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Posted by: Dinaga May 29 2012, 01:18 PM

I think it's an interesting subject to discuss. Getting people to appreciate your work is very important for your motivation, inspiration and confidence. If nobody cares about your music, it's not easy to progress and stay determined.

As for me, I get 95% of my support from GMC and my family. If it weren't for you, playing and improving would still be possible, but definitely a lot, lot harder. It would take years and years to make progress I made so far. It's great when you have someone who will listen to you, give constructive feedback/criticism and motivate you to keep on doing what you love.

But when it comes to friends, colleagues etc. it's not so bright. Maybe it's the curse of my city where people generally hate seeing other man's success - that's why it's really, and I mean REALLY (!) hard to get famous in Sarajevo. People will hate you just because you are actually doing something constructive, and not going for another mindless night out, or for a coffee.

I find it ironic that most of my friends, who I spend a big portion of my life with, don't care to at least tell me "Hey, I heard your latest song/solo/work". I always respect others' work and I do my best to appreciate it by telling them what I liked and then give some criticism/advice if needed. If I really like something, I'm more than happy to give a more detailed analysis of my experience - for example to mention the parts which I liked the most - it surely matters so much to the author! I know how important it is to feel one tiny bit respected for what you do, no matter how good or bad you are at it.

And it's not that I'm not promoting it - I'm sharing songs on YouTube, Facebook etc. and the most I can get is a "like" on the video, usually from the bandmates. Friends who I go out with hardly show support. The one question everyone asks is "Are you still playing guitar?" That's it. Girlfriends didn't care much either - unless I dedicated a song to them - then they would be super happy, proud and grateful. My last girlfriend used to call my former metalcore band "noise". She never even wanted to hear one song with a solo I was very proud of. Yes, it wasn't her style but still - if I cared about someone I would force myself to at least listen to one song featuring that person - no matter how bad it was.

I hope this topic won't be taken the wrong way - I'm not stating people should praise everything we do mindlessly, I'm just saying it would be great if friends who you see every day showed some support for a friend by at least aknowledging they heard a new song/solo/whatever. Seems little, but it matters.

That's why it's great to have so many awesome people on GMC where we can communicate in a healthy environment and feel accepted. It's surely the best way to advance! I met so many great musicians here who I never met in person (YET! ), but who showed more support than most of the people I see every day. That is PRICELESS, and no money can ever pay that. It's amazing how you can discover great people all around the world!

What are your expierences? Feel free to share them.

Posted by: JTaylor May 29 2012, 02:25 PM

It's hard when people are not into the same music. This morning, I learned the beginning of "Unchained" by Van Halen and I was very proud of myself! However, my wife did not recognize it at all because she is not much into metal. Actually, she does not care fpr anything I play which involves distortion. However, I am very blessed that she totally supports my guitar playing. I used to spend all of my time getting drunk and guitar certainly a healthier alternative!
Now, I also have to balance it though. If I play guitar so much to the point where I ignore my God, my family, my schooling, or my responsibilities around the house, she will not be supportive at all.
A lot of my friends at church play guitar and that is a great group. Other than that, my other friends could care less. However, in all honesty, I could care less about the stuff they are involved with, so it doesn't bother me.
And I do believe, I have given some good comments to you on FB!
The thing about getting famous is also prevalent in the United States. There are more awesome guitarists than you could swing a dead cat at, with no deals. Is it possible for you to hook up with Muris? Just an idea.....
Last but not least, you are one of the students who has helped me greatly with the encouragement you have given here on GMC, in PM's, and Facebook. I do appreciate it greatly and if you would like for me to try to spread your music around, I'll do everything I can to help.

Posted by: SirJamsalot May 29 2012, 05:27 PM

There's that old and wise saying "a prophet is not accepted in his hometown (or is without honor in his hometown)" `reason being, all people have personality flaws and quirks that close friends and family are privy to. When you get on stage, these same people see through the spotlight at who you really are in person and don't get to enjoy the illusion in the same way strangers do. When close family / friends see someone admiring you, they intrinsically balk subconsciously "ha! you don't know him - it's a facade!"

My wife and daughter think I'm "cute" - they could never see me as "cool", so anything I could do or wear on stage would just make me "silly'er" in their eyes. For this reason, I prefer it when my family doesn't show up to a gig (with the exception of my parents - they rock!). It makes me feel self conscious on stage knowing that someone is perceiving me as silly when the persona I'm trying to project is cool and confident on stage.

Bottom line is, you get a lot more respect and kudos from strangers than you will get from close friends and family. You can't fault them for that. It's just the way it is.

Posted by: Opetholic May 29 2012, 05:31 PM

Hey D-man,

It was interesting to read about your experience on how much support you get from your friends and people around you. Indeed I agree that the most amount of support I also get is here at GMC. This is because here it is a community full of people with similar goals and dreams. At least to become a good guitar player. I can't say I have a lot of support from friends around me either. I don't really have friends who have similar music tastes as I do. I guess that is the other thing. In order to be appreciated in this business, you have to somehow reach out to people and that happens when you make music they like. I for myself am not trying to become a famous guitar player or anything like that I don't think I am good enough for that and probably I am also too old to chose that path so for me it is just a matter of satisfying myself, what I would like to achieve as a guitar player and which songs I would like to be able to play. But for example JTaylor gave a very good suggestion I think: is it not possible for you for example to meet Muris in person? I think that kind of a thing would be the key: to meet people with similar interests and goals and with similar music tastes..

About being appreciated, yes I agree, every now and then everyone would need whatever they do to be appreciated. A nice take on some song, a solo, a nice song you have composed yourself or any other thing really. I personally don't have friends who appreciate this kind of a thing either Although my girlfriends were a bit friendlier in this respect maybe they at least liked to hear me playing every now and then. One of them even came to an Opeth concert with me once even though she hated anything with distortion But for me the kind of feedback or appreciation I get here at GMC from fellow guitar players and our instructors is more than enough. So I am happy

But, good luck man! You are a talented good guitar player and a musician. I hope you succeed if this is the path you want to take..

Posted by: Dinaga May 30 2012, 12:12 AM

Very interesting thoughts you have there mates! Thanks for sharing!

@Jonathan, I know the feeling of being so proud and excited of something you learned - nobody can understand it and feel it better than you! That's what is most important after all But as you said, you're blessed your wife supports your playing. And when you get that orange amp, it's going to be even more awesome

@SirJamsAlot, you are right on spot that comment. I never thought of it that way - but your words are really true - "You don't know him, it's only a facade" is something we do unconsciously.

@Mert, you are very right my friend, it is basically about reaching out - it's just that if you want to "reach out" in my country you basically have to "sell out" And don't say you're old, because you're never too old if you have passion

Posted by: JTaylor May 30 2012, 12:24 AM

Just this morning, I was doing the settings on my flanger. I finally got it where I wanted it, so I went to go get Christy from the living room. Turns out she was already hearing it. When I said flanger, she said "are you talking about that noise coming out of the office, that sounds like a fly buzzing around in your ear?"

Posted by: Dinaga May 30 2012, 12:28 AM

Hahaha, try wah pedal with clean tone next - you'll make duck sounds and you can slowly start building an animal kingdom Add some whammy bar harmonics and you can have pig squeeling too!

Posted by: casinostrat May 30 2012, 12:50 AM

Well, this is an interesting question...... I am the only musical person in my family, and as far as support goes I suppose my family supports me as much as non musical people can ( and there is a difference), but I get the most encouragement from first of all the people here at GMC , secondly the musicians and people I jam with.

Posted by: Todd Simpson May 30 2012, 02:32 AM

GMC is an amazing place for the very reasons your talking about. It's a supportive community FULL of folks in to guitar, music, getting better, learning, and helping each other. If it were not for GMC, I must say my world would be a darker place. Being able to connect with folks from all over the world and celebrate each others accomplishments and support each other as we learn/write/etc. is an awesome thing.

Todd

Posted by: casinostrat May 30 2012, 02:58 AM

Well said sir! GMC has not only helped me become a better guitar player, but also has helped me develop an appreciation for many styles of music, and discover that no matter where you go in this world, you will find people dedicated to the art of creating music.

Posted by: Cosmin Lupu May 31 2012, 01:32 PM

GMC has become a second home for me - I get support from people around me: friends and family. My friends are being supportive because 75% of them are musicians themselves I truly believe that if you emanate sufficient positive energy related to what you are doing, people will harmonize with you, even if they won't totally understand your motivation or true fire burning inside.

The main idea is to find motivation and the right energy to go on and exchange it through your music with the people listening to you they can be 10 or 1 000 000 - you have to be able to transmit your feelings. And that doesn't mean you have to be Andy Timmons sometimes 3 chords can tell a story which 1 million notes won't.

As a conclusion - let the music be your inspiration music is beautiful and it should be the only truly necessary catalyst in your endeavor. Listen to music whenever you're feeling down and out. Take that energy and use it for yourself

Sorry for all the philosophical ranting mates, I am reading Hagakure at this point

Cosmin

Posted by: Yash May 31 2012, 01:53 PM

GMC has become a second home for me too. You guys are always helping me out, now I know what friends really are, because I never really had any friends all my life, except for a few times. But everyone went away. Its been 3 months since school finished and no one cared to give me a call, except when they want to get a question solved or wanted to know my result, tell their result and embarrass me because I scored 5 marks less.

I dont get any support for my playing, neither from friends, and just a little bit from my family, because they all love me very much. My friends keep making fun of me that I play guitar, and none of them, just because I am different, have different musical taste, and probably out of jealousy too, due to innumerable reasons.

As a conclusion, I'd like to thank all you GMCers, especially Cosmin, Gabriel and Alex for being my mentor and supporting me and teaching me to be a better player, and also most of all, thinking for my betterment. No one else has done this except my mom, dad and brother. Thanks guys, I really owe you a lot. Now I know what friends are and that good people still exist.

Posted by: Cosmin Lupu May 31 2012, 01:59 PM

Always glad to help Yash thank you for your kind words!

Cosmin

Posted by: Yash May 31 2012, 02:11 PM

Man, this topic almost made me cry. I might seem very hard and rocker kinda dude sometimes but inside I am very emotional, can't help it. You're like the big brother I never had. Thanks.

Posted by: Cosmin Lupu May 31 2012, 09:47 PM

Heeeeey come here lil' man >:D< we'll get you set on the right path of learning how to jam

Posted by: Dinaga May 31 2012, 09:52 PM

You can never be too emotional!

After all, we deal with music here, and it's made of emotions

It's been said many, many, many times but GMC really IS the best guitarist community on the internet. And not only for guitarists, not even only for musicians - it's such a great place for everyone, full of awesome people. Something like that is a true gift and privilege to have!

So yeah, I love GMC - very, very much

Posted by: dark dude May 31 2012, 10:23 PM

That's sad to hear, Yash. You seem like a nice person, it's unfortunate that people have been like that to you. The people here will certainly help.

My worry is that being too kind / people possibly taking offense to proper criticism here leads to making members' music or recordings better than they are, and in the long term, they will suffer for it. However, I tend to be quite blunt with these things, so the bias and perhaps lack of patience is there

As as the topic goes, yes, I very much enjoy talking about technique and the art of practicing in chats or on the forum (which is my current guitar-related obsession), and have got some invaluable feedback from certain individuals on here, many of which could too easily be taken for granted. So, judging by the above posts, carry on not taking it for granted, or these people may crumble away sooner than you think.

Cheers, guys

Posted by: The Uncreator May 31 2012, 11:33 PM

Hard to say, A lot of key members such as Andrew Cockburn, Tony Miro, Pavel Denisjuk, Trond Vold, Staffy, (some of them newer members might not know all of them) always took the time to listen to my music and give me tips on my mixes. From the day one my goal was to record music and make it sound as good as possible, all these people gave me viewpoints from many different angles, allowing me to develop a good ear and good mixing technique which I still seek to improve everyday.

As for motivation to actually keep playing and writing, it may sound sad but I haven't really had any. My musician friends (most of them) always have given me positive thoughts on my stuff, but all my motivation comes from myself. I have an insane, and completely insatiable desire to just create something other than the reality I know everyday. Guitar was originally an escape from my shoddy and unstable teenage years (12 - 18 ), so by the time I had settled into my new life, it wasn't a choice of finding motivation to play, it was just necessary, as much as breathing was, it was second nature and to take it away would be equal to putting a bullet in my head. I do not know how to function without it.

Posted by: Yash Jun 1 2012, 01:18 PM

And thinking of Jam, when is your new jam gonna be. I always wanted to jam with someone, brings the sleeping creator out of me.
And I am 5'7" now so not very lil I suppose, hehe



Oh yes, I almost forgot that. No one can be too emotional here, we deal with emotion. Thanks for reminding me that Dinaga



Yes, I MIGHT seem like a person, but have my own problems which takes all the goodness out of me sometimes. You know stuff like a lot, and I do mean A LOT of anger and hate towards the ones who love me.

Posted by: dark dude Jun 1 2012, 02:14 PM

The important thing is that you're aware of the problem, it also sounds like something you'll grow out of.

Posted by: Dinaga Jun 1 2012, 02:49 PM

I agree with you on this one. It's important to give criticism the right way. If you only praise something, the author will think he's better than he /she actually is. But if you get too rough, it can lead to demotivation low self-esteem. For example, if you play a song to someone and he starts with the bad things, you might not even listen to the good sides, because you've already been demotivated.

However, I think the instructors (as well as others) here are very good at giving criticism because they will mention things you played good, but also the things you need to work on. And it will always be encouraging to read, not demotivating. At least that's how it's been for me on GMC That's why students here make such good progress - it's a serious institution, as well as a friendly environment to be in as a musician.

Posted by: Yash Jun 1 2012, 02:53 PM

Very true

Posted by: tonymiro Jun 1 2012, 02:55 PM

Giving criticism is not an easy thing to do but if people really want to learn and improve it's necessary.

I have to do it all the time as people routinely want/need feedback on their recording/mix. As a mastering engineer I tell the truth but tempered a bit to take account of their abilities, experience and what they're trying to achieve. Generally though I only comment when specifically asked.

I'll usually be much more critical of a professional mix that comes here for mastering for commercial release then of a home recording. I find there's little point in pointing out page after page of mix issues to a beginner as it's just too much to take in and so ultimately not helpful. Nonetheless, the one thing I won't do is tell someone that their mix is of commercial standard when it's not. People often don't like that though particularly as others will be telling them the opposite.

A pro engineer should be able to understand and cope with a detailed critique of the balance of their mix. So in those cases I can go in to much more detail - and here a critique can be lengthy, often broken down in to comments like: insufficient intro and fade in; 0.28 unwanted noise on tail of snare; snare lacks impact on the 2nd chorus; tom rolls need more stereo spread; tonality of the bass tom needs more low end definition; pitch issue with toms generally; 1:28-1:32 backing vox is poorly defined; 1:28-1:38 and 2:28-2:38 backing vox need de-essing; kick drum is recessed behind bass in intro and verse 1 and 2; backing vox need bringing up 3dB throughout; acoustic piano is down 3dB throughout; levels between verse1, chorus 1 and 2 and verse 2 not consistent; timing issue 4:21.5 - end; excessive string/handling noise 3:15-3:32.5; unwanted background noise/talking 3:43-3:47; unwanted amp noise on outro 4:58-end; fade out not smooth. And so on and so on. Nonetheless I still will treat the person as a professional and show them professional courtesy and respect. Personally, I try not to dissrespect other engineers or get in to arguments with them, no matter what I think of them and their work.

One of the more difficult issues is having to explain that a track needs re-recording/mixing from the ground up as it also inevitably begs the question as to whether or not the recording/mix engineer is up to the job. At that point not only am I critiquing the person's work but also potentially suggesting that they're not up to the job. Not an easy thing to do.

Posted by: Cosmin Lupu Jun 1 2012, 03:39 PM

The truth is that each one of us can get so into their creations, that at some point they won't notice some detail missing or being too accentuated, or on the other hand less accentuated. I never would've evolved without criticism and it was given in many ways, from 'dude you sucked BIG TIME' to 'Hey man, I loved that bend over there, but at the end you missed the two notes which could've made your performance flawless'

It is of utmost importance - if of course, you care about helping someone - to offer criticism in the proper way and when the time is right, if the person is not there to receive it, but you are feeling that the person could evolve after receiving it.