Double Tracking Vocals Instead Of Reverb?, Thoughts on the matter? |
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Double Tracking Vocals Instead Of Reverb?, Thoughts on the matter? |
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Sep 9 2010, 11:30 PM |
I had never even considered double-tracking vocals before reading this post on another forum where the author stated the following:
"Our producer wanted to put reverb on my voice, and I stopped him right away. First off, you need to double the vocals. Sing the song twice, pan one right and the other left. Then what you want to do is use a little (and I do mean a LITTLE) "Delay" on the vocals. You just want the delay to be tucked in the background to be ambient. It's just to smooth things out. Reverb makes things sound Karaoke, and you don't want that." Anyone with sufficient experience in recording voice want to chime in on this? Is this a common approach to recording vocals? Thanks for your input, Christian A. -------------------- The more I practice, the more I wish I had time to practice!
My Band Forum: http://passionfly.site/chat |
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Sep 10 2010, 01:14 AM |
I would like to learn how to mix vocals properly as well
I've noticed mixing vocals is often considered to be a bit difficult to get used to, mainly due to varying dynamics in voice tonalities. A good engineer can really make an average vocalist sound good. -------------------- "If the need is deep, you WILL find a way , if it isn't, you'll find some excuse"
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Sep 10 2010, 02:20 AM |
Ok. Here are a couple of tunes where I used vocal doubling.
On the first one, (more recent actaully), I did it more for effect, kind of like other backing vocals sung in unison. See if you can tell which lines were sung doubled and in unison (not the harmonies). I think one of the lines is the 2nd time I sing "the young man changes the station". "Home ain't a place you can drive to" (a.k.a, "The Distance 109")... TheDistance109.mp3 ( 3.72MB ) Number of downloads: 485 On this one, the vocal doubling is kind of subtle to hear, but I know it's there cause I remember spending a lot of time recording vocal takes to get my articulation as precise as possible for each take so that the effect would sound subtle. Then I also only panned the two takes one at 10, and the other at about 2 o'clock just to get a little separation. Keep in mind that this one was recorded on a Tascam 239 cassette 8-track. I had to bounce several tracks around, and then after mastering to two track cassette, conversion to .wav file and then MP3, it gets harder to hear the doubled vocal. But it's there, I know it,cause it's all me on the tape. Also, the gutar tone is kind of brittle. This was done in the days before modelling and I used a BOSS ME5 for the tone. Recorded in about 1992, I remember that when I finished it that I needed desparately to get back into guitar practicing, cause the solo's are a little lame. "Most Anyway"... [attachment=21927:02_Most_Anyway.mp3] Also listen to "Street Fighting Man" by the Stones for a dramatic example. |
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Sep 10 2010, 04:51 AM |
Ok. Here are a couple of tunes where I used vocal doubling. On the first one, (more recent actaully), I did it more for effect, kind of like other backing vocals sung in unison. See if you can tell which lines were sung doubled and in unison (not the harmonies). I think one of the lines is the 2nd time I sing "the young man changes the station". "Home ain't a place you can drive to" (a.k.a, "The Distance 109")... TheDistance109.mp3 ( 3.72MB ) Number of downloads: 485 On this one, the vocal doubling is kind of subtle to hear, but I know it's there cause I remember spending a lot of time recording vocal takes to get my articulation as precise as possible for each take so that the effect would sound subtle. Then I also only panned the two takes one at 10, and the other at about 2 o'clock just to get a little separation. Keep in mind that this one was recorded on a Tascam 239 cassette 8-track. I had to bounce several tracks around, and then after mastering to two track cassette, conversion to .wav file and then MP3, it gets harder to hear the doubled vocal. But it's there, I know it,cause it's all me on the tape. Also, the gutar tone is kind of brittle. This was done in the days before modelling and I used a BOSS ME5 for the tone. Recorded in about 1992, I remember that when I finished it that I needed desparately to get back into guitar practicing, cause the solo's are a little lame. "Most Anyway"... [attachment=21927:02_Most_Anyway.mp3] Also listen to "Street Fighting Man" by the Stones for a dramatic example. O.K., first off let me say I love these recordings. You might call your solos "lame" but for the songs, they fit perfect (IMO). That's a throw-back for sure - loved it. I find it hard to believe the "Most Anyway" track was you doing 2 takes - I'll take your word for it, but I couldn't tell by listening - my mind is blown. I'm not sure if I have the patience / discipline to try this method but it does sound surprisingly good. Thanks for sharing the awesome examples! Christian A. -------------------- The more I practice, the more I wish I had time to practice!
My Band Forum: http://passionfly.site/chat |
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Sep 10 2010, 06:43 AM |
'Doubling', or maybe more correctly 'thickening' a vocal goes way back to the start of multi-track recordings with The Beatles and is still used quite a lot today.
To thicken a vocal well needs a few things IME: 1/ A good vocalist who can reproduce a take very accurately. That is, sing the same piece nearly identically to the first proper take. NB - just duplicating the 1st take isn't the idea, same with doubling a guitar you need the little inconsistencies to make this work. 2/A mix engineer who can accurately align the multiple takes and check for phase issues. If necessary apply some pitch and time adjustments to the secondary ones. If you add some echo to the secondary you need to be careful that the whole thing doesn't just end up as smear. 3/Sensitive gain use on the secondary takes. The idea is to thicken the vocal not double it. So you should experiment with the secondary vocal stem at -10dB or more down from the first. 4/Placement of the emphasis/thickening - often best/better only on chorus and/or individual, specific words or phrases. 5/Considered use of different mics and/or pre-amps to get a slightly different spectral and dynamic balance. BTW - echo and reverb aren't really done to thicken a vocal but to add ambiance. -------------------- Get your music professionally mastered by anl AES registered Mastering Engineer. Contact me for Audio Mastering Services and Advice and visit our website www.miromastering.com
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Sep 10 2010, 05:45 PM |
i dont understand the comparison, they're two totally different cool vocal effects, if you wanna go heavier double the voice, but listen to tony, the singer gotta make both takes almost identically.
if you wanna add some depth to the voice, and put it moody go for a reverb or maybe a delay. i personally love a good slap back delay . -------------------- Check my Instructor Profile Rockers! Got a Blog too!, www.adriantracks.com Follow me on facebook and youtube! -Youtube |
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Sep 10 2010, 05:57 PM |
i dont understand the comparison, they're two totally different cool vocal effects, if you wanna go heavier double the voice, but listen to tony, the singer gotta make both takes almost identically. if you wanna add some depth to the voice, and put it moody go for a reverb or maybe a delay. i personally love a good slap back delay . a "slap back" delay? Any examples of what that might sound like? I'm imagining a pong-like-delay, which I'm not a fan of ^.^ -------------------- The more I practice, the more I wish I had time to practice!
My Band Forum: http://passionfly.site/chat |
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Sep 11 2010, 04:19 AM |
well i use a mono slap back delay a lot of times on my voice, it is just one repetition very present in the mix, and it depends A LOT on the song, but more or less i use the feedback at 1-5% and the mix at 35-45%
this is a cool effect, but WILL sound vintage under normal mix circumstances. -------------------- Check my Instructor Profile Rockers! Got a Blog too!, www.adriantracks.com Follow me on facebook and youtube! -Youtube |
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Sep 15 2010, 12:46 AM |
Reverb tends to make the voice sound too far away in the back,
In modern recordings, the crispier and present the vocals, the better This guy is really popular here in Colombia, -------------------- Visit my:
INSTRUCTOR PROFILE "If a composer could say what he had to say in words he would not bother trying to say it in music." Gustav Mahler Subscribe to my Youtube Channel here |
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