Lydian Mode? |
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Lydian Mode? |
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Feb 11 2007, 02:09 AM |
Amongst all my other practice, I am trying to figure out modes so that I can incorporate them in my playing - they have been, so far, incomprehensible to me. Today, I was working on a solo and I decided to analyze it in modal terms to see what I came up with - could someone check me on this to see if I have finally opened a crack of understanding ?
So, I was playing a chord sequence of Am7-Gmaj7-Am7-Gmaj7, and using a G major scale over both chords. So, G major scale on a Gmaj7 chord is Ionian - no surprises there. However, the same scale over an Am7 is Lydian I think, my reasoning is as follows: A is the relative minor of C, so I am in effect playing a G scale over a chord of C (kind of). The C-G interval is a 4th, making the mode Lydian ... does that make any sense at all, or have I completely misunderstood modes again??? If the above is correct, is it a rule that you always use majors to figure the interval (e.g. C instead of Am)? If I didn't do that I'd end up with a 6th interval, making it Aeolian which I'm pretty sure it isn't. And a related question - is the Aeolian mode the same as a relative minor for a particular chord? Thanks for any enlightenment! -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ... My Stuff: Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab |
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Feb 11 2007, 04:24 PM |
can I get the English version of that? Isn't dorian the car from back to the future?
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Feb 11 2007, 04:29 PM |
can I get the English version of that? Isn't dorian the car from back to the future? Nah, I thought it was a Ford Mixolydian Thanks for taking the time to respond Tank, that was actually extremely helpful as you pointed out what I was doing wrong - I was going from the chord to the scale instead of the other way around, which was why none of this made any sense ! So if I turn it around and always start with a chord of G(something), the scales would become: Chord - Scale - Mode G - G - Ionian Gm7 - F - Dorian Gm7 - D# - Phrygian Gmaj7 - D - Lydian G7 - C - Mixolydian Gm7 - A# - Aeolian Gdim - G# - Locrian Does that look right? And another question is, going back to the original example, and playing in the scale of G at all times. If the chord sequence went G-Em-Am-D (that old 50s - 60s classic) would I be playing Ionian-Aeolian-Dorian-Mixolydian? Or to put it another way, when thinking in modes, is it usual to find that a given progression works through several modes in this way? Or is it more usual that you would change the scale to follow the chords? Thanks! This post has been edited by Andrew Cockburn: Feb 11 2007, 04:37 PM -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ... My Stuff: Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab |
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Feb 11 2007, 06:16 PM |
can I get the English version of that? Isn't dorian the car from back to the future? No - the car is DeLorean! What a nice car! -------------------- "It isn't how many years you have been playing, it's how many hours." -- Prashant Aswani "PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE!" -- Michael Angelo Batio Check out my video lessons and instructor board! |
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Feb 11 2007, 08:49 PM |
You've got it, your chords - scales is correct. (Took me a few minutes to think it through!!!). As to your second question, you are right, if you were using the G-Em-Am-D and played G major all the way through, you'd be passing through all those modes as the chords changed. It can be a way of soloing, but it can become limited eventually. Personally I've started to change the scale as the chords change, which gives much more variety, (and a load more to think about/go wrong!!) /T Fantastic - I'm finally understanding! Now I need to play in all the modes for several years so I can feel them instead of just write them down in a post ;-) Actually, thinking about it a little more as I write this, I am now realizing that up until now I have, without knowing it, been using the first approach of staying in scale and using a different mode when I could easily get away with it (Ionian, Aeolian, Mixolydian and a little Dorian), and switching scales instead of using some of the more esoteric modes. Wow, not only do I already know four modes, I can now describe what I have been doing all along in far more baffling terms Thanks for the advice Tank - this thread has been really helpful to me. I've been baffled about modes for years, and I think it has finally clicked. -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ... My Stuff: Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab |
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Feb 15 2007, 01:59 AM
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This stuff is waaaaaay over my head, but just what I'm looking to learn....
Any suggestions on where to start guys? -------------------- Out of my mind. Back in five minutes.
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Feb 15 2007, 02:32 AM |
This stuff is waaaaaay over my head, but just what I'm looking to learn.... Any suggestions on where to start guys? There was another thread about starting/reopening the theory board - a few of us were interested in asking questions and maybe posting articles/lessons, so one answer could be "watch this space"! I think it would be good to build up some theory material for the site over time, and possibly some simple videos showing scales etc. When I get myself a little more organized I might have a go at putting some basic theory posts together, so let me know what would be helpful to you - I'm not an expert, but we can learn together, and there are plenty of people on this site who know a hell of a lot and can help with specific questions. Apart from that, there are a number of explanations of modes in particular around the net - just google for "modes" and you should get a bunch. If modes are a little too much to pick up initially (I found them really hard for a long time), you can start with the theory of basic scales, and the CAGED system, which you need to understand anyway for modes to make sense. -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ... My Stuff: Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab |
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Feb 15 2007, 10:00 AM
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Cool, thanks mate...
Its hard to know what to search for!! lol -------------------- Out of my mind. Back in five minutes.
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Feb 15 2007, 02:11 PM |
Shouldn't this be: G - G - Ionian Gm7 - A - Dorian Gm7 - B - Phrygian Gmaj7 - C - Lydian G7 - D - Mixolydian Gm7 - E - Aeolian Gdim - F# - Locrian ? No, I don't think so - the way you have it is going from scale to chord, I was going the other way .(i.e. backwards) So, taking Mixolydian as an example, in tanks post he said G - Cmaj7 (scale of G, chord of Cmaj7) would be Mixolydian, I wanted to do it backwards and keep G7 as the chord. The question then becomes, what base scale has a G 4 intervals up from it? The answer is D. -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ... My Stuff: Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab |
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