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> 7 royalty cheques that’ll make you lose your faith in the music industry
klasaine
post Feb 22 2014, 06:00 PM
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As both I and Tony Miro mentioned, this is nothing new at all.
The techniques for denying a musician their money has 'evolved' lets say but the story is ages old. We've always had to chase our remuneration and it's always been a game of hide and seek. I see it as part of the job description. That's why I posted a link to that book - financial music history from 40+ years ago.

You want more, here:
http://www.amazon.com/Are-We-Still-Rolling...g/dp/0977990311
http://www.amazon.com/Hit-Men-Brokers-Insi...eywords=hit+men
http://www.amazon.com/Confessions-Record-P...record+producer
http://www.amazon.com/Million-Dollar-Mista...ds=moses+avalon

This post has been edited by klasaine: Feb 22 2014, 06:21 PM


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Cosmin Lupu
post Feb 23 2014, 04:14 PM
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QUOTE (klasaine @ Feb 22 2014, 05:00 PM) *
As both I and Tony Miro mentioned, this is nothing new at all.
The techniques for denying a musician their money has 'evolved' lets say but the story is ages old. We've always had to chase our remuneration and it's always been a game of hide and seek. I see it as part of the job description. That's why I posted a link to that book - financial music history from 40+ years ago.

You want more, here:
http://www.amazon.com/Are-We-Still-Rolling...g/dp/0977990311
http://www.amazon.com/Hit-Men-Brokers-Insi...eywords=hit+men
http://www.amazon.com/Confessions-Record-P...record+producer
http://www.amazon.com/Million-Dollar-Mista...ds=moses+avalon


I have a pretty extensive list of martial arts books I have to buy, so these will have to wait a little, but thanks for the recommendations Ken. Looks like experience is speaking out loud here smile.gif What's the nastiest experience you have lived in respect to remuneration issues and the sort?


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klasaine
post Feb 23 2014, 06:49 PM
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My point in listing all those books (and there's plenty more) is to illustrate that it's always been rough for artists to re-coup.

On a positive note I'll add that there's plenty of avenues where one can collect monies that isn't always advertised or discussed because it's 'not exciting'. If you write music make sure you copyright your music, register with a licensing agency (BMI, ASCAP, SESAC, GESAC, ICMP) and maybe even set up your own publishing company. If you want to sell and/or license to TV or film you can not only collect an initial fee but then accrue residual or re-use money (mailbox money). It's not a hard thing to do. The more you write, the more you submit, the better your chances for 'placing' something. You just need to have your paperwork together.

QUOTE (Cosmin Lupu @ Feb 23 2014, 07:14 AM) *
What's the nastiest experience you have lived in respect to remuneration issues and the sort?


When I first started doing real recording sessions I actually worked (briefly) 'on staff' at a small record company (Total Experience Records). After not getting paid for a particular session - I complained a little. An exec at the Rec Co. asked me into his office, pulled a .45 out of his top desk drawer, laid it on the desk and asked me if I still had a problem with the payment schedule?
I know he wasn't gonna shoot me but I was probably 21 and easily intimidated. Needless to say that was also my last session for TE records, lol!

It's also pretty normal for the entire band to 'convince' a club owner or manager that he needs to pay you after you've played. *Lots of great stories about bands unplugging and packing up the club's mixing board and power amps in lieu of payment.

There have been many times where I just haven't been paid for services rendered or paid less than the agreed upon rate or paid 3 to 6 months after the gig, etc. All businesses have to deal with client non-payment occasionally. The music biz in no different. I haven't had hundreds of thousands of dollars in royalty payments denied to me for stupid reasons or band contracts so I consider myself fortunate. I also don't get bent out of shape when I have to chase down payment - it's not a big deal to me (I consider it normal).
I read those books I mentioned so that I don't make the same mistakes and more importantly for my circumstances - stay away from artists that are making those mistakes.

This post has been edited by klasaine: Feb 23 2014, 08:27 PM


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Cosmin Lupu
post Feb 24 2014, 11:44 AM
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QUOTE (klasaine @ Feb 23 2014, 05:49 PM) *
My point in listing all those books (and there's plenty more) is to illustrate that it's always been rough for artists to re-coup.

On a positive note I'll add that there's plenty of avenues where one can collect monies that isn't always advertised or discussed because it's 'not exciting'. If you write music make sure you copyright your music, register with a licensing agency (BMI, ASCAP, SESAC, GESAC, ICMP) and maybe even set up your own publishing company. If you want to sell and/or license to TV or film you can not only collect an initial fee but then accrue residual or re-use money (mailbox money). It's not a hard thing to do. The more you write, the more you submit, the better your chances for 'placing' something. You just need to have your paperwork together.



When I first started doing real recording sessions I actually worked (briefly) 'on staff' at a small record company (Total Experience Records). After not getting paid for a particular session - I complained a little. An exec at the Rec Co. asked me into his office, pulled a .45 out of his top desk drawer, laid it on the desk and asked me if I still had a problem with the payment schedule?
I know he wasn't gonna shoot me but I was probably 21 and easily intimidated. Needless to say that was also my last session for TE records, lol!

It's also pretty normal for the entire band to 'convince' a club owner or manager that he needs to pay you after you've played. *Lots of great stories about bands unplugging and packing up the club's mixing board and power amps in lieu of payment.

There have been many times where I just haven't been paid for services rendered or paid less than the agreed upon rate or paid 3 to 6 months after the gig, etc. All businesses have to deal with client non-payment occasionally. The music biz in no different. I haven't had hundreds of thousands of dollars in royalty payments denied to me for stupid reasons or band contracts so I consider myself fortunate. I also don't get bent out of shape when I have to chase down payment - it's not a big deal to me (I consider it normal).
I read those books I mentioned so that I don't make the same mistakes and more importantly for my circumstances - stay away from artists that are making those mistakes.


Pfff, I hope I will never be at gun point in any situation. Man, that's a bit weird. I also have friends that happen to wait a lot of time until the companies which hired the band for a certain event, will be sending the money. In the contracts, it is always stated 'the payment will be sent in an interval of up to 30/45/60 or even 90 days from the invoicing date'. Frankly, that sux big time for the artist, because, hey I need that money NOW not in 3 months. But no company will ever care, unfortunately and this is also happening in other fields as well.


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klasaine
post Feb 24 2014, 06:02 PM
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The entertainment business has always been run by criminals.
Technically, I wasn't at 'gunpoint' ... he just laid it on the desk so I could see it. Many freelancers carry a weapon. I don't but more than a few times I've glimpsed pistols inside a trumpet or sax case.


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Palacios
post Feb 24 2014, 06:18 PM
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QUOTE (klasaine @ Feb 24 2014, 09:02 AM) *
The entertainment business has always been run by criminals.
Technically, I wasn't at 'gunpoint' ... he just laid it on the desk so I could see it. Many freelancers carry a weapon. I don't but more than a few times I've glimpsed pistols inside a trumpet or sax case.

I used to do electrical contracting, and it's defiantly a huge problem there to. It's not uncommon to be owed thousands of dollars, and not get paid for 90 days or more. Many times the people won't have the money, but still need the work done; so they screw with you for long periods of time. After a while you develop a 6th sense on who pays, and who doesn't. Unfortunately California only allows for a $1000 deposit; even if the project is $100,000. Musicians don't really ask for a lot of money, and should be paid immediately. There is really just some unscrupulous people in the world. That's why I love working for somebody. I get paid every week, I don't need to look for customers, I don't need to bid on stuff, I don't need to be a slave to people demanding stuff 24/7. The best part is I can get laid off, and focus on my passion of traveling and playing guitar.

This post has been edited by Palacios: Feb 24 2014, 06:19 PM
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Cosmin Lupu
post Feb 25 2014, 09:17 AM
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QUOTE (Palacios @ Feb 24 2014, 05:18 PM) *
I used to do electrical contracting, and it's defiantly a huge problem there to. It's not uncommon to be owed thousands of dollars, and not get paid for 90 days or more. Many times the people won't have the money, but still need the work done; so they screw with you for long periods of time. After a while you develop a 6th sense on who pays, and who doesn't. Unfortunately California only allows for a $1000 deposit; even if the project is $100,000. Musicians don't really ask for a lot of money, and should be paid immediately. There is really just some unscrupulous people in the world. That's why I love working for somebody. I get paid every week, I don't need to look for customers, I don't need to bid on stuff, I don't need to be a slave to people demanding stuff 24/7. The best part is I can get laid off, and focus on my passion of traveling and playing guitar.


I am more of a free spirit and I can't work for someone who is paying me but in the same time, I can't look up to that person and say 'Hey, I learned a whole deal from this guy and I have evolved!' In my country, there's a lot of people with a good nose for moneymaking but not ok from any other perspective. I also like being a hunter smile.gif


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