Printable Version of Topic

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 15 2009, 05:32 PM

...For the Rated HTR's Gas association

Here's the deal, I did a topic some time ago about buying a new guitar and having 2000£ as a budge but,the problem is, if I want to do gigs, I need a stack since, atm, I have none. Just vote on the poll please and do give suggestions. I either buy a great metal guitar, buy a great stack or buy both but cheaper ones. But it has to be pure metal. Remember, vote but please suggest if possible.

Cheers for the help guys

Posted by: Staffy Oct 15 2009, 05:43 PM

I had gone for both, beeing on stage is what is all about in my meaning, and U still can get descent stuff for 2000$

//Staffay

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 15 2009, 05:47 PM

QUOTE (Staffy @ Oct 15 2009, 05:43 PM)

I had gone for both, beeing on stage is what is all about in my meaning, and U still can get descent stuff for 2000$

//Staffay

Posted by: vampire18 Oct 15 2009, 06:02 PM

i would say unless your an active performing musician a kick ass gutiar and a pod. youll be able to record songs on your computer that sound great and play for yourself and when you get maybe some gigs you can use you pod as fx padel on stage(p.s get one of the live versions) and play with a smaller amp, your probably not going to strat off performing in a football field anyawys and at home a big amp is even worse than a small one, it just doesnt do it justice

Posted by: Fran Oct 15 2009, 06:22 PM

I voted guitar, but it could have been amp too.

What I mean is you better get definitive gear, even if it takes a bit longer to get both things. You'll save money in the long run

Just my 2 cents

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 15 2009, 06:43 PM

QUOTE (vampire18 @ Oct 15 2009, 06:02 PM)

Posted by: Sensible Jones Oct 15 2009, 06:52 PM

I'd say split the money and buy both!!
With 1200-1500 you'll get an awesome 2nd hand Axe and that'll leave enough for a 2nd hand stack as well!!!

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 15 2009, 06:53 PM

QUOTE (Sensible Jones @ Oct 15 2009, 06:52 PM)

I'd say split the money and buy both!!
With 1200-1500 you'll get an awesome 2nd hand Axe and that'll leave enough for a 2nd hand stack as well!!!

Posted by: Sensible Jones Oct 15 2009, 07:52 PM

The list is pretty much endless!
Hardtail or Tremolo?
With temolo? Fairly high-end Ibanez's, Jackson's, Dean's!!!
Without tremolo? Les Paul's, Hardtail Ibanez, Dean!!
Active or Passive pickups? Medium or High Output pickups???

Secondly, as we've discussed before, you need to go try a few things in a Store to see what you like the feel of!!
No-one can tell you what will feel alright to you!

Posted by: Staffy Oct 15 2009, 07:57 PM

Or maybe You can go for the guitar and at the same time make a deal with the store about the stack ?
They are maybe willing to give some months credit if You are buying a guitar for 2000£, then You can do some gigs and pay the stack....

//Staffay

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 15 2009, 08:05 PM

QUOTE (Sensible Jones @ Oct 15 2009, 07:52 PM)

The list is pretty much endless!
Hardtail or Tremolo?
With temolo? Fairly high-end Ibanez's, Jackson's, Dean's!!!
Without tremolo? Les Paul's, Hardtail Ibanez, Dean!!
Active or Passive pickups? Medium or High Output pickups???

Secondly, as we've discussed before, you need to go try a few things in a Store to see what you like the feel of!!
No-one can tell you what will feel alright to you!

QUOTE (Staffy @ Oct 15 2009, 07:57 PM)

Posted by: Bogdan Radovic Oct 15 2009, 08:12 PM

Hmm If you are satisfied with the guitar you have currently then I would vote for stack. In my priorities list its guitar first then amp but both are almost equally important in building your own sound. Also size of the gig doesn't necessary require you to have a stack. 50w tube amp will do great job at any gig since on all the gigs guitar amp gets mic'ed and goes through PA system. Also on club gigs you won't have a chance of cracking loud a powerful head since your sound on stage needs to be balanced with other instruments and not to loud. Though stack is cool to have on outdoor gigs for sure So see if you have a good comfortable guitar, if you do you can get a good amp (and consider less powerful options like 50W half stack 2x12). If you don't invest in a cool guitar and save up the rest. Maybe you should be able to squeeze both in the price if you try hard

Posted by: ZakkWylde Oct 15 2009, 08:41 PM

What do you already have?

You wont need another good guitar if you have three good ones already if you catch my drift...
If you don't have any high-quality guitars then go for your dream guitar!

---

A Halfstack should only be bought when you are already in a band or are joining one, they are complete overkill for homeuse (first-hand experience: I had my JVM Marshall at home for a while!!!)

You can always keep some kind of amp-fund so that you will be ready to get a great halfstack when you need one; go all out when you buy a tube stack, get a really good one and better spend more than less cash - it's worth it!

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 15 2009, 09:26 PM

QUOTE (Bogdan Radovic @ Oct 15 2009, 08:12 PM)

Hmm If you are satisfied with the guitar you have currently then I would vote for stack. In my priorities list its guitar first then amp but both are almost equally important in building your own sound. Also size of the gig doesn't necessary require you to have a stack. 50w tube amp will do great job at any gig since on all the gigs guitar amp gets mic'ed and goes through PA system. Also on club gigs you won't have a chance of cracking loud a powerful head since your sound on stage needs to be balanced with other instruments and not to loud. Though stack is cool to have on outdoor gigs for sure So see if you have a good comfortable guitar, if you do you can get a good amp (and consider less powerful options like 50W half stack 2x12). If you don't invest in a cool guitar and save up the rest. Maybe you should be able to squeeze both in the price if you try hard

QUOTE (ZakkWylde @ Oct 15 2009, 08:41 PM)

Posted by: ZakkWylde Oct 15 2009, 09:51 PM

I guess your best option is buying used then...

Try to find a used Metal tube head, for example a Peavey 6505/5150 and make sure it has new tubes. Get a good and cheap 2x12 or 4x12 cab for it (also used, cabs last for decades if looked after...). That should be arround 1000£ if you can get some good deals.

That leaves arround 1000£ for a middle class new guitar or high class used guitar, again check Ebay and musician boards with adds on the internet. You could easily get an ESP Eclipse in great used condition for that much money!!

Posted by: tonymiro Oct 15 2009, 10:00 PM

Be versatile and get a good guitar and pre-amp and direct that to the desk. At some time in the future then build up a good amp/effects rack.

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 15 2009, 10:19 PM

QUOTE (tonymiro @ Oct 15 2009, 10:00 PM)

Posted by: ZakkWylde Oct 15 2009, 10:41 PM

I can only say it again: look out for a used guitar in a good shape and try to find some great deals

http://www.guitarmasterclass.net/guitar_forum/index.php?showtopic=31286

That beauty has not a single flaw and I got it for a little more than half the original price!

Posted by: Muris Varajic Oct 15 2009, 10:46 PM

Both, with 2000 GBP you can get some nice amp and guitar.

Btw, does it really have to be metal guitar??

Posted by: MickeM Oct 15 2009, 11:15 PM

Get a cheap Cort or something with EMG81/81 or 81/85 and a monster amp
How about a Peavey 3120? And a cab with Celection Vintage 30.
The Peavey is a rather new model, which always is fun. For a little less dirty sound you can always glance at the H&K Switchblade, as long as I'm happy with mine I will keep recommending it.

I've side by side tested a 4x12 with Vintage 30 and a Marshall with GT75 (scooped curve, brutal rock) and I have to say the cheap cab with V30 is far far better for the really tough tones. I'll rid of the Marshall and keep that one.
So go for Vintage 30's for metal, that's my tip.

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 15 2009, 11:40 PM

QUOTE (Muris Varajic @ Oct 15 2009, 10:46 PM)

Both, with 2000 GBP you can get some nice amp and guitar.

Btw, does it really have to be metal guitar??

QUOTE (MickeM @ Oct 15 2009, 11:15 PM)

Get a cheap Cort or something with EMG81/81 or 81/85 and a monster amp
How about a Peavey 3120? And a cab with Celection Vintage 30.
The Peavey is a rather new model, which always is fun. For a little less dirty sound you can always glance at the H&K Switchblade, as long as I'm happy with mine I will keep recommending it.

I've side by side tested a 4x12 with Vintage 30 and a Marshall with GT75 (scooped curve, brutal rock) and I have to say the cheap cab with V30 is far far better for the really tough tones. I'll rid of the Marshall and keep that one.
So go for Vintage 30's for metal, that's my tip.

Posted by: ZakkWylde Oct 15 2009, 11:48 PM

The Triple X is the predecessor of the 3120 MickeM mentioned.
A great and versatile metal amp, Max Cavalera of Sepultura and Soulfly uses them aswell as many others.

The cab you get with it is good, not great but also not too shabby. Replacement tubes and Flight cases so you are ready to go! If you can get that bundle for below 1k then you have made a great deal!!!

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 16 2009, 12:07 AM

Great, well, than it's settled, if I can get that bundle for less than 1k, I get 1k for guitar, any suggestions?

EDIT:
Just noticed, it's only for local pick up so I'm not sure If I'll be able to get it

How about this one?
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MESA-TRIPLE-RECTIFIER-FLIGHT-CASE-MARSHALL-1960-CAB_W0QQitemZ220483641259QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_MusicalInstr_Amplifiers_RL?hash=item3355d95fab&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14#ht_500wt_1025

EDIT:
Just noticed, it's only for local pick up so I'm not sure If I'll be able to get it
Both of them

How about this?

http://www.gumtree.com/london/16/44398016.html

Posted by: ZakkWylde Oct 16 2009, 12:07 AM

You have to consider that shipping a 4x12 cab is extremely expenisve and difficult (try to find a cardboardbox that size) so most people ony offer local pickup.

The triple rectifier is an awesome amp, one of the best but it has 150 watts so you have to play it really loud to make it sound good


Also it needs new tubes, a triple-rec runs on 14!!! tubes so you would have to spend at leasr 300Pounds for new tubes and biasing...

The valveking is a low budget tube amp, good for it's price but nowhere as good as the ''real ones'' you see behind pro artists on stage.

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 16 2009, 12:25 AM

I'm looking at london area amps and I'm finding low prices but unkown heads, what do you think?

http://www.gumtree.com/london/97/47182197.html
http://www.gumtree.com/london/41/46714241.html

Also found this, if it's still available do you think it's good?

http://www.gumtree.com/london/59/44741459.html

http://www.gumtree.com/london/28/47273428.html


NEW: I'm findng quite nice things IMO

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ESP-LTD-M-1000-Deluxe-electric-guitar-M1000_W0QQitemZ220494218934QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Consumer_Professional_RL?hash=item33567ac6b6&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14#ht_3273wt_1026

Posted by: ZakkWylde Oct 16 2009, 12:28 AM

That ESP Eclipse is great, an awesome Metal guitar for every subgenre metal has to offer.

Dunno about crate, haven't played one myself but they are known for being cheap not too good. Hiwatt is a brand related to classic rock, I doubt it can deliver Metal but I might be wrong, haven't played one myself...

Don't limit yourself by looking for head+cab offers! Find a good head and then you can worry about buying a cab afterwards seperate!!!

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 16 2009, 12:31 AM

Hmm, gonna contact the owner tomorrow to see if he still has it

did you check this one?
http://www.gumtree.com/london/16/44398016.html

What heads do you recommend than?

Posted by: ZakkWylde Oct 16 2009, 12:41 AM

Yeah that is the Valveking I was talking about, lower class tube amp

Go for the *usuall suspects*, the metal tube heads that are genre standards and fit in your budget:

Peavey 6505/5150: Machine Head, In Flames, Bullet For my Vallentine...
Peavey JSX: Soulfly, Dragonforce
Marshall Jvm/Jcm 2000: Megadeth, Trivium...
Mesa Dual Rectifier: Killswitch Engage, Metallica...
Engl Fireball/Powerball: Nevermore, Rammstein...

ofcourse there are many more like the Krank Revolution, The Hughes & Kettner Switchblade, The Randall V2, Peavey XXX/3120, Engl Savage/Blackmore, Framus Cobra/Dragon...the list is endless!!!

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 16 2009, 01:01 AM

the one I wanted was the Engl powerball but to get it, I can only get the stack, not the guitar.


I saw this one that's in London
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Randall-RH150-G3-Series-Head-2-BY-12-CABINET_W0QQitemZ300356243994QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_MusicalInstr_Amplifiers_RL?hash=item45eea0921a&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14#ht_500wt_1025

and the V2 is shipped but don't know the costs
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-Randall-Mike-Amott-V2-NINJA-HALF-STACK-SIGNED-V2NH_W0QQitemZ120422965300QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item1c09c4a034#ht_1301wt_1010

Considering it would be like 100£ I could get a schecter hellraiser...

edit:
or this, without the signature
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Randall-V2-Ninja-Guitar-Amplifier-4x12-Cabinet_W0QQitemZ300353411840QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_MusicalInstr_Amplifiers_RL?hash=item45ee755b00&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14#ht_1515wt_1010

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 17 2009, 12:46 AM

New one, just came today...

http://www.gumtree.com/london/80/47344880.html

Posted by: tommyboy Oct 17 2009, 04:49 AM

Here's my advice. Get a stack if you want a stack. The main thing is getting good cabinets. Example, Marshall 1960 loaded with celestion g12-75's. Here's why, you can get or change heads as you music style progresses and changes. Once you have the cabinets you'll always have a stack no matter what head your using.

So much of tone is created via the amp. I'm a huge Marshall fan as are many great guitar gods out there. Marshall heads used can be a great deal and there are tons of them out there. However, any quality tube amp could do the job.

A good amp will make even a cheap guitar sound better.

Cheers,

Tommyboy

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 17 2009, 06:33 PM

Hey tommy, the problem is that I due have a pretty good guitar it's just it's not good for the style I'm into at the moment.

Posted by: ZakkWylde Oct 17 2009, 06:41 PM

QUOTE (Rated Htr @ Oct 17 2009, 07:33 PM)

Hey tommy, the problem is that I due have a pretty good guitar it's just it's not good for the style I'm into at the moment.

Posted by: Rated Htr Oct 17 2009, 06:50 PM

QUOTE (ZakkWylde @ Oct 17 2009, 06:41 PM)