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Barthandelus
post Oct 30 2013, 08:22 PM
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Hi guys!

Need a little advice here - Im looking at some drum software, and the stuff that seems most popular is Reaper and Superior Drummer 2. I realise that SD comes with pre-made bars (phrases or grooves i think they call them?? Any difference?) Once i get these loops in to Reaper, can i tweak them note for note? Can i build my own drum tracks completely from scratch? As in a two kicks there, a snare there, drag it a long a bit, etc.?

Can i get other instruments for Reaper, such as strings, basses, synths etc.? I would like to make some backing tracks.

Also, what is the best way to get my amp connected to my sound card (an Asus Xonar D2) ? Some say the end of the effects loop to the line in on the sound card? My amp (Blackstar HT20) has an Emulated Output, which i *think* is a line out. Do i need any additional hardware between the amp and computer? A mic in front of the speaker isnt gonna work due to volume.

Any advice on this would be really helpful as iv never done this before! smile.gif

Thanks for your help, its appreciated.

-B
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jstcrsn
post Oct 30 2013, 10:25 PM
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QUOTE (Barthandelus @ Oct 30 2013, 08:22 PM) *
Hi guys!

Need a little advice here - Im looking at some drum software, and the stuff that seems most popular is Reaper and Superior Drummer 2. I realise that SD comes with pre-made bars (phrases or grooves i think they call them?? Any difference?) Once i get these loops in to Reaper, can i tweak them note for note? Can i build my own drum tracks completely from scratch? As in a two kicks there, a snare there, drag it a long a bit, etc.?

Can i get other instruments for Reaper, such as strings, basses, synths etc.? I would like to make some backing tracks.

Also, what is the best way to get my amp connected to my sound card (an Asus Xonar D2) ? Some say the end of the effects loop to the line in on the sound card? My amp (Blackstar HT20) has an Emulated Output, which i *think* is a line out. Do i need any additional hardware between the amp and computer? A mic in front of the speaker isnt gonna work due to volume.

Any advice on this would be really helpful as iv never done this before! smile.gif

Thanks for your help, its appreciated.

-B
first try http://www.asio4all.com/ , this should allow your amp to plug in to your computer .A better sound card(interface) would be the first thing I spend money on, most come with a daw light version, but you could just use reaper, you will pretty much have to lay out your drum track- reaper will just play/record what is programmed, also if you get a interface many of the ones that have protools light can't get plugins, I have been happy with presonus
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Darius Wave
post Oct 31 2013, 12:03 AM
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Very often soundcard's that are not at least semi-professional audio interfaces add a lot of noise to the signal (it has much to do with their placement in PC - distance from power supply etc). But yes - You can use Your blackstar emulated outpu - it's exactly the "line out" option for purposes like Yours

Yes - You can tweak the grooves of toontrack drums

Yes - You can bulid Your own. You can draw a midi files with DAW tools or just use external midi keyboard. I was never a good piano player so I decided to learn how to draw instead of how to play on midi keyboard


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coffeeman
post Oct 31 2013, 12:34 AM
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QUOTE (Barthandelus @ Oct 30 2013, 02:22 PM) *
Can i get other instruments for Reaper, such as strings, basses, synths etc.? I would like to make some backing tracks.


Yes you can can get other instruments, I recommend you to take a look at Native Instruments they have a big and cool collection of virtual instruments. They also have drum instruments but I haven't use them so I can't give you a review on them.

Take a look too at Addictive Drums ir has a lot of sounds, drum kits, and beats, and it sounds really cool.


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SirJamsalot
post Oct 31 2013, 05:58 AM
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I'm sure Todd will have tons of advice on this front, but until he chimes in, both Toontrack drum software options are really good. EZ Drummer is a cheaper option - I use it and have had really good success - programming drums to taste is very time consuming given every MIDI note has a myriad of options you can tweak to help the sound. Time swells, sound swells, articulations --- very difficult to do by hand. - I would recommend a package like SD or EZ that has samples you can drag and drop into your DAW's time line, then you can move the notes around - really reduces the time required to get the basics down.

here's a raw sample I did for a personal project. It has chokes, time swells, volume swells, etc. that I took and combined with other samples.

Much easier to "borrow" sounds that already exist!
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/46242175/DrumTrack.mp3



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Cosmin Lupu
post Oct 31 2013, 11:42 AM
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Hey buddy smile.gif The best results are obtained with using an external audio interface - they start from a pretty cheap level - around 50-70 bucks and of course the prices can reach huge levels in respect to the tech specs.

Now, that line out should go in the interface input and the interface should bring the signal into Reaper for instance - if that's what you are using. In respect to writing virtual instruments.. I totally recommend you to start writing instruments and drum grooves from scratch, using either a MIDI keyboard or your mouse. It's far better than importing grooves simply because you can write your own lines and serve YOUR musical purpose wink.gif

Create a MIDI track -> assign a virtual instrument on that track -> open up the so called 'piano roll' or grid window -> set the tempo and time signature and rhythmic subdivision that you want to work with and you're all set smile.gif


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jstcrsn
post Oct 31 2013, 02:07 PM
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there are also a few students that have threads learning what you have posted , these threads would be a quick starter for you as well
or I am sure this will help https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/guitar_fo...t=0&start=0
along with you tube having much help as well

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verciazghra
post Oct 31 2013, 02:15 PM
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HEY MAN! I don't know why these people are telling you to buy an external interface, your soundcard already supports ASIO! People, people! Not all built-in cards are rubbish! smile.gif

Okay, so don't get asio4all, it will hinder your built in asio to work. I'm not sure how well xonar d2 stacks against an external card but you definately wont have phantom power(which will only be a problem if you're using a condenser microphone). So for now you should be able to input your guitar to your soundcard altho the impedance might be off, so make sure you're turning the volume down on everything, (recording devices line in/microphone input) and also on the amp. If you're getting a lot of hiss check if your amp has a balanced line output. You may need some extra cables and junk to get it running smoothly, but try it before you go spending money on an external interface.


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Barthandelus
post Oct 31 2013, 04:18 PM
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Hi guys -
Thanks for all your help, i think i have a better idea where to go now. Think im gonna give it a shot!

One question - EZDrummer vs. Superior Drummer 2? Anyone got a real-world comparison?

Thanks again, all!
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verciazghra
post Oct 31 2013, 04:21 PM
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Like that? or?
QUOTE (Barthandelus @ Oct 31 2013, 04:18 PM) *
Hi guys -
Thanks for all your help, i think i have a better idea where to go now. Think im gonna give it a shot!

One question - EZDrummer vs. Superior Drummer 2? Anyone got a real-world comparison?

Thanks again, all!



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"To achieve great things, two things are needed; a plan, and not quite enough time." -Leonard Bernstein

"The only love affair I have ever had was with music." -Maurice Ravel

"There's no such place as dumb question." -Dose One
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Cosmin Lupu
post Oct 31 2013, 06:18 PM
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All the best mate - glad if we could help out smile.gif Post the first track or idea you come with, ok? We can help out further from that point wink.gif


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Todd Simpson
post Nov 1 2013, 02:37 AM
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Just saw this thread!!! Some great advice smile.gif To sum up!

1.)Many, but not all, built in sound cards are a bit rubbish but some are quite good smile.gif In most cases with laptops, your sound card is so close to the other components it can be more noisey than is ideal and very few built in units have high quality input/output such as "balanced" XLR and Quarter inch jacks.

THE TAKEAWAY

*Make the best of your current gear while planning to upgrade smile.gif If you can afford an external sound card/interface it will provide better inputs/outputs and get your sound processing away from your motherboard and other noisy bits wink.gif There are many interfaces to get you started, I'd say check out the FOCUSRITE SCARLETT and perhaps avoid maudio for the simple reason that Maudio tends to stop making drivers for their gear each time the company changes ownership or introduces a new product line.


2.)Superior Drummer or Ez Drummer?

THE TAKEAWAY

*Both are spiff and both will allow you to tweak the built in beats and build beats from scratch. Superior is a bit "Superior" to be honest but keep in mind that most folks have a copy of EZ drummer since it's a bit cheaper and you can get cool expansion packs so it's the choice you'll find in many home setups. Given that, i'd say start with EZ just for compatibility with other folks smile.gif

FINALLY! smile.gif

Check out the RECORDING WIKI!!!!


https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/wiki/index.php/Recording

This post has been edited by Todd Simpson: Nov 1 2013, 02:39 AM


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Barthandelus
post Nov 1 2013, 09:16 AM
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Thanks for all the replies guys - really good stuff.

Some people are saying that SD can be system-resource hungry; Im not planning on using a laptop - my machine i will be recording on is pretty beefy: 32GB DDR3 2400 RAM, I7 4.2GHZ CPU, nVidia 670 and the Xonar D2 soundcard is a seperate (not built in ti the motherboard) PCI Express card. (I do a lot of graphics work in Maya and After Effects, so i need that spec for that).

What i am afraid of is buying EZ but finding out a few months down the road that SD would have been better... Apparently SD sounds more naturally 'human' and less computerized? Not sample-wise, but from a dynamics perspective.
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PosterBoy
post Nov 1 2013, 10:02 AM
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I'd get Ez drummer, if you find you'd be better with superior drummer you can by an upgrade rather than have to spend the full amount on the program.

Check out Audiodeluxe.com for this stuff especially around Thanksgiving/Black Friday they will have awesome deals and discounts


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Darius Wave
post Nov 1 2013, 05:31 PM
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With Your PC You shouldn't be aware of SD memory usage wink.gif It works well even on my (last weeks of using - finally!) Athlon 2 x 2,6 2 GB RAM wink.gif And I'm do use a lot of plug-ins at one session so...that's not an issue You could consider with Your stuff wink.gif

But as Todd said...Price of cheap audio interface is uncompareble low comparing to profits You get out of this.


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verciazghra
post Nov 1 2013, 06:15 PM
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SD does sound "better" but it's much more difficult to use. In fact SD sounds so good that it's nearly impossible with good triggering and programming to tell the difference between SD and a real drummer. EZdrummer can sound really really good as well but it's more cumbersome to make it sound good since you don't have the same flexibility(which again adds up to it being more difficult to learn). So you basically have to do a lot of automation and channel sends inside your daw rather than in the plugin mixer. SD is a perfectly setup replica of a drummer studio, while EZDrummer is more of a garage with a couple of microphones and an 8 track.

Just my view, been using both for years.


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Cosmin Lupu
post Nov 1 2013, 07:06 PM
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QUOTE (Barthandelus @ Nov 1 2013, 08:16 AM) *
Thanks for all the replies guys - really good stuff.

Some people are saying that SD can be system-resource hungry; Im not planning on using a laptop - my machine i will be recording on is pretty beefy: 32GB DDR3 2400 RAM, I7 4.2GHZ CPU, nVidia 670 and the Xonar D2 soundcard is a seperate (not built in ti the motherboard) PCI Express card. (I do a lot of graphics work in Maya and After Effects, so i need that spec for that).

What i am afraid of is buying EZ but finding out a few months down the road that SD would have been better... Apparently SD sounds more naturally 'human' and less computerized? Not sample-wise, but from a dynamics perspective.


I also like SD more - but smile.gif BUT - Todd's post is a very good comparative perspective and it offers all the details that should make your thinking process direct you towards the right choice for YOU wink.gif Let us know what you have decided, mate!


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Barthandelus
post Nov 1 2013, 08:04 PM
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Listening to what people have said here, i thinking Im gonna plump for Reaper and EZDrummer for these reasons:

  • Less expensive
  • Quicker and simpler to use
  • Drum sounds come pre-tuned so i dont need to adjust every piece in the kit
  • I am not drummer, and have absolutely zilch experience with drum terminology and theory
  • I can use my PC keyboard as a makeshift MIDI device in Reaper. It will get me by. Ill be recording at home, so that will be plenty for now
  • If i find i need the features of SD or feel limited by EZ, i can crossgrade up to SD.


I think that should do it - my set up is at home, I am not in a band and the recording will be for myself (and to post online here for guidance)

Im doing a lot or exercises from this site at the moment, but im having a serious good time with the pirate metal lesson! Got it nailed at 130bpm, 20 more to go! Thats the one that gave me the idea to record, make some drums, etc. Im now in the position where i have more ideas than time to practice them all! smile.gif

Thanks again!

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verciazghra
post Nov 1 2013, 08:59 PM
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QUOTE (Barthandelus @ Nov 1 2013, 08:04 PM) *
Listening to what people have said here, i thinking Im gonna plump for Reaper and EZDrummer for these reasons:

  • Less expensive
  • Quicker and simpler to use
  • Drum sounds come pre-tuned so i dont need to adjust every piece in the kit
  • I am not drummer, and have absolutely zilch experience with drum terminology and theory
  • I can use my PC keyboard as a makeshift MIDI device in Reaper. It will get me by. Ill be recording at home, so that will be plenty for now
  • If i find i need the features of SD or feel limited by EZ, i can crossgrade up to SD.


I think that should do it - my set up is at home, I am not in a band and the recording will be for myself (and to post online here for guidance)

Im doing a lot or exercises from this site at the moment, but im having a serious good time with the pirate metal lesson! Got it nailed at 130bpm, 20 more to go! Thats the one that gave me the idea to record, make some drums, etc. Im now in the position where i have more ideas than time to practice them all! smile.gif

Thanks again!


I'm pretty sure you won't feel limited. If you have no experience SD will probably overwhelm! Perfect to start out with EZDrummer for you. Great choice! Have a blast with it!


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"To achieve great things, two things are needed; a plan, and not quite enough time." -Leonard Bernstein

"The only love affair I have ever had was with music." -Maurice Ravel

"There's no such place as dumb question." -Dose One
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Barthandelus
post Nov 1 2013, 11:50 PM
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Ok, so i bought EZDrummer and the Rock Solid EZX.
Im now looking for a bass guitar, strings / syth voices for Reaper. SpectraSonics Trilian looks great, but given with a price tag of nearly £200, its gonna be overkill. All im after is few bass guitars! :-)


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