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> Matt23's Mtp Thread, All assignments and uploads here
Pedja Simovic
post Sep 11 2009, 08:01 PM
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QUOTE (Matt23 @ Sep 11 2009, 08:49 PM) *
Thanks for that detailed reply Pedja smile.gif, I think I understand it, but I have a question. Should Cb not be B, to avoid 7 flats, and should C# not be Db to avoid 7 sharps?


Good questions!
Shouldn't Gb be F#? smile.gif
It is what it is... I actually had the same question going in my head years ago when I was starting with this (probably 12 years ago to be exact smile.gif. It popped to my mind the same thing, why call it Cb instead of B or C# instead of Db etc... I heard 3 things that I accepted today and teach my students that should help you as well.

1) In classical music pieces, key of the piece is very important as it sets the mood. Classical composers would argue with you all day that F# doesn't sound the same as Gb or C# doesn't sound the same as Db. To us it may just seem as enharmonic spelling, to them its much more. So I learned to deal with it. Also, classical music uses more sharp oriented keys because of orchestration purposes!

2) Jazz music is written by cycle 4, classical is in cycle 5!

3) Enharmonic spelling. Accept it as that, deal with it and its all good smile.gif



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Matt23
post Sep 11 2009, 08:07 PM
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Ok, fair enough, I'm prepared to accept it, but does noone really do the way I'm suggesting, because it seems more logical to have less sharps/flats in a key signature.

Also to "Shouldn't Gb be F#?", I didn't think so because changing Gb to F# and vice versa would have the same number (6) of sharps/flats in the key signature.
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Pedja Simovic
post Sep 11 2009, 08:10 PM
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QUOTE (Matt23 @ Sep 11 2009, 09:07 PM) *
Ok, fair enough, I'm prepared to accept it, but does noone really do the way I'm suggesting, because it seems more logical to have less sharps/flats in a key signature.

Also to "Shouldn't Gb be F#?", I didn't think so because changing Gb to F# and vice versa would have the same number (6) of sharps/flats in the key signature.


Well here is a simple explanation for you in that case. Major scale has 7 different notes right? C D E F G A B , correct?
In order for systems and cycles to work, we have to eventually use all the sharps (for all 7 notes) as well as all the flats (for all 7 notes). Only then this system makes sense - in my head at least. Why would go to 3,4,5,6 but not 7 sharps? smile.gif


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Matt23
post Sep 11 2009, 08:12 PM
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Because it is easier to read music with less sharps/flats in the key signature.

I agree that with the cycles and everything it makes more sense with 7 sharps/flats, but surely in actual music that's not the easiest thing to play.
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Pedja Simovic
post Sep 11 2009, 08:21 PM
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QUOTE (Matt23 @ Sep 11 2009, 09:12 PM) *
Because it is easier to read music with less sharps/flats in the key signature.

I agree that with the cycles and everything it makes more sense with 7 sharps/flats, but surely in actual music that's not the easiest thing to play.


I see your point but as guitar player, you just look at accidentals in the first line and you are done! You use same exact fingering for all 12 keys of major scale so nothing changes. It is of course another thing if you had to sight read a piece that goes outside of key using accidentals that don't belong in original key. That is when things get messy smile.gif But that's because all people who read music have really strong sight reading skills. It is very useful ability to have when reading music smile.gif


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Matt23
post Sep 11 2009, 08:23 PM
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Ok, I'll have another go at answering those questions now.
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Pedja Simovic
post Sep 11 2009, 08:31 PM
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QUOTE (Matt23 @ Sep 11 2009, 09:23 PM) *
Ok, I'll have another go at answering those questions now.


Ok Matt, I am in chat right now, you can join me there if you want.


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Matt23
post Sep 11 2009, 08:38 PM
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1) What is cycle 4 and cycle 5 in harmony?

Answer: Cycle 4 is a way of finding key signatures that contain flats by going up in perfect fourths. If you started at C (no flats), then up a fourth would be F. A fourth from F is a B, but to make that a perfect fourth, it must be dimished, so the key signature for F is Bb. At Bb up a fourth is E, which again you need to diminish to make a perfect fourth from Bb, so the key signature for Bb is Bb and Eb. You keep doing this until you reach C again, so all the key signatures that contain flats are:

C:
F: Bb
Bb: Bb, Eb
Eb: Bb, Eb, Ab
Ab: Bb, Eb, Ab, Db
Db: Bb, Eb, Ab, Db, Gb
Gb: Bb, Eb, Ab, Db, Gb, Cb
Cb: Bb, Eb, Ab, Db, Gb, Cb, Fb

Cycle 5 is the same, but you go up in perfect fifths, to find all the key signatures with sharps. So if you start at C, then up a 5th is G. To make G major you have to augment the 7th so the key signature is F#. You carry on doing this back to C.

C:
G: F#
D: F#, C#
A: F#, C#, G#
E: F#, C#, G#, D#
B: F#, C#, G#, D#, A#
F#: F#, C#, G#, D#, A#, E#
C#: F#, C#, G#, D#, A#, E#, B#

2) How many keys with sharps do we have in music? What about keys with flats?
Answer: 7 with flats, 6 with sharps.

4) What is the shortcut we use to move through cycle 4? What about cycle 5?
Answer: I think I answered this in my first question. That you always keep the sharp/flat from the key before, and augment the 7th (cycle 5), or diminish the 4th (cycle 4).
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Pedja Simovic
post Sep 11 2009, 08:49 PM
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All great Matt, you got it. Just small correction, 7 keys with flats and sharps! wink.gif


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Matt23
post Sep 11 2009, 08:50 PM
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Oh yeh. Must have forgotten how to count for a second then. smile.gif
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Pedja Simovic
post Sep 11 2009, 09:08 PM
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No big deal, by now I am positive you have learned all the assignments. When your finger fully recovers please record alternate picking examples. I will in the meanwhile post you some useful links in this thread (from chat tonight).


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Matt23
post Sep 15 2009, 08:37 PM
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Here's a take of the 5th exercise at 60, 80 and 100bpm. smile.gif
Attached File(s)
Attached File  Exercise_5.mp3 ( 471.21K ) Number of downloads: 53
 
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Pedja Simovic
post Sep 16 2009, 02:33 PM
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QUOTE (Matt23 @ Sep 15 2009, 09:37 PM) *
Here's a take of the 5th exercise at 60, 80 and 100bpm. smile.gif


This is sounding very good Matt, well done. At some points you seem to be ahead of tempo but you will fix that by playing this one more and more. When can I expect other examples?

Later today I will post some listening examples for you here (Youtube videos).


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Matt23
post Sep 16 2009, 06:09 PM
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I am quite busy atm but I should be able to get some more up today.
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Pedja Simovic
post Sep 16 2009, 06:55 PM
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QUOTE (Matt23 @ Sep 16 2009, 07:09 PM) *
I am quite busy atm but I should be able to get some more up today.


Excellent Matt!

I will check the thread later tonight (after 11pm).


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Matt23
post Sep 16 2009, 08:01 PM
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Here's another recording of the exercises. I had a go at the first 4 very slowly (50bpm), and again I did the last one at 60, 80 and 100bpm.
Attached File  AP_Exercises_160909.mp3 ( 1.89MB ) Number of downloads: 49
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Pedja Simovic
post Sep 16 2009, 09:46 PM
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QUOTE (Matt23 @ Sep 16 2009, 09:01 PM) *
Here's another recording of the exercises. I had a go at the first 4 very slowly (50bpm), and again I did the last one at 60, 80 and 100bpm.
Attached File  AP_Exercises_160909.mp3 ( 1.89MB ) Number of downloads: 49


It is going well Matt. Your 3rd example, you are playing wrong notes in that one. Whole example is in key of G major or D mixolydian !


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Pedja Simovic
post Sep 17 2009, 11:55 AM
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Matt,

I will be gone today from my town, back tomorrow. In the meanwhile I want you to keep working on 5 alternate picking examples and record them. I hope your hand is getting back to normal. I expect 3 tempos (60 80 100 bpm for example) for all 5 exercises. Record them and upload them all in this thread. If you finish that I will give you more examples for alternate picking.
As extra assignment, read through all my theory and harmony posts on my board. I will give you short tests with very specific questions in couple of days.

Let me know if you need any help,

Pedja


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Matt23
post Sep 17 2009, 03:52 PM
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Ok. smile.gif
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Matt23
post Sep 17 2009, 05:34 PM
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Here's all of the exercises at 60, 80 and 100bpm.
Attached File(s)
Attached File  AP_Exercise_1.mp3 ( 772.46K ) Number of downloads: 33
Attached File  AP_Exercise_2.mp3 ( 740.39K ) Number of downloads: 34
Attached File  AP_Exercise_3.mp3 ( 898.56K ) Number of downloads: 38
Attached File  AP_Exercise_4.mp3 ( 480.84K ) Number of downloads: 32
Attached File  AP_Exercise_5.mp3 ( 464.59K ) Number of downloads: 34
 
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