The Murder Of Music, Think Before You Act
Emir Hot
Dec 9 2009, 04:18 AM
Instructor
Posts: 7.201
Joined: 14-July 08
From: London UK
My friend and an awesome neoclassical shredder Borislav Mitic has recently signed for Lion Music which is the metal label from Finland that also released my album.

Just before he released his new record he posted a very seirous story about "The Murder of Music" on the Lion Music's website. Some of other Lion Music artists (including me) also gave their input on this subject.

CHECK IT OUT HERE!

I would be interested to see comments on Borislav's text from GMC community.

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Rik Veldhuizen
Dec 13 2009, 02:12 PM
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Posts: 253
Joined: 27-July 07
From: Netherlands
The mistake here is the comparison of kidney removal execution. The interpretation of the crowd's opinions/predictions is a different matter. Those who want to execute on it (i.e. remove the kidney) can and should take the results into consideration. You are not asking the crowd to actually remove the kidney, you are tapping into their collective intelligence on what could work best for the situation. Use their opinions/predictions to your own discretion.

Obviously, the kidney comparison is not working, given that the crowd does not necessarily have info that would help here smile.gif. However, we all buy/make/love music and have been doing this for a long time. Surely there is value in the opinions.

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This post has been edited by Rik Veldhuizen: Dec 13 2009, 02:12 PM
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jstcrsn
Dec 13 2009, 03:07 PM
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QUOTE (Rik Veldhuizen @ Dec 13 2009, 02:12 PM) *
The mistake here is the comparison of kidney removal execution. The interpretation of the crowd's opinions/predictions is a different matter. Those who want to execute on it (i.e. remove the kidney) can and should take the results into consideration. You are not asking the crowd to actually remove the kidney, you are tapping into their collective intelligence on what could work best for the situation. Use their opinions/predictions to your own discretion.

Obviously, the kidney comparison is not working, given that the crowd does not necessarily have info that would help here smile.gif. However, we all buy/make/love music and have been doing this for a long time. Surely there is value in the opinions.

i was using the kidney as a metaphore for someone who has been there and done that versus someone who hasn'nt and is only describing what they heard or how they think it should be donei- please don't make me use big words like metophore again , don't know if i spelled it right and it just hurts my head blink.gif
as fare as the cd thanks. it was made in 2ooo and the band broke up in early 03, i'll ask the singer if he minds me posting a song for GMC listeners

about hte main theme about Emir topic
if someone walked up to you and said i will sell your cd and make you onr million dollars but for every one you make i will make 9 mill. and without him you will probably make 50.000 .would you do it. is that wrong for that person to profit like that .well that is what the record campanies do. i understand about the knew media and it is effective but not like posters mass media t.v. exposure . to me all are good the problem lies in the STEALING in either one

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This post has been edited by jstcrsn: Dec 13 2009, 03:27 PM
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Emir Hot
Dec 13 2009, 04:36 PM
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Posts: 7.201
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From: London UK
QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Dec 13 2009, 02:07 PM) *
if someone walked up to you and said i will sell your cd and make you onr million dollars but for every one you make i will make 9 mill. and without him you will probably make 50.000 .would you do it. is that wrong for that person to profit like that .well that is what the record campanies do. i understand about the knew media and it is effective but not like posters mass media t.v. exposure . to me all are good the problem lies in the STEALING in either one

I would accept this offer. With that money I would be able to continue myself when the contract finishes. Record labels have to live of something. The service they provide is often something that we can't do ourselves. Their way of promotion and distribution is far more developed than what we can do alone. Also they help you with money to finish your product. I got some money for the studio plus they paid for all manufacturing, distribution, promotion etc... I only paid my musicians and the rest of the studio costs.

It might be true that their share is much bigger but that's how you get into the market with the big names and make your own name. You don't have to stay with the label for life.

Now, this would only work if people legaly buy your stuff. Imagine that with all their promotional work you don't cover what you invested then how can you possibly cover the cost without them? No Google or Youtube can help you get your money back, that's wrong thinking in my oppinion.

Either way (with the label or without) it's not working and the problem is in illegal distribution, filesharing and copying someone else's work. Very big names and awesome musicians, sometimes true legends, are slowly giving up.

QUOTE (Staffy @ Dec 13 2009, 03:32 PM) *
Ibriza Jusic

I personaly know this guy. He is from ex-Yugoslavia, awesome musician and was very famous 15 and more years ago.

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Staffy
Dec 13 2009, 05:04 PM
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Posts: 2.294
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From: Genarp, Sweden
QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 13 2009, 04:36 PM) *
I would accept this offer. With that money I would be able to continue myself when the contract finishes. Record labels have to live of something. The service they provide is often something that we can't do ourselves. Their way of promotion and distribution is far more developed than what we can do alone. Also they help you with money to finish your product. I got some money for the studio plus they paid for all manufacturing, distribution, promotion etc... I only paid my musicians and the rest of the studio costs.

It might be true that their share is much bigger but that's how you get into the market with the big names and make your own name. You don't have to stay with the label for life.

Now, this would only work if people legaly buy your stuff. Imagine that with all their promotional work you don't cover what you invested then how can you possibly cover the cost without them? No Google or Youtube can help you get your money back, that's wrong thinking in my oppinion.

Either way (with the label or without) it's not working and the problem is in illegal distribution, filesharing and copying someone else's work. Very big names and awesome musicians, sometimes true legends, are slowly giving up.


I personaly know this guy. He is from ex-Yugoslavia, awesome musician and was very famous 15 and more years ago.


I'll give You right in that a promoting company can do a lot more than Yourself since they got the financial resources. But still they are thinking in the wrong way. How many people visit a record store today in search of a new band/record ??? Personally I dont know a single person, my kids are adopting all new music through the internet or through watching TV-series/movies. So why are the companies still doing the same old-fashioned marketing??? There are surprisingly few ads on the internet for new bands and new music. At the same time we are experiencing higher ticket prizes to concerts, I paid 40€ for seeing Gary Moore in Berlin, and that was CHEAP..... This tells me once again: The musicians today must try to live on their concerts/live performances rather than selling records. An other interesting alternative would be if the record business worked more close with the gaming/entertainment business licensing the songs for games etc.

The only way to stop the filesharing is to make it difficult and hard to do - eg. it would be easier to buy it than put some hours to try to copying it. Another way would be to introduce a new digital format that will be hard to copy and as well have a much higher quality than the MP3's. But this will only work for some years - until its hacked and then we are back from the beginning again..... Compare it to Microsofts genuine validation and You'll get a grasp of what I mean... People are copying Windows, but in the long run its too messy to deal with, so its easier to pay for it.

But still, the most important question is: Do we really want to have record stores and consume music like in the old days? Personally I say no, I would rather pay 16€ to watch my favourite artist online with my credit card, than driving my car to a record store and buy the last album. The crowd has changed their consuming behaviour and so must the record labels/recording industry. Thats why we have a problem with pirating - eg. dont blame the consumers, blame the industry who still want to play by their own old rules!

//Staffay

QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 13 2009, 04:36 PM) *
I personaly know this guy. He is from ex-Yugoslavia, awesome musician and was very famous 15 and more years ago.


Yeah, thats true! smile.gif I was on a record with him playing guitar in the 80's, ask him if he remembers Matchtown Studios in Sweden. He was also doin a Yugoslavian version of a Swedish song, cant remember which it was though....

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Guitars: Ibanez AM-200, Ibanez GB-10, Fender Stratocaster Classic Player, Warmouth Custom Built, Suhr Classic Strat, Gibson Les Paul Standard 2003, Ibanez steel-string
Amps: Fender Hot Rod Deluxe, Marshall JMP 2103, AER 60
Effects: BOSS DD-20, Danelectro Trans. Overdrive, TC-Electronics G-Major, Dunlop Wah-wah, Original SansAmp, BOSS DD-2
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Posts in this topic
- Emir Hot   The Murder Of Music   Dec 9 2009, 04:18 AM
- - Santiago Diaz Garces   Let's take a look......   Dec 9 2009, 04:23 AM
- - audiopaal   I agree with him for the most part, and it's t...   Dec 9 2009, 08:07 AM
- - gibsonmatte   Really strong words from your friend Emir, and I a...   Dec 9 2009, 09:38 AM
|- - audiopaal   QUOTE (gibsonmatte @ Dec 9 2009, 09:38 AM...   Dec 9 2009, 10:37 AM
|- - jafomatic   QUOTE (audiopaal @ Dec 9 2009, 03:37 AM) ...   Dec 9 2009, 11:22 AM
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- - ItsMe   Nice article, strong words. I agree absolutely tha...   Dec 9 2009, 01:20 PM
- - CathShadow   I don't pirate, neither music, nor games. peri...   Dec 9 2009, 02:17 PM
- - Keilnoth   Ah well, I wrote a big text but then deleted it. P...   Dec 9 2009, 07:31 PM
- - Gus   Piracy is always a delicate topic. I remember Marc...   Dec 9 2009, 07:33 PM
- - MirkoSchmidt   hey, i have 42 Gigabyte Music ripped from Internet...   Dec 9 2009, 07:47 PM
- - Fran   QUOTE (Gus @ Dec 9 2009, 07:33 PM) ... In...   Dec 9 2009, 07:59 PM
|- - gibsonmatte   QUOTE (Fran @ Dec 9 2009, 07:59 PM) That...   Dec 10 2009, 12:07 PM
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- - Emir Hot   I would agree with Mirko that ripped music has no ...   Dec 9 2009, 08:05 PM
|- - MirkoSchmidt   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 9 2009, 08:05 PM) I...   Dec 9 2009, 08:09 PM
|- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (MirkoSchmidt @ Dec 9 2009, 07:09 P...   Dec 9 2009, 08:36 PM
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- - ItsMe   QUOTE (Gus @ Dec 9 2009, 07:33 PM) In my ...   Dec 9 2009, 08:09 PM
- - Keilnoth   Emir, I am really interested to know the policies ...   Dec 9 2009, 08:36 PM
|- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (Keilnoth @ Dec 9 2009, 07:36 PM) E...   Dec 9 2009, 09:01 PM
|- - audiopaal   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 9 2009, 09:01 PM) T...   Dec 9 2009, 09:22 PM
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- - ItsMe   Emir what do you think about streaming flatrates. ...   Dec 9 2009, 08:47 PM
- - Keilnoth   legaldownload.net seems to be the site use by Lion...   Dec 9 2009, 10:39 PM
- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (audiopaal @ Dec 9 2009, 08:22 PM) ...   Dec 10 2009, 12:15 AM
- - Ctodd   I would rather give my money directly to the artis...   Dec 10 2009, 12:18 AM
- - audiopaal   I checked some torrent sites but couldn't find...   Dec 10 2009, 12:25 AM
|- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (audiopaal @ Dec 9 2009, 11:25 PM) ...   Dec 10 2009, 09:46 AM
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- - Mandos   Just a little side note. Take a look at this labs....   Dec 10 2009, 01:20 PM
- - Keilnoth   Very interesting Mandos, thanks for the link !   Dec 10 2009, 02:20 PM
- - Staffy   Since this seems to be a "hot" topic, I ...   Dec 10 2009, 04:56 PM
|- - Emir Hot   I would dissagree on some of these since I felt it...   Dec 11 2009, 02:26 AM
|- - Staffy   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 11 2009, 02:26 AM) ...   Dec 11 2009, 10:07 AM
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- - Daniel Realpe   We live in a world under the monetary system that ...   Dec 10 2009, 08:21 PM
- - Ivan Milenkovic   The industry has changed upside down simply put. W...   Dec 11 2009, 01:19 AM
- - jafomatic   This is a perfect time to mention again that music...   Dec 11 2009, 03:39 AM
|- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (jafomatic @ Dec 11 2009, 02:39 AM)...   Dec 11 2009, 04:02 AM
|- - jafomatic   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 10 2009, 09:02 PM) ...   Dec 11 2009, 04:14 AM
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- - blindwillie   I have the greatest respect for you Emir but I dis...   Dec 11 2009, 09:06 AM
|- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (blindwillie @ Dec 11 2009, 08:06 A...   Dec 11 2009, 01:56 PM
|- - Ivan Milenkovic   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 11 2009, 01:56 PM) ...   Dec 11 2009, 03:05 PM
|- - Staffy   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 11 2009, 01:56 PM) ...   Dec 11 2009, 03:40 PM
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- - Keilnoth   QUOTE It is always cool to see your favorite band ...   Dec 11 2009, 02:16 PM
|- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (Keilnoth @ Dec 11 2009, 01:16 PM) ...   Dec 11 2009, 02:35 PM
|- - audiopaal   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 11 2009, 02:35 PM) ...   Dec 11 2009, 02:41 PM
||- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (audiopaal @ Dec 11 2009, 01:41 PM)...   Dec 11 2009, 02:44 PM
||- - audiopaal   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 11 2009, 02:44 PM) ...   Dec 11 2009, 03:38 PM
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|- - MirkoSchmidt   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 11 2009, 02:35 PM) ...   Dec 13 2009, 12:18 PM
|- - Staffy   QUOTE (MirkoSchmidt @ Dec 13 2009, 12:18 ...   Dec 13 2009, 12:27 PM
|- - MirkoSchmidt   QUOTE (Staffy @ Dec 13 2009, 12:27 PM) *B...   Dec 13 2009, 12:33 PM
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- - Keilnoth   QUOTE So what are we doing here with 10 hours of p...   Dec 11 2009, 02:47 PM
|- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (Keilnoth @ Dec 11 2009, 01:47 PM) ...   Dec 11 2009, 02:54 PM
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- - jafomatic   Apparently the labels can't advertise well eno...   Dec 11 2009, 03:08 PM
|- - Ivan Milenkovic   QUOTE (jafomatic @ Dec 11 2009, 03:08 PM)...   Dec 11 2009, 03:23 PM
|- - Keilnoth   QUOTE (Ivan Milenkovic @ Dec 11 2009, 03...   Dec 11 2009, 04:20 PM
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- - intemperateControl   Hard to come up with a solution to that problem. A...   Dec 11 2009, 03:17 PM
- - Ivan Milenkovic   Perhaps you can name the bands and we can discuss ...   Dec 12 2009, 03:17 AM
- - kahall   I don't know if it is my age, the internet, or...   Dec 12 2009, 06:38 AM
- - OrganisedConfusion   If the band is good they'll make money if they...   Dec 12 2009, 07:36 AM
|- - Caelumamittendum   QUOTE (OrganisedConfusion @ Dec 12 2009, 07...   Dec 12 2009, 12:27 PM
|- - Staffy   QUOTE (Caelumamittendum @ Dec 12 2009, 12...   Dec 12 2009, 12:36 PM
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- - blindwillie   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 11 2009, 02:35 PM) ...   Dec 12 2009, 01:58 PM
- - Pedja Simovic   This is very interesting thread. It started with v...   Dec 12 2009, 02:25 PM
|- - Staffy   [quote name='Pedja Simovic' date='Dec ...   Dec 13 2009, 11:36 AM
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- - Neurologi   There is but one problem with some or most of the ...   Dec 13 2009, 10:23 AM
- - Rik Veldhuizen   Sad to hear you won't continue your profession...   Dec 13 2009, 10:49 AM
- - jstcrsn   Quick qeustion. How many C.D.'s have any of yo...   Dec 13 2009, 12:39 PM
- - Neurologi   QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Dec 13 2009, 01:39 PM) Q...   Dec 13 2009, 12:41 PM
- - MirkoSchmidt   i have sold 0 cds, you?   Dec 13 2009, 12:43 PM
|- - jstcrsn   QUOTE (MirkoSchmidt @ Dec 13 2009, 12:43 ...   Dec 13 2009, 01:14 PM
|- - Neurologi   QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Dec 13 2009, 02:14 PM) t...   Dec 13 2009, 01:28 PM
|- - jstcrsn   QUOTE (Neurologi @ Dec 13 2009, 01:28 PM)...   Dec 13 2009, 01:30 PM
|- - Neurologi   QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Dec 13 2009, 02:30 PM) y...   Dec 13 2009, 01:42 PM
|- - jstcrsn   QUOTE (Neurologi @ Dec 13 2009, 01:42 PM)...   Dec 13 2009, 02:03 PM
|- - Neurologi   QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Dec 13 2009, 03:03 PM) d...   Dec 13 2009, 02:49 PM
|- - MirkoSchmidt   QUOTE (Neurologi @ Dec 13 2009, 02:49 PM)...   Dec 13 2009, 02:55 PM
|- - Staffy   QUOTE (Neurologi @ Dec 13 2009, 02:49 PM)...   Dec 13 2009, 04:32 PM
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- - Rik Veldhuizen   That is impressive. But: do not underestimate the...   Dec 13 2009, 01:16 PM
|- - Neurologi   QUOTE (Rik Veldhuizen @ Dec 13 2009, 03:1...   Dec 13 2009, 03:00 PM
|- - Neurologi   QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Dec 13 2009, 04:07 PM) a...   Dec 13 2009, 03:27 PM
|- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (Staffy @ Dec 13 2009, 04:04 PM) Pe...   Dec 13 2009, 05:17 PM
|- - Staffy   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 13 2009, 05:17 PM) ...   Dec 13 2009, 05:22 PM
|- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (Staffy @ Dec 13 2009, 04:22 PM) Ye...   Dec 13 2009, 05:38 PM
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- - MirkoSchmidt   wtf.... what means kidney? imy dictionary only tol...   Dec 13 2009, 02:49 PM
- - Kristofer Dahl   This is a very interesting and hot topic. Persona...   Dec 13 2009, 04:18 PM
- - Rik Veldhuizen   Selling 1000 CDs is great...! I can't even...   Dec 13 2009, 04:19 PM
|- - MirkoSchmidt   QUOTE (Rik Veldhuizen @ Dec 13 2009, 04:1...   Dec 13 2009, 07:32 PM
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- - NoSkill   This is an interesting topic. The last time I rea...   Dec 13 2009, 04:24 PM
- - MickeM   Artists have been poor through out all times, then...   Dec 13 2009, 05:25 PM
|- - Staffy   QUOTE (MickeM @ Dec 13 2009, 05:25 PM) So...   Dec 13 2009, 05:55 PM
|- - Emir Hot   QUOTE (Staffy @ Dec 13 2009, 04:55 PM) So...   Dec 13 2009, 06:10 PM
||- - Staffy   QUOTE (Emir Hot @ Dec 13 2009, 06:10 PM) ...   Dec 13 2009, 07:03 PM
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|- - Jakub Luptovec   Completely agree with Staffay. The music business ...   Dec 13 2009, 06:18 PM
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- - jafomatic   I assume not everyone (or anyone?) can see Hulu ou...   Dec 13 2009, 06:43 PM
- - Jakub Luptovec   Yea, even tho, I dont have USA IP, the hulu projec...   Dec 13 2009, 06:55 PM
- - Fran   Talking about good legal alternatives to listen/ge...   Dec 13 2009, 07:32 PM
- - Neurologi   Glad someone finally had the sense to point out th...   Dec 13 2009, 07:33 PM
- - Staffy   What must be understood in this debate is that not...   Dec 13 2009, 08:11 PM
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