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big harry
post Nov 5 2008, 01:44 PM
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Hi folks

Just for me that i am understanding right this kind of thing

is it possible to say in general

IONIAN = MAJOR
AEOLIAN = MINOR

the formulas are the same in both scales

is this right ?

thx for your answers
Harry
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David Wallimann
post Nov 5 2008, 01:56 PM
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Yeah, you are right.
The Ionian mode is also known as the Major scale.
The Aeolian mode is known as the natural minor scale. :-)




QUOTE (big harry @ Nov 5 2008, 07:44 AM) *
Hi folks

Just for me that i am understanding right this kind of thing

is it possible to say in general

IONIAN = MAJOR
AEOLIAN = MINOR

the formulas are the same in both scales

is this right ?

thx for your answers
Harry



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berko
post Nov 5 2008, 02:06 PM
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And we are saying NATURAL minor (instead of just "minor") because we want to distinguish between NATURAL, HARMONIC and MELODIC minor scales. The latter two are a bit different compared to the NATURAL minor scale

(check more about the harmonic and melodic minor scales on Andrew's theory board if you wish... smile.gif )



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big harry
post Nov 5 2008, 02:45 PM
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QUOTE (berko @ Nov 5 2008, 02:06 PM) *
And we are saying NATURAL minor (instead of just "minor") because we want to distinguish between NATURAL, HARMONIC and MELODIC minor scales. The latter two are a bit different compared to the NATURAL minor scale

(check more about the harmonic and melodic minor scales on Andrew's theory board if you wish... smile.gif )


thx David and Berko for the answers at first
at the moment i am trying to understand the way modes are built, step by step
i will check out Anrews theory board for the special minor scales :-)

as far as i check for now is that for getting to the different modes you need to use the same formula as in tha standard major scale

W W H W W W H

Ionian + W = Dorian + W = Phrygian + H = Lydian + W = Mixolydian + W = Aeolian + W = Locrian + H = Ionian

the scale boxes for all modes are the same just moved to the correct fret ?
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berko
post Nov 5 2008, 03:11 PM
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QUOTE (big harry @ Nov 5 2008, 02:45 PM) *
the scale boxes for all modes are the same just moved to the correct fret ?


That's it! biggrin.gif


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Andrew Cockburn
post Nov 5 2008, 03:13 PM
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That's correct - but don;t miss the importance of the root note of the scale. If you are building relative modes in the way you just illustrated, the root note also changes for each box. For instance, C Ionian moves to D Dorian, moves to E Phrygian etc.

A slightly harder but more rewarding way to vizualize it is to keep the root note the same, and apply the next formula along. Of you play C Ionian followed by C Dorian, you will quickly understand the difference in the modes - its harder with relative modes.


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DeepRoots
post Nov 5 2008, 03:20 PM
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Yeh- i find that to realise what the modes are its good to look at the relative modes of the major scale- but to really grasp them you should compare each one using the same root note and treat each one as a seperate scale- taking note of the shape of each and how they sound.
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BMcG
post Nov 5 2008, 04:06 PM
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Great posts. Knowing the modes in both a parallel and relative is really key. I made the mistake, when I was younger and trying to learn modes, of realizing that D dorian, E phrygian, F lydian, G mix, A aeolian, B locrian shared the same notes with C major, and so the whole thing was no big deal. You know C Major you know the rest. Nothing to learn here, let's move on!!

This was far from the truth. Relative modes are very useful, as it's very helpful to know the B phrygian is the "relative phrygian" to G major, etc., but to learn to construction of the modes in a parallel way it to REALLY know them.

What really kicked my butt, was when my jazz theory teacher in college made us write out (by hand!) all 7 modes in 11 keys (with no key signature, must write in all accidentals), in relative AND parallel! This is 154 scales to write out by hand. This took hours, and many hand cramps, but man did you understand the modes after doing that!

The next semester we had to do the same with melodic and harmonic minor, but that's for another story!

It's also key to group the modes with chord types.

Major: Ionian, Lydian (Major 7#11)
Minor: Dorian, Phrygian, Aeolian, Locrian (Minor 7b5)
Dominant : Mixolydian

This is also a great way to practice the modes. Set up a vamp with your looping pedal (or band in a box, or whatever) on one of these chord types and then improvise over it with the different modes and get a feel for the different colors they provide.

Have fun!
_Bryan

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