Collaboration - Slow Neoclassical Solo, FINAL MIX AND COMMENTS Options

[leedbreak]

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I am sorry if I missjudged your playing experience. Saying that you have been playing for 10 yeras (or so) and saying that you've been constantly practicing for 10 years is not the same. Which one of these is true? If the second one is true then you didn't have a well perpared program that would make you sound like a pro as in 7-10 years you should be able to play like a pro. GMC has some great examples of how people here can improve. The one that comes to my mind right now is Superize. Just a year ago he was really a beginner level. Now if you look at his REC takes he usualy gets all 5. You just shouldn't lose continutity in practicing and everything will sit on the right place soon. The fact that "truth can hurt so bad" is sometimes true but believe me that I receive negative comments every single day. I always learn something from each of them unless they come from someone that really doesn't have a clue about music Don't worry too much about that. We are here to help you go the right direction and your job is to practice and impress us

Well, then you judged right, cause like I said I am only counting GMC time as real practice

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[Crazyfret]

Crazyfret (8:43 - 9:48)

I am not sure how long you’ve been playing guitar for but if I knew it would help me better judge your playing. Your main problem is timing and rhythm placement. I used to have the same problem when I first got into soloing. While your melodic ideas were really nice your timing was off nearly throughout the whole take. Every line started somehow before the actual beat. You need to practice with the metronome and follow that beat and the tempo. That will help you tighten up your playing. Take some simple pattern in 8th notes and repeat slowly until you’re 100% aligned with the tempo. Not a single note should be before or after the beat. The rest of your playing was nice. Some lines reminded me of Garry Moore The guitar sound had a good definition but your vibrato is very weak and that gives you hard time in getting the 100% of your sound out. You need to practice vibrato. In this case of ballad feel you need to vibrate in 8th notes against the tempo. That adds a lot into the overall playing impression. Most of your notes were in the correct scale which is good. On 9:45 (ending of the last diminished run) you finished with the wrong note. You stopped on C# instead of D note. There I resolve on Bm chord and the D note is minor 3rd against Bm chord so that would be the right one to go for. Another thing which wasn’t really necessary was your very last note. You already finished unison with the backing and you should have stopped there. That note goes too much into the next take and interferes with Gus’ guitar Also read jafomatic’s and bladzerok’s comments about exporting the mono track for mixing. Not a big deal but it’s a good practice to remember for the next time. You had nice melodic runs just try to practice things I mentioned. Thanks for collaborating

Hi Emir

Thanks for your comments, very constructive and honest

You'll probably be suprised that I've been playing, or should that be I've had a guitar since 1989! So been playing / mucking about for nearly 20 years! I know I'm in comparison a poor guitarist I no longer have a band to play in and its only through this site that I've been able to get back into some form of playing / practicing.

I was a little disapointed to hear my timing is off it was something I was reasonably good at albeit being mainly a rhythm guitarist. It obvious now that I need to sit down and do some serious practicing again!!

My vibrato is weak and is something I'm working on but with winter approaching I should be able to dedicate more time to improving.

I welcome any advice you give and suggestions for lessons you reccommend will help. I have to be honest and say I find practicing with a metronome very dull but if you know any way of keeping me interested and motivated I'm all ears.

I've a couple of lessons lined up atm which I'm going to learn one of them being your neoclassical lesson as it was a challenge with the diminished runs, even though I messed it up in this collab. I find the choice of using different scales helps to give fresh ideas.

Thanks again

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[jafomatic]

I have to be honest and say I find practicing with a metronome very dull but if you know any way of keeping me interested and motivated I'm all ears.

If the metronome is too obnoxious, find another time keeper. A looped drum track, or even a delay unit synched to bpm and set to quarter notes, eighth notes, whatever you prefer.

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[Emir Hot]

Hi Emir

Thanks for your comments, very constructive and honest

You'll probably be suprised that I've been playing, or should that be I've had a guitar since 1989! So been playing / mucking about for nearly 20 years! I know I'm in comparison a poor guitarist I no longer have a band to play in and its only through this site that I've been able to get back into some form of playing / practicing.

I was a little disapointed to hear my timing is off it was something I was reasonably good at albeit being mainly a rhythm guitarist. It obvious now that I need to sit down and do some serious practicing again!!

My vibrato is weak and is something I'm working on but with winter approaching I should be able to dedicate more time to improving.

I welcome any advice you give and suggestions for lessons you reccommend will help. I have to be honest and say I find practicing with a metronome very dull but if you know any way of keeping me interested and motivated I'm all ears.

I've a couple of lessons lined up atm which I'm going to learn one of them being your neoclassical lesson as it was a challenge with the diminished runs, even though I messed it up in this collab. I find the choice of using different scales helps to give fresh ideas.

Thanks again

You didn't mess up The purpose of these collaborations is to help you realize things you should work on. Many people often see collaborations as competition. That's absolutely wrong. If you read some previous comments on instructors collaborations you will see that we all make many mistakes. Have a look at this one that I led before If you say that your timing is ok while playing rhythm that's great and I believe it is. With soloing is different as you're involving many techniques which obviously means that you nees much more concentration as there are more things to thing of at the same time. About the metronome practicing Jafomatic replied just as I would tell you. Take some phrase and repeat slowly until you perfectly align with the tempo. When you're ready speed up 10bpm and start again. I do that many times when I am learning something new. Your solo had nice melodies and you know how to play but I am only talking about the things that will help you improve. Thanks for joining and feel free to ask any questions, we're all here to help

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[Crazyfret]

That's absolutely wrong. If you read some previous comments on instructors collaborations you will see that we all make many mistakes. Have a look at this one that I led before

Lol I see your point Btw who teaches the teacher?

I find I get a lot out of these collaborations, esp the comments from the instructors and to hear the vast array of interpretations to a backing track which does offer up some really cool stuff like this one for example I think the playing was of a high order. You're spot on saying about the timing issue for lead work being more demanding than for rhythm playing

I need to take a leaf out of Supersize's book as you correctly said his playing has really come on in the last 6-8 months and its all down to old fashioned practice.

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[Emir Hot]

I need to take a leaf out of Supersize's book as you correctly said his playing has really come on in the last 6-8 months and its all down to old fashioned practice.

Yes, he really improved a lot.

It is also true that we can all learn from other takes. Each take has something very nice about it. Even I can pick some cool stuff from these but I'm not going to tell when I do

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[audiopaal]

Even I can pick some cool stuff from these but I'm not going to tell when I do

Hehe

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[maharzan]

Yep, creative ppl never unveil their source(s). haha.. nicely said Emir.

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[Emir Hot]

Yep, creative ppl never unveil their source(s). haha.. nicely said Emir.

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[Sensible Jones]

Sensible Jones (6:33 - 7:38)

Nice ideas Jones. Very nicely organized solo but there are things that you can improve. You played all correct notes but many of your runs were sloppy. Some of them were completely displaced from the actual rhythm and that just doesn’t sound right. I heard exactly what your great ideas were but they would make more sense only if you played them on the correct spot. You need to practice your licks slowly. Once you’re 100% sure that you’re doing great then you speed it up until you reach the tempo you need. The first sloppy one was 6:41-6:43. Very common neoclassical lick but you slipped a little. The next one was on 7:12. You played one unnecessary note before the actual expected pattern. That first note displaced the whole line and the whole run sounded off beat. That’s the place where many of you went unison with the backing – on the long drum fill over F# chord. On 7:25 you had some scratches just before the diminished run. They sounded like you didn’t know how to start that pattern and you went faster with the diminished line which sounded rhythmically displaced. All nice ideas and great note choice but many times not rhythmically correct. The ending was good with that little trill. The other thing I want to say is your sound. It’s too trebly and too distorted. Just tweak it with the EQ and gain. Take out some treble and put less gain. The basic sound definition was good. The last thing but not less important is your vibrato which is nearly flat. I mentioned that in previous comments. Vibrato is one of the most important ingredients for a good soloing that every player should use whenever there is a long note. Read audiopaal’s comment regarding the vibrato. Your overall playing is good and your melodic ideas are great. Just work on the things mentioned and you can become a good guitarist. With your talent I see no reason why you can’t get there soon. Nice work overall.

Thanks for the positive feedback Emir!!
It's very encouraging for me as this is the first time I've played this style of Lead!!
I shall continue using the backing to practice all the things you've mentioned!!
Unfortunately the only way I have of recording at the moment is running my Live Rig into the PC and using Audacity. I have some latency issues with the PC. (That's not an excuse for MY poor timing though!!! )
Believe it or not that particular patch was a Factory set 'Yngwie' sound and didn't sound too bad through my Monitors.
I can't wait until my Bro has finished building my new PC and I can start using a proper DAW to record!!!
Again, thanks for this backing as i really enjoyed the challenge!!

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[Emir Hot]

Thanks for the positive feedback Emir!!
It's very encouraging for me as this is the first time I've played this style of Lead!!
I shall continue using the backing to practice all the things you've mentioned!!
Unfortunately the only way I have of recording at the moment is running my Live Rig into the PC and using Audacity. I have some latency issues with the PC. (That's not an excuse for MY poor timing though!!! )
Believe it or not that particular patch was a Factory set 'Yngwie' sound and didn't sound too bad through my Monitors.
I can't wait until my Bro has finished building my new PC and I can start using a proper DAW to record!!!
Again, thanks for this backing as i really enjoyed the challenge!!

Thanks for playing with us Regarding the sound, if it's written Yngwie, believe me that doesn't mean anything Yngwie's gear doesn't fit in a 200£ box. You have to have his pickups, preams etc... in order to get something similar. I am sure your unit can produce good sound but you need to make it yourself. I used to have one Behringer multi effect full of presets. I tried SRV sound and after 3 chords strummed I instantly deleted all factory presets. They just pay people to put their name in, it's got nothing to do with the sound. Just listen which drive sounds warm and if you have enough sustain. That's how I do it.

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[Sensible Jones]

Thanks for playing with us Regarding the sound, if it's written Yngwie, believe me that doesn't mean anything Yngwie's gear doesn't fit in a 200£ box. You have to have his pickups, preams etc... in order to get something similar. I am sure your unit can produce good sound but you need to make it yourself. I used to have one Behringer multi effect full of presets. I tried SRV sound and after 3 chords strummed I instantly deleted all factory presets. They just pay people to put their name in, it's got nothing to do with the sound. Just listen which drive sounds warm and if you have enough sustain. That's how I do it.

I know what you mean about the presets, most of them aren't usable! The thing with that one is that if I'm in the Rehearsal Room or similar then it sounds alright when you're actually driving it hard.
The unit is a fairly old Zoom 9150 that I've had for ages. It has a valve preamp side first so that it's very warm sounding when driven but at low recording type levels it's sound seems to come more from the digital side which as bit of a pain!!
I've just picked up some of my old Gear from where it was being stored so I have a Zoom 9030 which I will try running through for recording and see if that's any better!!

Funny you mention SRV and Behringer as the SRV Patch on my V-amp is about the only decent one on there!!!!

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[Nimrandir]

Nimrandir (3:19 – 4:24)

This take is excellent. Great control and great ideas. You attached dry guitar because you were not sure about the sound but I think your sound works great over this backing track. Maybe just a little less bass frequency. You also mentioned some timing issues but that’s almost impossible to notice so I won’t take it as an important issue. You are one of rare in this collaboration that had good vibrato. Very nicely controlled and executed where needed. You really sound like very experienced player. I don’t know how you sound with faster shred stuff but in this kind of soloing you did a great job. Phrasing and note choice are very tasteful. There were some small trills in some of the melodic lines which added excellent taste to your melody. I almost don’t have anything else to say apart from well done. Next time just export mono take instead of stereo. Your dry take was mono but this one wasn’t. Great work Nimrandir.

Thanks Emir, I'm really flattered
Sorry about stereo track, as I've mentioned this is my first recording and first collab, so I didn't know that I need to export mono (I've exported dry to mono because in stereo it was panned completely to one side ).
As for shred - I'm not very comfortable there yet, but it is my goal, and I'm slowly moving towards achieving it

Thanks for the comment and for this collab - I really liked that the backing has all those key changes and some brainwork was needed to come up with something which sounds ok

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[Emir Hot]

Thanks Emir, I'm really flattered
Sorry about stereo track, as I've mentioned this is my first recording and first collab, so I didn't know that I need to export mono (I've exported dry to mono because in stereo it was panned completely to one side ).
As for shred - I'm not very comfortable there yet, but it is my goal, and I'm slowly moving towards achieving it

Thanks for the comment and for this collab - I really liked that the backing has all those key changes and some brainwork was needed to come up with something which sounds ok

Thanks for your great take. About the export just click mono option in the export dialog box, that should help. You should also record mono as that's how we all do it in real life

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[Oubollig]

Hi Emir,

Thanks for the comment, I appreciate the work you put into this

As for the wrong notes, I actually did all of it by ear and only after reading your comment I checked the theory behind my take but still I don't fully understand what I did wrong. I think I understand now that the A major chord didn't belong over the E/G# chord, because in E phrygian the chord would have been A minor(7). However, the E chord in Bminor key would have been Dorian as it's the 2nd mode and B aeolian the 6th right? My A major chord would be wrong anyway, but I don't understand why I should play E phrygian when in the key of Bminor the phrygian mode is F#. Or you switched key, but to me it doesn't sound like you did Also you say I could have played E7 arpeggio but that's dorian again, not phrygian, if I understand?
The next wrong part at 5:02 - 5:05, I'm really quite sure I played A, A#, C#, B there, where the A was intended as a passing note. However I meant to use B harmonic minor, and was not really thinking about modes at all. I used harmonic minor because you said I could use Bminor all the way to E/G#, so I assumed I could use harmonic minor as well. I didn't think about the C# in between though.
At the end I did the same but as it was descending I used A first... However, I don't understand why I should play an A#. Doesn't F# phrygian have the same notes as Bminor; F#, G, A, B, C#, D, E, F#?

It's true I do not play tight enough a lot of the time, but it's hard

Thanks again,

Joost

EDIT: By the way, I used stereo as well, sorry about that

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This post has been edited by Oubollig: Sep 2 2009, 08:13 PM

[Emir Hot]

Hi Emir,

Thanks for the comment, I appreciate the work you put into this

As for the wrong notes, I actually did all of it by ear and only after reading your comment I checked the theory behind my take but still I don't fully understand what I did wrong. I think I understand now that the A major chord didn't belong over the E/G# chord, because in E phrygian the chord would have been A minor(7). However, the E chord in Bminor key would have been Dorian as it's the 2nd mode and B aeolian the 6th right? My A major chord would be wrong anyway, but I don't understand why I should play E phrygian when in the key of Bminor the phrygian mode is F#. Or you switched key, but to me it doesn't sound like you did Also you say I could have played E7 arpeggio but that's dorian again, not phrygian, if I understand?
The next wrong part at 5:02 - 5:05, I'm really quite sure I played A, A#, C#, B there, where the A was intended as a passing note. However I meant to use B harmonic minor, and was not really thinking about modes at all. I used harmonic minor because you said I could use Bminor all the way to E/G#, so I assumed I could use harmonic minor as well. I didn't think about the C# in between though.
At the end I did the same but as it was descending I used A first... However, I don't understand why I should play an A#. Doesn't F# phrygian have the same notes as Bminor; F#, G, A, B, C#, D, E, F#?

It's true I do not play tight enough a lot of the time, but it's hard

Thanks again,

Joost

EDIT: By the way, I used stereo as well, sorry about that

Hi

I am trying to think of all this now but you gave me too many informations Can we meet in chat and I'll explain it to you. I'll play your take and tell you exactly every single line. It is good that you did analisys of all that so we can better understand each other. Regarding your playing it was very nice. I was just talking about the note choice. Let me know on PM when can we meet and we can go in the other chat room if the main one is too busy. Cheers

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