Playing Stuff Like Cliffs Of Dover Options

[OrganisedConfusi...]

Ok. Well because I am involved with the Cliffs Of Dover video collaboration I have been playing it a lot today. And I can play my bit now after a lot of practice but outside of my section it is stupidly hard for me to play the song. How do you build up to playing a song like that. I just seem very slow at playing and it makes me really sad as I try so hard to play well but I seem to pick and move my fretting hand ridiculously slowly. How do I build up to a song like that? I am light years away from the intro

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[lcsdds]

Ok. Well because I am involved with the Cliffs Of Dover video collaboration I have been playing it a lot today. And I can play my bit now after a lot of practice but outside of my section it is stupidly hard for me to play the song. How do you build up to playing a song like that. I just seem very slow at playing and it makes me really sad as I try so hard to play well but I seem to pick and move my fretting hand ridiculously slowly. How do I build up to a song like that? I am light years away from the intro

You have to break it down bar by bar, lick by lick and just gradually speed it up. With songs like this a metronome is your friend. How have you been attacking this song?

Monte

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[OrganisedConfusi...]

Just been playing it over and over for 7 hours today lol. Just watching tv and constantly playing the same bloody parts lol. I can play a whopping 30 bars currently

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[lcsdds]

Just been playing it over and over for 7 hours today lol. Just watching tv and constantly playing the same bloody parts lol. I can play a whopping 30 bars currently

Have you been using a metronome?

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[OrganisedConfusi...]

Have you been using a metronome?

No I'm fairly good with timing but I have just been trying to get the 30 bars in my head and knowing the licks first at about the correct tempo. I will use a metronome on those 30 bars now to perfect those bars.

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[lcsdds]

No I'm fairly good with timing but I have just been trying to get the 30 bars in my head and knowing the licks first at about the correct tempo. I will use a metronome on those 30 bars now to perfect those bars.

Sounds like you are doing it correct. Now it is just practice and time!!

Monte

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[OrganisedConfusi...]

Problem is that some parts I can't even consider playing I just don't know where to start. I am seriously the slowest player ever. Any tips on building up solo speed as I really can't pick at all fast

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[lcsdds]

Problem is that some parts I can't even consider playing I just don't know where to start. I am seriously the slowest player ever. Any tips on building up solo speed as I really can't pick at all fast

I have the same problem as you. My picking chops BLOW!!! My legato and tapping is pretty good. I am working like a madman right now to get my picking chops up to speed!! I think the only thing you can do is take on lick at a time a play it slowly. I ususally take maybe one or two bars and play it a about 3 different speeds. Let say I am trying to work a lick up to 150, like on Muris's alternate picking lesson. Since my picking BLOWS I can only play the parts at about 100 bpm before everything starts falling apart. So clean and accurate and comfortable speed is about 80-90 bpm. So what I do is set the metronome at 50 bpm and play a small piece of the lesson, maybe the first 2 bars for 1 minute. This slow speed really burns the motions into your muscle memory. I'll do this for 50 bpm thru 100 bpm increasing by 10 bpm increments. Then I'll move on to the next section and repeat. That way I can get through the lesson in an hour or so. I'll keep doing this until I can get it up to tempo. I know for Muris' Canon rock it took me a couple months to get it up to speed. There were alot of techniques I was not used to, like string skipping. Problem is that if you just keep playing something over and over and keep making the same mistakes then all you are training your fingers to do is make mistakes. Hope this helps a little and sorry for the long winded post.


Monte

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This post has been edited by lcsdds: Nov 24 2008, 03:00 AM

[-Zion-]

no long ago i read an article (which i think was posted here on gmc), arguing about speed being a BY-PRODUCT..

He argued that the speed will almost come automatically when you are confident, secure and know your stuff inside and out.. going back down a few steps and perfecting it at a slower pace, will do this for you..

taking it slow will imprint the movements into your brain, fingers, picking hand, as well as the cleanliness. The speed should follow soon after..

Or so i've read..


Honestly though, i think there are some truth to it.. but you cannot measure your speed without a metronome..

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[Darfuria]

As always: playing slow is the secret to playing fast.

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[Iluha]

Problem is that some parts I can't even consider playing I just don't know where to start. I am seriously the slowest player ever. Any tips on building up solo speed as I really can't pick at all fast

Tremelo pick one open string, surprised at how fast you can pick? Well thats your potential speed, but you probably cant pick so fast when you play notes because hand coordination comes into play.
Work on some picking lessons, they should help you.. There isnt any trick about getting better at picking, which makes it the most annoying technique to learn but also most rewarding.

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[Eat-Sleep-andJam]

Heyy OC,

One thing to keep in mind here is the man behind the music. Eric Johnson's technique is so highly developed OC, so in reality, unless your a really experienced or semi experienced alternate picker, this will be a challenge for you. As mentioned above you need to be patient and take it slow. Eric Johnson didnt get this technical overnight, and neither will you. Learn the parts of the song that you can learn. If you come across a hard part, use the metronome. I would also recomend to watch other covers of other people on Youtube playing the same song. See if you can pick anything up from them, also watch E.J himself playing his own work. I cant access Youtube here at school, but there is a video where E.J talks about pick technique. Watch it. Its very good

Hope that helped, and take it slow !

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[Jose Mena]

Eric Johnson is hard to play, I find his picking patterns hard, 2 notes per string alternate picking is an enemy of mine, I practice it everyday almost, but not comfortable with it at speeds beyond 160 bpm (playing 16th notes), what I do for greater speeds is cheat a little, I might use a little legato here and there, but you need to sit down to analyze where you are going to use the legato, and where it would sound best. I would rather do this that try to alternate pick all the notes and miss most of them, it will sound bad.

Not saying not to practice, practice all you can till you can do it, but if you are playing in the collab, or were to play this song live, make it easier for you.

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[OrganisedConfusi...]

Tremelo pick one open string, surprised at how fast you can pick? Well thats your potential speed, but you probably cant pick so fast when you play notes because hand coordination comes into play.
Work on some picking lessons, they should help you.. There isnt any trick about getting better at picking, which makes it the most annoying technique to learn but also most rewarding.

Unfortunately I can't even tremelo pick quickly on one string I told you I really do suck on guitar.

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[Ivan Milenkovic]

Some things do look light years away, and it is a slow process indeed but it is always shorter than we think, so it is best to learn what you can for now, and just feel comfortable playing that now. Speed will come in time just like anything else. EJ is very tricky with those fast alternate 16th runs, but not for him - he practiced those techniques his whole life, so it's no wonder he can play them so cleanly. If you wanna play it, you must built his technique in roughly the same time he did, so it's no wonder you can't do it in week or so. So don't worry mate, just enjoy the tune, and practice practice practice

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[Guitarman700]

Unfortunately I can't even tremelo pick quickly on one string I told you I really do suck on guitar.

Suck is in the eye of the beholder. Practice! Practice! Practice!

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[Wabba]

Some weeks ago, I had a problem with playing fast, So my dad told my to look the GMC Instructors's right hands when they were playing fast, and a noticed, that the move comes from the wrist, no from the fingers. So it some time to learn the new technicue, but it helped me lot. A practiced first with one-string tremolo, then with 3-notes per string on the high E-string, and then moved to scales. So are you picking from your wrist or from your fingers?

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[OrganisedConfusi...]

Some weeks ago, I had a problem with playing fast, So my dad told my to look the GMC Instructors's right hands when they were playing fast, and a noticed, that the move comes from the wrist, no from the fingers. So it some time to learn the new technicue, but it helped me lot. A practiced first with one-string tremolo, then with 3-notes per string on the high E-string, and then moved to scales. So are you picking from your wrist or from your fingers?

I don't really know lol. I guess if somebody could look at my video in the november challenges and tell me what I do that'd be great as I have no idea

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[FenderBeater]

You have to, as someone said already, take it bar by bar piece by piece. Eric Johnson is a pentatonic demon bro and there's only one person I've heard that can play those boxes as fast with that feeling and that was SRV.

Just the opening solo piece alone at 192bpm is hard enough. And then you have to have a legato feel with it like he has...just crazy and it's why he's the BEST to me.

This was the 3rd song I learned and it took quite a while but I made great gains when I stuck with it. I still having finished the song but that's only because I KNOW I can now after 11 years or so of playing. It won't take that long to learn but I'd work on it for 2 weeks then forget about it for a year, heheh. and so on. When I stuck with it for 6 months I breezed thru it without issues really but I broke it down and did nothing but try and master 2 bars at a time. Only when I got close to his tempo did I try the next two bars etc, etc until I was almost at the end.

Just stick with it and you'll get it, like everything else. One word of advice though..you can't really get into this song unless you have a mighty Strat. It's just not the same, it won't feel the same, it won't sound the same and your confidence won't be the same. I used to play it with my Jacksons and the one guitar I hate..my prestige 1570 Ibanez but it wasn't right and I didn't advance as quickly as when I grabbed the Strat. I just felt more confident playing it thru a Strat and just getting very close to his tone, the bell like chime of a Strat was enough to inspire me more. Nothing like ripping the intro solo and sounding exactly like him..that'd fire me up for hrs.

Some things do look light years away, and it is a slow process indeed but it is always shorter than we think, so it is best to learn what you can for now, and just feel comfortable playing that now. Speed will come in time just like anything else. EJ is very tricky with those fast alternate 16th runs, but not for him - he practiced those techniques his whole life, so it's no wonder he can play them so cleanly. If you wanna play it, you must built his technique in roughly the same time he did, so it's no wonder you can't do it in week or so. So don't worry mate, just enjoy the tune, and practice practice practice

[b]If you wanna play it, you must built his technique in roughly the same time he did/b]

Well said, that's about the smartest thing I've ever heard when it comes to getting something down. Alot don't want to hear that because as humans we ALL want instant results but that's about the size of it.

I like how you are not afraid to say that, for us with experience and alot of years of playing, we know why most don't mention it and don't put it that way. We don't want to discourage anyone but it takes alot of time.

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[Gus]

I think it really worths to have a "challenge" song that you simply love but it seems light-years far away at the moment.

I can give as example when I learned sultans of swing. It took me 4 classes with guitar instructor for him to teach me all. 1 more month to nail down everything but the second solo.

The second solo took me 2-3 more months practicing it every single day to play it up to speed. The fast arpeggios and the preceding part I could only play at 50% tempo in the beginning But after all it was really rewarding to learn it all. And I think practicing this song alone made me a much better player.

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This post has been edited by Gus: Nov 24 2008, 08:42 PM