Should Beginners Buy Expencive Gear ? Options

[buttmonk]

If the money is not a problem then go for the best u can afford, the better the guitar the easier it will be to learn. However....as a beginner, knowing what is the best guitar for u, what a good guitar actually is, especially when you don't even know what kinda music you wanna play and what techniques and tone it requires....is a lot more difficult.

My gear journey goes something like this:

1) Ibanez GRX40 Jumpstart Pack: Frets like coarse sandpaper and very bad for bends. Frets too small, larger frets are easier for beginner. Uninspiring sound. Heavy. Very poor amp. I think the amp was the biggest problem, with an amp this shit, how is the beginner supposed to imagine that they will ever be capable of producing the sounds in their mind's ear?

2) ESP LTD F-500: Much better guitar, but again a bad beginners choice in the sense that I paid 900€ for a top of the line LTD in which the quality is no better than a bottom of the line LTD. I would advise anyone not to do the same, if you are going to buy a Korean or similar guitar, don't go for the top of the range 1 since the quality control is gunna be the same as on the cheapie ones and you would be better saving for a Jap or US made bottom of the liner where the quality will be better. Sure, you might get better components, but the fret-work, finish, neck, setup etc will all be the same quality and this makes at least as much difference as the components. Frets not dressed too well and not level (fret buzz). Had to buy this 1 based on internet reviews, no possibility to try before purchase cos of where I was living. Again good advice for the beginner, don't buy anything you have not sat down with for 30mins, no matter how shit you are, the shop assistant should help you get some value out of that time even if you can't play anything yet.

3) Zoom modelling amp: Lots of pretty crap sounds, better than the Ibanez at least. Was kinda persuaded by the shop assistant and internet reviews, without really trying it properly cos I did not have the balls to sit in the music shop and test it out with my non-existant skillz:)

4) Carvin Bolt+ Kit: Great guitar, great neck with SS frets, good tone. Only 550€.

5) Orange Tiny Terror with PPC112 cab. Great tone and simple. Roland Microcube (pretty good actually, needed amp quick in between selling the Zoom and buying the TT).

Anyways, the moral of this story is that the beginner may find it very difficult to know what they want or need. Naturally, at the beginning, the beginner does not have the insight that comes with experience to know the answer to these questions. I certainly have made bad purchases thinking that "this will make me sound good" when really the main obstacle to me sounding good was my playing and technique. Any time spent by the beginner misguidedly pursuing such notions can only be detrimental to their advancement and may even be disastrous, the sooner they realise that the main way to get the sounds they want is just to practice and practice well, the better off they will be. Amplifier-wise, it is important to get an amp that has a few good basic tones (blues, rock, metal) and not too many options that would distract the beginner. It would help the beginner to know that the gear they are playing is good and is capable of producing the sounds that they aspire to so that there is no temptation to think "the reason I don't sound good is not my playing but my gear, must buy more gear!".

So, this brings me to another suggestion, lets have a sticky in the forum containing GMC recommened starter gear packs. Several reasonably priced but good quality beginner gear packs e.g. 1 for blues, 1 for rock, 1 for metal. Each option could contain several different guitar, amp and even effects box options at different price levels. But most importantly, there should be some demonstration clips by GMC instructors or users showing what sound can be obtained, using ONLY this kit ,with certain settings. Then the GMC beginner can always refer to this if they ever catch themselves thinking "it ain't me its me gear":)

BTW, I am still a beginner....

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This post has been edited by buttmonk: Feb 24 2008, 11:30 AM

[Jordan C]

My opinion is the route I took.

I didn't want a cheap as you can buy guitar but I wanted to be sure I could even begin to play first so I contradict myself now when I say I bought a cheap GUITAR IN A BOX kit with strat copy and a little amp and tuner...

I was picking things up quickly in first couple of weeks so it went straight back on ebay and I went to the guitar shop.

Buying the cheapest guitar I found actually made playing and getting a good sound quite difficult.

So while I was in the shop I explained that I didnt want cheap and cheerful, I wanted something mid range or top end budget range and I was introduced to two aria guitars, on e the fe-std and the other a pe-std... LP copy and acoustic.

Whilst being relatively cheap at 280GBP each they offered a much brighter sound than many of the same priced models.

I found playing them easy and they have suited me very well up until now when I am looking to maybe take my playing into a band situation. Now is where I need to upgrade my gear but even now I don't think that the GIBSON LP PE is the one etc I just feel my budget has to shift upwards so I am looking at guitars now between 500gbp and 900gbp... Should I make it big then the biggest and best will be bought but other than for show off purposed I don't NEED anything more than mid range.

As for amps... well after the GIB rubbish I got a 15 watt marshall. Then after that a spider line6 now I have the VOX AD100VT and well.... you should read my other threads about that one LOL

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This post has been edited by Jordan C: Feb 24 2008, 11:40 AM

[Bogdan Radovic]

Interesting point here buttmonk and Jordan C !

Hmm I think its a little easier for beginner to buy a good guitar in the mid-high price range than to choose a good one from the low end range (practically impossible for beginners)..As they say in our country : "How much money,that much music you get" eheheh it sounds weird in translation but its very true. When buying a first guitar I would suggest bringing a friend who plays and has some experience with you to the store..Also don't feel ashame to test the guitar in store even if you just know how to play power chord..Try it..Or make the store attendant play it for you so you can hear its sound..You are there to buy stuff and they will be happy to assist you in any way in order for you to buy something..

p.s. Great idea there about GMC instructor recommended starter pack Now to get some endorsements and it would be funny

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This post has been edited by Bogdan: Feb 24 2008, 06:50 PM

[Ivan Milenkovic]

And how about those beginners who have the money to buy let's say high end guitar? Do they need to buy it right away? They can buy it and then they can practice as far as I'm concerned. It is far better in my opinion for a beginner to practice on a high end guitar, than on a some cheap midrange guitar. Off course, this doesn't mean that he will progress better because they got better gear, certainly the amount of work that he puts to the instrument will make him a better player and not the quality of the gear.

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[Bogdan Radovic]

Yeah thats right Ivan ! I was just referring to idea that having a good instrument will give you opportunity to advance a little easier with of course hard practice...I think one same person can advance easier practicing on a good rather than bad instrument..In what degree and leaps - its an individual factor..

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[Ivan Milenkovic]

You have the point there Bogdan, but I wouldn't agree that players advance better because of the better gear. As I wrote the gear is irelevant. Now just to clear things up "bad" gear means - midrange gear and "good" gear means - high end gear. To me it doesn't make any difference. now bad player can play on good gear for as long as he wants but that will not make him better player faster simply because the gear he uses is high end.

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[Muris Varajic]

You practice harder and more on less "good" instrument,
my 2 cents.

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[Davidian]

When I just started I didn't want to buy to expensive gear, because I didn't know if I would play enough or even keep playing. I played with my beginner amp for about 8 months than I invested in a good amp, not cheap, not to expensive. That gave such a boost to my playing, so I would advise people who know they will play a lot to buy good amp. Then after a year, I really wanted a new guitar, my old one didn't sound good, no good harmonics,... So I work for a month and I went to the shop. At first I thought to buy a midclass price guitar, but when i was in the shop and tested an expensive one, i thought man just buy this and i won't quit playing.

So imo, you can buy a expensive guitar after you have played for a while with a 'cheap' one and then upgrade, it gives such a boost to your playing.

-Davidian

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[Bogdan Radovic]

You have the point there Bogdan, but I wouldn't agree that players advance better because of the better gear. As I wrote the gear is irelevant. Now just to clear things up "bad" gear means - midrange gear and "good" gear means - high end gear. To me it doesn't make any difference. now bad player can play on good gear for as long as he wants but that will not make him better player faster simply because the gear he uses is high end.

Hmm many low end instruments can't be setup up well , like string action etc ...So its easier to progress faster, practicing on instrument that is comfortable for you (better guitar) rather than "digging" on a low end one

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This post has been edited by Bogdan: Feb 24 2008, 10:20 PM

[Ivan Milenkovic]

string action can be a problem even on a midrange guitar (i was reffering to midrange anyway), BUT I still think that even high action midrange, top range, lowrange guitar can be good if one plays a lot. Many players have played with "high" action in their youth and became world famous, Hendrix, SRV.. do I need to say more. I can even mention Larry Graham, the man who literaly made his style on "high" action instrument because he couldn't play it properly so he had to slap. So imho I don't think action has anything to do with it really.

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This post has been edited by Milenkovic Ivan: Feb 24 2008, 10:33 PM

[Bogdan Radovic]

Its more aspiring to play a comfortable guitar thats all! I don't like to practice on a guitar that isn't comfortable in my hands..
Higher strings action is good for slap style on bass, sounds better..I didn't know that fact about Larry Graham though, I read a different version of how he started in his bass player magazine interview In short , he wanted to compensate for not having a drummer in a bend so he thumb slapped to make up for bass drum, and plucked to make up for not having snare and thats how it all begun (Must have been very exciting for him to "invent" a new technique Of course action may had something to do too

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[Pavel]

I think you can start with a relatively cheap guitar - 300-500$, but with time everyone wants a better axe being inspired by their favorite guitarists

For me - a JEM was a real kick to practice more and sound better But i did spend my 3 years on a 320$ RG370DX so i guess it's normal to start on a cheaper guitar and work your way up.

I'm not saying that you should by a crappy guitar - no way. But beginners don't know if they will take guitar serious and stick to it so it is kind of stupid to spend 2000$ on a guitar not even knowing what it is.

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[Bogdan Radovic]

I think everything above 500$ can be considered "expensive"...I was more thinking about really entry models start up packs that are around 150$-200$ (100-150e)..I never thought about it that way - not being sure that you want to play guitar..Its a fair point to the story..But I'm sure that there are people that when they decide something they stick to that so it doesn't apply to them

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[buttmonk]

I think everything above 500$ can be considered "expensive"...I was more thinking about really entry models start up packs that are around 150$-200$ (100-150e)..I never thought about it that way - not being sure that you want to play guitar..Its a fair point to the story..But I'm sure that there are people that when they decide something they stick to that so it doesn't apply to them

Agreed.

Saving too much money at the beginning can be false economy too. Such was true of my experience with 250€ Ibanez Jumpstart since there was no way that I would be able to continue playing it for any length of time because of the flaws and limitations that were apparent even to me. If I had not realised that they were in fact flaws and limitations of the gear, who knows, maybe I would have packed it in altogether... Would have been much better off spending say 300€ on a better Ibanez and 100€ on a Roland Microcube straight off. Also, getting a well setup guitar is very important for the beginner who is not gunna know how to do it themselves, and is a particularly problem with cheaper guitars. So unless the beginner has knowledgeable guitarist buddies they are probably better off getting their first gear from a good shop instead of buying off the net.

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[Muris Varajic]

I'm not saying that you should by a crappy guitar - no way. But beginners don't know if they will take guitar serious and stick to it so it is kind of stupid to spend 2000$ on a guitar not even knowing what it is.

+1

I wanted to say the same but your english is way too better than mine Pavel,
that's just not fair!!

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[Pavel]

+1

I wanted to say the same but your english is way too better than mine Pavel,
that's just not fair!!

Man your English is way better than you think - really

Bojan: it may sound funny but i started to play just of curiosity, never planned to be an upcoming shredder and i even thought of quitting guitar a few times so there are much more people than you think who really don't know if they will take it serious or not. I know a lot of people who bought a huge amount of gear and expensive guitars and sold them after a few months.

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