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Introduction To Scales
Willster
Aug 10 2007, 05:46 AM
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Ya that seems to make sense to me. Because when I play minor pentatonic over major chords it sounds great. Thanks for your help.

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voluto
Sep 21 2007, 08:40 AM
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This is fantastic! Thanks! The only thing that could possibly surpass this is if you could read it out. Then us aural learners could snuggle up and be spoon fed via mp3, at bedtime. tongue.gif

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FretDancer69
Dec 9 2007, 12:51 AM
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Great lesson andrew, but i have some doubts and i was wondering if you could help me...
  • Why do you say that Minor Pentatonic scales have only 5 notes? The first scale i learned was the Am Pentatonic and according to this diagram, it has 12 notes..im so confused...


thanks andrew. im addicted to theory now smile.gif

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This post has been edited by FretDancer69: Dec 9 2007, 12:52 AM


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DeepRoots
Dec 9 2007, 12:58 AM
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Hey Fretdancer-

You see the scale diagram- start playing it from the lowest orange note - our root note.

Its the 5th fret on the lowest E string, the A note.

Well our Am pentatonic starts here....if we assend up the scale to the 8th fret E string we have the second note ( C ) , our third note is 5th fret A string (D), our fourth note is 7th Fret A string (E) and finally our fifth note is 5th fret D string (G).

Now...

when we move to the next orange note in the scale we see that it is also an A note...and so begins the scale again.

So as you see- there are 5 notes, but more than one octave wink.gif

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Kaneda
Dec 9 2007, 12:59 AM
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QUOTE (FretDancer69 @ Dec 9 2007, 12:51 AM) *
Great lesson andrew, but i have some doubts and i was wondering if you could help me...
  • Why do you say that Minor Pentatonic scales have only 5 notes? The first scale i learned was the Am Pentatonic and according to this diagram, it has 12 notes..im so confused...

thanks andrew. im addicted to theory now smile.gif


The box has twelve notes, but 7 of them are duplicates in different octaves.

The A minor pentatonic scale has the notes A C D E G.

The notes on the fretboard you supply are, from bottom to top, left to right:

A C D E G A C D E G A C - the orange notes are all the 'A's.

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FretDancer69
Dec 9 2007, 01:35 AM
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QUOTE (DeepRoots @ Dec 8 2007, 05:58 PM) *
Hey Fretdancer-

You see the scale diagram- start playing it from the lowest orange note - our root note.

Its the 5th fret on the lowest E string, the A note.

Well our Am pentatonic starts here....if we assend up the scale to the 8th fret E string we have the second note ( C ) , our third note is 5th fret A string (D), our fourth note is 7th Fret A string (E) and finally our fifth note is 5th fret D string (G).

Now...

when we move to the next orange note in the scale we see that it is also an A note...and so begins the scale again.

So as you see- there are 5 notes, but more than one octave wink.gif



i see now, thanks alot man,

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Andrew Cockburn
Dec 9 2007, 02:14 AM
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QUOTE (FretDancer69 @ Dec 8 2007, 06:51 PM) *
thanks andrew. im addicted to theory now smile.gif


I'm glad smile.gif

And since you got 2 answers before I even read your question I see I am not needed around here anymore sad.gif

(just kidding - great to see others helping out with theory, and cool to see Kaneda back, even if it is just briefly wink.gif )

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FretDancer69
Dec 9 2007, 10:56 PM
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Sorry for bothering alot, but i have another question.... concering scales..unsure.gif:
  • When you create a scale (any) using the formula, how do you know when to change string?

For example, the formula for the Major Scale:

T T S T T T S

Ok, so its 2 tones first (4 semitones). Lets say we're construction a G# major scale so the first note would be G, and the second would be A, and the third would be a note after the tone... what im trying to say is, all the scale formula could be applied to the same string for example:

G# A# C C# D# F G G#

so there we have the scale, but all these notes are found on the E string (E string as an example), that would mean that the scale could be all these notes on 1 string, but i know its not that way, what i dont know, is how and why you change from string to string when constructing the scale?


thanks

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Andrew Cockburn
Dec 10 2007, 12:01 AM
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Aha! Very good question!

The answer is that there is no set way to do it.

Do it in one way and you will get boxes, do it slightly differently and you will get 3 note per string scales. Do it as you said and you can play the whole scale on 1 string. What these are, are patterns that reproduce the scale. Each scale has many possible patterns on the guitar, some are more useful and common than others - there are no rules on when to change string though, just convention, and convention is dictated by what works best. Boxes are good for beginners, and arpeggios, 3nps are great for fast speedpicking runs for instance.

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Kaneda
Dec 10 2007, 03:19 AM
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QUOTE (Andrew Cockburn @ Dec 9 2007, 02:14 AM) *
I'm glad smile.gif

And since you got 2 answers before I even read your question I see I am not needed around here anymore sad.gif

(just kidding - great to see others helping out with theory, and cool to see Kaneda back, even if it is just briefly wink.gif )


Stop the humble pie. You're essential, Andrew. smile.gif

Speaking for myself, I tend to just complicate things laugh.gif People would run away screaming if I ran the place wink.gif

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FretDancer69
Dec 10 2007, 05:04 AM
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QUOTE (Andrew Cockburn @ Dec 9 2007, 05:01 PM) *
Aha! Very good question!

The answer is that there is no set way to do it.

Do it in one way and you will get boxes, do it slightly differently and you will get 3 note per string scales. Do it as you said and you can play the whole scale on 1 string. What these are, are patterns that reproduce the scale. Each scale has many possible patterns on the guitar, some are more useful and common than others - there are no rules on when to change string though, just convention, and convention is dictated by what works best. Boxes are good for beginners, and arpeggios, 3nps are great for fast speedpicking runs for instance.



ohmy.gif I see ohmy.gif ohmy.gif thanks alot Andrew couldn't have explained it better, once again thanks! smile.gif

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Andrew Cockburn
Dec 10 2007, 12:10 PM
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QUOTE (Kaneda @ Dec 9 2007, 09:19 PM) *
Stop the humble pie. You're essential, Andrew. smile.gif

Speaking for myself, I tend to just complicate things laugh.gif People would run away screaming if I ran the place wink.gif


Here's the plan then - I'll lure them in with the simple stuff, then you nail 'em when they can no longer run away biggrin.gif

QUOTE (FretDancer69 @ Dec 9 2007, 11:04 PM) *
ohmy.gif I see ohmy.gif ohmy.gif thanks alot Andrew couldn't have explained it better, once again thanks! smile.gif


Cool smile.gif

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JensN
Feb 4 2008, 03:46 PM
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A great theory lessons Andrew. I have one question at the moment though.

As I've understood things (from other sources) one should always construct scales with accumulative letter names,
i.e. C D E F G A B, and then apply your scale pattern with sharps or flats as necessary to get your scale.

Now your example look like this:

QUOTE
So, we have built our scale of G# major according to our major scale formula to get the notes:

G# A# C C# D# F G


Was there a specific reason for the C C# choice?
I would have thought it would be G# A# B# C# D# E# F##
If I'm just confused and have gotten things completely wrong, please let me know. smile.gif

The acctual tones played on the fretboad for those 2 would be the same though, if I'm not completly lost...

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JensN
Feb 9 2008, 10:52 PM
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Anyone?
Am I totally off here?

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DeepRoots
Feb 9 2008, 11:04 PM
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QUOTE (JensN @ Feb 9 2008, 09:52 PM) *
Anyone?
Am I totally off here?

You are right smile.gif

I believe andrew wrote it like that as it is an introduction to scales, didn't want to confuse anybody with double sharps or a B# ("hey i thought there was no such thing?!?")

well picked up though - i see you are on the right track wink.gif

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Davidian
Feb 9 2008, 11:16 PM
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It's just a matter of notation, I think.
The 'formula' you wrote down, is exactly the same as the other one. The quoted one is, for me, the easiest. You can't get confused...
I think the way you chose to write down the formula, is the diatonic way, which means you never write the same letter dwon twice...



I am not an expert in this, and it could be wrong what I just wrote... But I hope it's right, and it helped you out wink.gif
EDIT: DeepRoots was faster than me...

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JensN
Feb 9 2008, 11:25 PM
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Thank you both.
I was a bit confused about it, but I'm glad to here I'm on the right track. smile.gif

Edit: and yes, now that you mention it, I can imagine how a B# and double # could be confusing as well.

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DeepRoots
Feb 9 2008, 11:36 PM
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Good to see you're having fun with it smile.gif

Now go have fun with the rest of Andrew's awesome series wink.gif

<clutches theory bible tightly> rolleyes.gif

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Andrew Cockburn
Feb 10 2008, 01:11 AM
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QUOTE (DeepRoots @ Feb 9 2008, 05:04 PM) *
You are right smile.gif

I believe andrew wrote it like that as it is an introduction to scales, didn't want to confuse anybody with double sharps or a B# ("hey i thought there was no such thing?!?")

well picked up though - i see you are on the right track wink.gif


Thanks for the defence DeepRoots smile.gif

Things get a bit hairy with that many harps and I didn;t want to confuse things but you are absolutlely correct.

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JensN
Feb 10 2008, 04:34 PM
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I'm indeed enjoying Andrew's theory lessons.
Big kudos for the effort you have put in here Andrew!

At the moment I have more time then usual to dig into theory since it seems I have been a bit over ambitious with exercises. I will let the guitars rest for a week or two to let my left hand get back into shape. But I think the theory lessons will be a huge advantage when I get back to playing again. smile.gif

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