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GMC Forum _ CHILL OUT _ Want That Big Record Deal?
Posted by: RichardK Apr 16 2014, 12:00 PM
We all dream about it. Nailing that gig and afterwards this guy comes up to you and says: “Hi, I represent Universal, I think you guys really have something special. Here’s a bag of money!” And off you go to a big-ass studio in LA, record a platinum album and be on your way to rockstardom. Sure, it’s not a very realistic scenario, but somewhere in the back of our minds, we all secretly hope for it.
I read this really cool http://http://www.cracked.com/article_20939_7-things-record-deal-teaches-you-about-music-industry.html about how the industry works. Despite what we know about countless bands getting screwed over, we still think we need those big companies to make it big. In fact, that’s the reason these companies exist: you take care of the creative side, they take care of the business side, because you don’t know or want to know about these things. Even though all the necessary information is just a google search away.
But still, we want to rely on people who really know the business, so we can focus on what’s most important: the music. Right? And the companies want you to be successful, because it means more money for them. Unfortunately, this is only partly true. Yes, they want you to be successful, but not too successful. Bands like Metallica have a huge fanbase, so they’re in a position to make demands, like bigger royalties. And record companies don’t like that.
Here’s how they work. For example in the Netherlands, the Big Three (Sony, Universal, Warner) will each sign three bands per year, give each one a budget and then continue with the most successful band, dropping the other two immediately, leaving them with a big debt. If you’re in the successful band, expect to be dropped within three years (because they don’t want you to create that big fanbase).
If you want to stay on longer, there’s the 360-deal, where you get a lot of freedom and room to develop your music. But this freedom comes at a price: 360 means all the way. So what you earn from touring and merchandise (the band’s biggest source of income), goes right into their pockets.
This is not a rant against major labels or labels in general, it’s just how they work. It’s just economics for them and it happens to be music. I know this because many of my friends are musicians or work in the business.
What I’m trying to say is: do we really still need labels? A lot of stuff they do for you, you can do yourself. You can make a really decent recording at home, hire a producer to polish and master it and just upload it to iTunes or Spotify. As for promo, artist bio and marketing, same thing. Do it yourself or hire someone to write it for you (still much cheaper than any label). Want gigs? Contact programmers and venues or hire a manager.
It’s a lot of extra work and it might distract from the fun of making music, but if you work together as a band, it’s not that hard at all. We have the interwebz, so all the info is at our fingertips. We all know it’s very hard to make it in music and only very few people do, but we all secretly hope for it. And labels may seem like a shortcut or a great way to focus only on the music. But if you really want to make it, all the extra work is a small price to pay. So, still want that big record deal?
Posted by: Sensible Jones Apr 16 2014, 02:04 PM
Interesting article!!
As I and a lot of my friends say:-
"From the 50's through to the 70's it was the Music Business, to this day it's all about the Business of Music!"
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 16 2014, 04:21 PM
I tend to agree with you in respect to the fact that you can do a lot of stuff on your own, but you can do that up to a point. Each market has its own rules and the market in Romania is nothing like the one in Germany or the USA. But out of my experience so far, you can't do ANYTHING from a certain level on, unless you invest. Investment means: time, brains, money and connections.
If you have the right connections and money and YOU KNOW how to produce your music so that you may turn up with an outstanding product, you can do it on your own without any help. Otherwise... it's a jungle out there man
I for one am at that point with my band in which we need sponsoring to be able to move forward, because in here if a band wants to do something special about a show, they have to pay everything themselves. If you want to do things the pro way, everyone will run away from paying you because you are expensive and this is how the circle goes
Posted by: klasaine Apr 16 2014, 05:05 PM
A lot of generalizations made in the OP.
Here's another one:
The big rec. cos. may not have always had the best business ethics or the best interests of the artists as their main tenets but most records made at home ... sound like they're made at home.
Posted by: tonymiro Apr 16 2014, 05:19 PM
Here's another one:
The big rec. cos. may not have always had the best business ethics or the best interests of the artists as their main tenets but most records made at home ... sound like they're made at home.
Very, very true Ken.
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 17 2014, 07:40 AM
Well, nowadays, a lot of people can make their ways in pro studios without a record label, so that's not the case anymore. I think that a band CAN make it without a big record deal, but.. to what extent?
Posted by: PosterBoy Apr 17 2014, 08:36 AM
With so many people recording music at home, I think studio time is becoming more affordable. I've notice two things, people building themselves pretty awesome project studios with decent equipment, so there is one avenue for decent recordings if they know what they're doing, and professional studios running more and more courses for becoming a recording engineer etc, meaning they aren't getting booked very much, so should be ready for some price negotiating.
As for promotion, I wonder how many people have left the record companies (with all their knowledge and contacts) and started out on their own, to cash in, sorry I mean help, on all the independent artists out there.
Posted by: tonymiro Apr 17 2014, 10:37 AM
Whilst it is certainly possible to turn out a good project using a project studio it is much less likely.
The unpalatable truth is that there is a big difference between the quality of equipment that you find in most home/project studios and in a professional one. The latter will also be in rooms that are fit for purpose and where the equipment has been properly set up and maintained.
Also, having some equipment in a project studio is one thing, having the experience and knowledge to use it appropriately and effectively is another. The various courses promoted in the back pages of SoS and other magazines are generally regarded in the industry as something that might* get you an interview for an internship/trainee engineer position at a professional studio. They are not however seen as sufficient hands-on experience to be an engineer.
* I do mean 'might' as I know many pro studios who will not interview someone whose experience is wholly based on those courses.
Posted by: klasaine Apr 17 2014, 04:39 PM
I was (and Tony too) referring to the generalizations of the OP.
Of course you can make it w/o a big label or big deal. That's always been the case. Remember, in the beginning, 'Atlantic' records was a small indie label set up by two brothers in a converted office space. 'Blue Note' was an indie. Engineer Rudy Van Gelder always recorded in either his parents house or his own place later on. Lots of bands started their own labels. Or, as was popular 'back in the day' an independent producer would fund a demo or EP and pitch it to a label.
Do you know what you're doing with the gear you have? That's the main obstacle/endeavor. Most, IMO, don't.
I play guitar professionally. I put a lot of time into it. I expect the same of the recordists whether they're in a house or an actual purposed recording studio.
Posted by: RichardK Apr 17 2014, 05:31 PM
Here's another one:
The big rec. cos. may not have always had the best business ethics or the best interests of the artists as their main tenets but most records made at home ... sound like they're made at home.
I don't know about that. Sure, you really have to know what you're doing, my point is that recording technology has come a long way these last ten years. And you're still gonna need someone to do the mixing and mastering. We've tried a sample, live take instrumental recording with five mics, and I was really surprised at how good it sounded
.And yes, these are generalizations, but I didn't want to type a 5000 word essay, just some general thoughts
.
Posted by: klasaine Apr 17 2014, 07:16 PM
.Me too
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 18 2014, 09:54 AM
Of course you can make it w/o a big label or big deal. That's always been the case. Remember, in the beginning, 'Atlantic' records was a small indie label set up by two brothers in a converted office space. 'Blue Note' was an indie. Engineer Rudy Van Gelder always recorded in either his parents house or his own place later on. Lots of bands started their own labels. Or, as was popular 'back in the day' an independent producer would fund a demo or EP and pitch it to a label.
Do you know what you're doing with the gear you have? That's the main obstacle/endeavor. Most, IMO, don't.
I play guitar professionally. I put a lot of time into it. I expect the same of the recordists whether they're in a house or an actual purposed recording studio.
You are perfectly right Ken
There is a phenomenon occurring, especially in Romania - people invest HUGE sums of money into gear, but never into actually becoming sound engineers... the result? Amazing studios ran by people who don't know what to do with them. In here, we lack 3 sort of pros in the music business: producers, sound engineers and vocal coaches
Posted by: tonymiro Apr 18 2014, 10:45 AM
There is a phenomenon occurring, especially in Romania - people invest HUGE sums of money into gear, but never into actually becoming sound engineers... the result? Amazing studios ran by people who don't know what to do with them. In here, we lack 3 sort of pros in the music business: producers, sound engineers and vocal coaches That's almost the opposite in the UK. Professional studios are staffed by pro engineers who all have 1000s of hours of hands-on experience. Studios however are closing because the owners can make more money from selling the building and land than they make from it as a studio and the engineers are out of a job. We're heading to a point where there weill be few professional studios and engineers left.
Posted by: klasaine Apr 18 2014, 05:01 PM
Sadly, many of the great rooms here in L.A. (and NYC) are shutting their doors as well. The only saving grace is that the more experienced engineers are usually setting up a (smaller but) workable space to record either in their homes or in relatively inexpensive industrial complexes (and/or really bad neighborhoods). We do still have some space out here that doesn't cost an arm and a leg and since everybody still has a car it doesn't have to be in or near the city center.
Los Angeles (and other places in the states) has many really great 'home' studios but the caveat is that they're homes turned into studios and run by engineers/musicians with a lot of experience in recording professionally.
But I'll tell ya ... I don't get to record nearly as much in a big, well treated room as I used to and I miss it. And I hear the difference.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 19 2014, 08:01 AM
Sadly, this appears to be a GLOBAL phenom. In fact,
I recently read an industry report that projected the entire music production industry was going to SHRINK by about 5% over the next 5 years. Not stay afloat, not grow, shrink.
It does make sense though when you look at the contraction of the overall "music biz" in terms of total dollars spent, including touring!! The digital pennies will never make up for the analogue dollars as they say but I digress
Most of us here are here because we love music so much, we have to play it. We have to record it and share it with the world. Regardless of money or lack thereof. Personally, I see that as one of the blessings of the current situation. I don't run in to nearly as many folks who are "starting a band" and look the part but have yet to learn to play at all. Around here I used to see that all the time.
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 19 2014, 02:41 PM
I don't know how it goes in other places, but in here, TV and radio stations pay broadcasting rights to artists whose music the stations will play. I don't know if it's valid for the digital environment - I mean if a digital radio station or tv broadcasts your music, do they have to pay royalties?
That sort of digital pennies would be good as well
Posted by: Gabriel Leopardi Apr 19 2014, 03:10 PM
Cirse has always been an independent band and I can say that it hasn't been a problem that avoid as from growing as a band. In the last months I've been talking with some of the biggest bands here and all them are telling the same: "We are happy that we ended our contract with Emi, Universal or whatever big label they have been working". They told me that the labels doesn't support them too much but that add a lot of bureaucracy, excuses and problems that made every thing that the band wanted to do slower or impossible. So they feel being independent as a liberation.
In the past labels were more powerful but nowadays they are weak, and most of them misunderstand the new tools to promote music correctly. The only three pros that I find in Argentinean labels are: (1) Radio rotation, (2) if everything goes right they give you money to record your album & (3) Fake Awards (yes, most of the awards are arranged and are used to give press to a band or album).
I vote for going independent and I recommend this site and book called the new rockstar philosophy: http://www.newrockstarphilosophy.com/
Posted by: klasaine Apr 19 2014, 05:45 PM
That sort of digital pennies would be good as well
Digital streaming (TV and Radio) does have to pay for plays but the rate is very low. I don't the exact numbers because I can't find what I would call an 'accurate' accounting and for example Pandora, Spotify, Sirius/XM all pay different rates.
If you search 'what does Pandora pay songwriters' you'll get a lot of research material. For example ... http://consumerist.com/2013/06/24/how-much-does-a-songwriter-earn-when-pandora-plays-his-song-1-16-million-times-hint-its-not-much/ But I can't verify those numbers.
*(Terrestrial) Radio in the states never paid royalties directly to the songwriters/bands. The radio stations (as well as any establishment that plays the radio or has bands that play published music) pay fees (determined by size of business) to the licensing agencies: BMI, ASCAP, SESAC and then those agencies take samples per demographic and pay royalties out of a pool of monies. http://www.bmi.com/creators/royalty/us_radio_royalties/basic
Posted by: tonymiro Apr 19 2014, 06:32 PM
As Ken says provided the digital streamer is licensed they will pay an aggregated amount to the relevant performance rights body who will then distribute. In principle it's much the same for traditional terrestrial broadcasting. If you do not use suitable ISRC on your release then don't hold your breath waiting for your share.
One word of caution for those self-releasing - at least one major digital redistributor has been found to not use standard ISRCs on material sent to them for digital distrbution. They instead encoded their own version, which will not be recognised by any performance rights body. I'm not sure if they still do this but they did for quite a while.
Also, if you distribute your material as mp3s you should also be aware that ISRC is not a standard metatag and needs to be specially set.
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 20 2014, 08:33 PM
One word of caution for those self-releasing - at least one major digital redistributor has been found to not use standard ISRCs on material sent to them for digital distrbution. They instead encoded their own version, which will not be recognised by any performance rights body. I'm not sure if they still do this but they did for quite a while.
Also, if you distribute your material as mp3s you should also be aware that ISRC is not a standard metatag and needs to be specially set.
In here, the cash from broadcasting and TV appearances goes in two major organizations The composer's union and the CREDIDAM - I have no clue what the letters stand for. These two, send the money to each artist's account. It's always a game of chance... some get about 30000 bucks at once even if they hadn't had so much activity and some get almost jack even if they had a lot of activity. The next year, it's viceversa and so on
Posted by: tonymiro Apr 21 2014, 09:10 AM
It can take a PRS a while to get the aggregated money and the info and then distribute it
.I think CREDIDAM is an abbreviation of Centrul Roman pentru Administrarea Drepturilor Artistilor Interpreti . Here's their website - http://www.credidam.ro/
Posted by: RichardK Apr 21 2014, 12:35 PM
In the Netherlands, there´s the BUMA, who actively look after the copyright of songs, for radio, tv and even in bars or clubs. From what I hear, they distribute everything honestly.
And I agree with the rest of you that it´s such a shame that so many skilled producers and engineers are out of work. But we´re getting a little off topic here
. What I was trying to get across, is that nowadays, there´s a whole lot more you can do yourself. As for capital (dollah dollah bill y´all). at least in the Netherlands, there´s grants, subsidies and even businesses who front money.So, if you really want to make a living out of being a musician, don´t you owe it to yourself to figure out how you can do things on your own? A guy I know, Thomas Azier, does everything by himself except the distribution, and he´s getting pretty successful in Europe.
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 22 2014, 04:49 PM
.I think CREDIDAM is an abbreviation of Centrul Roman pentru Administrarea Drepturilor Artistilor Interpreti . Here's their website - http://www.credidam.ro/
Thanks Tony - I knew the website, but that abbreviation always slips my mind
Well, you may have a point there - but the calculation method is actually something that eludes me I was wondering how can an artist know how his revenues are calculated?
Posted by: klasaine Apr 22 2014, 05:24 PM
Well, you may have a point there - but the calculation method is actually something that eludes me I was wondering how can an artist know how his revenues are calculated?That's what an accountant and entertainment lawyer are for.
And when you get to the point where you 'think' you should be earning more than you are, then you need to employ both (some actually do both).
Nobody is gonna pay you if they think you aren't looking.
Posted by: tonymiro Apr 22 2014, 06:28 PM
If you mean the broadcast royalties Cosmin - in the UK for radio it's based in part on the Rajar figures. So what a station pays depends on reach, audience, demographics etc. That is then factored by the type program and when it's aired. The station is meant to supply an itemised breakdown of their playlist for the given period and that with the Rajar etc allow the royalties to be calculated. Many bigger stations use playout systems that automatically collect the ISRC to compile the playlists for the PRS. No ISRC may at best mean no payment and can at worst mean that the station may not want to include your stuff. The payment is aggregated by the station and that is then broken down at the PRS and sent to the label . The label is then supposed to divide it up appropriately.
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 23 2014, 06:43 AM
Kind of like it works in our country, but the revenues are sent directly to the artist and not at a label out of what I know. Hiring a lawyer and an accountant - it sounds like the professional way to do it, but if I come to think of the artists in here, they usually use the money they earn from CREDIDAM to pay off debts accumulated in between the pays
It's sad, but, this is how it goes. Artists are not people that know how to deal with expenses and they don't want to learn anything that can help them live a more balanced life. Not everyone is like this but the majority is.
Posted by: RichardK Apr 24 2014, 04:13 PM
It's sad, but, this is how it goes. Artists are not people that know how to deal with expenses and they don't want to learn anything that can help them live a more balanced life. Not everyone is like this but the majority is.I think it's interesting we still have the idea in our heads that, in general, a musician or artist is still seen as the creative type and not as a business savvy type. It could be true, but I think a lot of people in the business perpetuate that stereotype to earn money. I think in a lot of ways, musicians can nowadays cut out the middle man. Except for accounting, you can leave that bureaucratic hell hole for the accountants
.
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 24 2014, 06:24 PM
For folks trying to create revenue streams from music, it's important to try to draw from as many sources as possible.
1.)Merch (any merch, you can start with something like cafepress.com which requires no initial money. You don't make much per item, but you can start selling all types of merchandise WITHOUT investment )
2.)Getting your music in iTunes/Spofity (wads of resources on this that I've posted endlessly, but this revenue is a very thin trickle)
3.)Licensing (selling/renting your music to be used for adverts or backgrounds, tv indie films, you can join one of billions of stock music sites, or agencies, bit too much for a point list)
4.)Getting listed with performing rights organizations.
Just a few and just a pinch of an idea on each. In short, you gotta put a lot of lines in the water and catch a lot of small fish. At least until you can "breakthrough"/"cross over" etc. Assuming of course that's the goal
For some folks, (Cannibal Corpse comes to mind) they don't ever plan on making a living from music. They all have day jobs. They play HUGE festivals all summer then go back to their jobs. Also FENRIZ (of DARKTHRONE credited with practically inventing Black Metal) STILL WORKS AT THE POST OFFICE!!! No joke.
Some folks have managed to make a living via other means in addition to music (OLA ENGLUND) comes to mind. He was working in an office up until pretty recently. His youtube channel is the source for pretty much all of his other success so don't underestimate the power of youtube
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 25 2014, 01:33 PM
Very good advice from Todd - but to offer a little glimpse of what the Romanian scene looks like:
- full time artists - 'We are too good to do something else as well! Everything should come to us' They literally starve when there are no gigs. I have a lot of friends living with this attitude and suffering for every bit of it.
- full time artists performing commercial music - they are barely artists as they are more entertainers than singers (because it's mainly singers) - they earn A LOT of money
- artist/ entreprenours - people like me and a very few other friends, that are trying to understand the means to get as much out of music as possible, but still have other income sources, such as small businesses, because they wish to be the masters of their own time, in order to be able to juggle with things as they see fit.
- people that have a day job and also a band - the majority doesn't try to learn too much, they are happy with the way things are and that's that for them.
These are pretty much the categories which you will meet in here - the biggest segment isn't trying to improve, that's the worse part... Education is the biggest fault here, because people literally refuse to search for opportunities. They just shrug and ask... what can I do?
If they would read Todd's suggestions they would not raise a finger to do something unfortunately... We have so much to learn..
Posted by: klasaine Apr 25 2014, 02:12 PM
It's not that much different anywhere else.
I would say the biggest advantage we have in the states are the 'secondary' markets. The potential places that your music can get used and no one even thinks about stealing it from you - TV, Film, public works projects, video games, sporting events, museum events/usage, in store play, in flight promotion (ex: short film about _____ town's convention center before the plane lands), etc.
Todd's list, numbers 3 and 4 refer and apply to this.
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 26 2014, 08:25 AM
I would say the biggest advantage we have in the states are the 'secondary' markets. The potential places that your music can get used and no one even thinks about stealing it from you - TV, Film, public works projects, video games, sporting events, museum events/usage, in store play, in flight promotion (ex: short film about _____ town's convention center before the plane lands), etc.
Todd's list, numbers 3 and 4 refer and apply to this.
We also have that here, but as I said - people prefer whining rather than sitting down a bit and analyzing the situation:
- I am not Metallica or Whitney Houston
- What can I do as an artist that respects him/herself in order to make a living out of my craft or derivatives in the world I exist in?
In fewer words - adapting - a hell of a hard issue
I will always keep this Darwin quote in mind:
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 27 2014, 06:42 PM
The DARWIN quote is perfect It really nails the answer. You gotta adapt. The "biz" (like pretty much every biz) is a moving target.
If folks in Romania, America, or wherever don't wanna progress/learn, that's on them, such is life eh? The good news is it makes a pinch more room for everyone else
- I am not Metallica or Whitney Houston
- What can I do as an artist that respects him/herself in order to make a living out of my craft or derivatives in the world I exist in?
In fewer words - adapting - a hell of a hard issue
I will always keep this Darwin quote in mind:Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 28 2014, 07:49 AM
True man, true, but when some of those folks are your friends or some even play with you, it's a tad more difficult to go over things You know what I am saying..right?
Posted by: Todd Simpson Apr 28 2014, 08:43 PM
Very true!! If you are the only one on the team pulling toward the goal, it's just awful. Getting everyone on the same page can be really tough!
You know what I am saying..right?Posted by: klasaine Apr 28 2014, 11:54 PM
Yeah, some things have never changed ... regardless of technology
@Cosmin ... do you guys (Days of Confusion) book your own shows/events?
Do venues in Romania even let you do that?
One thing that we do here in the states, or at least in the bigger cities, is basically rent out a venue - book bands/speakers/artists (whatever) - call up a food truck and see if they'll come out - see what's the reality of selling alcohol - set a price and get all the bands to do at least do FB/Twitter posting. *Whoever actually organizes the event does most of the media. Most clubs here won't even charge that much for the night especially if they get to open their bar and keep all the liquor profits.
Bands here have also been fairly successful getting product sponsors to do a 'one time' deal. For example: set up a show with 3 bands and ask Jack Daniels if they'd like to in some way maybe 'help' sponsor one concert (or not - they can just have a presence and give away or sell booze and t-shirts). That could be a good way for them to actually see how you draw - ?
I don't know ... just thinking.
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 29 2014, 08:29 AM
@Cosmin ... do you guys (Days of Confusion) book your own shows/events?
Do venues in Romania even let you do that?
One thing that we do here in the states, or at least in the bigger cities, is basically rent out a venue - book bands/speakers/artists (whatever) - call up a food truck and see if they'll come out - see what's the reality of selling alcohol - set a price and get all the bands to do at least do FB/Twitter posting. *Whoever actually organizes the event does most of the media. Most clubs here won't even charge that much for the night especially if they get to open their bar and keep all the liquor profits.
Bands here have also been fairly successful getting product sponsors to do a 'one time' deal. For example: set up a show with 3 bands and ask Jack Daniels if they'd like to in some way maybe 'help' sponsor one concert (or not - they can just have a presence and give away or sell booze and t-shirts). That could be a good way for them to actually see how you draw - ?
I don't know ... just thinking.
Yes and no - each of us knows a lot of people - organizers, managers and so on and we also have PR that acts as a manager these days - she also has a lot of contacts and helps out a lot.
These are very good suggestions indeed - the thing here, is that Jack is an expensive drink and folks usually complain about having to pay 5-6 bucks as an entrance fee for a gig.. so unfortunately, the idea is good but the people are uneducated
They will try to get ANYTHING for free - hey get me in for free, hey I wanna have a drink on the house, hey this, hey that! You know the drill That's why it's pretty difficult to get in a good relationship with a brand these days in my country. Jack for instance, is associated with artists that barely have some rock n roll in their music - just a slight hint, otherwise cheesy pop stuff, but the people listening to that, have money and drink Jack - there you go
Posted by: klasaine Apr 29 2014, 04:08 PM
Believe me I understand that very well.
I'll be 52 years old this year. My 'demographic' will spend some money when they go out.
Well, look at it this way ... you have something to look forward to
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Apr 30 2014, 12:21 PM
I'll be 52 years old this year. My 'demographic' will spend some money when they go out.
Well, look at it this way ... you have something to look forward to
So, in your acceptance, I should be looking forward to getting old, eh?
Well, I'd rather stay strong and agile and work harder Thank you 
I am currently on the hunt for companies which believe in young blood - there MUST be some out there
I really can't think that there's NO one - right?
Posted by: tonymiro Apr 30 2014, 03:31 PM
...Well unless you know something that we all don't you aren't going to get any younger mate
I really can't think that there's NO one - right?Perhaps you need to target those brands that position themselves as such. Less JD and maybe more Red Bull or any energy drink; for clothes - more Springfield or Pull and Bear and less Marks & Spencers...
Posted by: klasaine Apr 30 2014, 04:48 PM
Tony beat me to it.
But I'll keep my post.
Well, I'd rather stay strong and agile and work harder Thank you I am currently on the hunt for companies which believe in young blood - there MUST be some out there
I really can't think that there's NO one - right?Oh I went into middle age kicking and screaming believe me. Alas no amount of strength and agility staves off the actual years. Or - more importantly for a musician - the 'years' that others ascribe to you.
Big (old) companies - like Jack Daniels -are into safety (return on investment). They know that the blues crowd, the jazz crowd, 'classic' rock crowd and even the 'pop' crowd has some money to spend. Jack Daniels doesn't care about rock and roll or youth ... they care about money. That's why (either in this thread or another) I asked you about what else your demographic likes to eat/drink/wear - ?
Of course there's someone out there that's in to 'young' blood. More than likely - it's a younger (like minded) company.
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 1 2014, 05:46 AM
Companies are more interested in "young blood" than "old blood" just as a generalization But what they REALLY want is an artists that can drive "traffic". E.G eyeballs/adspace etc. A band with a really kicking social media presence has a really big "Leg Up" as it were in the current scene imho
So keep track of your numbers/analytics on all of your social media. Put that with your press kit. It's part of what you can use to sell your "Brand". Those numbers mean more and more to companies, especially since the decline in unit sales/product has forced the biz to shift and shift and shift to find new revenue streams.
One solid piece of advice is to consider an out of pocket monthly spend on INDIE PR FIRM to put your music in front of various bloggers/zines.
Here is one firm that does LAMB OF GOD among others. I don't know what they have as a standard rate but you might wanna hit them up
http://www.adrenalinepr.com/
Also here is a link to the PRICELESS "KILLING IS MY BUSINESS" post series @ Decibel Magazine. Worth reading every one
http://www.decibelmagazine.com/category/killing-is-my-business/
Well, I'd rather stay strong and agile and work harder Thank you I am currently on the hunt for companies which believe in young blood - there MUST be some out there
I really can't think that there's NO one - right?Posted by: Cosmin Lupu May 1 2014, 09:04 PM
Great advices Todd and also, resources You are right about this and I think it's more of a more thorough search matter
I would be curious, have you ever approached a company which is unrelated to music (i.e. not a company that you can endorse) that you managed to tie a sponsorship deal with?
Ken - you are also right, but see, for me personally, Jack (in here) is tied to names that haven't got anything to do with artistry in general.. I thought that, ok, business is business, but as a respectable company with a very old history, they are sure not living up to their reputation.
Of course, this is dictated by the market, but still... ah, I am just an idealist
Posted by: klasaine May 1 2014, 09:34 PM
A lot of companies, unrelated to music, will underwrite the transportation costs of tours. Even credit card companies have done this (amex - Paul McCartney). I was on a tour that was partially underwritten by Tommy Hilfiger. I still have a pair of sunglasses and one of shirts that they gave us (ton of swag). They paid for the rental of two tour buses.
*I'm not sure what Jack Daniels as a company is supposed to live up to. They sell whiskey. They sponsor americana/country rock bands like Zac Brown and baseball teams like the Texas Rangers. They probably don't think you're their demographic.
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu May 2 2014, 10:29 AM
I am sure it's a matter of selecting the right company for the whole thing. I started with the companies where I knew people, as that seemed fairly logical, but I think I should try to get over the relationships I already have and build new ones, by orienting myself towards the companies which are known to support youngblood.
Thanks for the insight Ken - I think that it's a matter of understanding the market first:
- what people are listening to your music
- what do those people like to consume/use and so on
- what companies produce the above used stuff
..so that's the path I'll follow
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