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> The Much Debated Digital Vs Analogue
Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 21 2012, 09:26 AM
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Guys, after posting a picture with the Aria guitar recording sessions, Gabe suggested I should share my thoughts on recording with a digital device rather than tube amps, which we used until now.

Fate had it that we had no studio at hand in this moment and we had to use the famed AxeFX smile.gif

All in a nutshell:

AxeFX - versatile, but way too complex for my taste. I simply don't like to spend that much time on figuring out a decent tone which I can use on a recording and that's a major downer.

Tube amps - every nuance is audible due to the high level dynamics, so you need to spend time recording as perfect as possible, but hey, the result can be brilliant, right? smile.gif

I can't say I dislike the results given by the AxeFX so far, but still (maybe I am too old fashioned?) I am craving after being able to record with a tube amp.

I will post samples of the tones we have created pretty soon, but until then let's share experiences on the matter smile.gif

Cosmin


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Ben Higgins
post Aug 21 2012, 09:46 AM
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I think it definitely comes down to how much time you spend with a certain type of technology.. this will reflect how well you can use it and get what you want out of it. I love tubes too but I think if we were to spend the same amount of time working with digital guitar software we'd probably get adept at getting great tone out of that too smile.gif

However, in saying that, I still don't want to swap ! smile.gif


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Aug 21 2012, 10:21 AM
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QUOTE (Cosmin Lupu @ Aug 21 2012, 09:26 AM) *
... versatile, but way too complex for my taste. I simply don't like to spend that much time on figuring out a decent tone which I can use on a recording and that's a major downer.

Tube amps - every nuance is audible due to the high level dynamics, so you need to spend time recording as perfect as possible, but hey, the result can be brilliant, right? smile.gif

...


Good point Cosmin - Sometimes we can have too much choice. Studio tme is expensive and it's not good to be under pressure trying to find a good tone. One of the great things about analogue is that the controls tend to be much more immediate and intuitive.


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Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 21 2012, 10:29 AM
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QUOTE (tonymiro @ Aug 21 2012, 09:21 AM) *
Good point Cosmin - Sometimes we can have too much choice. Studio tme is expensive and it's not good to be under pressure trying to find a good tone. One of the great things about analogue is that the controls tend to be much more immediate and intuitive.


Andy Timmons said it too biggrin.gif and it's in my head since I heard it (not these actual words, but this is the main idea) : 'I'm a guitar player not a sound engineer - I need to turn 3 knobs and make things sound good, so I can enjoy my playing, not spend hours to get a decent tone'



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zoom
post Aug 21 2012, 12:29 PM
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I agree. I started out with a pod and really struggle with tone even as a beginner. I don't have the patience even with my pod farm I use for uploading here I struggle. But plug in my fender blues junior with a few stomp boxes and wow! Easy.
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Ben Higgins
post Aug 21 2012, 12:37 PM
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QUOTE (Cosmin Lupu @ Aug 21 2012, 10:29 AM) *
Andy Timmons said it too biggrin.gif and it's in my head since I heard it (not these actual words, but this is the main idea) : 'I'm a guitar player not a sound engineer - I need to turn 3 knobs and make things sound good, so I can enjoy my playing, not spend hours to get a decent tone'


I agree. But then again I'm just not a gear head anyway ! smile.gif


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carminemarotta
post Aug 21 2012, 01:19 PM
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I just bought my first but small tube amp (a Blackstar HT5, 5w) and I am impressed on the huge difference between it and the POD HD: the sounds is way much better.

Carmine
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PosterBoy
post Aug 21 2012, 01:31 PM
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Andy Timmons is now in possession of an Axe Fx 2

Cosmin, the fractal forums are full of guys that do like to tweak and create great tones, I always start there.

Most of my patches are just slightly tweaked versions of a bank that YEK uploaded to the forum.

I still need to go through some of them as my goals and tastes change.

I have been with the Axe Fx for nearly 4 years, so I am well used to it (though the advanced options still baffle me!)


For versatility and to get lots of flavours you can't beat it, unless the studio has lots of amps and cab choices as well as mics and a decent engineer to position things just right.

I sometimes miss playing through an amp but not that often

This post has been edited by PosterBoy: Aug 21 2012, 01:33 PM


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The Uncreator
post Aug 21 2012, 01:38 PM
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I think this question has become irrelevant. For now, I can spot an Axe-Fx tone pretty quick. Axe-Fx, much like a 5150, or a Triple Rect, despits its variety of modelling, has shaped a sound of its own and has the digital signature. Not that any of thats bad, the Axe-2 is AMAZING.

That being said, soon, the difference won't be all that great. For now though, had I choice I would buy a 5150 smile.gif
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Todd Simpson
post Aug 22 2012, 12:49 AM
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Having had this O range Jim Root Dark Terror sitting on top of my VETTA and switching between them I can safely say I'm shocked, SHOCKED I SAY, and amazed just how different two amps can be.

It seems blatantly obvious sonically that the sheer, cahones of deep/rumbling/thumping/body/etc. of the Orange Tube just can't be denied and I was a skeptic. WOW this thing is MEAN. Size of a shoe box and accidently deafened myself when I forgot about the STANDBY switch. Oops.

The sonic character seems most apparent at mid gain. This is where the orange really does shine. Even delicate strikes are articulate and full bodied. Power chords are almost too big and need to be restrained. EVen an open G chords just feels deep and HUGE. That kind of body on the high strings, in the low mid seems to be something tube amps like this one really shine at.

The only fault I can find so far, and it's pretty minor, is that by itself, it's really, really, really hard to get the Terror to CHUNK/GRIND in a Metallic/Gears Grinding way. Not to say it isn't heavy. It's just not the amp for MESHUGGAH. Palm muted triplets are not really it's cup of tea IMHO. But it was never really designed for that. So for pretty much anything you throw at it, just rolling back the gain a bit or tweaking the EQ yields vastly different tones. Almost sounds like a different amp. Very flexible. But DimeBag Darrell, or Chuck Schuldiner would need to keep looking. It's got a HUGE DEEP Black Sabbath vibe that tones down to be a killer blues, rock, lead, rythm, amp.

I played the MESA MINI and it has COMPLETELY different character. MUCH more Bite, Grind, bit hotter on leads. However, rolling the gain back didn't do the same thing as it does on the orange. It seems the ORANGE is nearly a different amp at each point on the gain/eq dial. Vast differences in tone from little tweaks. The MESA was WAAAAAYYYY more METAL, but the Orange did seem more versatile. I hate to say it you need both.

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QUOTE (Cosmin Lupu @ Aug 21 2012, 04:26 AM) *
Guys, after posting a picture with the Aria guitar recording sessions, Gabe suggested I should share my thoughts on recording with a digital device rather than tube amps, which we used until now.

Fate had it that we had no studio at hand in this moment and we had to use the famed AxeFX smile.gif

All in a nutshell:

AxeFX - versatile, but way too complex for my taste. I simply don't like to spend that much time on figuring out a decent tone which I can use on a recording and that's a major downer.

Tube amps - every nuance is audible due to the high level dynamics, so you need to spend time recording as perfect as possible, but hey, the result can be brilliant, right? smile.gif

I can't say I dislike the results given by the AxeFX so far, but still (maybe I am too old fashioned?) I am craving after being able to record with a tube amp.

I will post samples of the tones we have created pretty soon, but until then let's share experiences on the matter smile.gif

Cosmin



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Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 22 2012, 07:17 AM
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Nice! Very nice! biggrin.gif Thanks Todd, well, I'd go for the Mesa anytime as it fits my band playing characteristics better, in respect to what you have told us about the Orange, but none the less. After watching this:



...I feel like maybe it's nicer to have a different amp for a different job and as the Captain Planet cartoon saying went back in the day: 'Let their powers combine!' for a serious sonic stage kitchen tongue.gif


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Max Sokolov
post Aug 22 2012, 10:14 AM
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Yes, that's a good point!
I still can't say, that I'm getting 100% best sound for me from my Axe FX.
It sounds great, but it always seems, that it can be better, but I don't like to spend lots of time on tweaking..


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Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 22 2012, 10:52 AM
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QUOTE (Max Sokolov @ Aug 22 2012, 09:14 AM) *
Yes, that's a good point!
I still can't say, that I'm getting 100% best sound for me from my Axe FX.
It sounds great, but it always seems, that it can be better, but I don't like to spend lots of time on tweaking..


I was expecting your input as well as Alex's, as the two of you are seasoned AxeFX users. I'll post the patches we've done and I pretty curious to see what you guys think smile.gif


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Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 22 2012, 12:18 PM
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QUOTE (carminemarotta @ Aug 21 2012, 12:19 PM) *
I just bought my first but small tube amp (a Blackstar HT5, 5w) and I am impressed on the huge difference between it and the POD HD: the sounds is way much better.

Carmine


Carmine! Hey man! How are you? Long time no speak smile.gif Can you tell us about your Blackstar experience? biggrin.gif


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carminemarotta
post Aug 22 2012, 02:58 PM
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QUOTE (Cosmin Lupu @ Aug 22 2012, 12:18 PM) *
Carmine! Hey man! How are you? Long time no speak smile.gif Can you tell us about your Blackstar experience? biggrin.gif


Hi Cosmin
I am well and you? I can't say a lot about the amp, since it is my first real one. However the difference with my Vox Valvetronix amp or the POD is big, very big, much more than I expected. I bought the HT1 and because I liked it so much I decided to return it and take the bigger brother. Very wise decision since the full EQ control, the foot-switch and the effect loop are well worth the difference in price (let alone the 5W against the 1W).
All the best
Carmine
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ztevie
post Aug 22 2012, 06:44 PM
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Being a "bedroom player" I must say that the piece of gear I've been most happy with is the Axe Fx II I got a few months ago... Everytime I turn it on it encourages me to play and never stop. I get this foolish lookin grin on my face cause it sounds so damn good!
I'va had a few amps in the past and also went thru some pods, but the Axe is in a league of it's own. Obviously I can't use a 100w tupe amp at home, but the Axe sounds so good, and has so many amps built in that I really can't imagine not having one now.
Even many factory persets sounds greta right out of the box, that was not the case with the Line 6 stuff. Also they keep developing it in a furious pace and it seems to get more open and alive each time a new firmware comes out.

I'm not a pro and I probably don't have an ear for the subtle differences tube vs Axe, but to my ears here at home the Axe is so open, allive, "tubey" and is so versatile with all the FX, amps and routing possibilities that it's all I ever need and more.
Of course you can tweak until your ears fall off, but the point is you don't have to. There are great patches available that will sound superb with minor adjustments to fit your own gear. With the Pod's I tweaked and tweaked and really never got that WOW-feeling. With tha Axe I don't tweak and have that feeling. I'm a happy camper!


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Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 23 2012, 08:58 AM
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QUOTE (carminemarotta @ Aug 22 2012, 01:58 PM) *
Hi Cosmin
I am well and you? I can't say a lot about the amp, since it is my first real one. However the difference with my Vox Valvetronix amp or the POD is big, very big, much more than I expected. I bought the HT1 and because I liked it so much I decided to return it and take the bigger brother. Very wise decision since the full EQ control, the foot-switch and the effect loop are well worth the difference in price (let alone the 5W against the 1W).
All the best
Carmine


Sounds like an exciting experience mate biggrin.gif I'm happy for ya! How about your practicing? You haven't been visiting your thread in some time sad.gif

QUOTE (ztevie @ Aug 22 2012, 05:44 PM) *
Being a "bedroom player" I must say that the piece of gear I've been most happy with is the Axe Fx II I got a few months ago... Everytime I turn it on it encourages me to play and never stop. I get this foolish lookin grin on my face cause it sounds so damn good!
I'va had a few amps in the past and also went thru some pods, but the Axe is in a league of it's own. Obviously I can't use a 100w tupe amp at home, but the Axe sounds so good, and has so many amps built in that I really can't imagine not having one now.
Even many factory persets sounds greta right out of the box, that was not the case with the Line 6 stuff. Also they keep developing it in a furious pace and it seems to get more open and alive each time a new firmware comes out.

I'm not a pro and I probably don't have an ear for the subtle differences tube vs Axe, but to my ears here at home the Axe is so open, allive, "tubey" and is so versatile with all the FX, amps and routing possibilities that it's all I ever need and more.
Of course you can tweak until your ears fall off, but the point is you don't have to. There are great patches available that will sound superb with minor adjustments to fit your own gear. With the Pod's I tweaked and tweaked and really never got that WOW-feeling. With tha Axe I don't tweak and have that feeling. I'm a happy camper!


Mate there's nothing wrong with the fact that you like it smile.gif I have been using tubes a long time now and I don't really feel like changing anything, after trying the Axe. But if you are a happy camper, that's just swell biggrin.gif


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carminemarotta
post Aug 23 2012, 09:36 AM
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QUOTE (Cosmin Lupu @ Aug 23 2012, 08:58 AM) *
Sounds like an exciting experience mate biggrin.gif I'm happy for ya! How about your practicing? You haven't been visiting your thread in some time sad.gif


Thanks Cosmin
since they stolen my pc, I haven't replaced it yet so can not record/follow lessons as much as before.

Take care
Carmine
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post Aug 23 2012, 01:10 PM
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PODs resemble the way guitars sound in a recorded album, and they do a fine job, or at least that's what it seems to me. Real amps sound better because it's an actual amp with a 12'', 2x12 or even 4x12 cab roaring in the room. How could a POD (or any other gadget) match that?

Once recorded, even with a mike on the amp, when you listen to it on a CD or ipod, the punch is not there anymore. That's why LIVE music is a blast, right?

Just my 2 cents wink.gif


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Cosmin Lupu
post Aug 23 2012, 01:16 PM
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QUOTE (carminemarotta @ Aug 23 2012, 08:36 AM) *
Thanks Cosmin
since they stolen my pc, I haven't replaced it yet so can not record/follow lessons as much as before.

Take care
Carmine


I had no idea about the PC Carmine sad.gif Very sorry to hear that mate. Hope you'll be able to catch up soon and get a new one smile.gif


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