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Posted by: Jesse Apr 25 2009, 03:36 PM

He's got skill, but what the heck is he thinking? You can't tell me that 100 % of his "moves" here are sincere and genuine. I'll point out the worst parts. His arrogance spoils the music a bit:D



During the video youll be seeing him trow/wipe his hair back about 10 times.
Even my mom thinks he's lame:D
2:04

2:49

This is often referred to as guitarphelia: 3:30

3:33 is bad too:(

What are your views on this?

Posted by: Guitarman700 Apr 25 2009, 03:40 PM

No, Vai is on a whole nother level of creativity than satch. And no hes not arrogant. or at least not in person.

Posted by: Jesse Apr 25 2009, 03:42 PM

Didnt answer my question? What do you think about his posing?

Posted by: AlexLion Apr 25 2009, 03:46 PM

I didn`t know your mom is a guitar Godess

Well about posing actually... yes.. i think the same, not that harsh like you, but sometimes he`s faces and moves freak me out and spoils his music a bit. You should see his Bad Horsie video Satriani actually make weird faces too, but no moves hopefully.

But anyways on that level where Steve is, he can do WHATEVER he want and how he wants And he give a crap if someone is not satisfied

Posted by: Jesse Apr 25 2009, 03:47 PM

Ive seen that, its horrible!


I dont care if he doesnt care.... just, I think it's a bit lame.

Posted by: SensE Apr 25 2009, 03:52 PM

Im not a fans of Steve Vai at all. I don't like the style of his playing, just my opinion. But, I must say he plays this song beautifully. I like the part especially from 2.00 to 3.57 mins.

Posted by: Jesse Apr 25 2009, 03:55 PM

Will you PLEASE Stay on topic?

I didnt say I didnt like how he played, but ABOUT HIS POSING!

Can we please stick to the main thing,

Posted by: Matt23 Apr 25 2009, 04:03 PM

I used to think like you, and hated Vai for his posing, but I realised that if you put that much feeling into your playing, it does come out of your guitar. I do think he is posing partly to make a good show, but it does help him sound expressive in my opinion.

Posted by: Jesse Apr 25 2009, 04:08 PM

I don't hate him. Come on, if he needs that to sound expressive... that's as lame as saying, I need drugs to think creatively. I mean, SRV didn;'t act like that did he?

Posted by: lcsdds Apr 25 2009, 04:10 PM

Say what you want about Vai and his "posing" but the man is musical genious and his playing is awesome. I would rather listen to Satch's music but when I saw G3 with Vai, Satch and Malmsteen.....Vai was by far the most fun to watch. Vai is a master showman as well as a guitar virtuoso.

Posted by: Matt23 Apr 25 2009, 04:11 PM

Well no, but he does play with some attitude. I do think Vai does these things partly to make a good show, but it does make your playing come more alive IMO.

Posted by: SensE Apr 25 2009, 04:14 PM

I'm sorry. The "style", I actually refer to his posing.

Posted by: AlexLion Apr 25 2009, 04:15 PM

I agree when your put more feelings into your playing it comes naturally (OMG!) but i think you must control those facial expressions a bit.. Playing in front of a mirror could be great Then you could have an idea about how that`s looking

Posted by: David Wallimann Apr 25 2009, 04:16 PM

I agree with you that he is a poser, but he doesn't bother me at all.
I just have a huge weakness for Steve.
He is so entertaining to watch and hear!

Posted by: bsamn Apr 25 2009, 04:30 PM

I get what your tryin to say man. But here is my take on it, (first the facial expression)

I remember a time when i used to hate anyone who use to make a face while playing (now hate may be to strong, lets say i used to make fun of 'em whther it be a well known rockstar or a friend) but as i started to play more and more, i realized that keep ur face still, donsn't only make u look robotic but also plain stupid. i mean when u see i guy trully playing guitar, they will all make faces no matter.

As far as posing goes, i say kudos to him. Guitar is a completely badass instrument and has alot of sex appeal imo. And no matter what anyone says, everyone wants to look cool, and steve vai does it in his own way. I personally love SRV and he himself moves and has that look on his face with a cigarette or cigar (the smoking while playing has to one of the most ridicualoous things i have seen i mean it looked cool once, now its just overdone) and couldn't care less about the rest of world, which in a way really gets u in the music. Thats his was of expressing his attitude.

This whole genre, whther u call it hard rock or heavy metal (anything mostly guitar related) is very visual, and people playing this music have to express it physically to stimulate the crowd.

I remember watching a Funtwo video, where that dude just stood still and played, man that was boring. I mean it just did not have that extra 'oomph'.

This whole thing has alot to do with attitude and attracting the opposite sex as well.

I hope this was cool, i just stated what i think is right imo.

Rock Hard buddy!

Posted by: AlexLion Apr 25 2009, 04:35 PM

I almost forgot! If Steve is not so bothering but his bassist.. Billy Sheehan is HORRIBLE!! Just watch Steve Vai`s part on G3 Tokyo.. That really is bothering me

to Bsamn:Oh, and i still think that SRV with his hat and cigar looked badass. That`s his trademark in looks

Posted by: SensE Apr 25 2009, 04:39 PM

I've seen a youtube video of Steve Vai. I don't remember what song it is. In one part of the song, he had 4 guys at his back, Steve did a "falling" move and the other 4 guys pushing him up, back and forth. Some of you may found it entertaining, for me , I think it's just radiculous.

Posted by: bsamn Apr 25 2009, 04:53 PM

I know SRV is kool no matter what ,

another thing i would like to add,
IMO - No matter how kool you look, you may have the coolest looking guitar, have awesome leather pants etc etc. you will look pathetic if you can't play guitar, on the other hand, you may look like a complete dumbass, and still be able to make the guitar talk, well people will love you.

Posted by: AlexLion Apr 25 2009, 04:58 PM

How true.

Posted by: bsamn Apr 25 2009, 05:06 PM

Yup!

I think image is the cherry on top, and big cherry, but thats it, and steve vai really kicks ass

Posted by: Jesse Apr 25 2009, 05:08 PM

I remember a time when i used to hate anyone who use to make a face while playing (now hate may be to strong, lets say i used to make fun of 'em whther it be a well known rockstar or a friend) but as i started to play more and more, i realized that keep ur face still, donsn't only make u look robotic but also plain stupid. i mean when u see i guy trully playing guitar, they will all make faces no matter.


Kinda agree yeah. But the point is, I dont hate anyone who makes a face, he just over does it. Just like gustavo guerra, he could be put in a Oral B commercial right away:D Hehe:D But I think his playing is awesome, I love to listen, just not see it , hehe:D The title was a bit , radical. But I think he is a great player, but I think he loves himself a bit too much.

Artemus, get on MSN man,

I MIGHT GO TO A STEVE VAI GUITAR MASTERCLASS IN JUNE HERE IN HOLLAND, I MIGHT GET TO JAM WITH HIM, SO IM PRACTICING MAJOR SCALE:D Any more techniques, that would impress Steve?

Posted by: Bedlam Apr 25 2009, 05:14 PM

I would always get a good laugh at the end of the song where he licks his finger and makes the nonsense sound on the string... he may look goofy at times, but whatever he's doing, he's doing it right!

Posted by: Artemus Apr 25 2009, 05:16 PM

Was it a Crossroads festival? Ridiculous or not, there's no denying its entertainment value. Sure, I go to concerts to hear the music but if that's all I wanted to do, I'd simply stay at home and stick on a CD - why bother going to any gigs? To say, "yes, I've seen him live.. he is actually that tall.."? No. Gigs need to be entertaining and showmanship is a huge part of engaging the audiences attention.
Don't get me wrong, the music is all important. Going to see a performance by a reknowned orchestra is a hugely enjoyable experience for the ambience and acoustic in a symphony hall even if the first violinist isn't jumping around stage like a gibbon, or the contrabassist spinning that baby round and round with disco ball lights.
However, before I stray off topic - these skilled guitarists are so well known not just because of their skill but because they are entertainers too. Ok the facial expressions and stage antics maybe a bit overblown or perhaps even seem arrogant but Vai and Satch have it balanced out from what I've seen. Great music, great show and they have fun, which in turn helps me have fun and create a memorable experience. If you think their antics are bad what do you make of Bon Jovi's flying around the auditorium, or Copperfield's windy-tunnel hair syndrome? To me it comes with the territory. Yeah, it might be cheesy but that's show business. As long as you don't get too arrogant and think you're god's gift (*cough* Malmsteen *cough*)

Posted by: Jesse Apr 25 2009, 05:19 PM

hehe malmsteem is hilarious in interviews, Nice post Artemus,

Posted by: Artemus Apr 25 2009, 05:20 PM

EDIT: I also want to add - who here has NOT made a face or pursed their lips when playing with a wah wah pedal for the first time? You know what I mean

Posted by: Jesse Apr 25 2009, 05:26 PM

Lol, I hated the wah, I like it now tho, Everyone did the woah woah thing with their mouth:D

Posted by: Guitarman700 Apr 25 2009, 08:40 PM

Its called Having a good time playing guitar, instead of standing there like a moron. your claim that he "loves himself to much, is ridiculous. steve vai is amazing live, and truly humble in person.

Posted by: audiopaal Apr 25 2009, 09:46 PM

I have to disagree with you here I'm afraid
I like 'em both but Satch is not a lesser player in my opinion..

Vai might have the edge in sheer technique, and wacky stuff, and he's a spectacle to watch.

Satriani on the other hand is just shy of Vai in skill/technique, but he's got TONS more "feel" in my opinion.
Listen to His Blues album for instance.. Vai could never played the blues like that the way I see it.
Just watch when they play blues songs with G3, Vai's playing diseappears almost compared to Satriani and Petrucci..

And I believe Satriani is more creative than Vai, because of the way they write songs..
Steve Vai slaps you in the face with his playing, he's awesome to listen to for a little while at a time and does some crazy stuff no one else knows how to do.
Joe Satriani takes you almost on a journey with beautiful songs, awesome fills and riffs you'd never find on a Vai album.
You can listen to his songs for a longer period of time, and that's a testament to his creativity as you don't grow bored as fast as you'd do with Vai (in my opinion)

So in my mind, that makes Satriani the better player in my book.

Although, when it comes to coolness; Eddie Van Halen wins hands down

Thank god for personal opinions

Posted by: lcsdds Apr 25 2009, 09:56 PM

I'm gonna have to agree with Paal on this one as well. Vai might have a considerable edge when it comes to chops...he has mastered all techniques where Satch is pretty much a legato player. Satch is the KING OF MELODY though. This to me is much more important. If I am taking a 6 hour road trip I could spend the whole 6 hours listening to Satch....with Vai I could maybe listen to his 7th song album all the way through. Now live...I would rather WATCH Vai....especially being a guitar player myself. If someone offered me the chops of Vai or the gift of melody that Satch has....I'd take Satch's gift of melody without hesitation. Your are right to Paal.....thank god for personal opinions.

Posted by: Artemus Apr 25 2009, 10:05 PM

Let's not forget who Steve Vai's guitar teacher was...

Posted by: Skalde Apr 25 2009, 10:07 PM

"This video is not available in your country"

Posted by: The Uncreator Apr 25 2009, 10:12 PM

I don't see why this would make him a poser, He is a magnificent guy in person, super nice and super funny, And full of helpful advice. To me he is one of the most original and creative minds in music, If you think those mannerisms are weird.....thats because, they are

He just goofs off on stage, thats all, I know people that do weirder stuff that that

I have nothing but respect and admiration for him.

Posted by: audiopaal Apr 25 2009, 10:42 PM

Posted by: Trond Vold Apr 26 2009, 12:19 AM

I agree 100% with that too.

I prefer Satriani over Vai, but i would never call Vai a "poser".
His whole stage-personality has always been flashy with alot of hairthrowing and facemaking, it's one of the coolest things about Vai Judging by interviews and videos he doesnt seem to have a shred of arrogance.
Both him and Satriani seems like really nice people.

Posted by: Alen Apr 26 2009, 12:27 AM

I'm not sure about the purpose of your topic?
I mean, how does all you've written relate to your signature statement 'Don't just play it, feel it.'?
The most musicians just feel ecstatic when playing their music. Somebody perhaps
experiences a kind of orgasm, when holding his guitar. I played, for instance two hours this evening. You should have seen my face ... I think, you felt a little bit alone this day and wanted to take a break from repeating some lessons .

In adition to that, here is may contribution to 'personal opinions':
While I could listen to Vai's complete discography over and over again, in comparison to that, what Satriani produced the last couple of years is absolute crap. He should stop recording songs and really concentrate on his strenghts: giving guitar lessons. He's best at that.

Posted by: Jesse Apr 26 2009, 09:41 AM

Well, you can feel it, but I also said that NO ONE, can tell me that 100 % of his "moves" are pure from "feeling" it.

I think, you felt a little bit alone this day and wanted to take a break from repeating some lessons ... What the hell? That doesn't make sense:D


"What Satriani produced the last couple of years is absolute crap?" That's a bold statement. Oh well:) Could you back it up...?



(No)

Posted by: kaznie_NL Apr 26 2009, 12:41 PM

hehe, I wouldn't mind if he put on some shirt under his jacket

Thanks Jesse, you just convinced me he's actualy prety good xD this song is quite nice and yes 3:33 is bad

Posted by: Frederik Apr 26 2009, 12:56 PM

What are u all talking about, he is wailing with his guitar. it only adds to the performance, there is nothing worse than musicians who doenst feel it. and if u dont feel it, u gotta "fake it till u make it". im also like that when im in the mood.

-Frederik

And BTW 3:33 is NICE

Posted by: Andreas N Apr 26 2009, 02:17 PM

Well i really don't mind it, even though he sometimes exaggerates a little... But maybe it's just part of his style

Worst poser i've ever seen is a kid trying to copy SRVs movements and facial expressions when he plays...which i found annoying..

Posted by: Schumi Jr Apr 26 2009, 02:51 PM

There's a blend between expression and showmanship. Sometimes it's difficult to tell which is which. And even when you can tell it's more showmanship, so what? I've seen a bit of SRV crossing the line into showmanship... and of course Hendrix, Chuck Berry, Buddy Guy, and countless other great and ENTERTAINING guitar players. Rock-based guitarists aren't up on stage to perform a recital, they are their to put on an all-around entertaining rockin' show!

Can it be overdone? Certainly, but I think you're finding in this thread that most of us don't think Vai overdoes it or if he does we can't help but enjoy the effort regardless. Personally, I also attended the G3 with Satch/Vai/Malmsteen and while I love Satch's and Malmsteen's recorded work, myself and everyone else I talked to walking out of the show agreed that Vai's performance was on another level that night - and hugely... get ready for it... entertaining!

Posted by: sted Apr 26 2009, 04:37 PM

I saw Vai years ago supported by Eric Sardinas, he was great to watch and very entertaining, did he overdo it? Well not really during the performance but at the end he had a long white robe on with a big light shining behind him and he spread his arms out like a messiah!! I just laughed my head off at that point, some of the Vai die-hards didnt like that much.
Anyway Eric blew him into the weeds by jumping into the audience and playing with a bud bottle, even got a little kid to play the strings while he did the fingering, now thats a showman!

Posted by: Marc_Maiden Apr 26 2009, 05:11 PM

how on earth can someone like or dislike a musician based on their facial expression?


i make facial expressions when i play, now i must be hated too....but hey, when you get into playing, it happens...maybe you havent reached that point, but when you hit the right note of the right chord and let it hold there, its like that first smell you get of fresh baked cookies, or the first day of spring after a long rainy winter, or jumping into the pool for the first time of the year....those make the moment, i dont think he is doing it on purpose, its just happening,


and


even if he did do it on purpose, why not? its a show, people are not going to wana come see a 1 man band when he just stands there! look at john petrucci for example, he almost has no expression of movement when he plays!

Vai cant be arrogant, he comes from a time of hair spray, crazy hair, women, and metal, and thats just how it is...watch any hair metal band, you will see even worse!


Vai is great, and is still too underrated in the musical world as is joe satriani....if you picked up a guitar, you automatically know of them...but if you pick up a radio, they are nothing but strangers



dont judge a guitar player by its cover, judge it by its music

the music does not lie.

Posted by: Guitarman700 Apr 26 2009, 05:30 PM

Best. Post. Ever.

Posted by: Jesse Apr 26 2009, 05:33 PM

Did I judge him by his expressions did I say I hated him? NO! Did I say I hate him?


Holy (bad word)

Can't you read what im typing?

Posted by: Marc_Maiden Apr 26 2009, 05:45 PM

no

Posted by: Jesse Apr 26 2009, 05:51 PM

Andrew, Could you lock this for me?

I don't hate Vai, I like his music (most of it) I just wanted to know what your views were on this, instead I got words put in my mouth and mis understood . I admit, the satriani thing in the first post was unnecsisairy and a bit out of place. If I insulted anyone, I apologize.

Posted by: bsamn Apr 26 2009, 06:28 PM

Yea i really think people are misunderstanding some of the stuff.....it would be better to lock it.

Posted by: skennington Apr 26 2009, 06:54 PM

Per Jesse's request, I am locking this thread before any unnecessary arguing begins. I think what needed to be said has been said already.

skennington/on behalf of the moderating team