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> Determining How Fast You Play?
SirJamsalot
post May 10 2010, 02:43 AM
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What's a good way to determine how fast you are in terms of picking speed? Set a metrinome to a certain speed and then do chromatic scales - 4 notes per string? or 3 note per string scales? If someone were to ask me how fast my playing is, I wouldn't know how to reply that answer :/


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lcsdds
post May 10 2010, 03:01 AM
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QUOTE (SirJamsalot @ May 10 2010, 02:43 AM) *
What's a good way to determine how fast you are in terms of picking speed? Set a metrinome to a certain speed and then do chromatic scales - 4 notes per string? or 3 note per string scales? If someone were to ask me how fast my playing is, I wouldn't know how to reply that answer :/

Thats a tough question......depends on the lick IMO. I can pick fast on one string. Not so fast on a six string run using AP with 3nps scales and even slower using 2nps scales and AP. IMO if you can handle 16th notes at 200 bpm no matter the lick you will be able to pretty much play whatever you want. That's my 2 cents anyways....... smile.gif
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SirJamsalot
post May 10 2010, 03:13 AM
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Perhaps there is a lesson that serves as a good indicator whereby you can you set your metrinome and if you can play it at that speed, that's a good indicator of how fast in general you can play?


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Gitarrero
post May 10 2010, 07:34 AM
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I'd go for an alternate picking exercise with scales like this one from Lian:
https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/ls/Metal_Patterns_1/

Or you can try to master this lesson...:
https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/solo-guit...me-neo-classic/


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Staffy
post May 10 2010, 07:39 AM
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Who cares? Speed has nothing to do with music. I guess that if You can play like this guy, the answer would be: "Fast enough...."

//Staffay



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SirJamsalot
post May 10 2010, 07:51 AM
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QUOTE (Staffy @ May 9 2010, 11:39 PM) *
Who cares? Speed has nothing to do with music. I guess that if You can play like this guy, the answer would be: "Fast enough...."

//Staffay



I'm not trying to equate speed with musicality - but as long as there are 1/4 notes, there will always be 1/8 notes tucked between them, so I'd like to be able to play the 1/8 notes as well.

Besides, I'm curious where I'm at. Just wondering what a good way is to find out.

And that guy - 300 bpm - the action on that guitar must be touching the frets - you can't see the strings move, let a lone his fingers rolleyes.gif


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Kristofer Dahl
post May 10 2010, 08:02 AM
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So many factors come into play here - anyone (even without practicing ) can do something extremely fast. Depending on how much you have prepared yourself it is going to sound more or less good (if you haven't practiced it will obviously sound horrible) - but who is to say when it sounds "good enough" to qualify as a speed which you master?

I think your best bet is to record a shred lick which you are comfortable with, upload it here so people can say if they like the sound of your technique or not:

* If you upload something and people think it's not clean enough you can probably not deem yourself as fast

* If you upload something which people consider clean and somewhat shreddy...then you are fast, but how fast you are will always depend on who you ask. Unless we establish a speed committee at GMC of course! cool.gif



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Staffy
post May 10 2010, 08:06 AM
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QUOTE (SirJamsalot @ May 10 2010, 08:51 AM) *
I'm not trying to equate speed with musicality - but as long as there are 1/4 notes, there will always be 1/8 notes tucked between them, so I'd like to be able to play the 1/8 notes as well.

Besides, I'm curious where I'm at. Just wondering what a good way is to find out.

And that guy - 300 bpm - the action on that guitar must be touching the frets - you can't see the strings move, let a lone his fingers rolleyes.gif


I dont really know how to measure it, the right hand is easy to "Guitar Speed Trainer", where You can measure Your actual speed and progress by playing the exercises included.

Nah, this guy is insane. But I havent heard him play anything musical.... (yet)

//Staffay

QUOTE (SirJamsalot @ May 10 2010, 08:51 AM) *
I'm not trying to equate speed with musicality - but as long as there are 1/4 notes, there will always be 1/8 notes tucked between them, so I'd like to be able to play the 1/8 notes as well.

Besides, I'm curious where I'm at. Just wondering what a good way is to find out.

And that guy - 300 bpm - the action on that guitar must be touching the frets - you can't see the strings move, let a lone his fingers rolleyes.gif


I dont really know how to measure it, the right hand is easy to measure with a metronome though. Another way to measure will be to do the lessons here and see what level You are on according the 10-point system. There is also a proggie called "Guitar Speed Trainer", where You can measure Your actual speed and progress by playing the exercises included.

Nah, this guy is insane. But I havent heard him play anything musical.... (yet)

//Staffay


EDIT: I pressed the wrong buttons in the first post....

QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ May 10 2010, 09:02 AM) *
Unless we establish a speed committee at GMC of course! cool.gif


Good idea Kris. I'm voting You for director!!!! biggrin.gif

//Staffay

This post has been edited by Staffy: May 10 2010, 08:05 AM


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SirJamsalot
post May 10 2010, 09:12 AM
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ok, thanks for the replies. why do I feel like it was a stupid question? dry.gif



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Kristofer Dahl
post May 10 2010, 09:16 AM
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QUOTE (SirJamsalot @ May 10 2010, 10:12 AM) *
ok, thanks for the replies. why do I feel like it was a stupid question? dry.gif


I think it was a very good question - many people probably wonder about this. It's a natural thing to think about as you are working on improving your chops/speed.

Guitarists who have already gone through their chops-building period will often say "focus on the music instead" - but to play music you need chops. How much chops you need depends on your musical preferences.


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maharzan
post May 10 2010, 10:22 AM
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Just trying chromatic really sucks. i wouldn't do that. For me musicality is more of scale variations with few chromatic notes. As a starter, I would just try a major scale and set up a beat and try all 4th, 8th, 16ths, triplets to 32nds.. or just set up a metronome and try 16ths. It sounds more melodious than chromatic. Its more practical as well.


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lcsdds
post May 10 2010, 03:33 PM
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I think it was a very good question. I still say that if you can play 16ths @ 200bpm thats all the speed you'll need. My goals have been like this.

[email protected] 200bpm any technique

quintuplets (5 notes per beat) @ 160bpm any technique

16th triplets (six notes per beat) @ 130bpm any technique

This is a goal I will probably never obtain but it is something to shoot for and a good gauge of where you are technically. I'm looking forward to the day where I can play the exact same lick using legato, AP, Tapping, or a combo of these at the exact same tempo. Now if I am playing a fast lick I usually have to pick a technique that I can play the lick at that speed. So my technique or lack thereof is dictating what technique to use. The goal is to let your ears determine what the music needs and then pick a technique to obtain the sound you are going for.

That was probably all jibberish but its early.......... smile.gif
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jstcrsn
post May 10 2010, 04:29 PM
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QUOTE (SirJamsalot @ May 10 2010, 02:43 AM) *
What's a good way to determine how fast you are in terms of picking speed? Set a metrinome to a certain speed and then do chromatic scales - 4 notes per string? or 3 note per string scales? If someone were to ask me how fast my playing is, I wouldn't know how to reply that answer :/

This has been my nemesis-A.P.
so i've developed a three note per string scale-The notes inside the phrase are =16
set your metronome at a gentle pace for you -the click will be every note you play
every fourth note will be a beat-(A different sounding click)
The different sound will be the start of your counting/playing
you will count1-2-3-4 1-2-3-4-1-2-3-4-1-2-3-4
you will be counting 4 but playing three and hearing a click on every note you play
so every thing together has to line up perfectly to restart the phrase
I think this has retrained my ear to hear a perfect timing between each note
Before I would play with a slight fluctuation when playing and it has never been close to perfect until i came up with this
hope it helps
Speed comes with perfection ,but perfection does not come with speed
I also think that i'm only as fast as i play my most difficult peice -cleanly

This post has been edited by jstcrsn: May 10 2010, 04:46 PM
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Bogdan Radovic
post May 10 2010, 04:32 PM
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Its a really good question. Now what can come handy is writing a practice log.
For example : Been practicing ex. 1 at 120bpm in 16th notes. If you do that for all exercises not only you will have a clear indicator how your speed has increased over period of time, but you'll know how fast-which things your can play approximately.

Now question : Am I fast enough?

That is really individual, my guess would be if you feel you can't play things you WANT to play because of technique (you can't do it fast enough) then you are not there. But if you feel comfortable and not hindered by technique for executing music that is inside you (even if playing is really slow) then you are indeed fast enough! smile.gif



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Todd Simpson
post May 19 2010, 01:40 AM
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It's a really valid question actually smile.gif Great replies from Kris. It's all relative of course in terms of "fast". But if you are just wanting to clock yourself to determine your progress. Pick a given scale or pattern and clock yourself with a metronome. Video yourself doing it. Post it to youtube and here and you can get some great feedback. Also, you can see how you are progressing over time.

Todd


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SirJamsalot
post May 19 2010, 04:06 AM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ May 18 2010, 05:40 PM) *
It's a really valid question actually smile.gif Great replies from Kris. It's all relative of course in terms of "fast". But if you are just wanting to clock yourself to determine your progress. Pick a given scale or pattern and clock yourself with a metronome. Video yourself doing it. Post it to youtube and here and you can get some great feedback. Also, you can see how you are progressing over time.

Todd


By "fast" I was trying to get a personal mathematical metric - I know fast is subjective - it's more of a curiosity about my own speed in terms of bpm. Perhaps you can help me with the math. Let's say I play the following scale up and down to a metrinome set at 120 bpm, with the 4th note landing on each beat, would that be considered playing a scale at 120 bpm? Is there a mathematical equation to apply to just put a number to? In that video of the guy doing 240 bpm of the butterfly thingy, how'd they come up with the 240 bpm is all I was asking.

1-2-3-4-5-6-7-1-7-6-5-4-3-2-1-2

groovy.


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Azzaboi
post May 19 2010, 04:55 AM
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That video at 320BPM is insane, but doesn't look as amazing as it should. He makes it look too easy!


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Vasilije Vukmiro...
post Jun 6 2010, 11:46 AM
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I like this question very very much. If someone plays 4-tones-per strings chromatic patterns at 200 bps, that is NOT 200!
If you play tremolo picking on one string on 200bps, that is not 200bps.
However, it would be good to include various types of picking in this question.
How fast do you play pentatonics, diatonic, sweep picking, alternate picking arpeggios?
For each of these question answers should be given, and then, by some strange mathematical equation we could determine average speed.
Maybe we should pick one classical piece as a reference point?


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Kristian Hyvarin...
post Jun 6 2010, 12:18 PM
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I agree with practically everyone here. As said, it really depends on the lick. smile.gif In my opinion, some basic patterns can give a quite good image on how fast one plays, for example two-notes-per-string pentatonic patterns (pentatonic workshop) or three-notes-per-string church modes patterns (modal madness). But I don't think that's the whole truth. Horizontal paterns, vertical patterns - let alone string skipping, hybrid picking...

A complete image on speed is practically impossible to give. But certain techniques, ceartain patterns... they can and actually should be measured if one relies on speed. This is a fun discussion, but since it is such a difficult question, I'm glad everyone still focuses on the music and not the speed. biggrin.gif
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SirJamsalot
post Jun 6 2010, 05:17 PM
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QUOTE (Vasilije Vukmirovic @ Jun 6 2010, 03:46 AM) *
I like this question very very much. If someone plays 4-tones-per strings chromatic patterns at 200 bps, that is NOT 200!


Then what is it?
I'm scratching my head here wondering why no one wants to touch this topic with a ten foot pole.

I think I stated the question clearly -
QUOTE
Let's say I play the following scale up and down to a metrinome set at 120 bpm, with the 4th note landing on each beat, would that be considered playing a scale at 120 bpm?


It seems the conclusion of this thread is that there is no mathematical equation that can tell us this because it's music man and we're not interested in speed - only music!

I give up. I love you guys, but this is too touchy of a topic to continue.
biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by SirJamsalot: Jun 6 2010, 05:27 PM


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