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> Pedal Multi-effects And The 4 Cable Method
Spock
post Feb 28 2014, 02:00 PM
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I found this excellent "how-to" on another forum. This particular thread talks about the Marshall JVM and a PodHD 500, but the same can be used for any amp with an FX loop and a unit like a Boss GT100.

I decided it was time to clean up my pedal board, and since I loved my old Pod HD500 so much, before I destroyed it, I decided to go ahead and get a new unit.

So, with the 4 cable method, you can bypass the amp models inside the Multi-FX unit and then decide which FX you want before the amp and which FX in the FX loop - 100% utilizing the true tone of your tube amp.

I am not the most mechanically minded person in the world, but I'm confident that after a while the programming and operations will become much easier - and the best thing, you can hit 1 pedal to control an entire range of tones. From Clean Green to Red OverDrive 2 with Gate, Chorus, Delay and EQ boost.

Anyway - take a look if you're interested in this sort of set-tup, it is the ultimate starting point for figuring this stuff out.

The Quick Guide - 4CM Setup
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Darius Wave
post Feb 28 2014, 03:24 PM
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I did something similar with my old boss me-5. Connection order was

Guitar --> boss input --> boss send to amp input -->amp send to boss return --> boss out to amp return.

This wa I had the amp's preamp in fx loop of a boss and I could edit signal chain and NOT USE DISTORTION FROM BOSS smile.gif

Good luck with Your experiments. I think it's a good way smile.gif


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Gabriel Leopardi
post Feb 28 2014, 04:35 PM
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The link is broken. I used this method in the past and I recommend it 100%! I used it with my old Pod X3 connected to my Mesa Boogie dual rectifier and the results were very good. The main difference is the improvement in delays and modulation effects like chorus and phaser.


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NPB1979
post Feb 28 2014, 05:00 PM
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Just to be clear, overdrive, fuzz and distortion ( i would also argue wah) should never be in an effects loop.

But delay, chorus, flange, and tremolo should be if they can be?
Just wanting to understand this correctly.

My my simple mind, it's two extra cables that could be faulty or an effects loop could have issues. I always like to play around with pedals, but when it's gig time, I do bare essentials to minimize a cut signal for whatever faulty or bad luck reasons.


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Spock
post Feb 28 2014, 10:01 PM
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QUOTE (Gabriel Leopardi @ Feb 28 2014, 10:35 AM) *
The link is broken. I used this method in the past and I recommend it 100%! I used it with my old Pod X3 connected to my Mesa Boogie dual rectifier and the results were very good. The main difference is the improvement in delays and modulation effects like chorus and phaser.



This is great news Gab. I may need to pick your brain when I get stumped. In theory I understand it, but I am not grasping on how to change Amp channels with the Pod yet. The channels would have to be assigned midi numbers, and I assume that would require using a midi cable too. I am mainly excited about noise reduction, better lead tone, less cables in my set-up (which any one of those could have been causing grounding issues).

I'm just hoping to learn all this stuff quick, have a nice clean set-up with a good sound and stay inspired. Changing up ever so often keeps things fun and interesting.
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Spock
post Mar 1 2014, 12:36 AM
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QUOTE (Gabriel Leopardi @ Feb 28 2014, 10:35 AM) *
The link is broken.



Try this one: Starts at the 2nd post in this thread...

http://jvmforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f...752c80afd9757ef

QUOTE (Darius Wave @ Feb 28 2014, 09:24 AM) *
I did something similar with my old boss me-5. Connection order was

Guitar --> boss input --> boss send to amp input -->amp send to boss return --> boss out to amp return.

This wa I had the amp's preamp in fx loop of a boss and I could edit signal chain and NOT USE DISTORTION FROM BOSS smile.gif

Good luck with Your experiments. I think it's a good way smile.gif



It's good to read you say this. Back in 99-2000 or so, I was in a band and attempted it with a Marshall JCM 2000 and a Digitech Artist 2120 - it was WAAAAAY too difficult for me to set up, so I ended up putting everything in the front and taking out the amp models. That unit was a beast, but I felt I needed to be a NASA engineer to figure it out. I ended up selling my 2120 to the same guy I purchased my 94 PRS from - and he still uses it to this day, and I still use the 94 PRS.

Line 6 opened up new doors for me with their ease of use interface, especially now that you can do everything on the computer and download it to the units via USB. I thought hard about getting the Boss because many of my friends have them and love them, but I wanted less of a learning curve and even with what I know about these units, this is going to be at least a small mountain to climb.

This post has been edited by Spock: Mar 1 2014, 12:38 AM
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Darius Wave
post Mar 2 2014, 12:49 PM
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It works best with amps having MASTER VOLUME. Otherwise when You move the channel volume, You affect the level of signal going back to the processor. Easy to get unwanted distortion but...it is possible smile.gif I was doing those experiments because I could never make myslef using distortion other than built-in from the amp...but...I wanted to have compressor section before the amp and delay section after the amps distortion. And it worked smile.gif

Most common issues with such a connection is the ground lops issue. You really have to organize all the power supplies perfectly


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jstcrsn
post Mar 2 2014, 01:17 PM
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don't know if this helpls
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Spock
post Mar 2 2014, 01:52 PM
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Great vid, I had watched a few but not seen that one.

I have it set-up and working, but as of right now I do not know how to change patches with my feet - still clicking on different patches on the computer to change them - then within each patch there is a selection of mods, compressions, eq,s, tube screamers and stuff which I can turn on and off with my feet. This is not the way I want it set up ideally, but it's a starting point. My goal is to press 1 switch and it change everything to exactly what I'm wanting for either rhythm or lead, including all the different mods and stuff. But I like the way these patches are set-up and the guy was nice enough to upload them to the forum for anyone to download.

I'm using the master volumes on the Marshall. Right now I have the volume on the Pod at 100% and all the other knobs turned all the way down to 0. On my amp, I have everything set at 12 o'clock, except master volume, and my gain at around 10:30 or 11 on the OD1 channel.

This is not even a set-up, however the sound is great, but I will tweak everything once, I've finished reading the pod manual and have a basic understanding of it.

When I had the older unit before, I used it only for recording direct, and didn't utilize it this way, so this is all new to me.
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jstcrsn
post Mar 2 2014, 03:03 PM
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QUOTE (Spock @ Mar 2 2014, 01:52 PM) *
Great vid, I had watched a few but not seen that one.

I have it set-up and working, but as of right now I do not know how to change patches with my feet -

you step on it ohmy.gif
okay , I know this was no help, but I couldn't resist
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Darius Wave
post Mar 3 2014, 09:55 AM
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Damn it...I was just about to write the same tongue.gif Sorry smile.gif)) So...The foot switches don't work now?


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Spock
post Mar 3 2014, 10:43 AM
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Oh yes the foot switches work, and I can press the bank up and down buttons and watch them scroll - it's was choosing one of the banks I couldn't figure out - but I know how to now, I had not made it that far in the manual at the point I wrote that.

There are a couple of different ways to set that up - changing to a designated patch when banking up or down, and the way the presets I downloaded were set up, were different from what I was use to.
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Gabriel Leopardi
post Mar 3 2014, 04:06 PM
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QUOTE (Darius Wave @ Mar 2 2014, 08:49 AM) *
It works best with amps having MASTER VOLUME. Otherwise when You move the channel volume, You affect the level of signal going back to the processor. Easy to get unwanted distortion but...it is possible smile.gif I was doing those experiments because I could never make myslef using distortion other than built-in from the amp...but...I wanted to have compressor section before the amp and delay section after the amps distortion. And it worked smile.gif

Most common issues with such a connection is the ground lops issue. You really have to organize all the power supplies perfectly



What are you using nowadays for effects and process live?


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Spock
post Mar 9 2014, 05:30 PM
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GOT IT!!!

All I had to do was hook up the midi cable and hit the midi switch on the JVM to remember which pedal activates it. So now I can start to find tones, which is a never ending process, but at least I have hooked all this up and have it working the way I hoped it would.

And if anyone goes with the same type setup, I'll be glad to help any way I can.
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