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> Laying Down Drum Tracks
steve25
post Oct 3 2008, 10:18 AM
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Hi there. I want to start looking at how i can use drums but don't really know how they're done. Is it best to say have 1 track for kick drum, 1 track for snare, 1 for hi hat etc how is there a certain way you'd usually do it? Also what kind of doubling is done with drums?

Another thing is mixing, what should i take into account when mixing drums. I mean does something have to have a higher EQ then another or anything? Also at the moment i'm using VST instruments in cubase so if anyone knows any good plugins let me know smile.gif

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OrganisedConfusi...
post Oct 3 2008, 10:39 AM
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You definitely need each aspect of the drum on a different track so you can mix every aspect. Reverb on Snare is always good.

This post has been edited by OrganisedConfusion: Oct 3 2008, 10:39 AM


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Siggum
post Oct 3 2008, 11:36 AM
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Well it depends on what you are mixing, if you use Addictive drums or Ez Drummer, they will come with presets that should cover the basics of the most common genres, so go easy and take the presets specially if your just beginning to experiment with drums. Good drum vst's :

Addictive drums: Pretty easy to use, quick to load and versatile with good punchy drum sounds.

Ez drummer: Easy to use via the groovebox, sounds are some what more authentic, but in the end its a matter of taste, also its taking a bit longer to load than Addictive drums.

Bfd2: This is a heavy program, over 50gigs of drum samples, i would not recommend this to a beginner. It does have pretty awsome and natural sounding drums, but it's very heavy on your system, and requires more knowledge than the other two.

Go check out some demo's and listen for yourselves.



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Nemanja Filipovi...
post Oct 4 2008, 09:46 AM
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As Siggum sad,Addictive is cool(I use it),BFD2 is more of a professional toy.
Tracking and sting up the channels:
You need only one midi channel,for VST drums if you are making beats with VST drums.Open midi channel(right click add,add midi channel).Press F11 add Adddixtive or EZ drummer or BFD.On the right side add the drums to the midi channel you opened.If you do not haw any ideas of a beat,use the patterns you haw in the drums you haw(yous drag and drop to a midi channel.
EQ:
First you need to do is to send all the channels out to a Cubase mixer.You haw under every set(Kick,snare...)and little arrow(in Addictive).Then you press F3(Cubase mixer) and work
To do EQ,compression and reverbs on drums is alway the hardest things,becouse you haw so much sets and components.
Here's some tips on EQ:)
Kick Drum
For bottom Boost 80-100 Hz
For transient Boost 3 K
For top Boost 6 K
Snare Drum
For boom (tone) Boost 125-250 Hz
For bang (transient) Boost 1-2 K
For buzz (snares) Boost 5 K
Tom-toms
For tone Boost 250-500 Hz
For attack Boost 7 K
Cymbals
For top Boost 10 K
If muddy Cut 200 Hz
High-hat
For heavy rock Boost 500 Hz
Light Boost 5 K
For top Boost 10 K


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Ivan Milenkovic
post Oct 4 2008, 05:42 PM
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Drum mixing is a pretty wide area, that depends on many factors such as gear, or style of music. All VST drums bellow have the option to split drum compontents into different channels, because that's the only way to mix them properly.
Good basic VST's are as Siggum suggested Addictive and EZDrummer. The two are good for everyday use in pilot projects.
Two more serious VST instruments are Bfd2 and Superiour Drummer 2. These two have a lot more options, huge sample base, and advanced humanize algorithms.

Use of all these VST is a bit easier because they contain predefined presets, but in the end, the more you try manually to make your drums sound good in your composition, and know what you are doing you can make great results even with a basic setup of VST drums.


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steve25
post Oct 5 2008, 11:04 AM
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Ok cheers i'll look into these. At the moment i've just been using the default that comes with it. So do you just load it from cubase and the interface will appear inside cubase?

Hmm i'm a little confused, are you saying make a midi track and record all the drum parts in that 1 midi track then split the different parts?
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Nemanja Filipovi...
post Oct 5 2008, 01:13 PM
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QUOTE (steve25 @ Oct 5 2008, 12:04 PM) *
Ok cheers i'll look into these. At the moment i've just been using the default that comes with it. So do you just load it from cubase and the interface will appear inside cubase?

Hmm i'm a little confused, are you saying make a midi track and record all the drum parts in that 1 midi track then split the different parts?

You open midi track,before that you need to loead the VST drums(F11).In the midi track,hold ALT and drag to right.Then click twice and you will get in to a key commander(up sides piano scroll).You make your bits there.Using notes from C1....
Thnen when you do the mix of it all,pres F3 and the Cubase mixer will show up.You will see that you haw Addictive components(Master,kick,snare,tom 1,tom 2.OH,room).Then you do EQ and compression on the separate channels.


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Ivan Milenkovic
post Oct 5 2008, 02:13 PM
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QUOTE (steve25 @ Oct 5 2008, 12:04 PM) *
Ok cheers i'll look into these. At the moment i've just been using the default that comes with it. So do you just load it from cubase and the interface will appear inside cubase?

Hmm i'm a little confused, are you saying make a midi track and record all the drum parts in that 1 midi track then split the different parts?


Yes you load it in Cubase from VST instrument list (F11), and the interface will appear inside just like any other plug.

You make one MIDI track fro drums only. You don't need anything else really. Drums are mapped to certain notes, and all of these drums are usually mapped similar to GM mapping tables, so you have kick on C1, rimshot C#1, snare D1 etc.. The channel splitting is handled via plugin itself. When you open the plug it will create it's own audio tracks. I think all of these plugs will open at least 8 audio tracks, and then in the interface of the drum plugin you route the signals from different components to any track you want.

I would strongly suggest that you go through the manual if you install any of these drums. It is not so hard to read them, you just need to do some light reading, and it will save you a lot of time, believe me.



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Nemanja Filipovi...
post Oct 5 2008, 02:15 PM
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QUOTE (Ivan Milenkovic @ Oct 5 2008, 03:13 PM) *
I would strongly suggest that you go through the manual if you install any of these drums. It is not so hard to read them, you just need to do some light reading, and it will save you a lot of time, believe me.

i agree,manuals and tutorials are always a good way to go.Every time a had a trouble with some thing,I press help.It helped me so many times.


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Rousseau Mannan
post Oct 9 2008, 02:21 AM
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Nice topic Steve. And excellent posts by Ivan & Nemanja. I would like to add a few things to the mixing side of drums. There are few basic techniques of drum mixing. First of all, u should cut off the highs of the kick and cut the lows of snare and cymbals/hi-hats. This will reduce the clash of different frequencies and make your snare and kick sound more focused.

Some people also like to pan different drum parts. Like put the kick to the left snare to the right (not extreme) n toms on both side. It creates a stereo image which makes it sound wider. You can experiment with these to achieve the tone that you want. Also, when mixing a full song with different instruments, its better to mix the drum first then go to bass and other instruments. It gives you more headroom for drum mixing. U can also add a little compression to the kick to make it punchier by playing with the attack or add a little bit of reverb to the snare. Mixing drums could be really fun but it can also frustrate you. Experimenting with different things will improve your skill just like playing guitar. Hope that helps.


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UncleSkillet
post Oct 9 2008, 03:20 AM
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QUOTE (RousseauBABA @ Oct 8 2008, 09:21 PM) *
Nice topic Steve. And excellent posts by Ivan & Nemanja. I would like to add a few things to the mixing side of drums. There are few basic techniques of drum mixing. First of all, u should cut off the highs of the kick and cut the lows of snare and cymbals/hi-hats. This will reduce the clash of different frequencies and make your snare and kick sound more focused.

Some people also like to pan different drum parts. Like put the kick to the left snare to the right (not extreme) n toms on both side. It creates a stereo image which makes it sound wider. You can experiment with these to achieve the tone that you want. Also, when mixing a full song with different instruments, its better to mix the drum first then go to bass and other instruments. It gives you more headroom for drum mixing. U can also add a little compression to the kick to make it punchier by playing with the attack or add a little bit of reverb to the snare. Mixing drums could be really fun but it can also frustrate you. Experimenting with different things will improve your skill just like playing guitar. Hope that helps.



That was also some really good advise.

Thanks man smile.gif


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Nemanja Filipovi...
post Oct 9 2008, 12:02 PM
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QUOTE (RousseauBABA @ Oct 9 2008, 03:21 AM) *
. Experimenting with different things will improve your skill just like playing guitar.

I agree 100 %,best way to learn how to mix in general(besides knowing the basics)is to experiment,and go by the system"listen and work".
I practice every day.I do a minute of a bit(whole drums),and then I try to mix it as best I can.Good exercise is to listen to the other well known artists(how they mixed the kick,snare,guitars....etc)Always compare your mix to a world known artist or just one best known from the music part you are working on.


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