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> Record Royalities, How Bill Nelson (Be Bop Delux and Red Noise) was screwed
Saoirse O'Shea
post Mar 30 2014, 04:58 PM
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This makes very sad reading:

http://www.jagshouse.com/music/billnelson.html

One of the first albums I bought was Be Bop Delux's 'Sunburst Finish'.


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klasaine
post Mar 30 2014, 07:38 PM
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Holy crap! So sad ... and all too common.

One of the coolest album covers of all time - and a great record.
Attached Image

This post has been edited by klasaine: Mar 31 2014, 06:09 AM


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Todd Simpson
post Mar 31 2014, 01:11 AM
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Also a great example of how important it is to specify whose getting paid in any contract. In this case, they signed a contract stating the label only had to pay the legal entity set up by the bands manager. So when that entity went out of business, they no longer had any legal obligation to pay anyone anything.

Very sad, but a good lesson on knowing what's in ones contract!


QUOTE (tonymiro @ Mar 30 2014, 11:58 AM) *
This makes very sad reading:

http://www.jagshouse.com/music/billnelson.html

One of the first albums I bought was Be Bop Delux's 'Sunburst Finish'.


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Mar 31 2014, 06:23 PM
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Very true Todd - and sadly as Ken says it's all to common for people to sign rather iffy contracts.
I think this was one of the reason why Robert Fripp set his own label up as he never got royalites from all his time with King Crimson. He sued the label and won and then kindly shared that with the rest of the band members who also hadn't received any royalties.


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Todd Simpson
post Apr 1 2014, 12:59 AM
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Cheers to Fripp! All to often, rather than learn about the "biz" folks sign without reading or consulting a lawyer about a contract. A buddy of mine (Steve Flynn of Atheist) signed his first contract at 18 and it was a huge rip off for the band. It said the label keeps everything but they were young and signed it anyway. Never got any royalties and the label went bust.

So yeah, crucial to consider anything you sign and to have the help of a lawyer. Honestly, probably better to pull a Fripp and do it yourself!


QUOTE (tonymiro @ Mar 31 2014, 01:23 PM) *
Very true Todd - and sadly as Ken says it's all to common for people to sign rather iffy contracts.
I think this was one of the reason why Robert Fripp set his own label up as he never got royalites from all his time with King Crimson. He sued the label and won and then kindly shared that with the rest of the band members who also hadn't received any royalties.


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Darius Wave
post Apr 1 2014, 08:44 AM
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That's more than sad to see this problem at such a high production level sad.gif It's like taking the hope away that anything is wort doing....


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klasaine
post Apr 1 2014, 03:43 PM
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QUOTE (Darius Wave @ Apr 1 2014, 12:44 AM) *
That's more than sad to see this problem at such a high production level sad.gif It's like taking the hope away that anything is wort doing....


It can definitely influence how serious one is willing to be about their art making once they have to get a job and/or support a family.





This post has been edited by klasaine: Apr 1 2014, 03:43 PM


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Todd Simpson
post Apr 2 2014, 05:26 AM
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I wouldn't say it's as dramatic as all that smile.gif

All he would have had to do is write a clause in the contract that transferred payments to him personally in the event the production company went out of biz. smile.gif


QUOTE (Darius Wave @ Apr 1 2014, 03:44 AM) *
That's more than sad to see this problem at such a high production level sad.gif It's like taking the hope away that anything is wort doing....



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Darius Wave
post Apr 2 2014, 09:24 AM
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Probably we have to learn a lesson on others experience


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klasaine
post Apr 2 2014, 03:55 PM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Apr 1 2014, 09:26 PM)
All he would have had to do is write a clause in the contract that transferred payments to him personally in the event the production company went out of biz.


They were kids in the 70s when those contracts were written. Wide eyed and excited just to be able to make a record and be 'signed'.

This post has been edited by klasaine: Apr 2 2014, 03:59 PM


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Apr 2 2014, 04:04 PM
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QUOTE (klasaine @ Apr 2 2014, 03:55 PM) *
They were kids in the 70s when those contracts were written. Wide eyed and excited just to be able to make a record and be 'signed'.


And also almost certainly very badly advised by their management and lawyer (if they had a lawyer).


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klasaine
post Apr 2 2014, 04:11 PM
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QUOTE (tonymiro @ Apr 2 2014, 08:04 AM) *
And also almost certainly very badly advised by their management and lawyer (if they had a lawyer).


Don't be so negative Tony wink.gif , I'm sure the management co. or the rec co. 'provided' them with a lawyer.


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Apr 2 2014, 04:13 PM
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I haven't asked him but I think Bill was only about 16 or 17 when they signed to Harvest and so as Ken says really only a kid.

QUOTE (klasaine @ Apr 2 2014, 04:11 PM) *
Don't be so negative Tony wink.gif , I'm sure the management co. or the rec co. 'provided' them with a lawyer.


laugh.gif . Our's did that for us as well to be 'helpful' to us (and we were screwed).


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Todd Simpson
post Apr 3 2014, 02:06 AM
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Good point!!! My buddy from ATHEIST was 18 when he signed and they got screwed as well. sad.gif Hindsight is 20/20 they say.

QUOTE (klasaine @ Apr 2 2014, 10:55 AM) *
They were kids in the 70s when those contracts were written. Wide eyed and excited just to be able to make a record and be 'signed'.



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