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> Bascuthach's Scales
Cosmin Lupu
post May 11 2012, 09:47 AM
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Hey mate! this here is your personal thread smile.gif We shall discuss everything regarding your music/ guitar preparation, so, out of what I understood, you want to learn more about scales, right?

What is your current knowledge on scales?

let's rock!

Cosmin


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Bas Cuthach
post May 11 2012, 04:04 PM
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The simplest way to do this is to give you my link http://draziw.webs.com/tunerchordsscales.htm it shows a bunch of scales I have generated using the scale generator, just scroll down and it shows the shapes and full scales that I know, I want to learn more tricks to playing them and study them further as for now I just run up and down them, the E harmonic minor I start at the 12 fret, and I want to remember what I learn, anyways mainly I'm studying the E Harmonic minor as I want to Write My own metal song, from use of chords and progressions to the running of the scales, I know that there is another scale to use with the E harmonic, I dont know what scale it is

oh and because of my little problem yesterday I tested the link and it works smile.gif

This post has been edited by Bascuthach: May 11 2012, 04:33 PM
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Cosmin Lupu
post May 12 2012, 12:02 PM
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Hehe biggrin.gif Great to know you sorted it out mate!

Regarding scales and using them smile.gif I discovered, in time, that knowing a pattern of a scale won't automatically mean that you can use it smile.gif

Knowing how a scale sounds and being able to SING it's notes and intervals against chords, is a start in using that scale smile.gif of course, knowing the positions is crucial as this is your connection to the instrument - knowing where to place your fingers so that you may be able to reproduce what you can SING biggrin.gif

Being able to sing, means that you have internalized a certain musical phrase, scale, sound, whatever biggrin.gif it's already in you, all you have to do is get good at expressing it through the aid of an instrument - guitar, bass, piano, trumpet, voice, saxophone, harmonica...and the list goes on and on and on...

This is the approach I would like to use with you smile.gif

Am I making sense? biggrin.gif

Cosmin


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Bas Cuthach
post May 12 2012, 09:02 PM
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Right Right, I can play different parts of different scales, like I can play G Ionian and yet I have not memorized G Dorian, And then I can take this scale and make all the major chords, and then I need to take these chords and create a rhythm, and also Im trying to piece it all together and turn it into a heavy metal song, ok so I can play the first 3 shapes of the E Harmonic Minor scale starting at the 12 fret, now I need to build strength and speed while playing this scale and be able to switch between the 3 shapes also I need to learn how to build a good rhythm part, I can find chords but do not know what sounds good with what, something about if your using 7th chords then all the chords you use will be 7th chords, not sure if I got that right, so I can play basic open chords and basic power chords, I can find what chords I can play with the scale, something about when the chord changes so does the scale, so I have to find different ways to play the E Harmonic scales, create drums add bass, create rhythm and write a lead, I dont sing, toss it all together and bam I have my structure, now what sounds good, ok so I want to write a song, lets start with writing a rhythm, what type of chords should i play with and how can I go from a soft piece to a hard core piece and back again? Here is a picture I made for inspiration
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Cosmin Lupu
post May 14 2012, 11:09 AM
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Hey man! Nice pic! Are you a graphic artist as well? biggrin.gif So, to make a nice transition, you can use a few elements:

Rhythmic elements:

1) Breaks - use the drums only or a little formula which can create smooth transition
2) Pause- meaning that nothing is heard for a couple of bars - void wink.gif it can create incredibly powerful contrast!

Rhythmic and harmonic elements together:

1) Over the drum fill/ break, you can come up with a guitar and bass formula which adds power to the transition
2) In the Pause - the voice only or the voice with a clean strummed guitar or a guitar theme can take the piece from clean to MEAN biggrin.gif

Regarding the chords - things can be regarded in the following way:

- create a structure using normal chords (strum them and sing if you have a vocal line prepared - I found out that singing over clean chords, especially using an acoustic guitar, REALLY helps writing great songs)
- after being happy with the chords, see if you want to add more color and add some alterations such as 7ths, 9ths, 13ths maybe

So, this being said, record and send something my way and we can take it from there biggrin.gif

let's rock


Cosmin


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Bas Cuthach
post May 19 2012, 07:59 PM
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this is the last thing I wrote just before you signed me up, Im still trying to come up with something and better my skill for my next piece

http://soundcloud.com/bascuthach/say-it-is-e
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Bas Cuthach
post May 20 2012, 06:18 PM
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Ok, so the timming is 4/4 at 120bpm, the scale is E Minor Harmonic, so the question is... how to build a song, to build tension and release it how to build drum tracks, backings, progressions, licks, I dont sing so we wont deal with that, so lets break it down, lets start with an intro, the theme is war, do I start the song out fast or slow, my call, ok I like the slow feel and want to build up, measures... ? sounds, I need sounds, I have an digitech rp50 and I can kinda create sounds so, Im using hydrogen Drums for my beats, I think I have every thing I need, now lets compose a song, what am I missing?

This post has been edited by Bascuthach: May 20 2012, 06:20 PM
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Cosmin Lupu
post May 21 2012, 04:26 PM
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Hey mate, I'll think a bit on this one, for some ideas (will come back with some thoughts this evening or tomorrow morning). In the mean time, I started a thread in which I want to gather as many song writing and orchestrating ideas. Feel free to use it and add your experiences here. Song writing can only be don through trial and error and whatever ideas I will come up with are things which I will try and test as we go biggrin.gif it's almost never the same in this field, aside for some formulas or popular pop progressions.

https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/guitar_fo...mp;#entry585349

Looking forward to see your thoughts on this wink.gif

Cosmin


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Cosmin Lupu
post May 23 2012, 09:09 AM
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QUOTE (Bascuthach @ May 20 2012, 05:18 PM) *
Ok, so the timming is 4/4 at 120bpm, the scale is E Minor Harmonic, so the question is... how to build a song, to build tension and release it how to build drum tracks, backings, progressions, licks, I dont sing so we wont deal with that, so lets break it down, lets start with an intro, the theme is war, do I start the song out fast or slow, my call, ok I like the slow feel and want to build up, measures... ? sounds, I need sounds, I have an digitech rp50 and I can kinda create sounds so, Im using hydrogen Drums for my beats, I think I have every thing I need, now lets compose a song, what am I missing?


First of all, you can start by organizing your ideas:

1) Gather all the parts you have created and you want to incorporate in the song
2) Establish a song structure: you can start with a simple one such as A B A B C B (A - verse, B - chorus, C - bridge)
3) Once you got these down, see if the parts you have, can go well with one another, regarding the tonality, scales and most importantly TEMPO!
4) Think of a general groove for the song - it can be in any time signature, as long as it fits with the parts you decided to incorporate.
5) Try and record everything together and see how your first draft sounds like smile.gif

After doing this, send me a recording and we shall take it from there, chipping away at our block of 'musical stone' until we get the statue.

what do you think mate?

Cosmin


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Bas Cuthach
post May 23 2012, 04:48 PM
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Sounds Good, Lets see what I can do
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Bas Cuthach
post May 24 2012, 12:14 AM
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OK so here is my first run using this idea, It might not work due to sound cloud, if it does let me know what you think
http://soundcloud.com/bascuthach/untitled-song-2
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Bas Cuthach
post May 24 2012, 04:46 AM
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Im sorry, sound cloud is having some kind of issue with this I will try to resolve the issue as soon as possible


Ok, I guess I had to change the name and re-upload it, deep breath and here it is
http://soundcloud.com/bascuthach/trial-1


This post has been edited by Bascuthach: May 24 2012, 04:59 AM
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Cosmin Lupu
post May 25 2012, 03:49 PM
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Aloha mate smile.gif

Alright, now that we got the structure down, let's see - the parts fit together, but they sound pretty linear, right? Now it's time to figure out how to get rid of the linear sound smile.gif

I would start with the drums - re-write each passage belonging to each part, so that it may serve the riff played over it smile.gif at this point the drums are the same everywhere even if the phrases are different.

Let's see what you feel like doing over each part, drum wise, shall we?

Cosmin


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Bas Cuthach
post May 26 2012, 12:15 AM
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Ok but I have to redo the whole song as I can not just redo the drums, I write the drums first then I add to them, I have no other way to do the drum part, there for I will be rewriting the song
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Cosmin Lupu
post May 26 2012, 08:57 AM
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QUOTE (Bascuthach @ May 25 2012, 11:15 PM) *
Ok but I have to redo the whole song as I can not just redo the drums, I write the drums first then I add to them, I have no other way to do the drum part, there for I will be rewriting the song


Mornin' man smile.gif yes, it will take a LOT of re-writing - hope this won't take you aback somehow. When you write music, there are times when you will re-do things a few hundreds of times until they have the perfect shape and sound. For instance, there is this song I wrote with Aria, one of my bands, which has always given us a headache from the perspective of coming up with a good vocal line. It took us a year and a half of tryouts, until we were fully satisfied. THAT line, came a month ago smile.gif

Let's see what you can come up with from the perspective of making the drums serve the riffs.

Cosmin


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Bas Cuthach
post May 30 2012, 05:18 PM
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Ok so I created a drum set using ps3 guitar hero world tour drums, plugged them into the computer and a few programs later I had a fully working 5 piece and bass drum set, I cant keep timing laugh.gif so back to scales, I will start with the C major scale and and make a video of that, then I will work on the different shapes, I will show you what I know and then we can go from there, before I write music i should know how to play wink.gif
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Cosmin Lupu
post May 30 2012, 08:28 PM
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Ok Bas wink.gif but, if you trust me with singing what you're learning how to play, I will make your ears more prepared for song writing than anything!

biggrin.gif

Cosmin

PS: there's a ton of fun stuff we can work on, developing your ears, musical direction, chops and song writing abilities smile.gif


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Bas Cuthach
post May 30 2012, 10:42 PM
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QUOTE (Cosmin Lupu @ May 30 2012, 12:28 PM) *
Ok Bas wink.gif but, if you trust me with singing what you're learning how to play, I will make your ears more prepared for song writing than anything!

biggrin.gif

Cosmin

PS: there's a ton of fun stuff we can work on, developing your ears, musical direction, chops and song writing abilities smile.gif


are you talking about turning what I play on the guitar into actual words? My friend said to write about war, I study science
I know a little bit about singing like harmonizing or humming to what Im playing though I did not do it much, Im working on theory with Alex as of today, so where do you think this thread should go, should I keep trying to build a song and prefect it, I trust you this is why I came to you wink.gif

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Cosmin Lupu
post May 31 2012, 09:27 AM
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Hey Bas - as I told you when I think of singing, I am thinking about expressing your musical ideas by humming first using your voice. It doesn't matter what part of the song you are trying to reproduce - lead, riff, chords, melodies, whatever wink.gif the idea behind this, is that you are using your voice, the guitar or a bagpipe biggrin.gif to express the music you have in you. These are instruments, not the purpose of your work.

We can focus on songwriting of course, but in order for you to maximize your potential, you have to focus on some ear training, technical elements and learning how to apply theory, such as learning a scale and learning how to use it various contexts.

The recordings you sent are good to start building on, but as I told you, songwriting occurs in time and you can't get instant results just by placing riffs over a drum track. Each instrument has to serve the other and viceversa smile.gif

Let's take things slowly and you'll see that it's gonna work smile.gif

Cosmin


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Bas Cuthach
post May 31 2012, 06:46 PM
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ok, I took the time to read and understand what your saying, so I got offered a gig in a church band and this will help me with what your talking about and you can also help me achieve what im looking for, ear training, plus I need to work on chord progressions and adding to them, oh so much to learn, this is why I come to you, so where do we start, lets start there wink.gif
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