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> Teodorom Jazz And Theory Mentoring
Alex Feather
post Nov 11 2012, 09:37 AM
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QUOTE (teodorom @ Nov 7 2012, 10:43 PM) *
Let me guess.
You write C6, Am9, Dm9, G11, C.
Let me read the last three chords as Dm7, G7, C MAJ 7. This is a standard ii-V-I progression.
The secondary dominant of Dm7 (in the key of C) is A7.
So I would read C MAJ 7, A7, Dm7, G7, C MAJ 7 as I-V/ii-ii-V-I.
I've found quite common to use Am7 instead of A7.
Or it is a I-vi-ii-V-I (quite common too) ?
But ... what is the relationship with the diminished scales ?
The Mark Levine book is trying to tell me something, but it is so difficult ...
Thanks
T.M.

I - VI - II - V - I is a very common progression
The diminished scale comes when you are getting to G7 chord!
By playing G diminished scale over it you will get a slightly outside jazz sound!
Now let's look at the scale it is a whole half diminished scale

as you can see it has:
A minor triad, C major triad

Now let's see half whole diminished scale


It has
G major triad and D minor triad without V
So basically you can play both scales over the whole progression!
Try it out and let me know what you think!


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teodorom
post Nov 11 2012, 06:23 PM
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Hi Alex,
here is my version of the track you asked for.
Again: it's far for being perfect, but this is the best I can do for now.
Quite all the "embellishments" you add are missing: here and there, now and then, I'm able to add them, but then sometimes I loose my tempo. So, in order to give you a reasonable version, I avoided most of them.
The main difficulty I have is on bars 17-21: sometimes I play ahead, sometimes I play after. This doens'nt happen when I play along you: I have problems when I play over the backing track. Please forgive me.
Thanks
Teodoro Marinucci
P.S. I don't understand your schemas: they appear identical to me ! More: the diminished or octatonic scale (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octatonic_scale) and the half-diminished or "Locrian ♮2" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half_diminished_scale) are different scales.
In fact the scale of my post of "Nov 7 2012, 10:25 AM" has 8 notes.

This post has been edited by teodorom: Nov 11 2012, 06:24 PM
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teodorom
post Nov 11 2012, 08:54 PM
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QUOTE (teodorom @ Nov 11 2012, 05:23 PM) *
P.S. I don't understand your schemas: they appear identical to me ! More: the diminished or octatonic scale (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octatonic_scale) and the half-diminished or "Locrian ♮2" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half_diminished_scale) are different scales.
In fact the scale of my post of "Nov 7 2012, 10:25 AM" has 8 notes.

I guess you are talking about the whole-half diminished scale and the half-whole diminished ()
scale that on the fretboard are the same: it depends on where the symmetry is.
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teodorom
post Nov 12 2012, 11:27 AM
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QUOTE (teodorom @ Nov 11 2012, 07:54 PM) *
scale that on the fretboard are the same: it depends on where the symmetry is.

This statement is wrong ! sorry about that.
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Alex Feather
post Nov 13 2012, 09:02 AM
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QUOTE (teodorom @ Nov 11 2012, 05:23 PM) *
Hi Alex,
here is my version of the track you asked for.
Again: it's far for being perfect, but this is the best I can do for now.
Quite all the "embellishments" you add are missing: here and there, now and then, I'm able to add them, but then sometimes I loose my tempo. So, in order to give you a reasonable version, I avoided most of them.
The main difficulty I have is on bars 17-21: sometimes I play ahead, sometimes I play after. This doens'nt happen when I play along you: I have problems when I play over the backing track. Please forgive me.
Thanks
Teodoro Marinucci
P.S. I don't understand your schemas: they appear identical to me ! More: the diminished or octatonic scale (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octatonic_scale) and the half-diminished or "Locrian ♮2" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half_diminished_scale) are different scales.
In fact the scale of my post of "Nov 7 2012, 10:25 AM" has 8 notes.

That sounded very very good! The only part that was a little off is the ending try to swing it a little bit more and don't do such a big pause in between the notes and it will be fine!
Also octaves could be a little bit more precise you can try using your fingers instead of the pick
Let me know how it goes and we can move on to improvisation on the same backing track!


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teodorom
post Nov 13 2012, 11:10 AM
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QUOTE (Alex Feather @ Nov 13 2012, 08:02 AM) *
That sounded very very good! The only part that was a little off is the ending try to swing it a little bit more and don't do such a big pause in between the notes and it will be fine!
Also octaves could be a little bit more precise you can try using your fingers instead of the pick
Let me know how it goes and we can move on to improvisation on the same backing track!

Thanks.
For sure my work on that track has not ended, that is I'm convinced that with the time (and working on something else) I shall improve that (it has always been impossible with me to repeat endessly the same track at perfection, I get ennoyed: improvement comes with variety).
In the octaves I'm using both pick and the fingers: perhaps the higher note are less distinguishable because I'm using a 10-46 gauge string set.
So, please, for the moment, let's move on.
Thanks
T.M.
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teodorom
post Nov 13 2012, 08:14 PM
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I tried, I tried, I tried, to improvise over your track.
But the results were still disappointing.
I was unable to see how the half-whole or the whole-half diminished scales could fit the backing track.
I don't know: yes I can try to improvise, but it this is my only task I guess I would stay there indefinitely.
On the contrary, playing tracks like the one I have just played, give me the feeling that my fingers are better moving on the fretboard.
Before I can try to improvise (seriously) I guess I should improve and learn so many things ...
Thanks
T.M.
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Alex Feather
post Nov 14 2012, 08:37 AM
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QUOTE (teodorom @ Nov 13 2012, 07:14 PM) *
I tried, I tried, I tried, to improvise over your track.
But the results were still disappointing.
I was unable to see how the half-whole or the whole-half diminished scales could fit the backing track.
I don't know: yes I can try to improvise, but it this is my only task I guess I would stay there indefinitely.
On the contrary, playing tracks like the one I have just played, give me the feeling that my fingers are better moving on the fretboard.
Before I can try to improvise (seriously) I guess I should improve and learn so many things ...
Thanks
T.M.

What do you mean how it fits? I think I explained why and how it works? I can try again and do it in more details?
You also need to get use to a sound! When I started playing diminished scales it sounded off but after a while I got use to it!
If you would like we can start slowly improvising and I will be adding new things as we will go along!
Let me know!


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teodorom
post Nov 14 2012, 10:37 AM
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Perhaps my problem is the lack of self-confidence, or exaggerate self-criticism, reality is that I don't like what I play (improvise).
In fact, when I was teenager, my friends in our band were used to tell me that I improvised better when being a little drunk ...
I know I have many other problems:
[1] I read to slowly (both the notes and the rhythm)
[2] I play too slowly
[3] The amount of chords I know is too limited
[4] My knowledge of the jazz theory stops before the modes
QUOTE (Alex Feather @ Nov 14 2012, 07:37 AM) *
If you would like we can start slowly improvising and I will be adding new things as we will go along!

Yes please !
Thanks
T.M.

This post has been edited by teodorom: Nov 14 2012, 10:38 AM
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Alex Feather
post Nov 15 2012, 06:57 PM
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QUOTE (teodorom @ Nov 14 2012, 09:37 AM) *
Perhaps my problem is the lack of self-confidence, or exaggerate self-criticism, reality is that I don't like what I play (improvise).
In fact, when I was teenager, my friends in our band were used to tell me that I improvised better when being a little drunk ...
I know I have many other problems:
[1] I read to slowly (both the notes and the rhythm)
[2] I play too slowly
[3] The amount of chords I know is too limited
[4] My knowledge of the jazz theory stops before the modes

Yes please !
Thanks
T.M.

Ok so give me a few hours to prepare a new assignment! We will start very slowly and I will explain what to play step by step over each chord I will also make positions easy to use and understand!


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teodorom
post Nov 15 2012, 08:32 PM
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QUOTE (Alex Feather @ Nov 15 2012, 05:57 PM) *
Ok so give me a few hours to prepare a new assignment! We will start very slowly and I will explain what to play step by step over each chord I will also make positions easy to use and understand!

My problem is that since I don't know what to do I don't practice ...
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teodorom
post Nov 16 2012, 07:58 AM
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QUOTE (teodorom @ Nov 15 2012, 07:32 PM) *
My problem is that since I don't know what to do I don't practice ...

Please don't feel asked to always provide some original material from your own.
What I'm asking is a consistent path along the (good) material contained in the GMC site, path allowing me to improve what are my weak points, together with some feedback.
Improvisation is ONE on these weak points, but I'm convinced that it would come once my overall knowledge of the instrument (and of the theory) has been largely improved.
I'm a patient guy, so that don't worry if you propose me Level 3 or Level 4 exercises. What I need, on the contrary, is the feeling that I'm clearly pointing somewhere.
Thanks
T.M.
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Alex Feather
post Nov 16 2012, 06:39 PM
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QUOTE (teodorom @ Nov 16 2012, 06:58 AM) *
Please don't feel asked to always provide some original material from your own.
What I'm asking is a consistent path along the (good) material contained in the GMC site, path allowing me to improve what are my weak points, together with some feedback.
Improvisation is ONE on these weak points, but I'm convinced that it would come once my overall knowledge of the instrument (and of the theory) has been largely improved.
I'm a patient guy, so that don't worry if you propose me Level 3 or Level 4 exercises. What I need, on the contrary, is the feeling that I'm clearly pointing somewhere.
Thanks
T.M.

Well the best way to get results is to be consistent I would suggest we will continue working on the same backing track just start with simpler scales at first and keep adding new once as we will move forward
So here is what I want you to do
|C6| Am9| Dm9| G11| C| over this part I would like you to play C major scale

| Am7| Bm7| D7| G6| G6| over this part I would like you to switch to G major scale

| F#m7| B9|E| G7#5| over this part I would like you to play F# Dorian
If you would like I can't post positions as well
Please record improvisation using scales I provided
This way I will be able to help you more we will continue adding new scales and positions as we will move along also in a few day I will be adding my takes to give you ideas
Let me know if you have any questions or need help with anything


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Alex Feather
post Nov 18 2012, 06:23 PM
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Just wanted to follow up and see how are you doing?
In a few days I will record a solo to give you ideas!
Let me know if you have any questions or need help with anything!


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teodorom
post Nov 19 2012, 12:22 AM
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QUOTE (Alex Feather @ Nov 18 2012, 05:23 PM) *
Just wanted to follow up and see how are you doing?
In a few days I will record a solo to give you ideas!
Let me know if you have any questions or need help with anything!

As I said, when I listen what I have recorded (improvising) I hear a monkey playing random notes on the keyboard.
Thanks
T.M.
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Alex Feather
post Nov 20 2012, 02:20 AM
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QUOTE (teodorom @ Nov 18 2012, 11:22 PM) *
As I said, when I listen what I have recorded (improvising) I hear a monkey playing random notes on the keyboard.
Thanks
T.M.

I think you are to critical to yourself! I need to hear you play in order to suggest areas you can improve! I am sure it doesn't sound like a monkey playing piano! smile.gif
The thing is everyone feel this way when I am improvising I feel that I am playing wrong stuff sometimes and there is nothing wrong with that! If you can hear your mistakes you improving!
I really would like to hear at least 12 bars of your improvisation! Also don't forget that there is no right and wrong in music everything sounds good as long as you believe in it!


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teodorom
post Nov 23 2012, 09:39 PM
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QUOTE (Alex Feather @ Nov 20 2012, 01:20 AM) *
I think you are to critical to yourself! I need to hear you play in order to suggest areas you can improve! I am sure it doesn't sound like a monkey playing piano! smile.gif
The thing is everyone feel this way when I am improvising I feel that I am playing wrong stuff sometimes and there is nothing wrong with that! If you can hear your mistakes you improving!
I really would like to hear at least 12 bars of your improvisation! Also don't forget that there is no right and wrong in music everything sounds good as long as you believe in it!

I see you point, but please, try to understand me.
I have no idea on how can I play the chords you told me. I attach what I have understood. The first 4 bars are ok, then the situation becomes more and more confused (at least for me).
Can I have the correct version please ?
How can I improvise if the chord sequence is unclear to me ?
Thanks
T.M.
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Alex Feather
post Nov 23 2012, 11:23 PM
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QUOTE (teodorom @ Nov 23 2012, 08:39 PM) *
I see you point, but please, try to understand me.
I have no idea on how can I play the chords you told me. I attach what I have understood. The first 4 bars are ok, then the situation becomes more and more confused (at least for me).
Can I have the correct version please ?
How can I improvise if the chord sequence is unclear to me ?
Thanks
T.M.

I have an idea how about we will schedule an hour Skype session where I can answer all your questions and make sure you understood everything!
Let me know and we will work something out!


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teodorom
post Nov 25 2012, 02:00 PM
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QUOTE (Alex Feather @ Nov 23 2012, 10:23 PM) *
I have an idea how about we will schedule an hour Skype session where I can answer all your questions and make sure you understood everything!
Let me know and we will work something out!

As I said I prepared some "improvisation" over the Jerry Arcidiacono lesson Jazz Notes 4 - Swing Rhythm.
I said "improvisation" because, even if the Backing Track comes from the Jerry lesson, and the Solo comes from GuitarPro.
It's not me playing at all !
Next: I have to learn it.
I tried to be less repetitive (and boring) as possible. You can judge ...
It took me two hours. My gap is among two hours and real time.
Enjoy !
Thanks
T.M.
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Attached File  Jazz_Notes_4_Swing_Rhythm.mp3 ( 592.17K ) Number of downloads: 33
Attached File  Jazz_Notes_4_Swing_Rhythm.gpx ( 47.77K ) Number of downloads: 112
 
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Alex Feather
post Nov 27 2012, 08:44 AM
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QUOTE (teodorom @ Nov 25 2012, 01:00 PM) *
As I said I prepared some "improvisation" over the Jerry Arcidiacono lesson Jazz Notes 4 - Swing Rhythm.
I said "improvisation" because, even if the Backing Track comes from the Jerry lesson, and the Solo comes from GuitarPro.
It's not me playing at all !
Next: I have to learn it.
I tried to be less repetitive (and boring) as possible. You can judge ...
It took me two hours. My gap is among two hours and real time.
Enjoy !
Thanks
T.M.

This solo sounds very good and I like what you did with it! Very melodic and nice! Not boring at all!
I think I figured out your system smile.gif You like to compose solo first and than learn it but it is not improvisation it is more composition It is a very interesting approach and I think it will help you because you are creating phrases and learning them!
Would you like me to create some licks for you to learn so you can start using them in your improvisation as well?


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