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> Most Hated Metal Genre
Most Hated Metal genres
Name whatever metal genre that you hate the most
Classic Stuff [ 0 ] ** [0.00%]
Thrash [ 3 ] ** [4.29%]
Death [ 20 ] ** [28.57%]
Melodic Death [ 0 ] ** [0.00%]
Technical Death [ 1 ] ** [1.43%]
Speed [ 2 ] ** [2.86%]
Power [ 3 ] ** [4.29%]
Grind [ 1 ] ** [1.43%]
Pirate [ 0 ] ** [0.00%]
Drone [ 3 ] ** [4.29%]
Gothic [ 5 ] ** [7.14%]
Symphonic (And all the combos, Symphonic Death, Symphonic Goth ect.) [ 2 ] ** [2.86%]
Black [ 9 ] ** [12.86%]
Viking [ 0 ] ** [0.00%]
Progressive (And all the combos, Prog Death, Prog Power ect.) [ 0 ] ** [0.00%]
Hair [ 8 ] ** [11.43%]
Folk [ 3 ] ** [4.29%]
Female Fronted Bands In General [ 4 ] ** [5.71%]
A Combination Of The Above Genres Not Mentioned (Please Say Which) [ 1 ] ** [1.43%]
Other [ 5 ] ** [7.14%]
Total Votes: 70
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Robin
post Jul 22 2007, 07:42 PM
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QUOTE (Mer-V @ Jul 20 2007, 10:37 AM) *
And for the church's burnings, I don't see how 'paying respect to the native culture' in a land could justify destroying other people's sanctuaries. A church might mean s*** to them, but to a lot of other people it does have great vallue. I can see why some people might still be pissed off about something that happend decades ago, but back then, things were different. Nowadays, when you differ in opion about what so ever, you don't go bludgeoning each others head in and the winner gets to 'apply' his opion to the grey masses. We live in a time that two religions can live with each other, I believe its called 'peacefull coëxistance'.

Edited for language - Andrew


You're thinking about black metal, and I can assure you that everything negative you hear about black metal is extremely over exaggerated.

Varg Vikernes burned one church in 1993(I think?), he is a little messed up(still a freakin intelligent guy though), he is like a viking fanatic and I agree that chrstianity was brutal and cowards when they went around europe murdering people that didnt want to become christian. But! Even though I'm an atheist, I totally disagree with church burnings. NOTHING good can come out of it. Varg Vikernes, also known as "The Count" plays in Burzum and he is also known for killing Euroynomous, the guitarist in Mayhem, just if someone didnt know who he is. Media says that Varg killed Euroynomous becuase he wanted to be more "evil" than him(damn you VH1), but it was actually becuase Euroynoumous was a total bitch. Long story, and probably not as true as he says himselfs, but they were both a little messed up, but none of them were satanists. None were.

And yes, after Varg burned the church(also becuase he wanted to sell his CD's, wich he did), there were MANY kids around the world that called themselfs "satanist" becuase they thought it was cool, and they burned churches. There was also a couple of other guys that had the same opinion as Varg Vikernes and burned some churches.

Darkthrone, Immortal, Mayhem, Aura Noir, Emperor etc. etc., all of those bands plus many more are norwegian, they arent satanists at all, even though most people think that. They arent evil or nothing, they are regular guys, some of them have a great, uhm, "self ironi", I dont know the English words for that, but you know, they can joke about themselfs even though they have "evil" music.
Gorgoroth is the only black metal band I know of that call themselfs satanists. They havent burned any churches though. They are freakin nice guys in real life though, documentarys and stuff from TV gives a wrong impression. Its kind of an image thing, but man they are nice guys if you meet them.

Recently I heard of some Italian(?) group of people that started burning churches, but if you think how many percent of all black metal fans and bands that burn churches, its REALLY small. Most of the people who call themselfs satanists say it becuase they think its cool.

Also, there are different types of satanism. LaVey satanism(if I remember the name correct) is almost like Atheism actually. I saw a documentary about it, totally normal guys, and when they had "satanic rituals" they were just maknig fun of themselfs.

Gorgoroth are also satanists, but as I said, I met their vocalist on Friday, wich "is" gorgoroth, he is in all gorgoroth interviews and stuff, and he was a 100% regular guy. Laughed and talked.
His type of satanism isnt bad either, even though he might seem crazy when you see him on TV. He said that the only true God were in nature and that the christian God was just a control freak, wich I sort of agree with, eventhough I'm an atheist. "Satan" means freedom, and thats sort of what most satanists believe in. Believe in yourself and humanity.

Sorry for the long post, I just hate it when people get a totally wrong impression of black metal smile.gif Its all about the music!

QUOTE (Andrew Cockburn @ Jul 21 2007, 07:09 PM) *
Guys, this is a guitar forum, and the religious stuff is off topic.

If you want to discuss this, please start a thread on the Off Topic board, although I'd rather you didn't because discussions about religion like this are contentious and unlikely to conform to GMC posting standards unless conducted with respect and tolerance.

We're discussing about a music genre that involves alot of religion, in a few cases atleast/highly exaggerated, as I said in the post above. I personally dont see the problem, but if you want me to delete my post, no problem.


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LanceB
post Jul 22 2007, 08:34 PM
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You met Gaahl? thats awesome!


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Fsgdjv
post Jul 22 2007, 08:51 PM
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I'm sorry for being such an ass about this, but Otep is not the same band as Opeth, don't mix them up to whoever did. (Sorry if you didn't mix them up though:P)

And, listen to Robin, he's right about the black metal and church burnings stuff. (except I'm not quite sure that Varg really did burn that church down, as I understand there were no evidences except that he knew there was a dead bird or whatever it was at the church when it was burned down? I might be totally wrong about this, but meh. He just seems to smart to burn down a church, even though he also seems mad enough to do it.)


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Robin
post Jul 22 2007, 08:59 PM
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QUOTE (Fsgdjv @ Jul 22 2007, 07:51 PM) *
I'm sorry for being such an ass about this, but Otep is not the same band as Opeth, don't mix them up to whoever did. (Sorry if you didn't mix them up though:P)

And, listen to Robin, he's right about the black metal and church burnings stuff. (except I'm not quite sure that Varg really did burn that church down, as I understand there were no evidences except that he knew there was a dead bird or whatever it was at the church when it was burned down? I might be totally wrong about this, but meh. He just seems to smart to burn down a church, even though he also seems mad enough to do it.)

He sort of went to the newspaper and confessed it(atleast according to a documentary I saw. Satan Rides The Media, finally a journalist that is neutral and not against one side or another). It was becuase he wanted to sell his music, and he did! biggrin.gif He thought it was worth sitting in jail for a couple of years for that.
Buuut he got sentenced to the worst punishment in Norway becuase of 8 Church burnings, but only one of them was him(according to the documentary and himself...), and of course the murder of Euroynomous.

So far he have been in jail for 14 years, I think he will be released next year. 14 years is freakin redicilous. There are much, much, much, much, much, MUUUUUUUUUUCH worse crimes in Norway wich gets like (literaly) one week jail becuase he says he forgot to take his medicin. And then they stay at this hospital for about a year and then they are free men. This have happened in one case atleast.

This post has been edited by Robin: Jul 22 2007, 09:03 PM


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Owen
post Jul 22 2007, 10:59 PM
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QUOTE
Darkthrone, Immortal, Mayhem, Aura Noir, Emperor etc. etc., all of those bands plus many more are norwegian, they arent satanists at all, even though most people think that. They arent evil or nothing, they are regular guys


Apart from the fact that Emperor are disbanded;

QUOTE
In the autumn of that year, the police began to investigate the murder of Euronymous of Mayhem, naming Varg Vikernes (of Burzum) as a suspect; this investigation eventually led to the incarceration of Samoth for arson, and of Faust for the murder of the homosexual man in Lillehammer.


One of its members was a crazy homophobe, the other a church burner. They're a bit wrong in the head.

QUOTE
Samoth, then-Emperor bassist Tchort, members of the band Mayhem and Varg Vikernes (Burzum) went on a spree of church arsons that struck fear in Norway during the early-mid 90s. Samoth and Tchort were arrested and given jail sentences, which put Emperor in a bit of a stand-still; they would not release their second album for another three years as the rest of the band awaited Samoth's parole. Tchort would not return to the band.


Black metal is a bit daft anyway, to believe in Satan you have to be a Christian essentially anyway, to say that its a set of beliefs is really a whole load of crap to cover up the fact that its a completely stupid idea.


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Robin
post Jul 22 2007, 11:25 PM
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QUOTE (Owen @ Jul 22 2007, 09:59 PM) *
Black metal is a bit daft anyway, to believe in Satan you have to be a Christian essentially anyway, to say that its a set of beliefs is really a whole load of crap to cover up the fact that its a completely stupid idea.

I forgot to say that satanism isnt about a guy named Satan. Satanists dont believe in a "God", as I said, they believe in themselfs and humanity. "Satan" means freedom in some language, dont remember wich. There are like 5-6 different types of satanisms, but as far as I know none of them have a "God" named Satan.

And I also mentioned that most "Satanists" are just kids that think its cool, they dont know what it is about. Still alot of kids like this on some internet communities, man they are stupid.

Oh and, why do you say "Black metal is a bit daft anyway, to believe in Satan you have to be a Christian"?
Almost none of the big(or less known bands for that matter) norwegian black metal bands are satanist.
Varg Vikernes have never been a satanist, he burned down that church becuase his hostility against christianity and to promote his music, yes he is a moron. But very few actual black metal bands do this, as I've said a hundred times, most of them were just kids. The first church burnings took place in Norway by a few people, like Varg. And after that people all over europe did this, mostly stupid kids. The only black metal band I know of that are actually satanists are Gorgoroth. But they dont believe in a guy named Satan, they believe that the only true God is in nature.
I'm a little sick of people always combining black metal with satanism.

Sure, some of the lyrics are satanic(most of the time anti-christ, not really satanist). But take a look at Power Metal bands for instance. Are they really warriors running around killnig everyone? Do they really want war? Do death metal bands really want death and torture? Slayer got some satanic/anti-christ lyrics, but in a interview with Slayer they said that they didnt really mean anything with it, they just thought it was a really good title. "God hates everyone" or something.
I know not all death/power metal bands sing about this, but neither does black metal bands.

My point is, even though black metal lyrics some times involves satanic lyrics they doesnt necessarily mean it. Dark music got to have dark lyrics smile.gif Aaaaand as I said, even if they are satanic, it doesnt necessarily mean that they worship some guy named Satan, becuase they dont believe in any kind of God, just in themself and humanity.

Sorry if it looks like I want to start a fight, but I just dislike it when people missunderstand black metal. Its all about the music, thats what most people say. But few people understands the music, you got to give it time to like it. Got to grow onto you.

Edit: just had to add: When I write lyrics, I (often)dont mean anything with them. Its just fantasy or ironic things, whatever comes in my mind. And I'm pretty sure many bands does this. I like fantasy in music, movies, TV series or whatever. I'm an atheist, but what would Star Wars and Battlestar Galactica been without religion? Nothing. I think its the same about music. If everyone only wrote stuff that is real and stuff they believe in, there would have been so little variation. Nile for instance, write about Egyptian myths and stuff, it doesnt necessarily mean that it have happened. They are probably just fascinated by the stories. I'm pretty sure you know more about Nile than me, but you get my point tongue.gif

This post has been edited by Robin: Jul 22 2007, 11:38 PM


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SLASH91
post Jul 23 2007, 12:12 AM
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My dad works in a hospital. And one day he came home, and said he opperated on some guy who said that he was a member of some group called Wicca or something. This guy actually said that he served satan. So, I think theres is actually a group who believes in God and satan.

This post has been edited by SLASH91: Jul 23 2007, 12:12 AM


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Robin
post Jul 23 2007, 12:19 AM
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QUOTE (SLASH91 @ Jul 22 2007, 11:12 PM) *
My dad works in a hospital. And one day he came home, and said he opperated on some guy who said that he was a member of some group called Wicca or something. This guy actually said that he served satan. So, I think theres is actually a group who believes in God and satan.

Probably. But the norwegian black metal bands dont. Not even Gorgoroth.


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Owen
post Jul 23 2007, 12:31 AM
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I did indicate in my posts that the whole "its a set of beliefs" thing is a bit daft too, although I tend to tread on the path of thinking that most organised religion is a bit misleading.

As you know I do not like power metal bands for exactly the reasoning you gave above.

I dont "misunderstand" Black Metal, dont get me wrong, I know what its all about, I just cant understand the logic of the concept behind it, or any other forms of metal where people are just singing fantasy - to put emotion into something you have to sing in what you believe. Dragons, Faries and the Devil all seem to be fictuitous therefore have no emotion.

Would it be fair to conclude that most of both Black and Power metal bands have no emotion in their lyrics? If so, what is the point in listening to them.

This post has been edited by Owen: Jul 23 2007, 12:32 AM


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Robin
post Jul 23 2007, 12:50 AM
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QUOTE (Owen @ Jul 22 2007, 11:31 PM) *
I did indicate in my posts that the whole "its a set of beliefs" thing is a bit daft too, although I tend to tread on the path of thinking that most organised religion is a bit misleading.

As you know I do not like power metal bands for exactly the reasoning you gave above.

I dont "misunderstand" Black Metal, dont get me wrong, I know what its all about, I just cant understand the logic of the concept behind it, or any other forms of metal where people are just singing fantasy - to put emotion into something you have to sing in what you believe. Dragons, Faries and the Devil all seem to be fictuitous therefore have no emotion.

Would it be fair to conclude that most of both Black and Power metal bands have no emotion in their lyrics? If so, what is the point in listening to them.

I must say I strongly disagree with that fantasy and superstition in music got no emotion. Black metal is all about emotion really. I think most bands have certain songs about superstition. Probably not bands like RATM and SOAD, political stuff. But most metal bands write about superstition, and if not superstition, they dont necessarily mean it. Slayer write about horrible torture and stuff like that, but I really doubt they want stuff like that to happen to anyone. But it fits the genre, and thats great. I'd rather listen to magical stories than listening to standard pop lyrics(going to a party etc.) or political stuff.

Just to get this straight, do you think black metal is bad becuse of the lyrics? In that case you should dislike Power metal and many, many other genres becuase of that aswell.
You like death metal right? As far as I know bands like, for instance Nile and Bloodbath dont write lyrics about stuff they mean/believe is real. Aaaaand also, black metal bands dont only write anti-christian lyrics. Darkthrone for instance, write about old sword fights, cold woods and mountains, war(like all other metal genres does), old myths and stories etc. etc.
And of course I know death/power/whatever metal bands dont write only about wars and torture.

I'm pretty sure most metal bands write about myths and stories etc. etc.

This post has been edited by Robin: Jul 23 2007, 12:52 AM


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Owen
post Jul 23 2007, 12:54 AM
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As I have stated more than enough times now - I dont like power metal.

Your not addressing the fact - how can someone put emotion into something they think is not real?

If you pretend say, that you have the worlds best guitar, can you really enjoy having it, no, because you know full well it does not exist.


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Robin
post Jul 23 2007, 01:05 AM
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QUOTE (Owen @ Jul 22 2007, 11:54 PM) *
As I have stated more than enough times now - I dont like power metal.

Your not addressing the fact - how can someone put emotion into something they think is not real?

If you pretend say, that you have the worlds best guitar, can you really enjoy having it, no, because you know full well it does not exist.

Thats something totally different. Thats like saying you cant enjoy Lord of the Rings becuase its just a story.

But do you really dislike every band that write about anything else than stuff that excists? In that case, you probably hate most bands and genres that excist. Is Iron Maiden bad? Are all black metal bands bad? Does power metal sucks ONLY becuase of the lyrics? Does Slayer suck?
etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.

And pretty please, answer this: You like death metal, right? Dont anyone of the bands you listen to write about torture and death or myths and stories? Becuase every death metal(extreme metal bands in general) band I've listened to, write alot about torture and death, but do they really want it? So if I understand you correct, a band can write about death and torture only if they want it to happen, but if they dont really want it, but just write about that becuase it fits the genre, the band sucks?


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JCJXXL
post Jul 23 2007, 01:10 AM
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QUOTE (Robin @ Jul 22 2007, 01:42 PM) *
Varg Vikernes burned one church in 1993(I think?), he is a little messed up(still a freakin intelligent guy though),


Hmm... obviously not intelligent enough to know the difference between right and wrong.

The problem I have with Black Metal is not even how crappy it sounds... it's about tthe message. What they sing about.

How can singing about negative acts or imagery benefit anyone?
And the comment about them singing about some crazy stuff but they don't really believe it is absurd I think.
In order to sing about something don't you have to believe in it? I mean how many of us would sing or play a tune we weren't into or made us feel uncomfortable? Obviously they are very comfortable with the message their music sends out. So that tells me what type of people they really are.

Let me give you an example to help you understand better, lets say there is a band that sings about pedophile type behavior but none of them have ever acted on it.. they were just regular nice guys. How many of you would be comfortable with that?

This post was not to continue the religous beliefs/disbeliefs discussion but more of my opinion as to why I can't stand black metal.
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Robin
post Jul 23 2007, 01:20 AM
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QUOTE (JCJXXL @ Jul 23 2007, 12:10 AM) *
Hmm... obviously not intelligent enough to know the difference between right and wrong.

The problem I have with Black Metal is not even how crappy it sounds... it's about tthe message. What they sing about.

How can singing about negative acts or imagery benefit anyone?
And the comment about them singing about some crazy stuff but they don't really believe it is absurd I think.
In order to sing about something don't you have to believe in it? I mean how many of us would sing or play a tune we weren't into or made us feel uncomfortable? Obviously they are very comfortable with the message their music sends out. So that tells me what type of people they really are.

Let me give you an example to help you understand better, lets say there is a band that sings about pedophile type behavior but none of them have ever acted on it.. they were just regular nice guys. How many of you would be comfortable with that?

This post was not to continue the religous beliefs/disbeliefs discussion but more of my opinion as to why I can't stand black metal.

What do black metal bands sing about? Whats the message? Why all this hate only against black metal? Have any of you read what I wrote in the posts above? Have you read any death, thrash, power or heavy metal lyrics? They are often about war, death, torture, superstition, but does all those bands suck?
If I understand you guys correct, you disliked black metal mostly becuase of the lyrics? Gaaaah, just read what I've said above.

Black metal is FAR from the only genre that write about war, supersticion, myths, stories etc. etc.
And black metal bands doesnt only write about satanism.

I find it frustrating that people can dislike all black metal becuase of the lyrics, but still so many other genres, even the genres you listen to yourself, write about similar stuff. I dont care if someone hates black metal, but when people say that it sucks becuase the genre often have lyrics about stuff that isnt real and you even listen to genres that does the same freakin thing. Technically you should dislike every band that have lyrics about stuff that isnt real/things they dont actually mean, and that list is extremely long.

This post has been edited by Robin: Jul 23 2007, 01:22 AM


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JCJXXL
post Jul 23 2007, 01:25 AM
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Why would I (or anyone else) want to listen about death and torture?

Sounds pretty depressing. So basing our decision on whether something sucks or not because of the lyrics is lame eh? So my pedophile example in my previous wouldn't bother you at all?

It would bother me not only as a listener but more so as a human being.


* It seems Slash91's poll has touched on a sensitive subject for some. I think it's an excellent topic to discuss but I am afraid some people are going to lose focus of this being a guitar forum.

This is why it's always best to not discuss religion or politics unless absolutely necessary because for the most part people are set in their ways/beliefs. And discussion on those topics usually bring the ugly out of people.

Maybe it's time for a mod to lock the topic?

This post has been edited by JCJXXL: Jul 23 2007, 01:29 AM
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Owen
post Jul 23 2007, 01:29 AM
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Slayer are pretentious, they sing about something they dont believe in then state that they dont believe in what they are saying, there is no point in that. It's like me writing a whole album about how Jesus Died for Our Sins whilst knowing all the time that this is not what I believed, its misguiding, its unintelligent and its evident that Slayer only do it to be the overaged scene kiddies that they are.

Iron Maiden, now they're just old geriatrics who ran out of ideas after their first albums, they never really had anything to say and like to be hypocrites, for example, to quote Brucie in the same article twice:

"Iron Maiden like to buck the trend, we're totally different from everyone else"

"I was looking for my tight leather 'Rockstar' pants."

Cmon' these guys are not for real, the whole 'Eddie' thing is just hilariously daft as well, "lets have a monster on our covers! lol!"

Does it mean anything? No, its just twaddle.

Then we have the Power Metal bands, lets not forget them, recycling Tolkeins Novels like it was going out of fashion, sure, they tell a story, that someone else wrote nearly 100 years ago and that everyone else has recycled since then, you cant sing about Dragons with conviction, stories should be taught with a purpose, a moral or an expression of something, Tolkeins novel was that, there are very close links to it and the war, it re-tells something that happened in real life. Power Metal bands do not do this, they sing about crap because they have nothing else to say, or because they find it "fun", that's not exciting, thats not expression, thats boring.

As for most Death metal bands, yeah its mostly rubbish, "rararararTexasChainsawMassacrerararar" but at least there are some Death styled bands who actually have lyrical subject to admire, bands like Opeth are a good example, Death is something we all experience in our lives, we all know we are destined to it and we see other people experience it, whether you find people singing about it distasteful is another matter, but it is a very real subject, its not pretentious or diluted if you find any of it that is pure.

Therefore what I am saying is that the Majority of Metal is rubbish, there are a select few bands from within it, that actually have something to say or for us to admire, the rest is all wrapped up in its own vanity, its about expression of beliefs, not copious amounts of leather, dragons and preachings of non events.


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JCJXXL
post Jul 23 2007, 01:32 AM
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QUOTE (Owen @ Jul 22 2007, 07:29 PM) *
"rararararTexasChainsawMassacrerararar"


Too funny. Thanks for the laugh. LOL.
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Robin
post Jul 23 2007, 01:40 AM
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QUOTE (JCJXXL @ Jul 23 2007, 12:25 AM) *
Why would I (or anyone else) want to listen about death and torture?

Sounds pretty depressing. So basing our decision on whether something sucks or not because of the lyrics is lame eh? So my pedophile example in my previous wouldn't bother you at all?

It would bother me not only as a listener but more so as a human being.

Heh, there are many fans of death, thrash and black on this planet, obviously many people want to listen to that, and not becuase they want it to happen or anything, but becuase it fits the genre and in some cases it can be a bit amusing and terryfing, wich obvisously many people enjoys. I dont know what you listen to, so I'm not gonna say any more about that to you, but I know Owen listens to death metal, and death metal often write about torture, death, war etc. I'm not saying they only write about this, probably alot more, but it sounds like you guys are saying that all black metal bands only write lyrics about satanism, and I know that many, many, many, many bands and genres that write these kind of lyrics, and I know that many, many, many, many people are fans of these bands.

And btw, are all movies and books based on stories crap? Dont they have any emotion at all? Stories in general, are they crap? Does the Bible suck becuse many of the stories have probably not happened?


Yes, I am a freakin bitch, but I'm not giving up untill I get a answer why Black metal lyrics are so much more crappy than all other genres. Both death and thrash(etc. etc......) have alot of lyrics based on the same freakin thing as black metal.

So, every band that have songs about stuff that havent happened or they maybe dont believe in it sucks? Slayer sucks? Nile sucks? Iron Maiden sucks? And every black metal band that excist sucks, the whole genre is just garbage, am I right now?


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Owen
post Jul 23 2007, 01:47 AM
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Ugh... your not listening. Read what I'm saying properly please.

QUOTE
stories should be taught with a purpose, a moral or an expression of something, Tolkeins novel was that, there are very close links to it and the war, it re-tells something that happened in real life


I believe this answers this point :

QUOTE
And btw, are all movies and books based on stories crap? Dont they have any emotion at all? Stories in general, are they crap? Does the Bible suck becuse many of the stories have probably not happened?


Stories have morals and principles - thats exactly what the bible is - Noah may not have been real, but his story tells people not to get overly greedy, that is the underlying message, thats why stories are good, because they say something.

As for Black Metal, how can something be classified as it if they're not singing about the lyrical subject as dictated by genre, that makes no sense, what do Black Metal bands sing about if not Satan? And if they do sing about other things are they strictly Black Metal bands.


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Andrew Cockburn
post Jul 23 2007, 01:59 AM
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QUOTE (JCJXXL @ Jul 22 2007, 08:25 PM) *
Maybe it's time for a mod to lock the topic?


I'm keeping tabs on this thread since it has the potential to upset, however, debate is good - since my last warning it has been mostly civil, if it stays that way there is no problem


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