM-200, Ibanez GB-10, Fender Stratocaster Classic Player, Warmouth Custom Built, Suhr Classic Strat, Gibson Les Paul Standard 2003, Ibanez steel-string Amps: Fender Hot Rod Deluxe, Marshall JMP 2103, AER 60 Effects: BOSS DD-20, Danelectro Trans. Overdrive, TC-Electronics G-Major, Dunlop Wah-wah, Original SansAmp, BOSS DD-2 Music by Staffy can be found at: Staffay at MySpace |
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..( Cause I´m still in Studing and i have no incoming so it´s hard for me to pay it already 
cause i have to get somebody to pay it for me (and this is not an easy thing to do .. and if the prices go even higher it will become even more difficult, and I bealive that many of the gmc students are in the same/similar situation has I´m .. )
 
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