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GMC Forum _ GEAR & PRODUCTION _ My Set Up Advice
Posted by: Im here to succeed May 14 2013, 12:38 PM
Hi guys, so...
Finally i have splashed out, i have a shaftesbury thinline, fender blues deluxe reissue, boss tu2, electro harmonix big muff, jim dunlop wah wah.
at the moment when i leave the wah wah pedal active in my chain, its not sounding too good, like it sounds really high end, tinny and no middle or lower end.
i'm new to all this, so i was wondering what are my options to get the best sound out of my gear, e.g. what order should i have the pedals in...
and also what can i add to my pedal collection to get a better sound.
thanks
Posted by: klasaine May 14 2013, 03:36 PM
Can't tell which is first but wahs usually like to be first in line right after the guitar.
If that's how it is set up and it's sounding thin then start switching up the order ...
Try: Big Muff > Wah > Tuner or tuner > Wah > Muff, etc.
Also, start with no pedals - add the wah (does it sound good?), add the Muff (still sounding good?)
*Don't use cheap cables between the fx - that could be the problem too.
What's the thing with the 'blue' light on?
Posted by: Im here to succeed May 14 2013, 04:14 PM
hmmm yeah i have tried mixing things up and checking for different sounds and from what ive researched, alot of people have this problem which is why there are things like compressors that you can add to it and blah blah blah
the blue light is just my power supply.
Posted by: klasaine May 14 2013, 06:30 PM
A compressor will not help with the problem you're describing.
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 14 2013, 08:47 PM
Well said Klasaine! 
If you ever end up diving in to "Multi FX" boxes/pedals, the compressor will usually just come as part of the package along with a NOISE GATE which is also crucial.
But you are going about the right way if you ask me. It's a good idea to start with
1.)A guitar
2.)An Amp
3.)Some pedals.
Learning the basics using basic gear is very helpful. As you learn and grow, you'll be able to carry lessons learned about gear with you. Learning to make a good signal chain with pedals will help yo make a good signal chain in a processor box and in software when you start using plugins. Then again, some folks never get in to processors and plugins. But in the event you do, your well prepped
Keep going, you are on the right path!!
Todd
Posted by: Gabriel Leopardi May 14 2013, 08:58 PM
Todd is right about this. There are not right and wrong ways to use effects. It depends on each part of your equipment and your tastes. Experimenting with a few pedals is the way to go until you get some experience with this. I have been playing guitar professionally for more 12 years and I'm still experimenting and searching and discovering things. Be sure that your pedals are true bypass, to avoid that they affect your signal when they are off.
Posted by: Im here to succeed May 15 2013, 11:48 AM
Cool, thanks guys. But does anyone know the solution to my thin sound once the wah is active?
Is there a certain pedal I can buy? Or one that you feel is a must have?
Posted by: AdamB May 15 2013, 02:12 PM
The 'thin' sound may not be fix-able by adding another pedal.
A lot of wah's have quite a thin sound, this is especially true of vintage-style wahs. This is not really a failing of the wah but simply because of what a wah is.
A wah is a sweepable filter, the filter setup is different for different models of wah (some wah's have selectable filter and sweep ranges). Most wah's are a band-pass type filter. This means that where you position the pedal is basically focusing on a section of the signal and cutting the rest. This means if the pedal is in the toe position, you're getting high-end and not a lot else, in the middle you're getting mids and not a lot else, and in the heel position you're getting bass and not a lot else. The short of this, is that obviously you're losing a lot of frequencies, and more generally 'energy', from the signal. Which results in it sounding thinner than the dry signal.
Your best bet is to try different models of wah and see if there is one that gets on better with your setup. As I say, each wah has different filtering properties and so some will work 'better' with your guitar/amp/pedal combination than others.
From my personal experience, I find that clean wah tones generally sound nice on their own, where-as overdriven wah mostly only seems to really work when I'm playing with a full band, I think because the wah just helps it cut through and you don't notice the missing filtered-out content so much because these frequencies are being supplied by other instruments in the mix.
Posted by: klasaine May 15 2013, 04:08 PM
A lot of wah's have quite a thin sound, this is especially true of vintage-style wahs. This is not really a failing of the wah but simply because of what a wah is.
A wah is a sweepable filter, the filter setup is different for different models of wah (some wah's have selectable filter and sweep ranges). Most wah's are a band-pass type filter. This means that where you position the pedal is basically focusing on a section of the signal and cutting the rest. This means if the pedal is in the toe position, you're getting high-end and not a lot else, in the middle you're getting mids and not a lot else, and in the heel position you're getting bass and not a lot else. The short of this, is that obviously you're losing a lot of frequencies, and more generally 'energy', from the signal. Which results in it sounding thinner than the dry signal.
Your best bet is to try different models of wah and see if there is one that gets on better with your setup. As I say, each wah has different filtering properties and so some will work 'better' with your guitar/amp/pedal combination than others.
From my personal experience, I find that clean wah tones generally sound nice on their own, where-as overdriven wah mostly only seems to really work when I'm playing with a full band, I think because the wah just helps it cut through and you don't notice the missing filtered-out content so much because these frequencies are being supplied by other instruments in the mix.
+1 on all this. Great info.
Exactly which model dunlop wah-wah pedal do you have?
Posted by: Amp360 May 15 2013, 11:59 PM
Hi,
Looks like you have a really cool setup. One thing to consider is that wah wahs are notorious tone sucking pedals. There are some great booteek models out there that do away with this problem but most of them are kind of expensive.
Now, I'm the kind of d0ode that doesn't mind paying for cool stuff, but I'm not into wah enough to do so. I have a reissue Vox that I did a true bypass mod to and it solved the problem. IIRC I changed out the switch in mine for a different type and soldered a couple wires and cut one and it sounds the same in or out of the chain. I also replaced a resistor that (for me) made it sound a little fatter.
A compressor can be a great effect, but it won't solve the problem you're having.
Google Crybaby True Bypass mod and for a couple bucks you can probably solve your problem.
Something like this (do a search for the exact model you have!):
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 17 2013, 05:50 AM
P.S. The THIN SOUND with the WAH active is the WAH doing what it's built for You understand that a wah wah pedal is a sweep filter? It changes based on what angle your foot is at. So if you leave it active, it stays at one point in the sweep. I actually thought you sorta kidding with that question. My bad 
To get rid of that just TURN OFF the wah wah pedal.
Todd
Hi guys, so...
Finally i have splashed out, i have a shaftesbury thinline, fender blues deluxe reissue, boss tu2, electro harmonix big muff, jim dunlop wah wah.
at the moment when i leave the wah wah pedal active in my chain, its not sounding too good, like it sounds really high end, tinny and no middle or lower end.
i'm new to all this, so i was wondering what are my options to get the best sound out of my gear, e.g. what order should i have the pedals in...
and also what can i add to my pedal collection to get a better sound.
thanks
Posted by: Im here to succeed May 21 2013, 12:05 PM
Cool, thanks for all the advice guys, and the reason I wanted to keep it active is for when going into a solo, it's a pain in the ass to hit the big muff and then hit the wah, sometimes I don't have enough time to activate both and mess up. Which Is why I wanted to keep the wah active
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu May 22 2013, 12:20 PM
A lot of cool info here for a dude like me, that never actually owned a wah pedal Yes, yes, you heard it right. I obtain my wah effect, by using the Phase 90 pedal from MXR and turning the ratio really low - it's more like an autowah but it gives me that feel that you get when you hold the wah pressed about mid distance. Although I'd so want one sometimes for playing some funky grooves!
Posted by: Darius Wave May 23 2013, 02:27 PM
I never bothered to mod the wah before I decided to make a true test one day and I was shocked...Wah pedals can add tons of noise to the signalchain also cut the signal level or freq range. I would start my search over there. Also try to keep all the plugs same as input jacks - all gold or all nikel / chrome. If You combine two different materials the will corrode.
Sometimes the length of effects chain do some losses in signal even if all are true bypass. Length of the cables has also muych to do with the signal quality.
Posted by: MikeyMayhem May 23 2013, 04:11 PM
One of the guitar techs at Guitar Center here passed on some sound advice about Wahs when I was playing around with them: "Wah pedals come in all shapes and sizes, functions and forms. It's about experimenting and finding the right one that would fit your style and tone." Like mentioned before in other posts, try other wah pedals out. Now obviously, you probably don't want to use a Dimebag Wah or Hammet Sig Wah Pedal for blues or funk, but you probably get the point 
I'll keep all of this info from the others in mind myself later on when I decide on getting a wah pedal after I improve my playing and what-not. Best of luck on solving your wah pedal problem!
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 24 2013, 05:27 AM
You may want to look in to a controller box that lets you setup different sets of effects. That way button 2 can be wah and muff for example.
Here is a link to the kind of thing I"m talking about. It lets you set up different effects loops. They make a bigger one with more options as well. These run around $75 U.S.
http://www.donnerdeal.com/moen-a-b-looper-switcher-for-guitar-effects-pedal-boards-black.html?acc=a87ff679a2f3e71d9181a67b7542122c
Or you could try out a multi effects box with a built in wah which makes switching quite a bit easier
The Boss ME-xx line is popular as are various products like the RP series from digitech.
Todd
Hi guys, so...
Finally i have splashed out, i have a shaftesbury thinline, fender blues deluxe reissue, boss tu2, electro harmonix big muff, jim dunlop wah wah.
at the moment when i leave the wah wah pedal active in my chain, its not sounding too good, like it sounds really high end, tinny and no middle or lower end.
i'm new to all this, so i was wondering what are my options to get the best sound out of my gear, e.g. what order should i have the pedals in...
and also what can i add to my pedal collection to get a better sound.
thanks
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu May 24 2013, 10:21 AM
I think that the rig can work out fine, just take heed at the suggestions gathered here and maybe replace the wah Out of what I am seeing, those pedals, amp and guitar should sound really nice without the wah.
The only wah that I have experimented with, belongs to a friend - it's the Morley Bad Horsie II. Very aggressive one, fit for metal stuff!
Posted by: klasaine May 24 2013, 03:35 PM
Here is a link to the kind of thing I"m talking about. It lets you set up different effects loops. They make a bigger one with more options as well. These run around $75 U.S.
http://www.donnerdeal.com/moen-a-b-looper-switcher-for-guitar-effects-pedal-boards-black.html?acc=a87ff679a2f3e71d9181a67b7542122c
Or you could try out a multi effects box with a built in wah which makes switching quite a bit easier
The Boss ME-xx line is popular as are various products like the RP series from digitech.
Todd
+1 to what Todd just mentioned.
If I understand correctly you want to leave the wah 'ON' all the time (is that right?). That will effectively be cutting lots of the frequency spectrum out of your guitar and amp tone.
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu May 25 2013, 09:40 AM
Indeed, Ken is right. Why would you want to leave the wah on all the time? I know it can be a bit frustrating to always push hard on the Dunlop pedal to ignite it, but there are also some models that can be turned on with an optic switch. The Morley pedals have this feature, out of what I know...
Posted by: Im here to succeed Dec 16 2013, 05:04 PM
Just a quick update of my setup... the new bogner blue sounds immense!
Here's my new guitar too.. all sounding great when it's cranked up
Posted by: miguelbatalha Dec 16 2013, 06:59 PM
Here's my new guitar too.. all sounding great when it's cranked up
Dat Telecaster.
What Wah are you using?
Posted by: Im here to succeed Dec 16 2013, 07:33 PM
What Wah are you using?
Haha yeah it's great.. and just a standard cry baby wah
Posted by: SeeJay May 6 2014, 02:38 PM
Get a pedal board, or at least a piece of wood to put everything on.
buy some nice patch cables too!
I've had some luck with those Blues Deluxe Amps. Usually keep it on the first channel and crank it! How's it working out for you?
Hi guys, so...
Finally i have splashed out, i have a shaftesbury thinline, fender blues deluxe reissue, boss tu2, electro harmonix big muff, jim dunlop wah wah.
at the moment when i leave the wah wah pedal active in my chain, its not sounding too good, like it sounds really high end, tinny and no middle or lower end.
i'm new to all this, so i was wondering what are my options to get the best sound out of my gear, e.g. what order should i have the pedals in...
and also what can i add to my pedal collection to get a better sound.
thanks
Posted by: Fran May 10 2014, 10:42 AM
My original cry baby wah sucks tone a LOT when it's off. There's another dunlop model which has true bypass which is supposed to fix that, but I never tried it.
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu May 10 2014, 01:28 PM
Interesting - I have a CryBaby that I have received as a present from a friend, but to be frank, I have never used it in my pedalboard. Guess it's time to do some tests
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 11 2014, 03:51 AM
I ran in to this as well with a couple of wah pedals I tried and returned. The good news is, I"m using a foot controller and an ELEVEN RACK now and there are a few different wah pedals to choose from and none of them suck tone out or make any noise Handy!!!!
Posted by: SeeJay May 11 2014, 04:16 AM
Diggin on that tele. I had a 72 tele, Simmilar, but had the double humbuckers. (Never was a big fan, sold it quickly) Look around online, I remember there's a few easy mods and tweaks that can really take the guitar up a notch.
Here's my new guitar too.. all sounding great when it's cranked up
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