Reply to this topicStart new topic
> No Such Thing As Playing With Feeling
Kristofer Dahl
post Aug 16 2019, 04:46 PM
Post #1


GMC Founder & Rocker
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 16.320
Joined: 15-August 05
From: Stockholm, Sweden
Member No.: 2



...or is there? What are the techniques used to play with feeling?



Let me know your thoughts!


--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Mertay
post Aug 16 2019, 07:15 PM
Post #2


GMC:er
Group Icon

Group: GMC Senior
Posts: 4.338
Joined: 27-May 13
From: Turkey / izmir
Member No.: 18.294



This where I think Guthrie Govan shines compared to even the best names out there;



--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Phil66
post Aug 16 2019, 09:12 PM
Post #3


Learning Apprentice Player
*

Group: Members
Posts: 6.783
Joined: 5-July 14
From: The Black Country, England
Member No.: 19.975



I think playing with feeling can't really be taught, you have to feel feelings and they have to come through your playing from within, it has to develop with time as your relationship with the instrument grows and you can energise your playing with the feelings you have.

It's a tricky thing to explain but I would liken it to a child in a school play just reciting the words, or singing the words, then watch an actor from the Royal Shakespeare Company say the same words or someone like Pavarotti sing the same song. It comes in time and more so in some than others.

I wish I could explain what I mean better.



--------------------
MY CURRENT REVISION FOLDER


SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE



“Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in installments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.”
Israelmore Ayivor
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Todd Simpson
post Aug 16 2019, 09:58 PM
Post #4


GMC:er
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 18.997
Joined: 23-December 09
From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Member No.: 8.794



Kris does a great job of showing how one can play with feeling by learning from someone who can already play with feeling. He gives some great examples. Beyond that, it's down to just playing a LOT to find ways to express feeling using your fingers smile.gif

QUOTE (Phil66 @ Aug 16 2019, 04:12 PM) *
I think playing with feeling can't really be taught, you have to feel feelings and they have to come through your playing from within, it has to develop with time as your relationship with the instrument grows and you can energise your playing with the feelings you have.

It's a tricky thing to explain but I would liken it to a child in a school play just reciting the words, or singing the words, then watch an actor from the Royal Shakespeare Company say the same words or someone like Pavarotti sing the same song. It comes in time and more so in some than others.

I wish I could explain what I mean better.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Phil66
post Aug 16 2019, 10:14 PM
Post #5


Learning Apprentice Player
*

Group: Members
Posts: 6.783
Joined: 5-July 14
From: The Black Country, England
Member No.: 19.975



I think that's what I was trying to say tongue.gif


--------------------
MY CURRENT REVISION FOLDER


SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE



“Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in installments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.”
Israelmore Ayivor
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Todd Simpson
post Aug 17 2019, 12:30 AM
Post #6


GMC:er
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 18.997
Joined: 23-December 09
From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Member No.: 8.794



Great minds think alike!! smile.gif
Todd
QUOTE (Phil66 @ Aug 16 2019, 05:14 PM) *
I think that's what I was trying to say tongue.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Kristofer Dahl
post Aug 19 2019, 08:32 AM
Post #7


GMC Founder & Rocker
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 16.320
Joined: 15-August 05
From: Stockholm, Sweden
Member No.: 2



QUOTE (Mertay @ Aug 16 2019, 08:15 PM) *
This where I think Guthrie Govan shines compared to even the best names out there;



I love Guthrie's improvs, they are full of spontaneous creativity with unmatched dexterity - def in a league of his own.

That specific tune (Fives) I have never really liked though, it just sounds like an exercise (but with perfection execution!)

QUOTE (Phil66 @ Aug 16 2019, 10:12 PM) *
I think playing with feeling can't really be taught, you have to feel feelings and they have to come through your playing from within, it has to develop with time as your relationship with the instrument grows and you can energise your playing with the feelings you have.

It's a tricky thing to explain but I would liken it to a child in a school play just reciting the words, or singing the words, then watch an actor from the Royal Shakespeare Company say the same words or someone like Pavarotti sing the same song. It comes in time and more so in some than others.

I wish I could explain what I mean better.


I think there can be a tipping point for some players when they understand how all those learned techniques can be used for a "personal" purpose - if that makes sense. And of course we all have feelings - so it's just a matter of learning to translate them with our instrument.

I do tend to think in general that the more emotional a musician is - the more interesting the music. I'd say this is valid in any genre from death metal to soul.

QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Aug 16 2019, 10:58 PM) *
Kris does a great job of showing how one can play with feeling by learning from someone who can already play with feeling. He gives some great examples. Beyond that, it's down to just playing a LOT to find ways to express feeling using your fingers smile.gif


Yes this rule is as valid as ever - you will end up sounding like the ones you learn from!


--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Mertay
post Aug 19 2019, 10:05 AM
Post #8


GMC:er
Group Icon

Group: GMC Senior
Posts: 4.338
Joined: 27-May 13
From: Turkey / izmir
Member No.: 18.294



QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Aug 19 2019, 07:32 AM) *
I love Guthrie's improvs, they are full of spontaneous creativity with unmatched dexterity - def in a league of his own.

That specific tune (Fives) I have never really liked though, it just sounds like an exercise (but with perfection execution!)


Actually thats why I shared it, I mean if taken bar-by-bar it can be taken as individual exercises but if as a song if played flat it would sound super boring. People covering it when searched on youtube (GMC's Muris has a video too) to me seems to emphasize on this a lot to give their own personality.

I personally don't listen his music much, but in terms of playing with feeling (specially on higher gain) suggest him to be focused. One more Guthrie example, this time a simple solo to see how much effort he puts on feeling;



--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Kristofer Dahl
post Aug 19 2019, 12:13 PM
Post #9


GMC Founder & Rocker
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 16.320
Joined: 15-August 05
From: Stockholm, Sweden
Member No.: 2



Yeah that one is fantastic solo.

Btw interesting point about starting off with an exercise and then add nuances to it until it sounds musically convincing.


--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Gabriel Leopardi
post Aug 20 2019, 02:24 PM
Post #10


Instructor
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 32.736
Joined: 3-March 07
From: Argentina
Member No.: 1.289



That's a GREAT video Kris. I agree with everything that you are saying and I also think that Guthrie is a great example on subtle details that take a guitar solo to another level.

It's interesting to find this at GMC because it's very valuable information for beginner / intermediate players who doesn't understand what we mean when we talk about feeling, or expression techniques like dynamics, vibrato, and all the details that you've described in video.

On the other hand.. everytime that I'm tired of reading people saying:

"Joe Bonamassa plays without feeling"
"Malmsteen plays without feeling"

Even the more inexpressive guitarist is playing with any type of feeling.... There is not such thing as playing WITHOUT feeling if you are a human being. laugh.gif


--------------------
My lessons

Do you need a Guitar Plan?
Join Gab's Army

Check my band:Cirse
Check my soundcloud:Soundcloud

Please subscribe to my:Youtube Channel
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Caelumamittendum
post Aug 20 2019, 04:55 PM
Post #11


Learning Rock Star
*

Group: Members
Posts: 5.545
Joined: 14-June 08
From: Copenhagen, Denmark
Member No.: 5.298



QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Aug 19 2019, 01:13 PM) *
Yeah that one is fantastic solo.

Btw interesting point about starting off with an exercise and then add nuances to it until it sounds musically convincing.


It's an interesting topic, and it got me thinking, your last sentence here, are we then bordering on "playing with feeling" = "making choices that add nuances"? Maybe feeling also has to do with a conscious choice, probably after a lot of practicing through the years, of adding those nuances: rakes, bends, legato, dynamics, slides.

I'm just watching the video you posted as I'm writing this, but I think we're talking about some of the same things.


--------------------
For some prog metal made by yours truly, check out:

https://soundcloud.com/benjamin-storm-linnebjerg/storm-linnebjerg-a-celestial-voyage-full-demo

And subscribe to my Youtube Channel and Instagram here! and here!
...and my Twitch:HERE!
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Mertay
post Aug 20 2019, 05:49 PM
Post #12


GMC:er
Group Icon

Group: GMC Senior
Posts: 4.338
Joined: 27-May 13
From: Turkey / izmir
Member No.: 18.294



QUOTE (Caelumamittendum @ Aug 20 2019, 03:55 PM) *
...


It's probably how every guitarist start writing a solo, one technically develops to a point to make his/her own solo's but the starting ideas comes from what we already play best. Only to musicalize what we're used to and continue from there.

But choices also connects to have been played (even listened) someone else's songs or solo's. We may have the options by technical practicing but when/how to implement them comes from that experience.

My third input would be personal opinion; when the process starts (solo is written or being recorded) the subtle stuff is also judged to consider if its good or not for us bar by bar. Our determination of musical quality standard in reality isn't really our choice but built on others (past) opinions we observe.


--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
klasaine
post Aug 20 2019, 10:25 PM
Post #13


GMC:er
*

Group: Members
Posts: 3.520
Joined: 30-December 12
From: Los Angeles, CA
Member No.: 17.304



I say that one starts "playing with feeling" once they have enough technique to play what they hear in their head. Or play it how they hear it in their head.
In other words, 'technique' is just the servant of the music.
It doesn't have to be a lot of technique or really complicated technique. Just enough for you to accomplish or say what you want musically.

This post has been edited by klasaine: Aug 21 2019, 01:24 AM
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Kristofer Dahl
post Aug 22 2019, 10:05 AM
Post #14


GMC Founder & Rocker
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 16.320
Joined: 15-August 05
From: Stockholm, Sweden
Member No.: 2



I agree with ken that ultimately, it's about where the technique stuff comes from.

You can be a master of micro bends, but be clueless about when to use them. So at the end of the day what you want is experience - both musically and from life in general. Combine those two with a varied and controlled technique - and maybe the Internet feeling police will leave you alone 🙃😁


--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

Fast ReplyReply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 


RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 13th November 2019 - 10:52 PM