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> Lots And Lots Of Questions, from accenting to the chuck schuldiner grip
kyuss
post Oct 22 2010, 08:05 PM
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hey guys, only come around and post about once every couple years when im completely stuck, and here i am mad.gif

i've slowly regressed to "noodling" on guitar and not really practicing. part of the reason this happened was because i started to get into slower genres of music, drone, doom, and stoner metal- so i decided to get back into tech death metal to get my chops up (because nothing makes you want to become a better guitar player like a good tech death cd laugh.gif ) so I decided to work on the seven solo from necrophagist- which would've been in my skill level about 3 years ago, but spending time on this solo really brought out all of my flaws i developed in the past couple years of "noodling".

first off i noticed that my accenting was completely gone and so was my sense of tempo, this impacted my alternate picking the worst: could anyone direct me to a good resource for getting my accenting back or working on my alt picking overall? like a good guitar vid with tons of alt picking shapes in it?

secondly i don't know how to exactly angle my left hand: i cant get good extension with the baseball bat grip, but i cant get any "expression" (bending vibrato accenting muting etc) out of classical style, i was thinking about training up on Chuck Shuldiner's technique ( heres a pic: http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2hxro0n&s=4 ) of having the thumb in the middle of the neck pointing towards the head, i get the best reach and best expression out of this style, but i cant mute any of the other strings im not playing on with my left hand; any thoughts, or resources someone could point me to? like a guitarist to examine or explain your own technique and its pros/cons

pretty much the same thing with my right hand also, i don't know whether to brace or not and where to brace, pick angle, which muscles to use, etc. right now im using my wrist to pick, trying to keep my pick as parallel to the string as possible, but im using my arm/elbow when i want to move up and down the strings

i know most people are going to say "do whats comfortable" and that is good advice, however, nothing is comfortable right now, so ill just start from scratch with the technique that has the least cons and most pros.

and thanks in advance guys, you've helped me out of many binds before biggrin.gif looking forward to getting a little insight on techniques and resources.
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SirJamsalot
post Oct 22 2010, 08:35 PM
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1. Best way to overcome noodling and get back good accents is to practice songs that have that kind of style. Find a song you'd like to emulate and emulate it. It's always best to practice in some sort of musical context, and the easiest way to find musical context is in a backing track or album you can play along with.

2. Alternate picking - a good lesson is this one to build up speed
https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/solo-guit...n-speed-bursts/

3. hand angle - well, most of your muting will be with your right hand. Fine-tuned muting will be with your fretting fingers as they transition to new strings, they maintain a light touch against the string you just left to aid in muting. Perhaps one of the instructors has some vids on that, I don't know any off hand.

4. pick angle - for AP, you shouldn't be picking at a parallel angle unless you're trying bang the string heavily for accents or heavyness. For speed and or swift scale patterns you should be anywhere from 30 to 80 degrees (closer to perpendicular) to keep your pick from hanging on the string. you want to glide over the string, not catch it with the pick

5. Comfort is something you develop. If you've been doing something that's not comfortable, then it's going to prevent you from doing it well. How you grab the neck is going to be personal taste - you ultimately do what you have to do to get your fingers positioned properly for bends and swift playing. You'll grab the neck differently many times during any session - that's just natural. Perhaps start by slinging your guitar higher up instead of at your waist to begin with - that will greatly improve the comfort, then gradually lower your guitar to where you want it to be, IMO. A guitar hung at the knees is not very conducive to fast AP, but does fine for the sloppy SLASH style pentanonic riffs and stuff.

My 2 cents.


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Sollesnes
post Oct 22 2010, 08:59 PM
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Dont lock yourself into positions. Like the classical position you say is great for single notes, but you dont bend like that. Move your hand around and put your thumb over the neck to give a nice grip for good bends. Muting will come as you go. If not, change up your positions wink.gif
If you want to think of what muscles to use, try to use as little as possible. Dont use your elbow. Try to pick from your wrist and/or thumb. How you hold your pick is completely up to you. Nothing is best, everything just feels and sound different.
Chances are youve not actually gotten worse, youve gotten better, because now you see your faults smile.gif Happened to me after such a period at least tongue.gif Unless you have old recordings of yourself and know for sure though. smile.gif

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Azzaboi
post Oct 25 2010, 07:11 PM
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Try this...

Rotate the pick so your not playing flat but on an downwards (or upwards if you perfer) rotatation. Never angle the pick up or down, but rotate it for a better, quicker, most aggressive chucky attack. It should make a different attack sound the more rotatation (almost up to 90%). Ensure your just using the tip to play and it's not moving around.

With the back edge of your picking hand karate chop the strings lightly and fold the hand over to palm mute. Play continous downstrokes per string or two string power cords (like the E5 power cord - open E string and 2nd fret on the A string) and adjust the pressure of your palm. You want to find that right amount of attack angle and palm muting pressure to suit your style and to be able to change and control it.

Pick and count while leaving the fretboard hand idle on the same string or cord:
1 (pick down / up / down), 2 (down pick), 3 (down pick), 4 (down pick) -
then repeat over and over (8 times then release the picking hand's palm mute for 2 times)

Just get the 'chung ah chung, chung, chung, chung' in your head along with perfect timing. You can play it slowly and use a metronome. Don't forget the attack angle on the pick and palm muting as well.

Once your've got that down, playing the E5 power cord do the same rhythm, but inbetween the counts mute the strings with the fretboard's free fingers just patting the strings lightly. Now your got both hands muting the strings.

This is really what makes heavy metal sound controlled and chunky while still loud and aggressive. Both hands working in perfect time with each other and both used in muting. Mix it up a bit with different exercises but keep a pattern looping. Now once your got the picking worked out focus on the fretboard hand changing cords and positions while picking in the same style - remember to still stay in time or slow down to your got it.

This works on your muscle memory and sense of rhythm. Once your've got the muscle memory then it's easiler to boost the speed.

As for the picking, I found the secret is use fingers for slow playing, pitch harmonics, and more expression, then make them ridge and use wrist for fast playing and alternative picking. Pretty much what your doing right now is great for fast playing. You can use a finger to anchor on the guitar base, which can really help with the control at speed but limits the movement across the strings or remain just a floating hand. I use a bit of both or just slightly touching against the bottom e string (this can be good control while still floating).

This post has been edited by Azzaboi: Oct 25 2010, 07:30 PM


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Todd Simpson
post Oct 25 2010, 10:44 PM
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Todd the Saturday Video Chat Instructor here smile.gif I'm a big fan of Alternate picking and I may have a few helpful tips for ya. Here is a chunk from my "Tips and Tricks" section in my instructor forum focused on right hand details and a link to my lesson notes for Alteranate Picking. 29 Lessons in and around Alternate Picking work.

For Alternate Picking I'd suggest gripping the pick so that not much pick is sticking out. Try to get the point of the pick to point out at a 90 degre angle from your thumb. Here is a picture to demonstrate.



Also, here are some things to try.

ALTERNATE PICKING TIPS AND TRICKS
1.)Choke up on the pick. Only the point should be sticking out.
2.)Don't pick from the elbow! Control the motion from your wrist or fingers.
3.)Try a very heavy pick, 1.2 MM or greater so as to eliminate "flex" in the pick.
4.)Try to sharpen your pick to a point with sandpaper or dremmel or what not so that the surface area
striking the string is as small as possible. There are some "training" picks that are shaped this way on purpose.
5.)Work with a metronome ALWAYS so that you keep your picking even.

6.)MOST IMPORTANT: Join me this saturday and every saturday for a live VIDEO CHAT lesson on ALTERNATE PICKING. We have been doing a series on that very topic for several weeks now. Here are the notes so far. Many great workouts to try.

LESSON NOTES ON GMC FOR MY ALTERNATE PICKING SERIES

Above all
Practice!


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kyuss
post Oct 26 2010, 07:09 PM
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wow thanks guys, i took everything you 4 said to heart and practiced up these past couple days, rigorously, with a metronome, and i finally feel comfortable on the guitar. Tightened the strap up a little, got a pack of jazz III picks (now i remember why i loved them so much ) but most importantly changed my picking angle, to about 80 degress as you guys said. Because im comfortable my legato, sweeps, economy, bends etc. is back up to where i know it should be, but i still need to work on my accenting. My biggest problem is accenting on an up stroke, i cant seem to get that in my muscle memory no matter how hard i try (hours on hours) but i guess i just have to keep putting in the time.

and thanks todd, i will definitely tune in, sounds exactly like what i need.
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SirJamsalot
post Oct 26 2010, 07:55 PM
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QUOTE (kyuss @ Oct 26 2010, 11:09 AM) *
wow thanks guys, i took everything you 4 said to heart and practiced up these past couple days, rigorously, with a metronome, and i finally feel comfortable on the guitar. Tightened the strap up a little, got a pack of jazz III picks (now i remember why i loved them so much ) but most importantly changed my picking angle, to about 80 degress as you guys said. Because im comfortable my legato, sweeps, economy, bends etc. is back up to where i know it should be, but i still need to work on my accenting. My biggest problem is accenting on an up stroke, i cant seem to get that in my muscle memory no matter how hard i try (hours on hours) but i guess i just have to keep putting in the time.

and thanks todd, i will definitely tune in, sounds exactly like what i need.


you feel comfortable after only a few days practicing? you're a better musician than I smile.gif
Took me months and months, and everything new is still an upward battle! They say patience is virtue, and I say discipline is must. Practice both and it'll come together in time.

For accenting the upstroke, here's an exercise for you -
http://video.answers.com/shred-alert-with-...cking-241274099

beginning your scales with an upstroke will help you speed into feeling more comfy with upstrokes.

biggrin.gif
cheers, have fun.


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Todd Simpson
post Oct 29 2010, 10:10 PM
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I'd like to congratulate all the guys on putting up such great info smile.gif Just goes to show, this really is a Guitar Players paradise. I"m happy to be able to contribute my two bits as well wink.gif I look forward to seeing you in our Saturday video Chat! We will get you to where you want to be asap.

Practice!
Todd


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Todd Simpson
post Nov 18 2010, 12:13 AM
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QUOTE (kyuss @ Oct 26 2010, 01:09 PM) *
wow thanks guys, i took everything you 4 said to heart and practiced up these past couple days, rigorously, with a metronome, and i finally feel comfortable on the guitar. Tightened the strap up a little, got a pack of jazz III picks (now i remember why i loved them so much ) but most importantly changed my picking angle, to about 80 degress as you guys said. Because im comfortable my legato, sweeps, economy, bends etc. is back up to where i know it should be, but i still need to work on my accenting. My biggest problem is accenting on an up stroke, i cant seem to get that in my muscle memory no matter how hard i try (hours on hours) but i guess i just have to keep putting in the time.

and thanks todd, i will definitely tune in, sounds exactly like what i need.


Happy to help smile.gif See you Sat!

Todd


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