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GMC Forum _ GEAR & PRODUCTION _ Need More Depth
Posted by: KiddKillit May 20 2011, 12:32 PM
Hey guys Im in a band recently my lead guitar player has quit i play rhythm and sing my problem is now that there is only one guitar i feel like my sound needs to be fuller I never really messed around with my tone just kind of pluged in and went for it I play a gretch 5120 threw a 5150 combo Ive been looking at chorus and delay pedals but im not sure what i need never really messed with any before
Thanks
Posted by: Sollesnes May 20 2011, 12:55 PM
Up the mids. Especially in live situations 
But sounding full with only one guitar is a lot about -what- you play
Posted by: Ivan Milenkovic May 20 2011, 02:28 PM
As Solle said, best way to fill the gaps is to play the fills yourself. This may seem hard, but watch what Hendrix did for example. He was the only guitar in a band and needed to play both rhythm and lead. Simplest way to achieve this is to use chordal embelishments, or fuller chords on distortion. If you're interested in some of these tricks, join me on Sunday on my video chat at 16PM GMT 0 (London Timezone)
This will lead to drifting away from the concept of your band tho. But so will the use of effects. As soon as you start using more embelishments, fuller chords, chorus, flanger or anything, the overall sound of the band is being changed. It's up to you to make it a good change tho.
If you want my advice, here it is: pedals won't help that much, it would be best to search for another guitar player, and one who is good enough to make decent arrangements for his lines (so you don't have to make them for him).
Posted by: Daniel Realpe May 20 2011, 03:06 PM
What you can do fx wise is go stereo,
Put a delay on one of the channel of around 16-24ms and pan each channel hard L-R
Don't forget to only allow the wet signal to go out and kill the dry signal,
that's the way John Petrucci from Dream Theater does it, but still they have a keyboard player who is playing all the time
Posted by: KiddKillit May 22 2011, 08:50 PM
This will lead to drifting away from the concept of your band tho. But so will the use of effects. As soon as you start using more embelishments, fuller chords, chorus, flanger or anything, the overall sound of the band is being changed. It's up to you to make it a good change tho.
If you want my advice, here it is: pedals won't help that much, it would be best to search for another guitar player, and one who is good enough to make decent arrangements for his lines (so you don't have to make them for him).
Hey man i missed you I thought it was at 4 pm my time is was 8 am is there any lessons up that will help me
Posted by: Ivan Milenkovic May 23 2011, 11:51 AM
It depends what style of music you're into. I will give you one of mine Hendrix-based lessons that involves chordal embelishments:
http://www.guitarmasterclass.net/rhythm-guitar/jimi-hendrix-style-licks/
If you're interested in more modern approach, let me know, and I'll try to dig something up!
Posted by: Cosmin Lupu May 23 2011, 01:08 PM
Mate, i look at things this way - of course, depending on what style of music you are playing - you should try and create powerful grooves (meaning a lot of work on formulas between you, the bass player and the drummer) which can solve a lot in the case when you are the only guitar in the band. There's also another thing - try and convince your bass player and drummer to perform backing vocals (if they want to learn of course and if they are up to that challenge).
Groovie music with a lot of well harmonized vocals in it is far better than anything 
. Look at Audioslave for instance - and they only have one voice 
best of luck
Cosmin
Posted by: Ivan Milenkovic May 23 2011, 06:21 PM
- of course, depending on what style of music you are playing - you should try and create powerful grooves (meaning a lot of work on formulas between you, the bass player and the drummer) which can solve a lot in the case when you are the only guitar in the band. There's also another thing - try and convince your bass player and drummer to perform backing vocals (if they want to learn of course and if they are up to that challenge). Groovie music with a lot of well harmonized vocals in it is far better than anything
. Look at Audioslave for instance - and they only have one voice best of luck
Cosmin
I agree with Cosmin 100% Rhythm section should provide additional filling of arrangements, and if bass player can sing backing vocals, this will already sound much better!
Posted by: KiddKillit May 24 2011, 04:27 AM
Thanks for the help guys Im into oldies style stuff like little richard , nick curran,ronnie self just rock n roll I would usually cut out and sing and im still working on how to do solos so im just tring to fill in what i can
Posted by: Ivan Milenkovic May 24 2011, 08:28 AM
Using double stops will help. These are two notes played at the same time, on the same fret, on adjacent strings.
There is a lesson of mine regarding R&R soloing with double stops that should come out soon, so stay tuned!
Posted by: Todd Simpson May 24 2011, 08:47 AM
Some great advice so far from all the guys Give pretty much all of it a try and see what starts helping in terms of what you are trying to get out of your sound.
Your gear choice is certainly up to snuff As Daniel said, some Delay, going Stereo, etc. Can help thicken up your individual tone
Also, what you play is big part of it as well. Being able to play and sing will come in handy now that you are filling up some empty space.
Another "thickening" trick is to run a dry signal along with your clean signal to a separate amp and include it in the mix. It will bring out some of your picking and as the signal is uncompressed by processing, it can add fullness when layered under a wet signal. You can split your tone with a simple mixer or splitter like this one
http://www.lehle.com/products/Dual/printversion.php?country=us&lang=en&type=Dual
and send it to two amps to play with this concept.
Todd
Posted by: KiddKillit May 25 2011, 04:53 AM
Im tring it all we practiced tonight for the first time as a 3 piece I added a little distortion from an old boss cheap pedal I had I also got a Electro-Harmonic Clone Theory pedal and im really diggin it. it dosnt take away from the guitars original sound Im working out what I can play while I sing I can play the rhythm He just did little stuff that spiced it up and alot of palm muting Ill work it out Feel like Ive been energized Thanks again for the help
Oh yhea I uped the mids on my amp too .......
Posted by: Ivan Milenkovic May 25 2011, 02:51 PM
Glad you solved the issue man, those are some nice solutions!
It's time to rock now!
Posted by: Todd Simpson Sep 20 2011, 05:24 PM
- of course, depending on what style of music you are playing - you should try and create powerful grooves (meaning a lot of work on formulas between you, the bass player and the drummer) which can solve a lot in the case when you are the only guitar in the band. There's also another thing - try and convince your bass player and drummer to perform backing vocals (if they want to learn of course and if they are up to that challenge). Groovie music with a lot of well harmonized vocals in it is far better than anything
. Look at Audioslave for instance - and they only have one voice best of luck
Cosmin
This is a GREAT point. Audio slave is a four piece and they sound HUGE. Then again, they do have the benefit of about a century worth of combined writing/performing experience. So don't beat yourself up to bad if you don't sound like them straight off the bat, but they are a killer example of what's possible sonically even with pretty minimal instrumentation.
But as was mentioned, probably putting another player in the mix will help quite a bit. It's good to be able to keep moving forward as a band even if a member quits/gets married/etc. So see about thickening your sound, experiment with new tones/gear, embelishments and add a new player when you can.
Posted by: SpaseMoonkey Sep 20 2011, 05:54 PM
I'd say you need the bass and drums to kind of stand out more as a band. I think of bands like Pantera and RHCP for the example. You have your grooves but when a solo kicks in the band still has that groove going to fill in the gaps. So then you still have that feel/sound as if its still playing.
http://www.guitarmasterclass.net/ls/Scarified_by_Racer_X/
I think this video kinda puts what I'm say as an example. Sir Realpe plays it all as a single guitar with just a drum/bass track behind it only.
Posted by: Alex Feather Dec 23 2011, 02:26 AM
Put a delay on one of the channel of around 16-24ms and pan each channel hard L-R
Don't forget to only allow the wet signal to go out and kill the dry signal,
that's the way John Petrucci from Dream Theater does it, but still they have a keyboard player who is playing all the time
Didn't Brian May do something similar?
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