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> Emu 1616m?
OzRob
post Apr 12 2010, 02:51 AM
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QUOTE (tonymiro @ Apr 10 2010, 11:37 PM) *
Absolutely - also some video cards, particularly the newer high spec 'gamer' type ones have a habit of getting in the way of audio work and bluetooth is a real pain IME.

If you have a lot of hardware on the pc watch the bootup sequence as video and a few others usually takes a lot of juice on power-up and can stop an audio card initialising properly.

If you can't run a pc dedicated to audio the next best thing is dual boot and set up a specific hardware profile for audio. I'd also go so far as to suggest that you consider killing all non-audio apps, particularly virus guards and the like and keep the pc away from the Internet.


Tonymiro, there are some great tips there. Thank you. I'm upgrading soon to a real workhorse machine and your suggestion will help me set it up properly right from the start. Thanks again.



Ps. Is anyone running E-mu cards under Windows 7 64-bit? If so, any known hassles? Edit: I've been googling the topic and it does appear that only Vista 64 is supported and there are hassles under W7 64.

This post has been edited by OzRob: Apr 12 2010, 03:08 AM


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antonskv
post Apr 12 2010, 07:36 AM
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QUOTE (OzRob @ Apr 11 2010, 09:51 PM) *
Tonymiro, there are some great tips there. Thank you. I'm upgrading soon to a real workhorse machine and your suggestion will help me set it up properly right from the start. Thanks again.



Ps. Is anyone running E-mu cards under Windows 7 64-bit? If so, any known hassles? Edit: I've been googling the topic and it does appear that only Vista 64 is supported and there are hassles under W7 64.



Since I've been researching this very subject a lot, i can recommend using OS that E-MU officially supports with stable drivers. (I say stable, cause EMU has drivers for Vista and Win7 (including 64-bit ones) in beta stages.) Yesterday, or actually today... I myself just got this device working under these conditions and I'm very happy with it.

Though I'm very new to this interface, and I've had my share of problems setting it up, final result is way BEYOND my expectations. Great sound quality and lack of noticeable latency is such a breath of fresh air after USB-bus interface. I feel after i master "PatchMix DSP" software this interface will become my favorite interface for many years to come. Sound quality and processing power of this interface is way beyond my expectations. I'm highly pleased with it. (No matter how small size i use for a buffer, it seems to keep it's sound quality without any cracking and buzzing which is what happens on USB interface I've had before).

As you can read for other posts, i implemented Tonymiro's advise and configured my workstation with EMU being single sound device installed. And this interface performs really good as regular sound card for day-to-day computer use. I listen to all movies with high quality sound through my Studio Monitors. And once i disabled on board sound and removed Sound Blaster PCI card, no problems have arisen anymore.

Most likely I've read many of same posts that you have about EMU problems. I've noticed a lot of them reported same driver crashes type of problems that I've had (read above about blue screen). I think that a lot of them face a problem that is not very well described in the official documentation (I say 'i think' cause i have not read whole doc yet, its quite large), simple fact that this interface does not perform well at all with any kind of other sound devices being installed in OS at the same time. A lot of small details might be overlooked in some of the posts - i mean not every single poster and responder is a professional hardware/software technician. So there are details posters in other forums might've overlooked, especially since i have not seen many answers about removing all other sound cards in posts outside of Staffay's and Tonymiro's advices (or maybe i have not searched thoroughly enough 'cause i've got my EMU working relatively fast for a interface of this complexity - 24 hours and it was all working). But i think I've seen some Win7 related posts about driver problems, not just XP/Vista ones, so i think you'll might end up having problems on Win7(64) as well.

I know that you probably want 64-bit OS running, since 64-bit OS supports much more RAM than a 32-bit one (which has a limit of 3.0 or 3.5 GB available for operation within the OS). This is something i have pondering myself, since i have more than 3GB to install, but i cant since when i have 4GB inside the box on 32-bit OS 'causes unpredictable problems during run time.

One of the questions i have asked myself in the past... "Do you want to purchase a interface which costs almost $500 to realize that your computer cannot function with it?" Its a very uncomfortable feeling... he he smile.gif This is what stopped me from blowing almost $1000 on MOTU interface that everybody around here is boasting, since MOTU users here are Mac users 100%, i don't think i know a single one on PC. I went through few other interfaces which worked worse on my comp than UX1, though FireWire interfaces should theoretically work better than USB ones. For example PreSonus "FireBox" worked so bad on my comp that i returned it the next day, but reviews for this box were great.... My thoughts as of 'why'? All Mac users.

Though i don't think this will be the problem with this interface on Windows. I think you'll get a excellent deal on a best interface you can get for a PC, 'cause i don't think it gets any better than this one. (At least in this price range)

But for SEPARATE workstation:

But i think since you planning to build a separate workstation for audio work, you have nothing to loose by trying it on 64-bit system first. See when you get it, install fresh 64-bit OS and install EMU drivers before any other hardware, and get it functioning. Once it all functions - add each piece of hardware one by one, doing a restart and test of EMU in between: reason is that if any conflicts appear you'll see exactly which hardware makes the conflict. This is the way i found about my other sound card conflicting with EMU. (Also don't do 20-30 windows updates through 'windows update' program, 'cause if any of them conflict you'll have better chance of pinpointing it.)

I think you'll have better luck with XP or Vista, but separate workstation will let you experiment with each of OS:es. Give each 64-bit Windows a try and see which works good with EMU card.

Also Windows 7 Ultimate has this feature which allows Win7 to run in full XP mode which might be suitable for using EMU with its own stable XP drivers.


Does anything i said make any sense? Or have i've had so much caffeine and Red Bulls today that nothing i say makes any sense now? smile.gif lol

If you decide to go through with it, please share the knowledge when you get something up and running! I'm one of the people who is very anxious to get some good info on my EMU 1616m performing on any 64-bit OS, but in particular on Windows 7 (64-bit).

If you'll need any help I'll do everything possible that i can to help you out, and I'm sure other helpful people here who have been helping me so far will lend their helping hand too.

Hope i made sense instead of babbling incoherently smile.gif

Sincerely,

Anton


P.S. Maybe one of the teachers, like Ivan for example, will be kind enough to maybe do a course on PatchMix and how to use it in different situations. I know i would be extremely grateful. I'd even be willing to help with any means available to me. I know if in a year or so, when i master it myself, if such lessons wont be available yet (cause i know everybody are very busy), i will make my best effort to try to produce them myself.

And one more time thank you to every single person who has written their input into this topic.

Cheerios (are good for breakfast).

QUOTE (tonymiro @ Apr 11 2010, 07:16 AM) *
Pretty certain that error report is saying that you have corrupt Windows Registry because of the 0x0000008e comment. The other possibility again from the 0x00000008e is a RAM isssue.

Oh and the ha20x2k.sys suggests that the cause is a Creative/EMU driver.


First thing to check here would be that your 161m has the most up to date drivers.



Yeah Tony thanks man, i got it figured out. It was a problem with conflicting WDM drivers of my Sound Blaster. Even after OS re-install, as soon as i installed Sound Blaster X-Fi WDM drivers through Windows Update, my PatchMix started throwing errors and having problems connecting to my EMU.

Removed it and installed EMU drivers again, still works good. (So far anyway...)

Thank you for your input! smile.gif

This post has been edited by antonskv: Apr 12 2010, 07:33 AM


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antonskv
post Apr 12 2010, 08:08 AM
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QUOTE (Santiago Diaz Garces @ Apr 10 2010, 03:46 PM) *
I'm using M-audio Fasttrack and it's a really recommendable product. Maybe you should have it in mind


Hi Santiago,

Yes i know this interface very well, since my friend uses it on his Mac laptop. There are few versions of it too i believe, but all M-AUDIO FastTrack interfaces are USB based.

The point of me choosing E-MU 1616m, was the fact of total bypass of USB and FireWire bus problems in between instruments and workstation. This was an interface that i knew would let all my other equipment (like for example my AKG Perception 420 condenser mic) function at full capacity with no problem.

And in my friends house, there was a time once where his FastTrack started showing some latency-related "cracking/hissing" when we tried to record more then a single input at the time, like mic + bass + guitar + effects on top. I don't know anything about Macs so my friend was operating everything of course, but i do believe that more likely it was the USB limitation of throughput of amount of data instead of my friend's inability to properly configure or operate it. But everything is possible.

With EMU 1616m, I might be "using a tank/jackhammer to hammer in a tiny nail", but when i made a decision to buy it i felt that this is an interface that i will use for MANY years to come and never reach the limit of it's abilities. I think so far it was a good decision.

I am an amateur, and i say it proudly. I don't pretend to know all those things that professionals (semi-professionals, and hobbyists with many years of experience) know about this subject, and i know I'm stupid + prone to make rash decisions, but to be honest with all those hundreds of hours i spent working on problems like these, i have had a blast learning. And when you work on the problem and hear final result in form of sweet guitar tone and great vocals.... OOOOOH! That feeling is priceless! For everything else there is a "Master Card"... wink.gif biggrin.gif

Thanks for your input Santiago! Keep rocking! cool.gif laugh.gif

Best Regards,

Anton


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Staffy
post Apr 12 2010, 09:46 AM
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I'm glad that everything worked out nice for You. I can promise lots of hours with top-notch sound with this card, and when You got it to work properly - it will never give up!!!!

//Staffay

Ps. Btw. I think You can find set-ups for Patchmix in the user-forums, the most common DAW's is covered as far as I remember. Then You can have different profiles depending on the tasks. Ds.


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antonskv
post Apr 12 2010, 10:45 AM
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QUOTE (Staffy @ Apr 12 2010, 04:46 AM) *
I'm glad that everything worked out nice for You. I can promise lots of hours with top-notch sound with this card, and when You got it to work properly - it will never give up!!!!

//Staffay

Ps. Btw. I think You can find set-ups for Patchmix in the user-forums, the most common DAW's is covered as far as I remember. Then You can have different profiles depending on the tasks. Ds.


If you only knew how happy i am smile.gif I'm not just happy i am ecstatic smile.gif I'll take it slow and little bit by little bit, see if i can master this card and get most of it. But like you said "Even developers don't know how PatchMix works" hehe, so i got a quite task ahead of me.

As far as the set-ups - i'll check them out.

I only hope that this whole thread of messages shows other non-Mac people that there is a way to match all those high-end Mac-friendly interfaces, without any sense of feeling inferior about being a PC user. 'Cause i've been hearing comments like "Oh well but for Audio work Mac is better, no?" when my friends are choosing a computer/laptop buy. That does make me sad, 'cause i'm a PC person since like 1990, and though while i can appreciate Macs (and might even get a Mac laptop, been thinking of it when i get extra $$), i don't discard PCs like something "lesser".

I think this interface is a very good alternative to getting professional audio if you can dedicate a workstation purely for that purpose. Even that is not fully true, since EMU now acts as perfect replacement for day-to-day sound card. So to be honest i have lost nothing by installing it, and gained a lot.

In some time i will be writing a full review about this, once i feel i know enough to present it to other people in proper elaborate way. Maybe in few months.

What pleases me even more is to see how well community reacts to other community member's questions/problems, and its nice to see so many people are willing to help. We're rock solid smile.gif

You da man Staffay! wink.gif


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Apr 12 2010, 12:06 PM
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QUOTE (antonskv @ Apr 12 2010, 09:45 AM) *
...

I only hope that this whole thread of messages shows other non-Mac people that there is a way to match all those high-end Mac-friendly interfaces, without any sense of feeling inferior about being a PC user. 'Cause i've been hearing comments like "Oh well but for Audio work Mac is better, no?" when my friends are choosing a computer/laptop buy. That does make me sad, 'cause i'm a PC person since like 1990, and though while i can appreciate Macs (and might even get a Mac laptop, been thinking of it when i get extra $$), i don't discard PCs like something "lesser".

...



FWIW Anton I work as an independent professional post production audio/mastering engineer. ALL of our platforms here are pc - 4 laptops for location with a SADiE LRX, one i7 64 bit desktop that currently runs Sequoia (soon to go to SADiE) and one backup 32 bit that is currently running Pyramix plus an old pc just for the internet. Provided you set up a pc for audio it's as good as Mac. Also the professional software we run here won't run on a Mac without emulation. I would also say that I know a lot of professionals in pre and post production audio who use pcs - so Macs are not industry standard for audio at all. I get sent a lot of stuff mixed on PT-HD to master because the mix engineers accept that I will get a better end result then they can. If Macs were the best for audio then I would either be out of business or I'd run Mac.

For interfacing I use Prism and Lavry ADDA - most pro end Mac users are on ProTools-HD a 192, or sometimes with Apogee. A Lavry DAC outperforms any PT and Apogee hardware in every subjective and objective audio test that has been done. For the pc interface - to get the signal in and out of the pc rather than for changing between analogue and digital - we use RME for light pipe and AES/EBU. RME are again known for producing the most stable audio drivers in the business. In ten years of using RME on a pc platform base the RME has never caused any downtime.

Now I'm not trying to start a mac vs pc debate - both are good and macs used to be more likely to run without conflicts straight out of the box. (That is no longer true though.) I just want to give you some info for the next time someone tells you that macs are better for audio wink.gif



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antonskv
post Apr 12 2010, 03:09 PM
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QUOTE (tonymiro @ Apr 12 2010, 07:06 AM) *
FWIW Anton I work as an independent professional post production audio/mastering engineer. ALL of our platforms here are pc - 4 laptops for location with a SADiE LRX, one i7 64 bit desktop that currently runs Sequoia (soon to go to SADiE) and one backup 32 bit that is currently running Pyramix plus an old pc just for the internet. Provided you set up a pc for audio it's as good as Mac. Also the professional software we run here won't run on a Mac without emulation. I would also say that I know a lot of professionals in pre and post production audio who use pcs - so Macs are not industry standard for audio at all. I get sent a lot of stuff mixed on PT-HD to master because the mix engineers accept that I will get a better end result then they can. If Macs were the best for audio then I would either be out of business or I'd run Mac.

For interfacing I use Prism and Lavry ADDA - most pro end Mac users are on ProTools-HD a 192, or sometimes with Apogee. A Lavry DAC outperforms any PT and Apogee hardware in every subjective and objective audio test that has been done. For the pc interface - to get the signal in and out of the pc rather than for changing between analogue and digital - we use RME for light pipe and AES/EBU. RME are again known for producing the most stable audio drivers in the business. In ten years of using RME on a pc platform base the RME has never caused any downtime.

Now I'm not trying to start a mac vs pc debate - both are good and macs used to be more likely to run without conflicts straight out of the box. (That is no longer true though.) I just want to give you some info for the next time someone tells you that macs are better for audio wink.gif


Heh, truly makes me feel better. Sometimes against my own solid opinion i feel bad that i don't even know how to use a Mac since i never had one and never even used one to browse internet. Figured that its something "more professional" during those bad moments when some of audio hardware on my PC is giving me problems or doesn't perform as well. Those moments happen rarely but when they do, it sucks.

As far as having something concrete to say to "Mac is best for pro audio...", I'm gonna do this:

*prints out Tonymiro's posting in amount of 10 copies, laminates every piece and puts them into his bag*

I'll stick those printouts in their teeth, 'cause there is no way I'm gonna remember all that smile.gif

"Here chew on this, that was said by a pro. Now shut up, and stop making dilettante-like comments, which are nothing close to the truth. If you like Mac cause it looks cool and is considered cool by you friends - get it and don't pretend to be a specialist. You can make pro audio with either." smile.gif LOL LOL

Just kidding... hehe

BTW... I regret a lot, that when i was working for post production studio which was located hand-in-hand, i didn't learn more about audio recording and production... We were on same floor, i even cleaned that 1 million dollar mixer board once smile.gif smile.gif lol... If i knew i will get into it, i would've tried to pump as much info as i could. We used to hang out with Sound Engineers, i could have pumped some knowledge. Oh well that's in the past: "Could'a, Would'a, Should'a... Blah blah blah...". Would've been cool though. Would've had better luck making my stuff sound better from home recording if had some knowledge dropped on me, but most likely technology changed so much in last 8-10 years, i might've as well not benefited at all from that outdated info.... Who knows...

Anyway...

I'm off to connecting my KORG PadKONTROL to my new EMU... smile.gif Talk to you later.


Thanks man. For your help with my questions too. I hope one day i can return a favor.


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Apr 12 2010, 03:14 PM
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NP Anton smile.gif


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Get your music professionally mastered by anl AES registered Mastering Engineer. Contact me for Audio Mastering Services and Advice and visit our website www.miromastering.com

Be friends on facebook with us here.

We use professional, mastering grade hardware in our mastering studo. Our hardware includes:
Cranesong Avocet II Monitor Controller, Dangerous Music Liasion Insert Hardware Router, ATC SCM Pro Monitors, Lavry Black DA11, Prism Orpheus ADC/DAC, Gyratec Gyraf XIV Parallel Passive Mastering EQ, Great River MAQ 2NV Mastering EQ, Kush Clariphonic Parallel EQ Shelf, Maselec MLA-2 Mastering Compressor, API 2500 Mastering Compressor, Eventide Eclipse Reverb/Echo.
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