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> Floating Fingers ..or Not?
Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 23 2011, 08:27 AM
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I have gotten used to keeping my fingers floating while alternate picking due to the fact that I mostly enjoy playing with hybrid picking as well so, I was thinking:

how do you prefer your right hand fingers while performing - floating or leaned towards the guitar body? What are the advantages of your approach?


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Ben Higgins
post Aug 23 2011, 08:40 AM
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For 'small, concentrated' techniques like alternate picking I rest my little finger towards the guitar body but for general riffing and strumming I let my whole hand move freely... whatever it needs to do at the time. It's a good idea to be able to do both smile.gif


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Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 23 2011, 10:14 AM
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Indeed, there are moments when resting a finger on the guitar body is necessary, although I feel very free when I'm not doing that tongue.gif

QUOTE (Ben Higgins @ Aug 23 2011, 07:40 AM) *
For 'small, concentrated' techniques like alternate picking I rest my little finger towards the guitar body but for general riffing and strumming I let my whole hand move freely... whatever it needs to do at the time. It's a good idea to be able to do both smile.gif



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SpaseMoonkey
post Aug 23 2011, 11:36 AM
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For chugging and digging into the strings I go free hand it seems to give me more strength and control for palm muting as well. Leads and faster licks I tend to plant the pinky. String skipping I'm just up in smoke about because neither way seems to feel comfortable with me, maybe I need to work it more? Last is sweeping I tend to do it the Herman Li way, I'm free hand and move the whole arm .


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Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 23 2011, 12:10 PM
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QUOTE (SpaseMoonkey @ Aug 23 2011, 10:36 AM) *
For chugging and digging into the strings I go free hand it seems to give me more strength and control for palm muting as well. Leads and faster licks I tend to plant the pinky. String skipping I'm just up in smoke about because neither way seems to feel comfortable with me, maybe I need to work it more? Last is sweeping I tend to do it the Herman Li way, I'm free hand and move the whole arm .


I've noticed a difference between Steve Vai for instance who likes to free float the hand when alternate picking and Michael Angelo Batio who plants more than the pinky, using his fingers as some sort of supporting device. Nevertheless, it works awesome for him, although it looks rather strange and uncomfortable.





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Michael AC
post Aug 23 2011, 12:25 PM
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Ok that just makes me sick! In a good way!

I do not think I will ever be able to play like that...argh!
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Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 23 2011, 01:07 PM
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QUOTE (Michael AC @ Aug 23 2011, 11:25 AM) *
Ok that just makes me sick! In a good way!

I do not think I will ever be able to play like that...argh!


Michael Angelo Batio is an amazing dude! He is NOT just a brainless shredding machine! I can guarantee that wink.gif


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ZzRenato
post Aug 23 2011, 01:30 PM
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Floating for all


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Ivan Milenkovic
post Aug 23 2011, 03:03 PM
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I have used my pinky finger very much anchored to the body for a number of practicing years, and still do sometimes. It doesn't really bother me that much. Floating, no floating, it's just about making nice relaxed smooth transitions/movements of the picking hand.


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Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 23 2011, 03:05 PM
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Nicely said Ivan! For instance I anchor my hand when I hold my guitar lower than usual, as it helps a lot when I move around.

QUOTE (Ivan Milenkovic @ Aug 23 2011, 02:03 PM) *
I have used my pinky finger very much anchored to the body for a number of practicing years, and still do sometimes. It doesn't really bother me that much. Floating, no floating, it's just about making nice relaxed smooth transitions/movements of the picking hand.



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Ivan Milenkovic
post Aug 23 2011, 03:26 PM
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QUOTE (Cosmin Lupu @ Aug 23 2011, 04:05 PM) *
Nicely said Ivan! For instance I anchor my hand when I hold my guitar lower than usual, as it helps a lot when I move around.


Good method for keeping the guitar with the body smile.gif


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slash48
post Aug 23 2011, 04:38 PM
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Hey Guys, important point- Grazing over the body of guitar with fingers is not a bad habbit.... It's when you have one or more of the fingers fixed on the body of the guitar and not moving that it is! This restricts wrist movement and creates tension- it's a bad habit.... Another point- Palm Muting is not a bad habit since it's consciously done to change the tonality of the notes and doesn't restrict wrist movement or create friction! What about Michael Romeo from Symphony X? He picks at blazing speed while anchoring.... It works for him because he preforms the gross movements with his wrist, and "picks" with his fingers. Most people don't do this....Steve Morse, great at picking while anchored but developed carpel tunnel in only his right hand.... Does it have to do with anchoring? Well, it does create tension!

If you don't believe me, believe physics. Physics will tell you that the least amount of surface area interacting with another surface equals less friction, and therefore, more speed.

Sorry for the rant but this is something I've thought for a long time about and wanna share what I know!
If you anchor try not anchoring, you just might like it.... Cheers!,
Dylan

This post has been edited by slash48: Aug 23 2011, 04:44 PM


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Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 23 2011, 04:53 PM
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No ranting mate! Not at all, your words are very true smile.gif thanks for sharing!

QUOTE (slash48 @ Aug 23 2011, 03:38 PM) *
Hey Guys, important point- Grazing over the body of guitar with fingers is not a bad habbit.... It's when you have one or more of the fingers fixed on the body of the guitar and not moving that it is! This restricts wrist movement and creates tension- it's a bad habit.... Another point- Palm Muting is not a bad habit since it's consciously done to change the tonality of the notes and doesn't restrict wrist movement or create friction! What about Michael Romeo from Symphony X? He picks at blazing speed while anchoring.... It works for him because he preforms the gross movements with his wrist, and "picks" with his fingers. Most people don't do this....Steve Morse, great at picking while anchored but developed carpel tunnel in only his right hand.... Does it have to do with anchoring? Well, it does create tension!

If you don't believe me, believe physics. Physics will tell you that the least amount of surface area interacting with another surface equals less friction, and therefore, more speed.

Sorry for the rant but this is something I've thought for a long time about and wanna share what I know!
If you anchor try not anchoring, you just might like it.... Cheers!,
Dylan



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K1R
post Aug 23 2011, 05:10 PM
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My pinky usually rests on the guitar. I was worried about it and wanted to tech myself to play without that "support". But then I saw this vid:


If Guthrie plays like this, then there is nothing wrong smile.gif

This post has been edited by K1R: Aug 23 2011, 05:10 PM


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Gabriel Leopardi
post Aug 23 2011, 05:13 PM
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I use both depending on what I'm playing. Using floating fingers allows me to play faster. I use my pinky anchored in the guitar body when I'm playing bluesy/melodic licks that are slow and must be played strong with my pick.


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slash48
post Aug 23 2011, 06:21 PM
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QUOTE (K1R @ Aug 23 2011, 12:10 PM) *
My pinky usually rests on the guitar. I was worried about it and wanted to tech myself to play without that "support". But then I saw this vid:


If Guthrie plays like this, then there is nothing wrong smile.gif


Don't get me wrong, I love Guthrie and he's possibly my favorite guitarist but what he's doing with his pinky is exactly what I would advice against.... Again physics will tell you that the least amount of surface area interacting with another surface equals less friction, and therefore, more speed. Therefore Guthrie Govan could have less tension and have the ability to play faster and be less prone to injury.... And just because a certain guitarist gets lucky and doesn't get injured doing it, there are still people like Steve Morse who would probably give an arm to recreate their picking technique into a floating one considering the injuries they've gone through. Oh, and by the way Guthrie is a perfect example of the restriction it has on wrist movement... Right when he needs to go to light speed, he picks with his forearm, not his wrist. I think the reason Guthrie hasn't been injured yet is he's only anchoring one finger on the body. The more fingers the worse, and he's just doing one.Saying So and So good guitarist plays with anchoring so there's nothing wrong with it is really kind of illogical because they had to overcome the problems with anchoring by practicing technique more then floaters.... Give floating an honest try K1R, you might like it better.
Cheers! (Great job with the sweeps by the way... Always refreshing to hear actually clean sweeps with good tone)

QUOTE (Cosmin Lupu @ Aug 23 2011, 11:53 AM) *
No ranting mate! Not at all, your words are very true smile.gif thanks for sharing!


No problem, just wanted to share my insights!

Cheers! smile.gif

Petrucci visibly relaxes at the end of every fast run and Steve Morse actually has carpal tunnel syndrome in both wrists.
Conversely, look how relaxed Shawn Lane and Paul Gilbert are when performing similar runs.

This post has been edited by slash48: Aug 23 2011, 06:13 PM


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Twinbroz
post Aug 23 2011, 06:56 PM
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Look up a japanese guitarist, Takayoshi Ohmura. He picks insanely fast without moving anything but his finger, a mix of economy picking know in jazz as circle picking.

His mentor and an also very well know Japanese guitarist know as Kelly Simonz also uses this anchoring. I feel people are too into western music. Stay open minded wink.gif
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K1R
post Aug 23 2011, 07:00 PM
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QUOTE (slash48 @ Aug 23 2011, 07:58 PM) *
Don't get me wrong, I love Guthrie and he's possibly my favorite guitarist but what he's doing with his pinky is exactly what I would advice against.... Again physics will tell you that the least amount of surface area interacting with another surface equals less friction, and therefore, more speed. Therefore Guthrie Govan could have less tension and have the ability to play faster and be less prone to injury.... And just because a certain guitarist gets lucky and doesn't get injured doing it, there are still people like Steve Morse who would probably give an arm to recreate their picking technique into a floating one considering the injuries they've gone through. Oh, and by the way Guthrie is a perfect example of the restriction it has on wrist movement... Right when he needs to go to light speed, he picks with his forearm, not his wrist. I think the reason Guthrie hasn't been injured yet is he's only anchoring one finger on the body. The more fingers the worse, and he's just doing one.Saying So and So good guitarist plays with anchoring so there's nothing wrong with it is really kind of illogical because they had to overcome the problems with anchoring by practicing technique more then floaters.... Give floating an honest try K1R, you might like it better.
Cheers!

I'm in the group of risk then, as I usually anchor ring finger too...Thanks for the information, mate. I will try not to anchor fingers.


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slash48
post Aug 23 2011, 07:43 PM
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QUOTE (K1R @ Aug 23 2011, 02:00 PM) *
I'm in the group of risk then, as I usually anchor ring finger too...Thanks for the information, mate. I will try not to anchor fingers.

I'm glad your switching! After you've practiced floating a decent amount let us know how you feel about it compared to anchoring....

Cheers mate, good luck with
the practice!

QUOTE (Twinbroz @ Aug 23 2011, 01:56 PM) *
Look up a japanese guitarist, Takayoshi Ohmura. He picks insanely fast without moving anything but his finger, a mix of economy picking know in jazz as circle picking.

His mentor and an also very well know Japanese guitarist know as Kelly Simonz also uses this anchoring. I feel people are too into western music. Stay open minded wink.gif


No sir. Takayoshi Ohmura is my favorite guitarist along with Guthrie and the Japanese guitarist of Galneryus, Syu. His phrasing, tone, solos, and riffing all are incredible.... I listen in a single day to Symphony X, Miles Davis, and Takayoshi, so yes, I consider myself open-minded. I'm aware of circle picking too.... But keep in mind Takayoshi Ohmura isn't JUST doing circle picking. We never do any pure technique. There are always other motions involved.... I myself can see wrist movement in Mr. Ohmura. There is also something called Sarod picking which is explained by Buckethead's teacher Pebber Brown on youtube which is circle picking with alterations. My general rule is big muscles for big jobs and small muscles for small jobs so although that would make me think circle-picking could be efficient, the thumb and first finger already have enough trouble holding on to and adjusting the angle of this silly piece of plastic to also function in moving it.... That's my philosphy and I'm sticking to it. biggrin.gif I know Kelly Simonz also and again, just because so and so good player uses anchoring doesn't mean it's a good technique, it just means they have to practice more on technique, and are more prone to injury. Again, it's not me telling you this, it's physics....
Blah, I'm bored of all this technique talk....
Cheers mate


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Sinisa Cekic
post Aug 23 2011, 10:17 PM
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QUOTE (Ivan Milenkovic @ Aug 23 2011, 04:03 PM) *
I have used my pinky finger very much anchored to the body for a number of practicing years, and still do sometimes. It doesn't really bother me that much. Floating, no floating, it's just about making nice relaxed smooth transitions/movements of the picking hand.


+1 biggrin.gif


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