Playing Over Chords With Zero Theory Knowledge |
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Dec 3 2021, 10:12 PM
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I was surprised that the Captain has only a bit more theory knowledge than me
 -------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE  “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
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Dec 3 2021, 10:53 PM
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He has a great sense of phrasing and dynamics!
-------------------- QUOTE It's a proven fact that guitar faces have a bigger impact on tone than wood does.   |
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Dec 3 2021, 11:06 PM
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QUOTE (MonkeyDAthos @ Dec 3 2021, 09:53 PM)  He has a great sense of phrasing and dynamics! Yeah, I guess you can be an amazing brick layer without being able to design a good house 
-------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
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Dec 4 2021, 03:29 AM
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This is where possessing just a hair's breadth of theory can pay huge dividends ...
Em7 and Bm7 are diatonic to G major., Bbmaj7 and Am7 are diatonic to G Dorian (minor). Knowing that means that if you want to play E minor pentatonic (which is the same as G maj penta) over the whole thing, you can as long as you switch out B natural for C or Bb when you get to the Bbmaj7 chord. Sure, "discovery" is a wonderful thing but hunting around in a dark room for something when there's a flashlight on the night table is a lot easier and usually yields quicker and better results. This post has been edited by klasaine: Dec 4 2021, 09:51 PM -------------------- - Ken Lasaine
https://soundcloud.com/klasaine2/foolin-the-clouds https://soundcloud.com/klasaine2/surfin-at-the-country-hop Soundcloud assorted ... https://soundcloud.com/klasaine3 New record ... http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/kenlasaine Solo Guitar ... https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXZh...5iIdO2tpgtj25Ke Stuff I'm on ... https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXZh...b-dhb-4B0KgRY-d |
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Dec 4 2021, 10:17 AM
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QUOTE (klasaine @ Dec 4 2021, 02:29 AM) This is where possessing just a hair's breadth of theory can pay huge dividends ... Em7 and Bm7 are diatonic to G major., Bbmaj7 and Am7 are diatonic to G Dorian (minor). Knowing that means that if you want to play E minor pentatonic (which is the same as G maj penta) over the whole thing, you can as long as you switch out B natural for C or Bb when you get to the Bbmaj7 chord. Sure, "discovery" is a wonderful thing but hunting around in a dark room for something when there's a flashlight on the night table is a lot easier and usually yields quicker and better results. That's a good point well made Ken. For some reason I struggle to remember theory. I'm wondering if it's some kind of dyslexia. For instance, at work, if someone says to me, "do you know where the three seven two eights are?" I haven't a clue what they mean, even if I've worked on them a hour before, if they say "do you know where the high compression Bugattis for Crossthwaite and Gardiner are" I'll say, "yeah, they're in packing, I finished them them the other day". Ii had difficulty remembering digit sequences etc and I wonder if it's the same kind of problem with things like "Em7 and Bm7 are diatonic to G major., Bbmaj7 and Am7 are diatonic to G Dorian (minor)". There's a handful of part numbers I can remember at work, 1003 (Big bore A series die cast Mini 1275 block), 3028 (Forged Lotus Twin Cam), 3157 ( Forged high compression Vauxhall 2.0 litre) 3025 (Forged big boots A series Mini 998 block) and that's about it out of the hundreds of different pistons we make. I know most won't be interested in those details, it's purely to demonstrate the things I can remember if that makes sense. I only remember those because we've been making them forever, and make a few batches of each every year. Maybe there's a clue there, maybe I need to take small chunks of theory and practice them often until it sinks in. The other thing with the Lee, he seems to have a decent ear, when he was saying things sounded odd, it sounded fine to me  Cheers. -------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
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Dec 4 2021, 05:28 PM
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I think it's really more about how often you have to access and then apply the information.
If you only work on and jam over rock and blues chord progressions, you're not gonna run into a whole lot of key changes. If your wheelhouse is Prog or Jazz then you deal with key changes constantly. This post has been edited by klasaine: Dec 4 2021, 05:30 PM -------------------- - Ken Lasaine
https://soundcloud.com/klasaine2/foolin-the-clouds https://soundcloud.com/klasaine2/surfin-at-the-country-hop Soundcloud assorted ... https://soundcloud.com/klasaine3 New record ... http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/kenlasaine Solo Guitar ... https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXZh...5iIdO2tpgtj25Ke Stuff I'm on ... https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXZh...b-dhb-4B0KgRY-d |
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Dec 4 2021, 06:14 PM
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QUOTE (klasaine @ Dec 4 2021, 04:28 PM) I think it's really more about how often you have to access and then apply the information. If you only work on and jam over rock and blues chord progressions, you're not gonna run into a whole lot of key changes. If your wheelhouse is Prog or Jazz then you deal with key changes constantly. Never mind key changes, I struggle with chord changes.  I think a lot of it is also that I try to take too much in in one go.
-------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
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Dec 4 2021, 07:38 PM
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Small bites to start is a good method. In fact, using the Captains progression would be good practice because it's really only the one chord - the Bbmaj7 - that is the odd man out.
-------------------- - Ken Lasaine
https://soundcloud.com/klasaine2/foolin-the-clouds https://soundcloud.com/klasaine2/surfin-at-the-country-hop Soundcloud assorted ... https://soundcloud.com/klasaine3 New record ... http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/kenlasaine Solo Guitar ... https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXZh...5iIdO2tpgtj25Ke Stuff I'm on ... https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXZh...b-dhb-4B0KgRY-d |
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Dec 5 2021, 08:07 AM
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Thanks Ben, much appreciated that you took the time to do this video. I'll try to fit it in along with the other stuff.
Cheers 
-------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
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Dec 5 2021, 03:18 PM
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QUOTE (Caelumamittendum @ Dec 5 2021, 10:31 AM) Don't feel obligated to do anything just because I make these videos. I enjoy making them and I'm learning from them too  Thanks Ben, I appreciate that you've taken on board what we spoke about recently, cheers for that, it's nice to know. All the best Phil -------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
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Dec 5 2021, 09:34 PM
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QUOTE (Caelumamittendum @ Dec 5 2021, 10:31 AM) Don't feel obligated to do anything just because I make these videos. I enjoy making them and I'm learning from them too Thanks buddy, At this point https://youtu.be/Qr-CzR6ZZQs?t=386 is there some kind of map for finding these or is it just committed to memory? You seem to just go there, boom! Cheers QUOTE (tflava @ Dec 5 2021, 03:35 PM) For me theory also really helps. To know what my options are. In real time improvising its difficult for me sometimes but i keep practicing it. However in somgwriting and composing it gives a real advantage For jnstance. If you have an A power chord you can play many different scales over it, of the bass play the same scale. So then with writing you can try to make a one chord vamp and play a dorian over it with the guitars and the base. And then you try to play a phrygian over it in a new arrangement. Then you van more easily identify the feeling of the scales and expand your palette of somgwriting Maybe its hard for some but it works for me. Grtz tim Thanks Tim, That's a little bit advanced for me at the moment. Thanks anyway though
-------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
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Dec 5 2021, 09:52 PM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Dec 5 2021, 10:34 PM) Thanks buddy, At this point https://youtu.be/Qr-CzR6ZZQs?t=386 is there some kind of map for finding these or is it just committed to memory? You seem to just go there, boom! Cheers No other "map" than knowing the notes of the G major chord as G B D, I'd say.  But this is the cool thing about guitar. The shapes will essentially be the same for another chord, just moved up or down. You know, like how the B minor pentatonic looks the same as the A minor pentatonic shape. For me it sort of came with knowing the notes of the fretboard - along with the shapes. If you have a G note, then the next note up in the G major arpeggio will be a B note, then D. It's a repeating cycle of "...G B D... G B D... G..." or "root, 3rd, fifth". You may start to recognize where all the G notes are first, then the B notes and then D notes. It can be done string by string horizontally of course, vertically in a fixed position or even diagonal or jumping around to find the notes. I'm sure you've heard those exercises a million times of finding the notes on the fretboard. For me it was important to not just tie them to a name, but also to an underlying chord. I think this helps develop the ear too. Maybe having an underlying G major chord played and sustained and trying to find all the notes of the chord on the fretboard in various ways. A combination of shapes and remembering the notes of a chord helps. I think of it as the alphabet too - A B C D E F G, knowing that if I have played a G then two steps lower in the scale is an E. At some point it's not information that requires thinking to access, but might become more "instinctive". For instance, if we're in F major you'll notice the same shapes as in the above chart, but they will all be moved down two frets. I.e. the root, F, will be on the 6th fret of the B string. [click here for picture of F major arpeggio shapes] I learn the best by applying these things to music though, so what I always got the most out of was playing on a backing track but being conscious about what I wanted out of it at the same time. Kris talked about this in his recent live stream too, I think. Or at least in the recent video posted on Facebook, here: https://www.facebook.com/guitarmasterclass/...35771717735415/ This post has been edited by Caelumamittendum: Dec 5 2021, 09:58 PM |
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Dec 5 2021, 10:18 PM
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QUOTE (Caelumamittendum @ Dec 5 2021, 08:52 PM) No other "map" than knowing the notes of the G major chord as G B D, I'd say. I learn the best by applying these things to music though, so what I always got the most out of was playing on a backing track but being conscious about what I wanted out of it at the same time. Kris talked about this in his recent live stream too, I think. Or at least in the recent video posted on Facebook, here: Thanks, Already that is too much information for my head to take in. I think my brain needs a defrag I think I need to work on just two chords as you said. I'm thinking, and correct me if I'm wrong, that you're kinda using the CAGED system in a way though I might be wrong.With theory I need to apply it and work on one single block until I've got it in my head. Cheers -------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
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Dec 5 2021, 10:58 PM
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QUOTE (Caelumamittendum @ Dec 5 2021, 09:25 PM) Sorry about that! The first chart is really just one chord. It's the G major chord tones and it shows all the places to find the notes that make up the chord. You can even boil it down to a one chord progression and work on one chord at a time and then when you feel confident in those notes you can add a second chord. You don't even have to know every position of that chord's chord tones before moving on. It could be the chord tones around 5th fret to the 8th fret of G major and then as talked about in the video add a second chord and work to find the notes of that second chord around the same position on the fretboard Please don't apologise, it's my limitations not yours even reading that "It could be the chord tones around 5th fret to the 8th fret of G major" is overwhelming me Please carry on delivering your advice as you see fit, I'll find a way to use it Thank you Ben, and I mean that most sincerely
-------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
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Dec 6 2021, 08:49 AM
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Thanks buddy,
That's a much better way of seeing it for me. Nice one mate Cheers -------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
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