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> Are You A Singer?, how beneficial it is for guitar players?
Ivan Milenkovic
post Jul 26 2011, 02:37 PM
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do you guys feel that singing is beneficial for guitar players? What type or singing can you do well? Can you sing properly when playing live, or do you sing when recording somwthing in the studio?


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HungryForHeaven
post Jul 26 2011, 03:04 PM
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I like to sing, although I don't do it well. I have a very limited register in which my voice sounds acceptable. I am more and more leaning towards taking singing lessons from a professional, something I have been wanting to do for years. ohmy.gif

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Adrian Figallo
post Jul 26 2011, 03:12 PM
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i do, my dad always told me that is super important for every musicians to master the instrument but also to sing, specially if you wanna get the gig, singing is ALWAYS a plus.


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Gabriel Leopardi
post Jul 26 2011, 03:27 PM
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I can't consider myself a singer but I can sing. I do backing vocals with my band and I'll like to explore a bit more my voice in the future.


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Sinisa Cekic
post Jul 26 2011, 03:54 PM
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Many friends say that my voice is desperate! And I believe them smile.gif


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superize
post Jul 26 2011, 03:56 PM
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I love to sing but i cant do it good but i am trying to learn to sing and play at the same time


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Ivan Milenkovic
post Jul 27 2011, 02:08 PM
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It seems it is definitely beneficial.


If you like to sing, how do you sing, do you sing a scale, or practice melody lines with guitar etc..


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HungryForHeaven
post Jul 27 2011, 10:11 PM
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QUOTE (Ivan Milenkovic @ Jul 27 2011, 01:08 PM) *
If you like to sing, how do you sing, do you sing a scale, or practice melody lines with guitar etc..

I basically just burst out in random songs or sing along to whatever I am listening to. In the car, especially.
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Cosmin Lupu
post Jul 27 2011, 10:44 PM
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I am very involved with singing actually - I am organizing a periodic singing workshop along with some good friends and I am also a vocalist in one of my projects, called Aria, which (shameless plug) if you haven't had the chance to, you can have a go at by listening to this little sample right here tongue.gif

https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/guitar_fo...showtopic=39823

Singing helps you develop many traits - ears, improvisation and composition skills, articulation and I do believe there can be even more smile.gif

Personally, I think that singing is crucial for any instrumentalist, it just makes the difference smile.gif


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Ivan Milenkovic
post Jul 27 2011, 11:06 PM
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Wise words from Cosmin and everyone. Do you think singing is an important part of being a guitar player? Do you think more doors are open when you know how to sing?


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El Fortinero
post Jul 28 2011, 07:49 AM
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well i am a singer, at least i try to be. and it really helps you. I used to sign in restaurants (for money of course) with backings tracks, melodic songs. Nowadays I just sing in my nu metal band.

I do not consider myself a great singer, my theory is great but my singing is not, and that's because i should practise more, simple as that.
Anyway i will try to tell you a few things about it:

*Singing can help you to create a solo. let me explain this, imagine you are creating a solo ; when you are not a great guitarist your fingers go to wherever they want to go in the scale, or to the usual positions, if you want to break this situation try to create the solo just singing it with your voice (without playing the guitar), that's the moment when the music that is inside your head appears, and then try to do it with the guitar. It has worked many many times to me, specially in slow solos

* Singing can help you with giiiiiiirllsss ( as Kris uses to say) girls haven't got a clue about sweep picking, shred, tapping, etc. but a tuned singer will always get laid, no matter how ugly you are (do u really need an example??)
so if we have a great great guitar player and another that just knows some chords but can sing properly, guess who will have action that night?


* become a singer is difficult :
-It takes many many years of training
- Expensive lessons
- luck of information / or worst: wrong information on the net
- it's really frustrating to hear your voice recorded, no ones like it and the reason of this is because our brain mixies the sound of our inner voice with the sound that we produce (the one that everybody hears), and gives you the idea that "you voice sounds like these" and when you hear your voice recorded, the mic just recorded the voice that came out, so you don't have that "mixing" with your inner voice and that's when you said "ey, that's not my voice, i do not sound like this".
- Tunnig is one of the keys of singing, if you don't practise it, you loose it

Singing has nothing to do with your voice,, is the same example if I say that you can't play the guitar because your hand is too small.
Have you ever heard your favorite singer speaking? does he sound so great? or is just another human voice? singing is a matter of where the sound will be produce (in your body), there are lots of techniques that changes the sound of your voice, or you really think that Dickinson speak in that way? smile.gif or axl rose, or S. bach, or Coverdale, etc etc

ok it's to broad these thread and it's 3:15 Am I should be sleeping sad.gif



just a few tips to improve your singing:

*loose your shame (the most difficult)
* practice tunnig, you can do this by playing the vocal melody of the song in the guitar (be sure it is perfectly tune) and singing it alltogether ( imitating each sound with your voice, do it slowly) if you are tune enough your voice will be mixed with the guitar.
* take a good breath every time you can in the song
*open your mouth when singing, not too much of course.
*go with a professional teacher, but try to find a good one, if she/he saids that you have to push with your diagpharm to hit higher notes, run away from him, that's old school singing, it's not good, it was meant to be for classical music, not suitable for rock stiles.


see the videos of singing success from Bret Manning in you tube . He coaches Paramore, Red, and lots of rock bands. Their videos are great but you will need some time to understand them. Also the best videos are the ones that you have to pay fo them ( as usual)
but again go with a professional. once your voice is damaged, theres is no turning back.

I repeat, i am not a great singer, but i know a lot of theory, so if you want to ask me something i'll be glad to help.
ok, hope you find it useful smile.gif 3:35 Am sad.gif

This post has been edited by El Fortinero: Jul 28 2011, 07:55 AM


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Cosmin Lupu
post Jul 28 2011, 08:14 AM
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Well summed up and detailed Nahuel! Good advice from someone with experience!

Needless to say that vocal coaching is an art in itself and you can always bump into people who think they can teach you how to sing but they actually have no clue on what they're talking about.

The whole deal with gaining technique as a singer is knowing your body and using it to achieve goals.

A few examples:

Anchoring - have you noticed the way Bruce Dickinson 'grips' onto the stage with both his legs well anchored? That is no ordinary rock n roll singer primp around mates smile.gif it actually helps him gain momentum in order to sustain long notes, in combination with his dorsal muscles which also help a in a huge amount!

Trust me, all these things which we may regard as being silly, are actually the key in becoming a proficient singer smile.gif


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Ivan Milenkovic
post Jul 28 2011, 08:23 AM
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Those are some awesome guidelines for everyone who is interested in singing, thanks a lot man! smile.gif


Do you guys have some similar tips to share with everybody? smile.gif


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CDP
post Jul 29 2011, 12:19 AM
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I used to be the worst singer in the world. When my kids were little and I sung to songs on the radio they would yell at me to stop. Even my loving wife told me to stop singing because it was upsetting her:-) Then I found some singing lesson cd's the most important thing for me was to sing to pitch and I would practice in the car going to work in 6 months time I was singing pretty well. Nobody complains anymore when I sing although I wouldnt call myself a singer. I think singing is vital for the guitarist. Because once you start singing to a chord progression you start to understand a relationship of melody to rhythm and cord progressions that you can never get from reading about it. My soloing got so much better and my ear for music got better to. You start to sing you scales or chord progressions while you play them and then you start to play whats in your head because you can sing it and match it on the guitar. I dont consider myself anymore than an intermediate guitarist but when I do take lessons from time to time the instructors always ask me how I learned melody and that is from singing. Hope this helps.

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thefireball
post Jul 29 2011, 03:27 AM
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Sure, singing can be a great skill to hone. I don't really sing much by myself (usually with a choir, so I don't really know what my voice can do on its own...if you know what I mean.


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Cosmin Lupu
post Jul 29 2011, 08:03 AM
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QUOTE (thefireball @ Jul 29 2011, 02:27 AM) *
Sure, singing can be a great skill to hone. I don't really sing much by myself (usually with a choir, so I don't really know what my voice can do on its own...if you know what I mean.


Choir makes you sing with a lowered larynx which is not that fancy in my opinion...


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Ivan Milenkovic
post Jul 29 2011, 10:06 AM
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QUOTE (Cosmin Lupu @ Jul 29 2011, 09:03 AM) *
Choir makes you sing with a lowered larynx which is not that fancy in my opinion...


What do you mean Cosmin? What is larynx, how does it affect singing?


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zen
post Jul 29 2011, 10:35 AM
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I used to sing .. stopped practising coz I could'nt devote enough time to it and guitar. sad.gif
I can link some old stuff if anyone wants to check it out.

Yes it helps guitar playing to an extent.


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Ivan Milenkovic
post Jul 29 2011, 01:25 PM
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Sure, some links would be great smile.gif


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Cosmin Lupu
post Jul 29 2011, 04:58 PM
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Alrighty guys, to answer Ivan - you can read a thorough definition in the link below:

Definition of the larynx

In classical music, people are trained to sing with a lowered larynx - technique which can induce some serious damage to the vocal chords (vocal folds) if not used properly.

Modern style singing uses a raised larynx - you can feel this phenomenon occur when you take a surprised breath once someone unexpectedly enters a room in which you are.

The idea is to be able to understand and maintain a raised larynx when singing - imagine that all the sounds you produce will come out from somewhere above your nose.

I you would have a lowered larynx, they will sound dark and coming from below the nose.

It is a whole theory regarding this subject so, I'll be happy to take the discussion further if you guys are interested !


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