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Posted by: Unleash-The-Shred Dec 8 2007, 05:43 AM

WARNING This video contains graphic images which people may find upsetting of cruelty towards animals.

Nothing deserves to be treated this way!

http://www.youtube.com/v/XG0YrDMeVvI&rel=1

EDIT added to the warning message to make it clear. Cheers, Tony

Posted by: buckjones Dec 8 2007, 05:48 AM

I second that!!!! I couldn't even watch the whole thing.... People are sick, absolutely sick!!! Everybody needs to watch this to see whats going on in this sick world!!!

Posted by: Eat-Sleep-andJam Dec 8 2007, 05:48 AM

Couldnt watch the whole thing. Stopped about 45 seconds in. Terrible. Im no P.e.t.a member or anything but I agree that is just cruel.

Posted by: Ayen Dec 8 2007, 05:52 AM

Oh my god thats terrible! I nearly started crying!

They did all those things while the poor animals were still alive!!

Posted by: Eat-Sleep-andJam Dec 8 2007, 05:53 AM

I turned it off when they were skinning the poor cat alive
Man oh man if I ever meant those people in person.......

Posted by: Ayen Dec 8 2007, 05:55 AM

I sure hope there's a heaven where animals get justice, or these people are reincarnated into those animals or something because that's just not fair. Seeing that last skinned dog barely breathing just has me reeling.

I don't care about natural selection or anything, they could easily do it while the animal is alive. That is just inhumane and I hope these people receive the same treatment.

Posted by: Xranthoius Dec 8 2007, 05:55 AM

Oh my god!... thats so cruel those animals deserve anice family people shouldnt do that!!! Gah I... just look at 2:36. That shoudl be illegal everywhere!!!

Posted by: Unleash-The-Shred Dec 8 2007, 05:56 AM

Same about the PETA member thing. But this disappointed so badly. First off, animals or any living thing for that matter should be put through torture like it is shown on this video, EXPECIALLY THAT PART AT THE VERY END. It is one thing to kill an animal and take everything from it and put it to good use, but they should be killed in a certain way. I don't believe in killing animals in the first place, although I do eat meat, but if I didn't eat meat it wouldn't stop this from happening anyways.

But these people were killing dogs and cats for their fur, and only their fur. To make coats, etc. That is complete bullsh*t!

I know there was a video about animal torture on this site before but this one just blew it out of proportion for me.

Posted by: Wyvernx Dec 8 2007, 05:58 AM

I really doubt those people can live with themselves, I had an uncle who had to butcher alot of farm animals, and he couldn't do it, and he was nearly traumatized from the experience, but sometimes it all comes out of pure necesscity of money.

Posted by: Unleash-The-Shred Dec 8 2007, 05:58 AM

Exactly my point. They are killing them for their fur. They skin them alive and leave them to die slowly. That is fu**ed up. They should at leased put them to sleep and then do it. But this shouldnt be done at all!

Posted by: Xranthoius Dec 8 2007, 06:00 AM

Dude omg the ending... now that was way way way way way way way beyond cruel... It ws still alive...

EDIT: I wish i never saw this.... but yet I am...........

Posted by: Ayen Dec 8 2007, 06:01 AM

Ugh, I can't believe it. I mean I can udnderstand cattle, the deaths I saw seemed actually humane since they didnt feel it. But whats wrong with putting the animal to sleep before skinning it? Leaving it skinless and dying in a pile with the others is just slaughter.

Posted by: Xranthoius Dec 8 2007, 06:02 AM

+1 for that.... I cant say how bad this is!!!...... I'm so pissed off at those people

Posted by: Unleash-The-Shred Dec 8 2007, 06:10 AM

And for the record, who the fu** films this sh**?!?! They don't do anything about it either.

Posted by: Ayen Dec 8 2007, 06:15 AM

How is this not illegal? It seems to be done in a systematic way, and I know it's not in the US because animal control laws have at least some power over this.

I don't care what argument is given, there is no way this is justified in any way, shape, and/or form. Putting them to sleep first might be. But breaking off a dog's leg while he's still alive and crying is just inhumane. How someone could not even take a second thought to breaking a living dog's leg off is beyond me.


Edit: I'll be on the GMC Chatroom for a bit, anyone wanna join?

Posted by: Unleash-The-Shred Dec 8 2007, 06:24 AM

Great point, Agreed.

Posted by: Hemlok Dec 8 2007, 06:29 AM

Alright I don't think this should be posted on GMC. You should at least warn people before you go and post a link to animal slaughter.

This is disgusting, someone with moderator powers lock this thread.

Posted by: Unleash-The-Shred Dec 8 2007, 06:42 AM

What the hell are you talking about it shouldnt be allowed. Its something that people should be aware is happening and something needs to be done about it.

Its not like I posted porn on here that isnt appropriate. Its not like the people are getting slaughtered in those videos so it doesnt really have any meaning.

This video does.

Notice how everyone else agreed with what my point was and didnt say anything against it. I'm not posting this here because I think it is funny or something.



Is that better? I posted a warning.

Posted by: fkalich Dec 8 2007, 06:46 AM

Correct, we don't want to shock people by showing them what actually goes on in the world.

I don't mind this. I assume this is in Asia, probably China. One of the reasons I am boycotting all interest in the Olympics next year. The things that go on over there, and nobody does a thing about them.

My brother in law was there last year on business, he said he saw them clubbing dogs to death on the street.

Don't get me wrong, I worked with Chinese people for 5 years. And I love the culture. This is not the culture, this is just a manifestation of a corrupt and moral bankrupt government over there.


edit: Of course this is not in the US. We can't be proud of everything here, but we can be proud of our protection of animal welfare. A football player just had his career destroyed, and he was sent to federal prison for dog fighting.

get on the mailing list of the Humane Society, everything that is good that happens, they are involved. They get the new legislation through, very powerful lobby. And they also work on international issues.

Posted by: Unleash-The-Shred Dec 8 2007, 06:50 AM

I'm not trying to shock people with this. But you do have a good point of view on all of it, I like your response very much.

And no disrespect to Hemlock, I just didn't agree with that you said.

Posted by: buckjones Dec 8 2007, 06:51 AM

Nicely said fkalich!! The chinese culture is rich in many things unfortunately like you said there is just as much horrific things that are happening that nobody is doing.

Posted by: JCJXXL Dec 8 2007, 06:52 AM

I am so not going to watch this.
There is no excuse for animal cruelty/torture/execution at all.

Posted by: shammy Dec 8 2007, 06:58 AM

Just ruined the great energy I had flowing, next time I will not even look at a post labeled like this.

Posted by: Hemlok Dec 8 2007, 07:01 AM

Well there are alot of things that go on in the world, I am not being ignorant of these things but I just don't want to see them on an internet video. Rape, murder, road accidents, I don't need to see a video or see it first hand to know it goes on.

Likewise.



Yes, it is better.

To be honest I for some reason when coming into the thread thought this was something to do with a guitar.

Posted by: fkalich Dec 8 2007, 07:35 AM

You have not picked up on my sarcasm yet. Andrew is good at picking up on that right off.

I expect that a moderator will lock this thread as soon as one sees it. But I personally have a soft spot for animals, particularly domestic animals, so I don't mind. Now politics or religion, I would not want to hear about that. Animal protection, I always like to hear about that.

Posted by: fkalich Dec 8 2007, 07:53 AM

Only a few things you have to remember about Chinese people. The food thing. For example lunch. We can be casual about that, say "oh, lets keep working and skip lunch". In my experience, my Chinese friends considered that absolutely unacceptable. The food thing goes further, very big part of the culture, and they will admit that.

But in general, in my experience, they were very tolerant of people. Very warm, and gracious. Maybe they considered me wacky, but that was ok with them. Now I doubt they wanted their children to be like me, but it was ok that I was wacky, no problem with that.

Posted by: RobM Dec 8 2007, 08:01 AM

Yup, I agree 100% on that. No one should be allowed to do that to another living thing without it happening to them in return. Human beings have to eat and cows, chickens etc have been selected as our meat of choice. No one should be allowed to kill anything just for it's fur. In this day and age we don't need it to keep us warm, there are far better and cheaper materials out there for that.

To kill a dog and/or cat just for the fur should be criminal world wide! I'd like to meet the people who starred in this video!

Posted by: Unleash-The-Shred Dec 8 2007, 10:04 AM

How is this sarcasm???

Posted by: fkalich Dec 8 2007, 10:26 AM

only the first line, where I wrote "Correct, we don't want to shock people by showing them what actually goes on in the world." Maybe you saw that I was being sarcastic, I got the impression that you thought I was serious on that line.

This fur trade has been driven by demand. In the US there have been laws on the books for 7 years I think against this. Europe has acted also recently. However I think that is a problem with the EU, kind of hard to get some things done with so many parties involved. But enforcement can be difficult, they try to disguise it as some other fur.

The simple solution to me is a world wide ban on all fur, or any kind. There is no need, synthetics are now warmer, time to stop this unnecessary practice. I don't mind people hunting for non protected species. As predators are largely no longer around, that is the only way the populations such as for deer stay in check (other than by starvation). But if you kill it, you should eat it, immoral to harm animals unless you eat them, in my view.

In some places they eat some animals that are really not domesticated for that. These are typically a special breed. For example, in Slovenia (where my ancestors come from) they eat horse, a special type. And in Korea they have a special breed of dog. I consider that immoral personally, the relationship of the domestic dog and horse was not established on food, and to me this is taking advantage of a trust between them and us. It is not necessary, I would not eat it, and I sort of disrespected my Brother for eating horse when he visited Slovenia recently.

Posted by: Unleash-The-Shred Dec 8 2007, 10:33 AM

Oh, I thought you were saying the whole thing was sarcasm.

Posted by: tonymiro Dec 8 2007, 11:54 AM

As a mod I've not locked (or deleted) the thread as it does not contravene the posting rules, in my opinion, in spite of the video being undoubtedly upsetting and graphic. I have however increased Unleash's warning to make it more explicit about the content. At present the posts on the thread have been civil and respectful towards each other - lets try to keep it that way guys.

Cheers,
Tony

Posted by: Unleash-The-Shred Dec 8 2007, 12:01 PM

Thanks Tony.

Posted by: Smells Dec 8 2007, 12:13 PM

sickened

Posted by: tonymiro Dec 8 2007, 12:16 PM

On a personal note - and with my mod hat firmly off - I recently watched a BBC Panorama program about illegal dog fighting in the UK. As upsetting as I found it I watched it in its entirety as I attended a funeral some weeks back of the 9 year old daughter of a friend who had died after being savaged by a 'fighting dog' that attacked her whilst she was playing in her garden during the Summer. Her parents were told by the police that it would be difficult for them to do anything without video evidence. The dog by the way has not been 'put down' but is still walked daily by its owners through the same neighborhood - often directly past the front door of my friend's house - and has since attacked other dogs and an adult.

So as a possible answer to those who have asked why the video could be filmed and the makers do nothing about the cruelty witnesses - one reason may be to provide video documented evidence that can then be presented to the respective authorities.


As much as I find the content of this video, and the Panorama program, difficult to watch and distasteful I tend to agree with fkalich's comment (and sympathise with his use of sarcasm on this occasion) - there are some issues where it may help for the authorities to be shocked out of their possible complacency.

Cheers,
Tony

Posted by: David.C.Bond Dec 8 2007, 12:28 PM

I'm certainly not going to watch that, judging from your responses it wouldn't be a nice way to start my day.

Posted by: Andrew Cockburn Dec 8 2007, 01:17 PM

Me either - and I would add that I am all for people being made aware of the terrible truths of the world, but why on a Guitar site? We're here to practice guitar, not to be shocked into moral outrage.

As a mod I totally agree with Tony's decision, but personally I'd rather not see stuff like this at GMC - there are other websites better suited to this kind of content.

Posted by: David.C.Bond Dec 8 2007, 01:23 PM

Hear, hear. Well said Andrew.

Posted by: Smells Dec 8 2007, 01:35 PM

Totally, I switched my PC on this morning and was the first post I looked at, then ... went downstairs to get it out of my head.

Posted by: Xranthoius Dec 8 2007, 02:53 PM

Good choice... It totally ruined my mood. I feel so horrible and helpless. I have a dog and just couldn't imagin if someone did that do her...

Posted by: Alucard Dec 8 2007, 05:34 PM

Disgusting, those men are not men at all since it takes them and a few of their buddies to kill a helpless cat or dog.

Posted by: Milenkovic Ivan Dec 8 2007, 06:13 PM

Thats awfull It really makes me sad

Posted by: Xranthoius Dec 8 2007, 06:17 PM

... There so heartless.... they do it without thinking about it first...

Posted by: stratman33 Dec 8 2007, 06:18 PM

this is awful..there is no need for it on this site, it should be removed.

Posted by: SLASH91 Dec 8 2007, 07:00 PM

Absolutely horrible. I know this sounds bad, but I hope that every one of those men gets exactly what he has given to those poor animals 10 fold. I'm not an animal rights activist or any kind of garbage like that, but this is absolutely awful. I only got halfway through it before I turned it off.