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Tolek
post Mar 12 2009, 08:47 PM
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Hey guys,
I was thinking about getting a keyboard that I can connect to my computer and use for playing VSTs etc. I found some time ago the Magix Music Maker 15 XXL.

What do you think about that deal? About 150 € for a program and a keyboard? Not bad I think.
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ItsMe
post Mar 12 2009, 09:07 PM
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I don't realy like the magix musikmaker. It's more a quick and easy consumer program and doesn't have a good midi editor for example.
If you are on a budget but want to buy something with more posibilities get yourself some cheap Sonar Home Studio (http://www.cakewalk.com/Products/HomeStudio/English/) or Mackie Traction (http://www.mackie.com/products/tracktion3/) and buy this USB controler

http://de.m-audio.com/products/de_de/Oxygen49.html (starts at 110 $)


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Tolek
post Mar 12 2009, 09:15 PM
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Thanks for these tips. The only problem is that it´s too expensive for the moment. I don´t earn any money and don´t get any pocket-money. We´d have to starve if we´d buy those softwares and keyboard. biggrin.gif So, I´m looking for something inexpensive like this Magix product.
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ItsMe
post Mar 12 2009, 09:23 PM
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if you only need a cheap controler without anything else but the keys get this thing for 50

http://keyboards-midi.musiciansfriend.com/...ller?sku=701522

and use reaper, which is free, as you DAW. It's 10 times better sounding and better thought out then Musik Maker

Reaper should support this Controler


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jer
post Mar 12 2009, 09:26 PM
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agreed on magix.

I've used there daw before.

Very limited.

This one includes Ableton Lite. (there is a rebate too if you are looking at monitors)

http://keyboards-midi.musiciansfriend.com/...oard?sku=700932



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Tolek
post Mar 12 2009, 09:28 PM
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QUOTE (ItsMe @ Mar 12 2009, 09:23 PM) *
if you only need a cheap controler without anything else but the keys get this thing for 50

http://keyboards-midi.musiciansfriend.com/...ller?sku=701522

and use reaper, which is free, as you DAW. It's 10 times better sounding and better thought out then Musik Maker

Reaper should support this Controler

I´m using Reaper already. I´m not only looking for a keyboard but also for some VSTs to get the sound. biggrin.gif

I found a few bundles on musicstore.de. They´re not the cheapest, but I could ask my father to pay a part of a bundle as birthday present. laugh.gif
What do you think about those?

QUOTE (jer @ Mar 12 2009, 09:26 PM) *
agreed on magix.

I've used there daw before.

Very limited.

This one includes Ableton Lite. (there is a rebate too if you are looking at monitors)

http://keyboards-midi.musiciansfriend.com/...oard?sku=700932


I´ve already got Ableton (it came together with my POD Studio), but it doesn´t work on my CPU, dunno why. Anyway, I´m using Reaper which is cool. smile.gif The other necessary thing for me are VST´s.
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jer
post Mar 12 2009, 09:43 PM
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what kinds of sounds are you looking for?

Are you wanting to actually play the keys in "real time" as if playing a piano?

You dont need the keyboard to write and edit midi information. Or toplay it back thru VSTs. Thats all in the PC. (you may already know this of course, I dont want to assume)


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Tolek
post Mar 12 2009, 09:48 PM
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QUOTE (jer @ Mar 12 2009, 09:43 PM) *
what kinds of sounds are you looking for?

Everything. biggrin.gif From Piano, over Strings to Sax. I know some free and unfree VST sites, but I didn´t have a closer look at this.

QUOTE (jer @ Mar 12 2009, 09:43 PM) *
Are you wanting to actually play the keys in "real time" as if playing a piano?

Yes, playing live and recording.
Just a quick question: Is it possible to introduce notes via keyboard into Guitar Pro?
And another one. biggrin.gif When I want to create a song, do I have to play that keyboard live (to the backing track) or can I play something and set the rhythm value later?
You get it? biggrin.gif

QUOTE (jer @ Mar 12 2009, 09:43 PM) *
You dont need the keyboard to write and edit midi information. Or toplay it back thru VSTs. Thats all in the PC. (you may already know this of course, I dont want to assume)

Sure, I know, but with the keyboard it´s much easier and faster for me.
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ItsMe
post Mar 12 2009, 09:59 PM
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Hmm when I move back to Germany I will definetly miss the faaaaaar better music stores in the US.
Anyway I don't think these bundels make allot of sense. The cheap fatar is no USB controler but a MIDI keyboard. It has only a midi out. The m-audio keyrig is what you need but I guess you don't want the audio interface.
BTW there are allot of free VST readily availiable on the net

http://www.kvraudio.com/get.php?mode=resul...st=f&q=free just as a starter for searching

check this: http://www.native-instruments.com/index.ph...eplayer&L=2
this is a free version of the native series of vst instruments. it comes with allot of great instrument for example a great acoustic bass. The rest is more synth and electronic stuff but the sounds are as great as in the really expensive comercial versions

and here a nice free piano vst
http://www.yohng.com/piano.html


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Ivan Milenkovic
post Mar 12 2009, 10:12 PM
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keyboard controller is easy Tolek mate, just get the cheapest one you can find. I recommend this:


M Audio KeyRig 49 - 88e

specs:
• four top-quality virtual sound modules: SP-1 Stage Piano, MS-2 Polyphonic Synthesizer, MB-3 Tone Wheel Organ and GM-4 General MIDI

• use stand-alone or with a sequencer
• variable velocity and controller settings
• split and layer modules for performance combinations
• module and master effects processors
• compatible with most popular software
• includes Ableton Live Lite music creation software


Now this costs only 88e. You still have 60e to spend on some VST instrument, and if you could pull out 35e more this could be a nice all in one package for you:


NI Bandstand E - 95e




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jer
post Mar 12 2009, 10:16 PM
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If you are playing the midi controller and getting the sounds from the vsts you would be recording the midi as you played it. Hearing it after it exits the VST.

Once recorded you could easily go back in and move notes that were in the wrong spot, change sounds, whatever you wanted really.

If only we had midi like that for guitars!!!!!

I'd look at native instruments for a VST pack. What I've heard from them sounds great. I dont do much in this realm myself, but I've absorbed some from keyboardists I've played with in the past.

Another thing you can do is get a normal keyboard with a midi out. AND A MIDI IN. Then you can use all the sounds built into the keyboard itself. Saving you from needing VSTs at first. You jsut use the sounds built in. Its like having a midi contrioller and vst all in one box. The downside is if you abandon the built in sounds you paid extra for them and no longer use them.

But you can take it places and play without a PC too....



QUOTE
keyboard controller is easy Tolek mate, just get the cheapest one you can find. I recommend this:


Yep, same one I recommended! smile.gif

I have the predecessor to that one. The Radium 49


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ESP LTD MH-400
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Carvin 50x2 Stereo Tube Amp
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Digitech GSP-1101 Preamp/Effects Processor
Behringer FCB1010 Midi Controlled Floorboard
Behringer Dualfex EX2200
Behinger Stereo EQ
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Saoirse O'Shea
post Mar 12 2009, 10:25 PM
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QUOTE (jer @ Mar 12 2009, 10:13 PM) *
If you are playing the midi controller and getting the sounds from the vsts you would be recording the midi as you played it. Hearing it after it exits the VST.

Once recorded you could easily go back in and move notes that were in the wrong spot, change sounds, whatever you wanted really.

If only we had midi like that for guitars!!!!!

...


To some extent we have midi guitars already jer. I use a Roland GI20/GR2 set up on a Les Paul instead of a Midi keyboard for inputting midi to my pc. I think David and Muris are testing out another midi guitar system at the moment as well - one that's a lot cheaper then the Roland and might make midi guitar as cheap as midi keyboards smile.gif .


Tolek - I'd second ItsMe's suggestion to look at KVR - great site for vsts. Also you may want to take a quick look at this thread.


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Tolek
post Mar 12 2009, 10:26 PM
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QUOTE (ItsMe @ Mar 12 2009, 09:59 PM) *
Hmm when I move back to Germany I will definetly miss the faaaaaar better music stores in the US.
Anyway I don't think these bundels make allot of sense. The cheap fatar is no USB controler but a MIDI keyboard. It has only a midi out. The m-audio keyrig is what you need but I guess you don't want the audio interface.
BTW there are allot of free VST readily availiable on the net

http://www.kvraudio.com/get.php?mode=resul...st=f&q=free just as a starter for searching

check this: http://www.native-instruments.com/index.ph...eplayer&L=2
this is a free version of the native series of vst instruments. it comes with allot of great instrument for example a great acoustic bass. The rest is more synth and electronic stuff but the sounds are as great as in the really expensive comercial versions

and here a nice free piano vst
http://www.yohng.com/piano.html

Thanks for the links. I think I found another VST pack by NI which posted Ivan. smile.gif

QUOTE (Ivan Milenkovic @ Mar 12 2009, 10:12 PM) *
keyboard controller is easy Tolek mate, just get the cheapest one you can find. I recommend this:


M Audio KeyRig 49 - 88e

specs:
• four top-quality virtual sound modules: SP-1 Stage Piano, MS-2 Polyphonic Synthesizer, MB-3 Tone Wheel Organ and GM-4 General MIDI

• use stand-alone or with a sequencer
• variable velocity and controller settings
• split and layer modules for performance combinations
• module and master effects processors
• compatible with most popular software
• includes Ableton Live Lite music creation software


Now this costs only 88e. You still have 60e to spend on some VST instrument, and if you could pull out 35e more this could be a nice all in one package for you:


NI Bandstand E - 95e

Now, that is awesome and really interests me! smile.gif I think I´ll have to do some conversations with my parents. biggrin.gif
Jako hvala lepo! biggrin.gif


QUOTE (jer @ Mar 12 2009, 10:16 PM) *
If you are playing the midi controller and getting the sounds from the vsts you would be recording the midi as you played it. Hearing it after it exits the VST.

Once recorded you could easily go back in and move notes that were in the wrong spot, change sounds, whatever you wanted really.

If only we had midi like that for guitars!!!!!

I'd look at native instruments for a VST pack. What I've heard from them sounds great. I dont do much in this realm myself, but I've absorbed some from keyboardists I've played with in the past.

Another thing you can do is get a normal keyboard with a midi out. AND A MIDI IN. Then you can use all the sounds built into the keyboard itself. Saving you from needing VSTs at first. You jsut use the sounds built in. Its like having a midi contrioller and vst all in one box. The downside is if you abandon the built in sounds you paid extra for them and no longer use them.

But you can take it places and play without a PC too....





Yep, same one I recommended! smile.gif

I have the predecessor to that one. The Radium 49

My little brother has a MIDI keyboard by Korg. A pretty good one! But I have no midi input...
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jer
post Mar 12 2009, 10:27 PM
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QUOTE (tonymiro @ Mar 12 2009, 04:19 PM) *
To some extent we have midi guitars already jer. I use a Roland GI20/GR2 set up on a Les Paul instead of a Midi keyboard for inputting midi to my pc. I think David and Muris are testing out another midi guitar system at the moment as well - one that's a lot cheaper then the Roland and might make midi guitar as cheap as midi keyboards smile.gif .


What I mean is the ability to go in, bump some ill placed notes/chords and tweak all the values of those without effecting sound.

You cant play the midi back thru the guitar and get your amp sounds. (at least I dont think you can) Thats what I'm talking about. So far the guitar midi stuff is just for inputting midi via playing the guitar. Right?


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My Gear

Jackson SL-1 USA Soloist
Jackson DK2M
ESP LTD MH-400
ESP LTD EC-1000
Ibanez Custom S-Series
Martin 001 Acoustic

Handmade Marshall JCM800 50watt head (with mods)
Carvin 50x2 Stereo Tube Amp
Boss GT-10 Preamp/Effects Processor
Digitech GSP-1101 Preamp/Effects Processor
Behringer FCB1010 Midi Controlled Floorboard
Behringer Dualfex EX2200
Behinger Stereo EQ
Line 6 POD with 2.3 upgrade
Line 6 Floor Board
Line 6 Spider III Practice Amp
Nady UHF Wireless


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Tolek
post Mar 12 2009, 10:27 PM
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QUOTE (tonymiro @ Mar 12 2009, 10:25 PM) *
To some extent we have midi guitars already jer. I use a Roland GI20/GR2 set up on a Les Paul instead of a Midi keyboard for inputting midi to my pc. I think David and Muris are testing out another midi guitar system at the moment as well - one that's a lot cheaper then the Roland and might make midi guitar as cheap as midi keyboards smile.gif .


Tolek - I'd second ItsMe's suggestion to look at KVR - great site for vsts. Also you may want to take a quick look at this thread.

I know that topic, thanks anyway, mate! smile.gif
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Bogdan Radovic
post Mar 12 2009, 10:42 PM
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QUOTE (Tolek @ Mar 12 2009, 10:26 PM) *
Thanks for the links. I think I found another VST pack by NI which posted Ivan. smile.gif


Now, that is awesome and really interests me! smile.gif I think I´ll have to do some conversations with my parents. biggrin.gif
Jako hvala lepo! biggrin.gif



My little brother has a MIDI keyboard by Korg. A pretty good one! But I have no midi input...



Hey then you just need something like this (Midi to USB) adapter its around 30$ !! http://www.zzounds.com/item--EMUXMIDI1X1



That way you solved the keyboard problem and just need the VST software!!

This post has been edited by Bogdan Radovic: Mar 12 2009, 10:42 PM


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Tolek
post Mar 12 2009, 10:45 PM
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QUOTE (Bogdan Radovic @ Mar 12 2009, 10:42 PM) *
Hey then you just need something like this (Midi to USB) adapter its around 30$ !! http://www.zzounds.com/item--EMUXMIDI1X1



That way you solved the keyboard problem and just need the VST software!!

Cool, I didn´t know this exists. The only problem is that my brother lives with my father and he surely doesn´t want to give me his keyboard because he plays sometimes on it. Next year, he´ll continue with his keyboard education, so he´ll need it anyway. And that´s why I wanted to buy a simple MIDI keyboard.
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Bogdan Radovic
post Mar 12 2009, 10:46 PM
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QUOTE (Tolek @ Mar 12 2009, 10:45 PM) *
Cool, I didn´t know this exists. The only problem is that my brother lives with my father and he surely doesn´t want to give me his keyboard because he plays sometimes on it. Next year, he´ll continue with his keyboard education, so he´ll need it anyway. And that´s why I wanted to buy a simple MIDI keyboard.


oh I see...Well then Ivan's suggestion of M Audio KeyRig 49 is one to consider ! They are very good quality...


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Tolek
post Mar 12 2009, 10:49 PM
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QUOTE (Bogdan Radovic @ Mar 12 2009, 10:46 PM) *
oh I see...Well then Ivan's suggestion of M Audio KeyRig 49 is one to consider ! They are very good quality...

Sure, that´s why I am motivated to save some money where possible. smile.gif
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Pedja Simovic
post Mar 12 2009, 10:55 PM
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Tolek how good are you at playing keyboard ?
I am asking because I think you should get very simple midi keyboard that has at least 2 octaves. If you are not keyboard played and don't plan to solo all over the place, you don't need more than 2-3 octaves in my opinion.
As far as VST's go, you can find plenty of free ones online using Google, and that is not illegal ! smile.gif


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