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> Time For My New Summer Hobby, Building a bobber chopper!
Sensible Jones
post May 21 2009, 12:25 AM
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QUOTE (AlexLion @ May 20 2009, 06:30 PM) *
btw you must be as cool as Muris if you took guitar at 17!!

If only I was!! I was too busy messing with Bikes to spend too much time with Guitar!! That's why I joined here to take my Guitar a bit more seriously!
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Emir Hot
post May 21 2009, 12:30 AM
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This is Harley from a friend that I sometimes ride. Great machine



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Sensible Jones
post May 21 2009, 03:30 PM
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QUOTE (Emir Hot @ May 21 2009, 12:30 AM) *
This is Harley from a friend that I sometimes ride. Great machine

Nice Emir! Looks like a 'Night Train'!


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Sircraigery
post May 23 2009, 05:33 PM
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Wow this thread has really taken off!!

Really great bikes guys!! I would love to find an old triumph in a barn somewhere, but in Canada, those are few and far between.

And yeah, I'll ned tones of help. I've been riding bikes since I was 5, but this is my first build. The frame is stripped of any cosmetic parts. It's function.

Right now before I cut, I'm trying to get the engine to spark (boo-urns). Neither of the coils are giving spark, so I think my points are bad (good thing they are cheap). Have to check those out today (I LOVE SATURDAYS FOR THIS REASON!!) Hopefully, I'll get the old girl running sometime this weekend, and I can start chopping next weekend.


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(Yes, there are about 10 bikes at my friends house right now haha)

I know it looks dirty and stuff, but that's because it is out of a barn afterall. I cleaned little parts of the engine and it's still nice and shiny under all that dirt. And I do have all the body panels (which are mint other than some sun fading), but I took those off before I took any pics.

This post has been edited by Sircraigery: May 25 2009, 05:18 AM


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Outlaw2112
post May 23 2009, 05:41 PM
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my money pit... tongue.gif

thinking bout gettin a jet ski this year and take over the water
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Sircraigery
post May 24 2009, 08:54 AM
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Sweet bike man!

OK, here's my first trouble, and I need help. First, load this schematic:
Attached File  KZ650_B1_1.pdf ( 838K ) Number of downloads: 122


Next, check out the coils and the points/condenser part of the schematic. As you can see, the 12V comes into the primary coils and runs down to the points/condensors to ground.

When the points are open, there is no ground -> no current -> no voltage to the secondary -> no spark. Correct? (please correct me if I'm wrong).

When the points are open, the current flows and induces a voltage onto the secondary -> spark.

My question is, what is the point of the condensers. I've heard they prevent arcing of the points switch, but it's only 12V. Can this possibly arc?


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USAMAN
post May 24 2009, 09:28 AM
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An ignition system is an ingenious invention. This is how it works.
To make a coil work you must have alternating current (kinda). Ignition coils work on the principle of induction which can only occur if you have three things.
1. Conductor (coils of wire inside the coil)
2. Magnetic field (provided by the 12v in the primary of the coil).
3. Relative motion ( provided by alternating current). Wait .....we have dc...no relative motion.
If you look at alternating current on an oscilliscope (basically a graph) it looks like a sine wave ~~~~~~~.
if you look at dc current it looks like a straight line.


18
12----------------------------------------------------
6
0------------------------------------------------------


In order to make an ignition coil fire they need to provide some relative motion. What they do is turn the power off and on. Each time you tun power off it heads towards 0 volts...thats relative motion. Every time you turn it on it heads towards 12volts that also is relative motion. So the resulting wave form looks like the attached image below.



Which strongly resembles a sign wave. So every time the points open the coil fires as well as every time that the points close.

Now the condesnser is nothing but a simple capacitor. (conductors separated by a diaelectric). The easiest explination is you need it. You points will burn out quickly if you do not have it in the circuit. It prevents an arc flash at the point contacts and helps to provide a quick cascade in the secondary of the ignition coil. The ignition system may function without it .....but not for long.

I didnt check this for typos its 3:30 in the morning.

Peace.

This post has been edited by USAMAN: May 24 2009, 09:38 AM
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Attached File  12_volts.bmp ( 900.05K ) Number of downloads: 97
 


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Toroso
post May 24 2009, 02:04 PM
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Will you be converting to a hardtail? How much trouble is that and is it worth it?


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Jesse
post May 24 2009, 02:15 PM
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Outlaw, what bike is that? It is "friggin" awesome!


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Sircraigery
post May 25 2009, 05:31 AM
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QUOTE (Toroso @ May 24 2009, 02:04 PM) *
Will you be converting to a hardtail? How much trouble is that and is it worth it?


It's going hardtail. And it's more of a hobby for me, so we'll see how 'worth it' doesn't really apply - more so just keeps me busy.

Plus I want an oldschool bike, but can't afford to shell out $70,000 for an Indian Larry build hehe. My total budget for this bike is 2 grand tops on this bike, so that's about 1500 us. And I'll easily reach that since we're painting and doing everything ourselves.

QUOTE (USAMAN @ May 24 2009, 09:28 AM) *
An ignition system is an ingenious invention. This is how it works.
To make a coil work you must have alternating current (kinda). Ignition coils work on the principle of induction which can ....
I didnt check this for typos its 3:30 in the morning.

Peace.


K thanks man. Today I took the points off to file them (I know, bad idea...but it was a temp thing to see if I could get a spark) and I've found that they are pitted fairly badly... Which, I've heard makes arcing much easier.

Now, I tested the condensers with an ohm meter, and I didn't see the normal rising ohms as the cap charges. I remind you, this bike hasn't been working in years, so I figure the caps have dried up. So, no condesers + pitted contacts + anything = no spark.

Just ordered a set of points and condensers off ebay for $20 biggrin.gif

QUOTE (Sensible Jones @ May 20 2009, 03:47 PM) *
You cannot just 'build' a Rat Bike, they evolve!! Just because it's Flat Black doesn't make it a Rat!!!! biggrin.gif biggrin.gif


Yeah, that's true enough I suppose. But I'm all over the retro style.

I'm putting on a sportster tank (been done a million times, but I love that tank), some 10" apes, with the white walls.

What did you do with the oil tank there? I was just thinking of leaving it out, but is there any real benefit to one?

It actually gives me a good idea, I might make a fake one just to hide the electronics inside!

This post has been edited by Sircraigery: May 25 2009, 05:09 AM


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Guitars:
Ibanez Prestige RG2610E [BKP Cold Sweat]
Ibanez Prestige RG2550E [Carbon Fiber Plastics]
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Effects:
Electro-Harmonix Metal Muff
Ibanez Weeping Demon Wah
Boss DR-3 Dr. Rhythym

Amp:
Marshall JCM2000 DSL 401

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Sensible Jones
post May 25 2009, 12:09 PM
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QUOTE (Sircraigery @ May 25 2009, 05:31 AM) *
Yeah, that's true enough I suppose. But I'm all over the retro style.

I'm putting on a sportster tank (been done a million times, but I love that tank), some 10" apes, with the white walls.

What did you do with the oil tank there? I was just thinking of leaving it out, but is there any real benefit to one?

It actually gives me a good idea, I might make a fake one just to hide the electronics inside!


This one has the Electrics in that dummy Oil Tank. There's no benefit that I can think of to having a separate Oil Tank, except perhaps a slight bit of cooling, but totally not a necessity!! An Oil Cooler is a fairly easy conversion on these engines though! We have built a couple of bikes using the Frame as the Oil Tank and also a Streetfighter using the Swinging Arm as the Oil Tank!

As for your 'Points' problem..
I always install BOYER BRANSDEN IGNITION SYSTEMS and DYNA COILS as it's the most reliable Set-up I've come across!! If you go this route remember to buy a couple of Ballast Resistors from Boyer or else the Dyna's will burn the Ignition Module after a while!! (Guess how I found this out!!!!! That was a bloody long walk/push home!!!!)
biggrin.gif biggrin.gif


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Outlaw2112
post May 25 2009, 07:12 PM
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QUOTE (Jesse @ May 24 2009, 02:15 PM) *
Outlaw, what bike is that? It is "friggin" awesome!

Its a 2003 harley softail standard that i customized...

Pm 240 phatail kit, chromed out, raked out the front, changed the lowers to black.. turned out nice and its a one of a kind cause i customized it from scratch to my liking.. I have a skull air cleaner that looks cool

and thanks

heres a pic i took last year at a harley shop in the mountains when we were out riding, i thought it looked cool with the sun going down in the reflection on the windows of the harley shop... too bad i only had my cell phone camera so the quality isnt that good, but its still a cool pic

This post has been edited by Outlaw2112: May 25 2009, 07:15 PM
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AlexLion
post May 25 2009, 09:38 PM
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QUOTE (Outlaw2112 @ May 23 2009, 07:41 PM) *
my money pit... tongue.gif

thinking bout gettin a jet ski this year and take over the water

Look what is written on your pickup front! laugh.gif laugh.gif GMC! I guess it`s Kris truck! biggrin.gif
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Sircraigery
post May 27 2009, 06:50 PM
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Ordered my parts today. SG, I would to buy one of those ignition kits, but they are still going to run about $200 cdn.
If I didn't have to replace the coils already, I would get one. Once I get the bike on the road, I'll be sure to pick one up.

But for points and condensers, I found a GREAT website: partsnmore.com. They specialize in older jap bikes (the best ones around). If you live in Canada, they ship for free, US is standard $5US shipping on your order.

Also, I'm building a table tonight to get this bike off the ground about 1.5-2 ft. I'll post some pics of that when I'm done too. But right now, as far as the bike goes, waiting on my carb kits and ignition parts. smile.gif


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Guitars:
Ibanez Prestige RG2610E [BKP Cold Sweat]
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Electro-Harmonix Metal Muff
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AlexLion
post May 27 2009, 07:11 PM
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Cool, looking forward to see what you come up with!
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playaxeman
post May 27 2009, 07:47 PM
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Honda 1966

restored by an uncle of my wife

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Sensible Jones
post May 28 2009, 11:10 AM
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QUOTE (playaxeman @ May 27 2009, 07:47 PM) *
Honda 1966

restored by an uncle of my wife

Stunning job!!! That was my Dad's first Japanese Bike!!!!
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playaxeman
post May 28 2009, 11:28 AM
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Thx

I will tell uncle Henk, he will like it.



These Honda's are so well build, they will run a life time.


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Sensible Jones
post May 28 2009, 11:33 AM
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QUOTE (playaxeman @ May 28 2009, 11:28 AM) *
Thx

I will tell uncle Henk, he will like it.



These Honda's are so well build, they will run a life time.

ALL Hondas are!!!!! biggrin.gif biggrin.gif


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Sircraigery
post May 29 2009, 06:32 AM
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MORE PHOTOS!!!

Started chopping the frame tonight, so exciting!

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The struts are the angle my exhaust is going to be when finished. I still need to move the swing arm back about 4-5 inches, but this give a good idea.
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Guitars:
Ibanez Prestige RG2610E [BKP Cold Sweat]
Ibanez Prestige RG2550E [Carbon Fiber Plastics]
Ibanez Roadstar II RS-135 [Stock]
Quest Acoustic [Stock]

Effects:
Electro-Harmonix Metal Muff
Ibanez Weeping Demon Wah
Boss DR-3 Dr. Rhythym

Amp:
Marshall JCM2000 DSL 401

'Only the dead have seen the end of the war.' - Plato
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