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OrganisedConfusi...
post Dec 6 2008, 05:25 PM
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QUOTE (Matt23 @ Dec 6 2008, 04:08 PM) *
Even though I really like Satriani's music, I've got to say I really hope he loses this. Nearly every chord progression and melody in the world has been used in more than one song.

It's exactly what I mean. I like Satriani but possibilities on songs are becoming less and less. There is only so much you can do. If people keep suing each other then people will stop writing songs through being scared of being sued by an artist they have probebly never even heard.

It's a shame. I wrote a song once and the intro sounded very much like a song by another local band and we happened to debut the song on the same day at the same gig as them and we just laughed about it and thought it was the strangest coincidence ever and it was nearly an exact copy. It happens and it also sounds like Don't Cry by Guns And Roses and you can play our song over it but nobody would ever say I hope that it was copied from that.

It gets quite depressing when you have to be fearful everytime you write a song. I haven't heard every song in the world so for all I know I could be copying someone.

It's a shame and I hope he loses this as possibilities are becoming less and less.


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Matt23
post Dec 6 2008, 05:45 PM
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It isn't good the amount of suing taht goes on. It's just going to make people scared to do anything.
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FrankW
post Dec 6 2008, 06:27 PM
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QUOTE (OrganisedConfusion @ Dec 6 2008, 04:51 PM) *
I pray Satriani loses. It isn't copyright infringement and if Satriani wins then there will be a lot of bands suing each other over very minor similarities. And yes it always comes down to money with egotistical people like Joe. Coldplay have lots of money and they don't care if some nobody sues them I'd imagine.



There are strict guidelines that define copyright infringement. I don't know what they are, and neither do you. People can't sue each other over minor similarities, but that's for the courts to decide. The fact that the melody in question is in the same key, with the exact same beat and phrasing makes it suspect in my opinion. There are just too many similarities. It doesn't happen too often, either by accident or on purpose. But I think Satch has a legitimate case here. We'll see. Either way, though, this doesn't make Satch a bad guy, OC, take it easy for crying out loud. Why all the nastiness?
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OrganisedConfusi...
post Dec 6 2008, 08:18 PM
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QUOTE (FrankW @ Dec 6 2008, 05:27 PM) *
There are strict guidelines that define copyright infringement. I don't know what they are, and neither do you. People can't sue each other over minor similarities, but that's for the courts to decide. The fact that the melody in question is in the same key, with the exact same beat and phrasing makes it suspect in my opinion. There are just too many similarities. It doesn't happen too often, either by accident or on purpose. But I think Satch has a legitimate case here. We'll see. Either way, though, this doesn't make Satch a bad guy, OC, take it easy for crying out loud. Why all the nastiness?

I'm only nasty when I get annoyed about things. This has really annoyed me as I know many more songs that sound way more similar than those 2 do and the two bands don't sue each other over it.


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showyourfist
post Dec 7 2008, 05:36 PM
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I'd side with satriani.

Listen too the rhythms, they're near indentical.

As he sings, it copies the lead exactly, even when it goes higher at the end, at exactly the same time.


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tommyboy
post Dec 9 2008, 04:52 AM
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QUOTE (OrganisedConfusion @ Dec 6 2008, 01:18 PM) *
I'm only nasty when I get annoyed about things. This has really annoyed me as I know many more songs that sound way more similar than those 2 do and the two bands don't sue each other over it.


What If your wrong, and the courts side with Satch? Will you admit to being a jerk about this issue. I've read both threads on this and your conduct is way out of line. It's one thing to be passionate about your own opinion but to come off as a arrogant S.O.B. does nothing for your argument. I'm done talking with you because obviously you don't give a damn what others think.

You should list your many other other songs that are much closer and similar than this example. I'd love to hear them!

tommyboy

This post has been edited by tommyboy: Dec 9 2008, 04:54 AM


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OrganisedConfusi...
post Dec 9 2008, 10:17 AM
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QUOTE (tommyboy @ Dec 9 2008, 03:52 AM) *
What If your wrong, and the courts side with Satch? Will you admit to being a jerk about this issue. I've read both threads on this and your conduct is way out of line. It's one thing to be passionate about your own opinion but to come off as a arrogant S.O.B. does nothing for your argument. I'm done talking with you because obviously you don't give a damn what others think.

You should list your many other other songs that are much closer and similar than this example. I'd love to hear them!

tommyboy

I can't see it happening but if it did I'd be disappointed in the result. It's not being a jerk taking Coldplay's side or having a different opinion to you. I think Satch is motivated by money and that is why I've been hard on him. I don't think anyone would say I'm arrogant although it did make me laugh as people who know me in real life know how negative I am about myself. I'm totally the opposite of arrogant.

I'm sorry if I offended you and I've never ignored other peoples views. I am alright with people thinking Satch is in the right but I don't think he is. It's as simple as that. I don't think it will ever go to court anyway as I think big bands like Coldplay tend to settle things out of court but you never know. Not many win these sort of cases as it is pretty much impossible to say someone knowingly copied the song. And if the song is too similar. But the Satch melody the first half was aken from another song anyway. I can't remember what it's called but it's on youtube.

And one copy that is particularly annoying is Marilyn Manson - Mobscene copying Faith No More - Be Aggressive. Also Weezer - Hash Pipe exactly uses the same riff as Bryan Adams - Black Pearl.

What song of rolling stones does the Verve have to give money for copying on Bittersweet Symphony or whatever it's called. It copied this song "The Last Time," . Now that is a real rip off and rolling stones won. I think you'll see why I don't think joe and coldplay is quite the same.

This post has been edited by OrganisedConfusion: Dec 9 2008, 10:19 AM


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Moon Boots
post Dec 9 2008, 01:46 PM
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QUOTE (OrganisedConfusion @ Dec 9 2008, 09:17 AM) *
It's not being a jerk taking Coldplay's side or having a different opinion to you.


No...but posting aggressive, personal remarks about a man you've never even met most certainly is.

Whether Satriani is right or wrong we should have the dignity to try to understand his position without resorting to tasteless insults.


Just my 2 cents mellow.gif


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OrganisedConfusi...
post Dec 9 2008, 01:52 PM
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QUOTE (Moon Boots @ Dec 9 2008, 12:46 PM) *
No...but posting aggressive, personal remarks about a man you've never even met most certainly is.

Whether Satriani is right or wrong we should have the dignity to try to understand his position without resorting to tasteless insults.


Just my 2 cents mellow.gif

I wasn't using aggressive personal remarks. I said I hope he loses because he is being a whinging moron. That is just an opinion. I'm not saying he should die or I'll stab him to death or anything like that lol. I said I hope he loses everything because he is whinging. I don't get why everybody is so shocked and appaled by an opinion that isn't that strong compared to how far some go.

And check out the Verve/Rolling Stones songs on you tube. THAT is plagiarism. Then you may realise that the link between Satch and Coldplay is barely anything.


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Moon Boots
post Dec 9 2008, 03:52 PM
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QUOTE (OrganisedConfusion @ Dec 9 2008, 12:52 PM) *
I wasn't using aggressive personal remarks.


I disagree.

These are from the first page:

"Satriani is clearly a money grabbing idiot."

"What an idiot Satriani is."

"Satriani is a money grabbing idiot and I actually detest him now."



Please feel free to discuss the topic but avoid personal insults as it does not contribute to the debate.


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OrganisedConfusi...
post Dec 9 2008, 04:02 PM
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QUOTE (Moon Boots @ Dec 9 2008, 02:52 PM) *
I disagree.

These are from the first page:

"Satriani is clearly a money grabbing idiot."

"What an idiot Satriani is."

"Satriani is a money grabbing idiot and I actually detest him now."



Please feel free to discuss the topic but avoid personal insults as it does not contribute to the debate.

I'm sorry if these came across as aggressive personal insults to you. But calling somebody a money grabbing idiot is just an opinion. Saying he is doing it for the money and if he kept this quiet and did this without talking the case up to the media might have been more respectful. Calling somebody an idiot in the UK is barely anything and you should know this if you live in London biggrin.gif I'm sure you hear real insults given there. It is an insult but I said why I called him that because I think he is doing it for the money. If I said he was an idiot without backing it up then that would be an insult.

To me and in UK this isn't seen as an insult if you back up your claim with reasoning. And it also certainly isn't aggressive as I didn't use any bad language and there was no anger in my tone. I'm just very worried about the outcome of this because if Satriani does win then you can be sure that hundreds of other artists will bring court cases against others and it'll be down to the labels probably as if they see an opportunity for more money they'll go for it.

And then there is the fact of how much does he deserve if he wins. It certainly isn't as blatant as The Verve/Rolling Stones straight rip that the Rolling Stones get 100% royalties for so what does Satch deserve on a sliding scale if he is found to be in the right. I certainly wouldn't say 100%.

I'm sorry if you found me aggressive or insulting to him but to me and where I am from that is not aggressive talk or insulting so sorry if you took it in that light. I just mean be my comments that I don't like the way he is going about this.

I hope you understand smile.gif

Lets just see what happens with the case. I know I'm very interested in the results and very worried about the results and their effects.

This post has been edited by OrganisedConfusion: Dec 9 2008, 04:01 PM


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Zaxerian
post Dec 9 2008, 04:12 PM
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http://www.musicradar.com/news/guitars/joe...-lawsuit-185914

also

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=tnD5laDP8A0&...feature=related

This song is the same as Satriani's... and released before his...

So if Satriani wins maybe this artist should sue Satriani and win smile.gif
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berko
post Dec 9 2008, 04:19 PM
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Here is some additional stuff about the issue. It's been put up a few hours ago on UG.

(I've made my comment in the other thread already)

http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/genera...ay_lawsuit.html

EDIT: Just noticed, it's only a report about the musicradar interview...

This post has been edited by berko: Dec 9 2008, 04:21 PM


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coffeeman
post Dec 9 2008, 04:26 PM
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Before judging I would really like to know what colplay has to say about this.


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OrganisedConfusi...
post Dec 9 2008, 04:30 PM
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QUOTE (coffeeman @ Dec 9 2008, 03:26 PM) *
Before judging I would really like to know what colplay has to say about this.

I think they will keep quiet about it because they have respect for people. Satch shouldn't have spoken to the media like that as it just seems to be getting the media behind him or trying to get people on his side. If he just kept quiet and took it to court then it would have been more respectful. I doubt Coldplay will release a statement unless they have to.


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Martin la guitar...
post Dec 9 2008, 04:32 PM
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QUOTE (OrganisedConfusion @ Dec 9 2008, 04:30 PM) *
I think they will keep quiet about it because they have respect for people. Satch shouldn't have spoken to the media like that as it just seems to be getting the media behind him or trying to get people on his side. If he just kept quiet and took it to court then it would have been more respectful. I doubt Coldplay will release a statement unless they have to.


he tried to keep it quiet but Coldplay never replied...
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OrganisedConfusi...
post Dec 9 2008, 04:34 PM
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QUOTE (Martin la guitarra @ Dec 9 2008, 03:32 PM) *
he tried to keep it quiet but Coldplay never replied...

That's because they probably thought there was no point. That basically says take us to court or leave us alone. What's the point in telling an artist they've ripped off your song. They won't reply so just take them to court. Coldplay have every right not to comment on it and I think it's better they don't as they don't need to.

Satriani didn't need to come out and cry about him being hurt and taking it to court. Just an article saying he is sueing them would have been enough.

This post has been edited by OrganisedConfusion: Dec 9 2008, 04:35 PM


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post Dec 9 2008, 04:35 PM
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QUOTE (coffeeman @ Dec 9 2008, 04:26 PM) *
Before judging I would really like to know what colplay has to say about this.

hehe, this is the post in this thread making the most sense wink.gif it's very very important to hear both sides of the story!


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