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 Chords In Minor Keys
 Feb 18 2009, 04:26 AM Post #1 GMC:er Group: Members Posts: 33 Joined: 11-February 09 Member No.: 6.769 I know how to figure out the chords in a major key. You write out the scale place the sharps where appropriate then use the formula Major, Minor, Minor, Major, Major, Minor, Diminished. Just to use an example i will use C.C = C, Dm, Em, F, G, Am, B diminished But what would the chords be if the Key was C#? Is there also a set formula?
 Feb 18 2009, 04:31 AM Post #2 Learning Tone Seeker Group: Members Posts: 2.054 Joined: 2-September 08 Member No.: 5.825 QUOTE (Becks @ Feb 18 2009, 04:26 AM) I know how to figure out the chords in a major key. You write out the scale place the sharps where appropriate then use the formula Major, Minor, Minor, Major, Major, Minor, Diminished. Just to use an example i will use C.C = C, Dm, Em, F, G, Am, B diminished But what would the chords be if the Key was C#? Is there also a set formula?That formula applies to ALL keys. For C# Major everything just gets moved up a semitone.
 Feb 18 2009, 04:35 AM Post #3 Instructor Group: GMC Instructor Posts: 2.279 Joined: 4-August 08 From: Argentina, Buenos Aires Member No.: 5.625 That's right C# major would beC# - D#m- E#m- F#- G#- A#m- B#dim.But I don't understand the title of the topic "Chords in minor keys"In a minor key would be the same starting on the VI degreeAm would beAm- Bdim- C- Dm- Em- F- G- AmBut as you might know the minor keys uses sometimes the Harmonic minor or most of the time the Melodic minor that turns the IV and V degree into major chords so the cadences are more "strong".Let me know if this helped you -------------------- Check out my Instructor Profile and BoardLIVE VIDEO CHATS EVERY MONDAY AROUND 22PM (GMC HOUR)
 Feb 18 2009, 04:47 AM Post #4 GMC:er Group: Members Posts: 1.310 Joined: 17-April 08 From: Rhode Island USA Member No.: 4.917 Hmm, this whole chord scale music theory is tough to grasp haha --------------------
 Feb 18 2009, 05:02 AM Post #5 GMC:er Group: Members Posts: 33 Joined: 11-February 09 Member No.: 6.769 QUOTE (Ramiro Delforte @ Feb 17 2009, 07:35 PM) That's right C# major would beC# - D#m- E#m- F#- G#- A#m- B#dim.But I don't understand the title of the topic "Chords in minor keys"In a minor key would be the same starting on the VI degreeAm would beAm- Bdim- C- Dm- Em- F- G- AmBut as you might know the minor keys uses sometimes the Harmonic minor or most of the time the Melodic minor that turns the IV and V degree into major chords so the cadences are more "strong".Let me know if this helped you I realized after that the title did not make sense. lolokay that makes sense. I am new to this whole theory thing. There is sooo much to learn and at times its rather confusing. But thanks for the help!one more thing. Would the formula for a minor key be minor, diminished, major, minor, minor, major, major, minor?
 Feb 18 2009, 05:06 AM Post #6 Learning Tone Seeker Group: Members Posts: 2.054 Joined: 2-September 08 Member No.: 5.825 QUOTE (Becks @ Feb 18 2009, 05:02 AM) I realized after that the title did not make sense. lolokay that makes sense. I am new to this whole theory thing. There is sooo much to learn and at times its rather confusing. But thanks for the help!one more thing. Would the formula for a minor key be minor, diminished, major, minor, minor, major, major, minor?Yes it would. Good job!!
 Feb 18 2009, 05:20 AM Post #7 GMC:er Group: Members Posts: 33 Joined: 11-February 09 Member No.: 6.769 QUOTE (lcsdds @ Feb 17 2009, 08:06 PM) Yes it would. Good job!! Fantastic!!! thank you very much!! And Ramiro you used the example with Am, shouldn't there be some sharps in there? This post has been edited by Becks: Feb 18 2009, 05:18 AM
 Feb 18 2009, 05:36 AM Post #8 Instructor Group: GMC Instructor Posts: 2.279 Joined: 4-August 08 From: Argentina, Buenos Aires Member No.: 5.625 Nop, Am is the relative minor of C major so it hasn't any sharps or flatsHere I leave you the link to the Wikipedia entry about the circle of fifths.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circle_of_fifthsThat would be really helpful to memorize and understand how the alterations takes place into any key. This post has been edited by Ramiro Delforte: Feb 18 2009, 05:44 AM -------------------- Check out my Instructor Profile and BoardLIVE VIDEO CHATS EVERY MONDAY AROUND 22PM (GMC HOUR)
 Feb 18 2009, 05:46 AM Post #9 GMC:er Group: Members Posts: 33 Joined: 11-February 09 Member No.: 6.769 QUOTE (Ramiro Delforte @ Feb 17 2009, 08:36 PM) Nop, Am is the relative minor of C major so it hasn't any sharps or flatsHere I leave you the link to the Wikipedia entry about the circle of fifths.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circle_of_fifthsThat would be really helpful to memorize and understand how the alterations takes place into any key.So in a minor key how do you know which notes have sharps??
 Feb 18 2009, 05:56 AM Post #10 Instructor Group: GMC Instructor Posts: 2.279 Joined: 4-August 08 From: Argentina, Buenos Aires Member No.: 5.625 Well if you take a look to the circle of fifths you might notice that the C is in the center because it doesn't have any alterations.If you go to the right of the circle you'll be adding alterations soG major would have 1 sharp F# = Em is like G major starting from ED major would have 2 sharps C# = Bm is like D major starting from BA major would have 3 sharps G#= F#m is like A major starting from F#E major would have 4 sharps D#= C#m is like C major starting from C#B major would have 5 sharps A#= G#m is like B major starting from G#F# major would have 6 sharps E#= D#m is like F# major starting from D#C# major would have 7 sharps B#= A#m is like C# major starting from C#The left part of the circle have the flatted keysF major would have 1 flat Bb = Dm is like F major starting from DBb major would have 2 flats Eb = Gm is like Bb major starting from GEb major would have 3 flats Ab= Cm is like Eb major starting from CAb major would have 4 flats Db= Fm is like Ab major starting from FDb major would have 5 flats Gb= Bbm is like Db major starting from BbGb major would have 6 flats Cb= Ebm is like Gb major starting from EbCb major would have 7 flats Fb= Abm is like Cb major starting from AbLet me know if this claryfies a little bitAll the major keys are related to minor keys and vicevesa. So you'll learn all the major keys and it's relation with the minor keys.The need for other keys began with the begining of the tonality sistem. So the alterations are there to make the exact proportions of the major and minor scale, is an intervalic proportion. Major: 2 2 1 2 2 2 1 (semitones talking)Minor: 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 The alterations are there to make this proportions hapend, I'll give you an exampleC major: C D E F G A B CG major: G A B C D E F G (this scale is not G major because between the F- the seventh degree- and the G -the first degree- there isn't a semintone or half-step so I have to sharp the F in order to get the scale exactly like the C major)G A B C D E F# GNow it has the same proportions. The same happend with all the scales This post has been edited by Ramiro Delforte: Feb 18 2009, 06:02 AM -------------------- Check out my Instructor Profile and BoardLIVE VIDEO CHATS EVERY MONDAY AROUND 22PM (GMC HOUR)
 Feb 18 2009, 03:20 PM Post #11 Instructor Group: Members Posts: 4.565 Joined: 29-March 07 From: Fort Collins, CO Member No.: 1.439 QUOTE (Becks @ Feb 17 2009, 10:26 PM) I know how to figure out the chords in a major key. You write out the scale place the sharps where appropriate then use the formula Major, Minor, Minor, Major, Major, Minor, Diminished. Just to use an example i will use C.C = C, Dm, Em, F, G, Am, B diminished But what would the chords be if the Key was C#? Is there also a set formula?Just wanted to add that the 7th degree (or chord) is really a half diminished chord. If you are talking about 3 note chords, then it is called a diminished triad (Root, min3rd, dim5th) but with the 4 note chords it's only a half diminished: Root, min3rd, dim5th, min7thA diminished 4 note chord would have a diminished 7th instead of a minor 7th. -------------------- www.youtube.com/Wallimannwww.davidwallimann.com
 Feb 18 2009, 04:37 PM Post #13 Instructor Group: GMC Instructor Posts: 7.201 Joined: 14-July 08 From: London UK Member No.: 5.490 QUOTE (Muris Varajic @ Feb 18 2009, 03:31 PM) I believe that diminished only is pretty fine name for diminished triad.However there is a big difference between diminished and half diminished when we talk about 7th chords.I'm saying this because there is no half diminished triadso unless you really forgot to add "7th" there's no chance for confuse,and from what I see here Becks was talking about triads only. Well explained Muris -------------------- Check out my Instructor profilewww.emirhot.comwww.myspace.com/emirhotguitarwww.myspace.com/sevdahmetal
 Feb 18 2009, 04:47 PM Post #14 Instructor Group: Members Posts: 4.565 Joined: 29-March 07 From: Fort Collins, CO Member No.: 1.439 QUOTE (Muris Varajic @ Feb 18 2009, 10:31 AM) I believe that diminished only is pretty fine name for diminished triad.However there is a big difference between diminished and half diminished when we talk about 7th chords.I'm saying this because there is no half diminished triadso unless you really forgot to add "7th" there's no chance for confuse,and from what I see here Becks was talking about triads only. Exactly. :-) -------------------- www.youtube.com/Wallimannwww.davidwallimann.com
 Feb 18 2009, 06:53 PM Post #15 Instructor Group: GMC Instructor Posts: 2.279 Joined: 4-August 08 From: Argentina, Buenos Aires Member No.: 5.625 I agree with Muris When I explained the topic the "triad" was tacit, so the diminished refers to the diminished triad. And that could also be thoutgh because I didn't add any seventh to the other chords. -------------------- Check out my Instructor Profile and BoardLIVE VIDEO CHATS EVERY MONDAY AROUND 22PM (GMC HOUR)
 Feb 18 2009, 11:54 PM Post #16 GMC:er Group: Members Posts: 33 Joined: 11-February 09 Member No.: 6.769 Wow you guys have officially lost me... But thats okay one day i will know all this stuff!
 Feb 18 2009, 11:56 PM Post #17 Instructor Group: GMC Instructor Posts: 8.109 Joined: 13-September 08 From: Nis, Serbia Member No.: 5.892 QUOTE (Becks @ Feb 18 2009, 11:54 PM) Wow you guys have officially lost me... But thats okay one day i will know all this stuff! Which part did you get lost on ? -------------------- My Video Lessons
 Feb 19 2009, 12:17 AM Post #18 GMC:er Group: Members Posts: 33 Joined: 11-February 09 Member No.: 6.769 QUOTE (Pedja Simovic @ Feb 18 2009, 02:56 PM) Which part did you get lost on ?pretty much everything.... i stil am not 100% sure on how to figure out the chords in the minor keys. well i know how to get them but i dont know where to put sharps. And the triad thing they were talking about i dont even know what a triad is.
 Feb 19 2009, 12:52 AM Post #19 Get to da Chopper! Group: GMC Senior Posts: 2.700 Joined: 18-March 07 From: South Wales, UK Member No.: 1.374 QUOTE (Becks @ Feb 18 2009, 11:17 PM) pretty much everything.... i stil am not 100% sure on how to figure out the chords in the minor keys. well i know how to get them but i dont know where to put sharps. And the triad thing they were talking about i dont even know what a triad is. Triad = 3 note chordWhere are the sharps? First you need to know the formula for a minor key is T S T T S T T (where T is a whole tone and S is a semi-tone)Apply that formula to your key of choice- lets use F# : F# G# A B C# D EFrom there- you need to know which type of chord lies on which degree of the scale, for a minor key that is:Iminor IIdiminished IIImajor IVminor V minor VI major VII majorwhen we apply our scale notes to that we then get:F#minor, G# diminished, A major, B minor, C# minor, D major, E major. Sorted!Learning the circle of fifths like Ramiro explained will allow you to memorize this sort of thing so that you can know the notes in a key on the fly- there is an initial bit of work involved though . Until then you can just work it out with the right formula (you'll want to remember the formula for which degree is which kind of chord in a scale though)Hope that was of some help
 Feb 19 2009, 01:01 AM Post #20 Instructor Group: GMC Instructor Posts: 7.201 Joined: 14-July 08 From: London UK Member No.: 5.490 QUOTE (Becks @ Feb 18 2009, 11:17 PM) pretty much everything.... i stil am not 100% sure on how to figure out the chords in the minor keys. well i know how to get them but i dont know where to put sharps. And the triad thing they were talking about i dont even know what a triad is.Triad is the chord that has 3 notes, when you take 1st, 3rd and 5th note from the scale. If you take 1st, 3rd and 5th note from major scale you will get a major chord where the 1st note is the root. If you take the same formula from a Dorian scale you will get a minor chord, etc... Now if you add 7th on top of 1st, 3rd and 5th note then you get a seventh chord. In C major case it would be C maj 7 in C major scale. Moving on to the next mode (D Dorian) you will get D min 7. The whole C major scale haromized looks like this: Cmaj7, Dm7, Em7, Fmaj7, G7, Am7, Bm7b5 and Cmaj7 again. Does this sounds more clear? This post has been edited by Emir Hot: Feb 19 2009, 01:02 AM -------------------- Check out my Instructor profilewww.emirhot.comwww.myspace.com/emirhotguitarwww.myspace.com/sevdahmetal

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