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Hardtail
post Jan 6 2011, 05:29 AM
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I haven't touched my guitars in a couple years and I recently decided to get back into it... and not just get back into it, but push myself beyond the meager tiny bit I knew when last I played.

My basic Rhythm skills still seem solid enough to perform but I'm hoping to learn more about playing lead.

Anyway, my Church band asked be to come join them and since they don't really NEED anyone else I figured it would be a good opportunity to jam with them and learn some firsthand stuff (they are all Music Master Degree or ex-performers).

In the off-chance I need to perform what's the latest on pedal machines? I was looking at some of the Line6 PoD stuff but just don't know what is best anymore. I can't use any amplification or speaker due to the Church venue so it all has to be direct-line input into the Mixer.

Any info would be great!

Hardtail


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Mudbone
post Jan 6 2011, 05:54 AM
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Line6 gear sounds great, but from my experience almost all of their equipment has proven to be very unreliable. Just about every single piece of Line6 gear I have come across has been about as reliable as a wet paper bag holding a brick.

The Boss GT-10 is very reliable and sounds great, with the exception of the high gain tones, which are ok at best. If you have no need for bone crushing distortion, than you should consider the GT-10. Another multi effects processor you may want to consider is the Digitech RP 500 and RP 1000, both are great pedals and cost much less than the Boss or Line6 models. For your intended use I would recommend the Digitech RP 500, you can find them for around $300, and sometimes even less.


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Hardtail
post Jan 6 2011, 06:08 AM
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QUOTE (Mudbone @ Jan 5 2011, 11:54 PM) *
Line6 gear sounds great, but from my experience almost all of their equipment has proven to be very unreliable. Just about every single piece of Line6 gear I have come across has been about as reliable as a wet paper bag holding a brick.

The Boss GT-10 is very reliable and sounds great, with the exception of the high gain tones, which are ok at best. If you have no need for bone crushing distortion, than you should consider the GT-10. Another multi effects processor you may want to consider is the Digitech RP 500 and RP 1000, both are great pedals and cost much less than the Boss or Line6 models. For your intended use I would recommend the Digitech RP 500, you can find them for around $300, and sometimes even less.


I've heard good things about the Digitech products. What about the Vox Tonelab ST? It's super cheap and seems to get some pretty rave reviews... with it's small package though i'm not sure it will give me as much on-stage flexibility as the digitech.

Hardtail


--------------------

Beginner's Amp & Guitar Gear Guide
My Keeley Blues Driver BD-2 Review
My Line6 Flextone II Review

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Amps: Fender Blues Junior Special Edition & Fender Studio 85 (Simultaneous... yummy)
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Mudbone
post Jan 6 2011, 07:15 AM
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The Vox does look really nice, don't much about it. I'm checking out the demos right now, I want to see if having that single 12AX7 tube in it makes a big difference. Theres a pedal from Zoom you could check out as well, its got two 12AX7 preamp tubes. This leads me to believe they could be used as cascaded gain stages, which is what gives that defining tube sound. Its a pretty bad ass pedal, I'm actually looking in to getting one myself. Its also got a three dimensional expression pedal, which is something no other processor has. Check out the link below.

I'm not sure how reliable it is, thats why I didn't recommend it in the earlier post. To me, reliability trumps everything - if a piece of gear doesn't work, then it doesn't matter how good it sounds when it actually is working. I had a Zoom pedal before that had an issue with the input and output jacks. The jacks were soldered directly to the circuit board, so over time the solder connections cracked because that was the only thing holding the jack in place - pretty stupid design if you ask me. Other than that it actually wasn't a bad pedal. Zoom pedals aren't as well built as Boss or Digitech, but they're not as bad as Line6.

Vox is owned by Korg I believe, and Korg equipment has decent build quality, so the Vox seems like a good pedal. It all depends on your ears, that is the ultimate decider biggrin.gif If your ears are happy then it is good, if not, then its not worth a damn to you.


http://www.zzounds.com/item--ZOMG92TT


--------------------


He who laughs last thinks slowest.

"That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence." - Christopher Hitchens


Gear:

Guitars: Uncle Rufus' Twanger Classic
Amps: Mississippi Boom Box
Mojo: Hammer of Odin and a pair of Ox gonads
Inspiration: Samuel Adams Boston Lager

Zero to Hero: 1,387/10,000

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Ivan Milenkovic
post Jan 6 2011, 02:10 PM
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What's your budget there mate? How far can you stretch? There are many processors out there, and I can recommend many, but with budget limit, it will greatly increase my chances to recommend something that will be practical for your job, possibly future use, and get you the best price possible.


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Hardtail
post Jan 6 2011, 05:46 PM
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QUOTE (Ivan Milenkovic @ Jan 6 2011, 08:10 AM) *
What's your budget there mate? How far can you stretch? There are many processors out there, and I can recommend many, but with budget limit, it will greatly increase my chances to recommend something that will be practical for your job, possibly future use, and get you the best price possible.


$500US seems to be the top end. I was hoping to find something for $300US. The Gigitech RP1000 is $327US on Amazon.com right now. That is what I am currently thinking about but definitely would like to hear more about the others.

Hardtail


--------------------

Beginner's Amp & Guitar Gear Guide
My Keeley Blues Driver BD-2 Review
My Line6 Flextone II Review

Guitars: Martin D-16RGT with B-Band UST & '99 Fender "Big Apple" Hardtail HH Strat
Amps: Fender Blues Junior Special Edition & Fender Studio 85 (Simultaneous... yummy)
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Ivan Milenkovic
post Jan 6 2011, 08:20 PM
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If you need expression pedal, I'd say go for Digitech RP1000, it's a great multi-purpose device.

If you don't need expression pedal, I would say you check out TC Electronics Nova System. It doesn't have that much features as Digitech, but the quality of effects is top notch.


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MickeM
post Jan 6 2011, 08:41 PM
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I'd have a look at the Nova system like Ivan suggests, it has analog distortion which compares like day and night to digital ditto.
It's not the latest pedal, like you ask for, but might be what you are looking for.
Make sure it has the output you need for the mixer.


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Praetorian
post Jan 6 2011, 10:03 PM
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I have to agree with Mudbone on this one. I use, and love the Line 6 Studio GX amp modeling since I play into my PC instead of an amp. But, I am on my THIRD one as the first two broke! I do not play any gigs, and they take no abuse at all. They still broke and stopped working.

They are inexpensive and very fun...I just wish they lasted longer!


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MickeM
post Jan 6 2011, 10:21 PM
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QUOTE (Praetorian @ Jan 6 2011, 10:03 PM) *
they take no abuse at all.

Please post a photo of your (worn) night stick! biggrin.gif


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Mudbone
post Jan 7 2011, 01:13 AM
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QUOTE (Praetorian @ Jan 6 2011, 04:03 PM) *
I have to agree with Mudbone on this one. I use, and love the Line 6 Studio GX amp modeling since I play into my PC instead of an amp. But, I am on my THIRD one as the first two broke! I do not play any gigs, and they take no abuse at all. They still broke and stopped working.

They are inexpensive and very fun...I just wish they lasted longer!


A buddy of mine went through three Spider III combos, and another friend got a Lowdown bass combo that he had to return within a day because it crapped out, and the second one he got crapped out after a few months. Also, every time I go into Guitar Center I always plug into a Line6 amp, because they're usually the only ones to have a built in tuner biggrin.gif But I would have to say at least half of the floor models I've plugged into had some sort of issue. Line6 seriously has got to do something about the reliability of their equipment, because their modelling stuff is pretty good... when it actually works tongue.gif


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He who laughs last thinks slowest.

"That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence." - Christopher Hitchens


Gear:

Guitars: Uncle Rufus' Twanger Classic
Amps: Mississippi Boom Box
Mojo: Hammer of Odin and a pair of Ox gonads
Inspiration: Samuel Adams Boston Lager

Zero to Hero: 1,387/10,000

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Hardtail
post Jan 7 2011, 04:40 AM
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Good info guys... thanks!

For now, it appears my Fender Studio 85 has a direct line out. And since it is solid state it should provide me with the same or better reliability as any digital setup. Amazingly enough my Keeley Blues Driver, and other pedals I own sound amazing through the amp and none of it is lost from the direct out (it almost sounds as warm as a miked tube amp).

I can get at least 5 good usable tones (on-the-fly for performing) out of my current rig which is enough for my needs so maybe I'll keep saving my $$$ and get something else down the road... like good wah-wah and volume pedals smile.gif

Hardtail

This post has been edited by Hardtail: Jan 7 2011, 04:56 AM


--------------------

Beginner's Amp & Guitar Gear Guide
My Keeley Blues Driver BD-2 Review
My Line6 Flextone II Review

Guitars: Martin D-16RGT with B-Band UST & '99 Fender "Big Apple" Hardtail HH Strat
Amps: Fender Blues Junior Special Edition & Fender Studio 85 (Simultaneous... yummy)
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Ivan Milenkovic
post Jan 7 2011, 08:23 PM
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Aaah, well that changes the situation quite a bit! smile.gif Yeah, in that case I would definitely agree with you mate, and keep that gear for gigging. SS amp is relatively light and portable and Keeley BD pedal is very very good! smile.gif Besides, you won't get better sound than that with MultiFX units (although they have some other advantages).


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thefireball
post Jan 8 2011, 01:04 AM
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I have a BOSS ME 20. It's nice! I like it! It delivers great blues, overdrive, and distorted tones in my opinion. smile.gif


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Bear Rose
post Jan 8 2011, 04:14 AM
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I'd recommend a POD (probably an HD since its the newest). Lincoln Brewster uses a POD and gets tremendous results!



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Todd Simpson
post Jan 8 2011, 04:46 AM
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Well it sounds like you've almost decided not to buy anything? Which is always cheaper than buying smile.gif But if you do think about buying again, make sure to try the board/pedal before plunking down money. Some killer gear has been suggested, but it comes down to your ear. It's crucial to try out new gear with your guitar and using an amp close to your own. Even if you have to drive forever to do it.


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Hardtail
post Jan 13 2011, 02:57 AM
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Okay so I played the amp last night with some old headphones I found and it sounded terrible when I kicked on the Blues Driver or my other distortion pedal. I figured it was the low quality headphones I had so I went out and bought some decent middle-grade studio monitor headphones, and it still sounds terrible.

I'm concerned that the distortion sounds fine through the speaker because of the way a speaker responds to a distorted signal... but the headphones are so high quality and crisp that the distortion actually sounds like a computerized crunch (if that makes sense). That would be fine for practicing but now I'm concerned that when I go to perform (using the Preamp direct to the PA Mixer) it will sound terrible as well.

Anyone have any experience using a preamp out signal on an amp directly to the house mixer? I'm beginning to think a purely digital amp emulator may be the way to go again (likely the Digitech RP1000).

Hardtail


--------------------

Beginner's Amp & Guitar Gear Guide
My Keeley Blues Driver BD-2 Review
My Line6 Flextone II Review

Guitars: Martin D-16RGT with B-Band UST & '99 Fender "Big Apple" Hardtail HH Strat
Amps: Fender Blues Junior Special Edition & Fender Studio 85 (Simultaneous... yummy)
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Mudbone
post Jan 13 2011, 05:23 AM
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QUOTE (Hardtail @ Jan 12 2011, 08:57 PM) *
Okay so I played the amp last night with some old headphones I found and it sounded terrible when I kicked on the Blues Driver or my other distortion pedal. I figured it was the low quality headphones I had so I went out and bought some decent middle-grade studio monitor headphones, and it still sounds terrible.

I'm concerned that the distortion sounds fine through the speaker because of the way a speaker responds to a distorted signal... but the headphones are so high quality and crisp that the distortion actually sounds like a computerized crunch (if that makes sense). That would be fine for practicing but now I'm concerned that when I go to perform (using the Preamp direct to the PA Mixer) it will sound terrible as well.

Anyone have any experience using a preamp out signal on an amp directly to the house mixer? I'm beginning to think a purely digital amp emulator may be the way to go again (likely the Digitech RP1000).

Hardtail


Sounds like you're gonna need a speaker emulator. A guitar amps speaker is a vital link in the signal chain, and without it distortion will sound terrible. Amp emulators like the one you mentioned provide a speaker emulator in addition to the preamp emulator. So unless you can find a speaker emulator, it looks like you're gonna have to plop down the cash for a multi effects unit.

The Digitech Bad Monkey has an output for plugging directly into a mixing board, so I assume it has a speaker emulator built in... I've never tried it on the one I got. Maybe someone else here has some experience with this?


--------------------


He who laughs last thinks slowest.

"That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence." - Christopher Hitchens


Gear:

Guitars: Uncle Rufus' Twanger Classic
Amps: Mississippi Boom Box
Mojo: Hammer of Odin and a pair of Ox gonads
Inspiration: Samuel Adams Boston Lager

Zero to Hero: 1,387/10,000

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MickeM
post Jan 13 2011, 10:43 AM
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QUOTE (Mudbone @ Jan 13 2011, 05:23 AM) *
The Digitech Bad Monkey has an output for plugging directly into a mixing board, so I assume it has a speaker emulator built in... I've never tried it on the one I got. Maybe someone else here has some experience with this?

When my band mates Marshall broke I handed him my Bad Moneky and we lined it into the mixer and it sounded absolutely terrible.
I've played through a Blackstar HT pedal and that sounded descent through the mixer, I'd even concider giging with it as a second to tube amp. I never had any success with a POD X3 either, it works fine with head phones and recording but amplified I just don't think it's up to par.


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Hardtail
post Jan 14 2011, 05:10 AM
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Thanks for the info guys... I just LOVE the creamy crunch I get out of my Keely Blues Driver and amp... and would hate to go to a multi-effects processor to get a bunch of sounds I don't see myself using.

I'll keep doing some homework and get back to you.

Hardtail


--------------------

Beginner's Amp & Guitar Gear Guide
My Keeley Blues Driver BD-2 Review
My Line6 Flextone II Review

Guitars: Martin D-16RGT with B-Band UST & '99 Fender "Big Apple" Hardtail HH Strat
Amps: Fender Blues Junior Special Edition & Fender Studio 85 (Simultaneous... yummy)
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