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Posted by: synfection Apr 12 2009, 09:54 PM

what are your thoughts on guitar hero?

on one hand i could see how it could lead kids to a real guitar but ... on the other i've seen seriously obsessed kids with that game that have stopped playing their guitar to play guitar hero more!!!

tell me your thoughts!!

Posted by: Artemus Apr 12 2009, 09:59 PM

It's a fun game but I sometimes find it annoying when I can play a song on a real guitar, but on guitar hero I'm just an epic fail!
Still, I get interest from kids wanting to play the real thing - I've not had a phone call or email asking whether I could teach someones son/daughter the guitar hero controller.. always seems to a real guitar with strings and the likes that people want to learn.. hmm

Posted by: Ctodd Apr 12 2009, 10:03 PM

guitar hero is one of the reasons that I got interested in playing guitar. I was really proficient at it much before I picked up a real guitar, and now I try to practice at least 2 hours a day, but lately (past few weeks) I've barely been playing at all . Anyway that's a different story.

bottom line is I think it's great that kids can get into music like that, it somewhat connects them with it, and having "control" (I wish to use that word loosely) over the music is a great way to introduce someone to creating real music.

Posted by: DragonX556 Apr 12 2009, 10:09 PM

I think it is good because it introduces music to kids who may have never heard any of it before. I personally don't play it because I'd rather practice real guitar than a video game that I probably won't be playing in a year.

Posted by: superize Apr 12 2009, 10:11 PM

I really like to play guitar hero but i prefer the real thing because i can do so much more with it......

I would like to encurage people to play real guitar instead of a fake plastic one.....

Posted by: Artemus Apr 12 2009, 10:33 PM

My favourite T-shirt:

Posted by: synfection Apr 12 2009, 10:35 PM

haha where can i get one!

Posted by: Bogdan Radovic Apr 12 2009, 10:38 PM

I think this is a good thing! It introduces kids to guitar music (rock , metal and all the quality genres/songs that are featured in guitar hero games)...It introduces them to idea of starting to play the real thing...I'm sure many won't progress to a real guitar (but I don't think they would play anyway even if they never played guitar hero) and I'm also sure that many kids will get inspired to start playing the real thing! I don't think kids that played guitar somewhat seriously would stop practicing in order to get good at guitar hero.Even if they did I'm sure they didn't see the guitar hero as substitute.If they wanted to play sports more they would surly stop playing the guitar anyway.
Its a good thing I guess.

Posted by: Artemus Apr 12 2009, 10:42 PM

http://www.guitartshirts.com/ for the guitar t-shirts

Posted by: Azzaboi Apr 12 2009, 10:48 PM

Its a great addictive game with some good songs, one of my friends is real pro at it and can finger tap, etc in the game! Got into playing the real guitar, so it's all good. Helps with ya timing?

Posted by: Fran Apr 13 2009, 12:10 AM

I really like GH, addictive gaming with awesome rocking tracks!, I'm all for this new wave of games and I believe they make many people start playing the real thing.

Posted by: jer Apr 13 2009, 12:27 AM

I think these games are AWESOME.

I'd rather see kids playing this than Grand Theft Auto or Halo.

And it can only lead them to the real thing.

It wont always do that, but if they had any interest anyway it will.

Posted by: ParalyzedHorse Apr 13 2009, 12:30 AM

I think playing guitar hero is helpful to your real guitar playing. You really need to have good timing to hit the notes in guitar hero. So by playing guitar hero, you are getting better at rhythm and also syncing your left hand to your right.

Posted by: jer Apr 13 2009, 12:32 AM

It cant hurt, thats for sure.

I like rockband better. I prefer drums to guitar.

It feel like I am doing something more useful.

When I get a song down on drums I try to sing it also.

Posted by: Praetorian Apr 13 2009, 02:48 AM

I agree 100%. Plus, if it leads a kid to pick up a real guitar, then great! If it leads a kid to broaden his scope of music, then great! If it doesn't lead a kid to play real guitar...then like you say...it is better than him playing a game where he is killing people.

Posted by: PluckerFlucker Apr 13 2009, 03:26 AM

It sucks.

I have kids and 2 are teenagers. They spend more time trying to push buttons than plucking strings.
And!!
If they spent as much time on a real guitar they would have learned to play a song or 2, getting them into making real music.

Ive tried to teach them but when they hang out with their friends (who dont have a coach) they would rather play guitar hero.

Its poser. Pretend stuff.

And I dont think it gets anyone into the real thing coz, playing real guitar is much harder and more time intensive.

Did u know slash is an epic fail on guitar hero, even his own riffs!! lol

Guitar is all about making your own music, and being a musician, guitar hero is all about playing a game.

Posted by: jer Apr 13 2009, 03:32 AM

are there people really giving up guitar for the game instead?

Or choosing one or the other.

I'm willing to bet that guitar hero gamers who arent into playing for "real" wouldnt have been into playing for real if the game hadnt been invented.

Its weird, if people would have asked this question 5 years ago: "what if kids spent their game time listening to a wide array of music and simulating rock stars instead of shooting everything and killing hookers?

People would have praised it to no end.

Now its here and some people are complaining.

As games go its by far a better way to go than most others.

Its as close to accomplishing something real as you can get in a game.

But in the end, its a game. And there will always be game haters.

Posted by: PluckerFlucker Apr 13 2009, 03:47 AM

As far as it goes being a game, and not musically inclined or suggest "talented" players; yeah, sure, waste your time away.
But it can never be remotely respected in the same field as music.

I would rather blow away armed opponents who are skilled with a gamepad than pretend to be a real musician with a push button guitar.

Posted by: Marcus Lavendell Apr 13 2009, 09:43 AM

I agree with you.

It's a fun game and it introduces kids (and adults as well ) to guitar, and that's definitely a good thing.

Posted by: Skalde Apr 13 2009, 11:56 AM

Posted by: jer Apr 13 2009, 12:32 PM

Thats the thing. I'm coming from the standpoint of kids. And I dont want my kids pretending to be blowing people away. I'd rather they pretend to be rock guitarists.

When I was younger it was tennis rackets. We'd hold tennis rackets like guitars. Or just air guitar to our favorite guitar gods.

Now there is something a bit more interactive for those whom are interested.

Thats great I think. All the air guitaring in the world didnt make me want to not pursue real guitar. Maybe if I had a chance to play a game like that back in 1985 I'd have done well at it, gained confidence, and tried real guitar sooner?!?!?!?

In my opinion anything that takes focus away from games involving killing.

There is enough killers in the world. We needn't be training more.

But introducing kids to music? Hell yeah!!! Maybe it'll get the schools to see that cutting all the music programs is a bad idea. THERE IS INTEREST!!!!!!!

Posted by: Ivan Milenkovic Apr 13 2009, 01:04 PM

I agree. Compared to other violent games that we are bombarded with GH is a positive thing, similar to Super Mario for example. I don't wanna disrespect the people who play violent games - I played a lot of them myself, but I think GH is definitely something that has more meaning to me then those games.
I don't see how GH is comparable to real guitar in any way tho..

Posted by: jer Apr 13 2009, 01:11 PM

I wonder why people who play sports don't bad mouth the people who play John Madden football or Tiger Woods golf?

That's nothing like golf!!!!!! What a waste! Pick up some real clubs poser!!!!

Posted by: Roadside Apr 13 2009, 03:04 PM

It´s a funny game, but I hate the hype about it. If you concern that it is so much easier. Anyway let´s play the real one with the G-string

Posted by: synfection Apr 13 2009, 07:14 PM

LOL at the guitar hero for mac:D

Posted by: Praetorian Apr 13 2009, 09:49 PM

That is a good analogy!

Posted by: jer Apr 13 2009, 09:53 PM

Thanks.

Its a very overlooked analogy in my opinion.

For some reason it seems a good sized chunk of guitar players think that the guitar hero gamers are under the impression that they are gaining real guitar skills.

I have yet to meet any that think that. Its a game. They know its a game. Let them have their fun.

And as games go, you could waste your time on a lot worse.

Posted by: Startear Apr 13 2009, 10:05 PM

agreed, it's better to play guitar hero than WOW xD

Posted by: jer Apr 13 2009, 10:10 PM

Posted by: fkalich Apr 13 2009, 11:27 PM

Well, you can't say something is good because you find something even worse. People don't read anymore, not the classics, do stuff like this instead. It just is real bad. Just because we have more advanced technology today does not make your average person more intelligent than decades past, all statistics and evidence demonstrate it has been the opposite.

And physically also. I know for adults to stay in shape takes efforts, but look at kids today. I live on a college campus and have seen the weight gains over the years as they arrive. Years ago about half the young ladies were knock outs on campus. Now all you think is "why would anyone with a belly like that want to show it off". I think the average kid at 18 weighs 20-25 lbs more than years ago, and it is the same in Europe. Not active, not socializing, playing sports with people. I also think more of them end up lacking social skills, very introverted, afraid of anything outside their little closed social group. Because rather than getting out and socializing, which involves active things, they sit in front of terminals and video games instead.

Here is something, a very old video from 1972. This was Slade, the original GLAM band, very first one. After the first minute they start showing the audience. Look how thin the ladies are, nearly all of them. Now on campus, maybe 1 in 10 is like that. Why is this a good thing, being inactive, a couch potato, rather than an active person, who maybe reads good books instead?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLsw668PVyY

Posted by: jer Apr 13 2009, 11:33 PM

Are you asking me?

I don't think it is a good thing.

Balance in everything is good. Is this like the World of Warcraft assumptions? Anyone who plays Guitar Hero HAS TO PLAY 80 hours a week? Says who?

Enjoying a video game does not a couch potato make.





I'm not sure how you read. But in my experience, reading is one of the LEAST active thing man has yet to come up with. Turn the page, move your eyes back and forth, repeat. Thats not going to lead to a smokin' body.

Posted by: Marcus Siepen Apr 14 2009, 04:38 PM

I have no problem with Guitar Hero, I have it myself and it is a great party game. And it for sure introduces kids to some bands/artists that they would have never heard about I guess, it just doesn't have to do anything with really playing guitar in my opinion. It is a nice game, nothing more, nothing less.

Posted by: berko Apr 14 2009, 04:42 PM

Posted by: Artemus Apr 14 2009, 04:53 PM

On the subject of GH, I've got to share these with you:

Finally a music simulation game that even I might be able to play:


And a great advert for playing the real thing:

Posted by: Marcus Lavendell Apr 14 2009, 05:28 PM

I can understand why some say that Guitar Hero is not like playing real guitar at all... well, simply because it's just a game where you hit some buttons when they show up on the screen

But in some ways I actually do think that it's a lot like real guitar (especially when playing at expert level). You really have to "get in the groove", and I believe that helps you understand rhythms. And you'll also learn better synchronicity between the left and right hand. These "skills" can easily be converted to real guitar playing, in my opinion. Of course you can learn these things with a real guitar as well, but I don't think this game is so bad after all...

Just my 2 cents

Posted by: Skalde Apr 14 2009, 10:15 PM

I once tried Guitar Hero and found it rather boring. For me it was just pushing buttons and had nothing to do with music.
I was only paying intention to the screen and not the music, actually I didn't see to much relation with pushing the buttons and the music.
Obviously the point of Guitar Hero is to get in the Groove like, M.Lavendell said, but it didn't work for me.
Maybe it would have worked if I hadn't played real guitar. I can not see any downsides of the games either. For me it's just a game and music stays music.

Posted by: Red Apr 14 2009, 10:52 PM

It isn't a good thing, but it feels really good to do nothing and be an inactive couch potato

Posted by: jer Apr 14 2009, 11:37 PM

Unless you are reading a book.

Then somehow you are not a couch potato...

I'm still working on that one. I havent figured it out yet either.

And I'm pretty sure that playing thru even the most easiest of guitar hero songs on EASY burns a helluva lot more calories than reading.

Posted by: Skalde Apr 15 2009, 12:14 AM

Well, and I am pretty sure that reading books has much more benefits than playing guitar hero(expacailly for kids)

Posted by: Artemus Apr 15 2009, 12:20 AM

This I agree with but there's no harm in doing both

Posted by: Jose Mena Apr 15 2009, 12:28 AM

Seems to me it makes kids develop an interest for guitar, and if not great guitar music at least, I don't think it is a bad thing, I played it, it was fun, but I am not really good at it, it is just a game that is all.

Posted by: Skalde Apr 15 2009, 12:32 AM

Of course there is nothing wrong with playing games, but keep in mind there are plenty of games which are far more challenging(and benefical) then GH, like chess.
For me GH is just a game(did anyone see the South Park episode of GH? )

Posted by: jer Apr 15 2009, 01:18 AM

I don't think anyone would dispute the potential there.

Depending on the book.

Looked at the books for your adults lately?

The original statement regarding books was: don't be a video game couch potato, read books instead.

Which,and I don't think I'm alone here, could be one of the silliest statements I have ever read.

Posted by: Artemus Apr 15 2009, 01:34 AM

I think it boils down to the definition of a "couch potato"
In reference to one being physically inactive, sitting reading a book isn't a physically strenuous activity but stereotypically a couch potato refers to laziness, in all aspects, so images of one often involve a slob of some sort watching rubbish on TV.
Reading a good book atleast requires some brain activity and use of the imagination but in terms of getting that toned slender look and healthy pumping heart - reading about a healthy lifestyle does not make you healthy

Posted by: fkalich Apr 15 2009, 03:00 AM

Coach potato has mental and physical aspects, they go hand and hand. Don't separate the mental and physical aspects.

A book was written awhile back, and although now dated (it centered on the TV rather than all the stuff that has been added now to keep the public entertained), but the premise still applies. You can read reviews on Amazon to get the premise. But I think the picture is worth a thousand words. Rather than just a TV, stick video games and internet crap there also. I have none of it, killed my TV 4 years ago. I strongly feel that the more exposure you have to the modern media entertainment culture that we live in, the less you are for it.



Here is an interesting site, volunteers do the readings. You are what you put into your mind. And it will show in your music. When I see a guy play, I know all about him, I know about all the teachers, not having met one, just by how they play. You expose your intellect when you play. I believe that every person who wants to really be an accomplished musician, should also be very literate, have read the classics. You don't have time for video games. Albert Einstein was an accomplished violinist b.t.w., took it everywhere with him.

He said once "keep things as simple as possible, but no simpler". I apply that to my music.

http://librivox.org/

Posted by: jer Apr 15 2009, 03:08 AM

I hate this statement.

What makes a classic?



My point remains. Reading doesn't remove someone from the couch potato sedentary status. Sit around and push buttons, turn pages, whatever.... A couch potato is a couch potato is a couch potato.

Spending all your free time reading is worse for you than mmorpgs. At least there you have social contact.

Am I knocking reading?

No. Not at all.

I just laugh at people who think its the be all end all answer. You know how much CRAP there is in printed form?

Lots.... But people dont get all uptight about it since there arent pictures. Kids are reading books that should be rated R and they are 14. But since its READING dumbass parents think its all just fine.....

Just cuz its printed doens't make it noble.

Posted by: Tono Fyr Apr 15 2009, 03:14 AM

What Mr. Siepen said.

Posted by: Koopid Apr 15 2009, 07:01 AM

Reading is worse for you than mmorpgs? How you come up with that? Social contact?? You pretend to be someone you're not and interact with other people pretending.

I am a reader, I read a couple of books every week, I have done so my entire life. I tried to come up with an explanation on how much more information about the world you get from books that was not the actual intent of the book but it just comes with it but I can't explain what I mean

I am also a gamer. I played Q1 online the same month it was released. I have won the European championship in Quake3 4-man team (in a quite small mod but still) and finished second the year after. It is social but to say I "know" anyone in the game is just not true. I do have one friend from Quake3 after playing 4 years of active Quake. Had I spent that time with real people in a real sport I would have made more friends that that in 4 years I am sure

I am also a MMORPG player. I started in -96 with meridian59, the first "3d" graphic MMORPG. I played EQ from beta3 until release of WoW which I played until we finished BWL back when that was the endgame (2 years or so ago?). I had one year absence from MMORPG's when my first son was born in these 11 years. I have no "friends" left from MMORPG's, once you finished playing they go away, I kept in contact with a few but we have no other similar interests.

What I am trying to say is that from Reading I have a value left. I have learned a lot and since I am a "skilled reader" or whatever you call it I can also learn new things faster and easier. From gaming I have no value left. I have one person I talk to on MSN a lot and the only thing I learned from it is to play that specific game.

There is ofcourse for some people that have problems socializing with people in RL good value in mmorpgs but to say that it is better than reading, I just can't agree.

About guitar hero.. GOOD of course. It is a game that makes you listen to nice music. Listen, not play. If you like it, play it...

EDIT:
There is a value in MMORPG's that I forgot to mention! It's FUN! It's very much fun or I wouldn't have played it for 10-11 years. What I meant is that there is no value left after you stopped playing

Posted by: Sircraigery Apr 15 2009, 07:24 AM

Ok kids, let's not fight.

I like GH just for simple reason it's slowly killing off Rap music. Most high school kids now listen to real music, when I graduated it was all about 50 Cent, and Jay-Z. Now THAT stuff is complete crap.

Posted by: David Wallimann Apr 15 2009, 01:00 PM

I don't know if it really helps as a guitar player, but I got a lot of business from that game for sure!
Probably 50 per cent of my students started because of the game...

Posted by: jer Apr 15 2009, 01:50 PM

I didnt say mmorpgs are better than reading.

I said if you spent ALL of your free time in one or the other at least mmorpgs involve socializing and contact with other people.

Reading the printed word does not be default lead to intelligence. Go to the beach. Look at all the reading going on. Are these the greatest minds of our generation? I see a lot of fluff romance books laying there.

There are just as many garbage books as there are worthless tv shows, probably more.

Ad whats a classic? A story of a whale and a captain? Sounds like something my kid would read.

Fiction, in any form, is just that. Fiction. I dont care if its Shakespeare, Stephen King, or Jackie Collins. Why is reading Othello any better than some modern trashy erotic thriller? Is it really any differnet? Or have we been brainwashed by the schools to think that its somehow more noble because its Shakespeare?

Do you give your mind more of a workout imagining the scenes yourself as you read vs watching tv? Sure. But in the end you are in the land of make believe. All by yourself. Laying on the couch. Just like the guy watching Jerry Springer.

Its all entertainment.

Sure you can learn things reading. And you can learn things watching the discovery channel too.

I just dont buy that I'm smarter than you because I am holding a book, you are holding the TV Guide, crap. And I'll take the physical health, social roundedness and metabolism of a 16 yr old who plays Rock Band with his friends after school EVERY DAY for 4 hours vs the kid down the street locked in his room reading all night, alone.

If after 5 years of that one of them was discovered to be a violent offender, which one would your money be on?


Like I said a lot of posts ago, its all about balance. Too much of one thing is just that. Unbalanced and too much. Even reading.

Posted by: opeth.db Apr 15 2009, 03:04 PM

I'd rather just buy the artist's CD and play my real guitar. But thats just my opinion of course.

Posted by: Koopid Apr 15 2009, 05:12 PM

Sure, me too. But that doesn't mean its right for everyone. Guitar Hero seems to be a fun game, I can't see anything wrong with it like so many guitarists seem to do...



I never said you were smarter because you read... I say that it simulates you in different ways. Reading takes more effort than TV. A well written book that makes you think takes more effort than a trashy erotic book or the TV-guide. But as everything else, its not for everyone. Some people enjoy TV more so they should watch TV. If you like erotic novels, read them...

Do I say reading a lot makes me smarter or more intelligent? No, I don't because I don't think it does. I don't think knowledge equals intelligence either.

Infact I am quite sure I never said anything about reading books and intelligence? I said that I think its better for you in the long run than playing MMORPG's. I still do, even if you did spend ALL of your free time on it.. I have done both, reading all my free time and gaming all my free time.

Posted by: jer Apr 15 2009, 05:29 PM

Sorry if I wasnt clear, I'm not saying you said those things.

I'm commenting more on fKalich's position. And those that put books on a pedestal as if they have magic powers that improve intelligence and credibility over video games, television, the internet, whatever... To me thats an all too common stance. I think its ludicrous.


That point of view was mainly found here:
( http://www.guitarmasterclass.net/guitar_forum/index.php?s=&showtopic=26521&view=findpost&p=367481 )

Specifically to your comment I was saying that I feel that someone who spends 100% of their time in a book, is going to be at a social disadvantage to someone who spends 100% of their time in a mmorpg setting. Its the solitary vs social aspect. Humans are a social entity. Being cut off from the world (any world) like that isnt healthy.

Thats my point.

To summarize my point of view (which is just that, MY point of view) Books arent better than anything else. Crap can be printed, and it sure is, just as it can be filmed. I think people that sit behind a book and accuse others of wasting time hitting A,B,X,Y, buttons or watching television are nothing short of full of themselves. What makes your hobby better than anyone elses? Get over yourself. If someone wants to spend their free time playing a video game, who cares? Why are you threatened that the controller looks like a guitar? Are you afraid they'll get all the girls? Does it bother you that they are having the fun of playing the game without all the tedious guitar practice? Has anyone EVER heard anyone claim to have real guitar skills after spending some time with a Guitar hero controller? Personally I think the guitarists of the world that are bothered by this need to take some tips from the football players out there. You dont see them all up in arms about people playing John Madden football on the Playstation.

The facts remain that a LOT more real guitars are being sold. A LOT more real guitar lessons are being given. There are tab books for the songs in the games for sale. Why would anyone need that? You know why, cuz these games are spawning REAL GUITAR players. How people can say these games arent good eludes me. Getting kids into music via a game? GENIUS!!!!!

Again, just my opinion, not directed at anyone in particular.

Posted by: synfection Apr 15 2009, 11:48 PM

thanks for all the replys by the way guys. its making a good read!

Posted by: ErikEklund Apr 17 2009, 07:24 PM

When I first played guitar hero I had not heard of Eric Johnson, but his song Cliffs of dover was in the game and he became one of my favorites