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> Kris-must Charm :: Audio Collaboration, GMC students and instructor collab
Nick6373
post Dec 29 2014, 09:01 AM
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Hey guys! First post ever just got membership!
Here's my attempts (I couldn't decide which one I liked more so I'm post both of them):

#1 https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-one-w-backing

#1 No Backing Track: https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-one-no-backing


#2 https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-2-w-backing

#2 No Backing Track: https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-two-no-backing
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Darius Wave
post Dec 29 2014, 12:36 PM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Dec 28 2014, 07:59 PM) *
I think this situation is very interesting. Darius and I are of clearly different opinions, though I can see where his is coming from. Now this is a very 'good' problem, since both your versions are good (it's just that I think one of them is excellent). biggrin.gif



In the end what matters is what you (Degroot) think, so I think you should have the final word. Heck you can even subit a thrid version if you want!


EXACTLY!
smile.gif

Fortunately we are not scientists who argue about the earth to be square or round biggrin.gif

Let's be clear. DeGroot is at the skills level where he doesn't need that much straight technical care from us and at this level our help becomes more and more subjective. We start to talk more about our personal feelings on his takes than a obvious mistkes in playing smile.gif Really cool idea to let him and students decide smile.gif

I'm glad we have that situation here because it simnply prooves something very important smile.gif You know what I mean Monica? smile.gif


QUOTE (Phil66 @ Dec 28 2014, 08:31 PM) *
Ok everyone,

Another try. The very last lick feels like a big sigh of despair as the lonely old person closes their eyes. Bloody hell this has brought some darkness out in me unsure.gif

[attachment=40339:Crimbo_c...g_take_5.wav]

[attachment=40340:Crimbo_c...g_take_5.wav]
I don't know if it's classed as cheating but I only recorded the last 5 bars at the end. I can play it all the way through but I think the first part is ok so to save time I just did the last 5 bars.
Playing it back I think the bend at :29 is off, shame I didn't hear it when playing as I have run out of time now. Back tomorrow.

IMPORTANT NOTE BELOW

If anyone downloaded the files above before 20:30 GMT there was an error. Please download again. Sorry folks, I'm still learning how to record properly.

Cheers all.

Phil


No worries smile.gif Recording a few crutial bars is acceptable when You don't want to loose Your creativity for repating something You consider to be done. I hope You'll forgie us trying to squeeze You to the limits but I think we all agree every single take You make is getting better and better smile.gif


QUOTE (Jim S. @ Dec 29 2014, 12:50 AM) *
Yes certainly. In fact I'm working the tapping and ending licks again. I'm looking at two angles. The first is how I'm attacking with picking hand. 2 problems, 1 I loose control of my tapping foot when I begin those solos. 2, when I switch positions my timing goes out of sync because I'm not familiar enough with that change.

I'm also finding that adding a rhythmic element to those runs helps keep the line in time. That's kinda hard to explain.

Darius I know the chord progression is D, Bmin? Or Db/Bmin? To G then A?

I'm having a hard time with the chord in between D and Bmin. Any chance you could give me some hints? Soon as I record again I'll post it here!



Hey Jim. Chrod progression is actually nothing fancy. It's a bcking track from my latest lesson - You can review it for any tips You need smile.gif It's just a D, G, Em, A all over smile.gif

QUOTE (Nick6373 @ Dec 29 2014, 08:01 AM) *
Hey guys! First post ever just got membership!
Here's my attempts (I couldn't decide which one I liked more so I'm post both of them):

#1 https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-one-w-backing

#1 No Backing Track: https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-one-no-backing


#2 https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-2-w-backing

#2 No Backing Track: https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-two-no-backing



hey and wellcome in the family smile.gif Very nice intruduction though smile.gif For my taste Your first take would be a nice sketch to workout. I believe it is more a spontanious improvisation than arranged solo. What I would suggest to do is to learn Your own solo just like You would do while learning Guns'n'roses solo etc smile.gif The idea is to make things as perfect as possible. There are some timming and tuning issues to fix.

Fisrt of all I would recommend to recheck the tuning in positions while tuning Your guitar. When the takes is 100% in tune it doesn't have to be mindblowing but still sound pro. Correct pitch in the solos brings that "pro" feeling while listening even if the solo seems to be simple. Antoher extra points we get for the good timming. You can achieve that by simply learning Your solo and practicing before recording final version smile.gif


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Monica Gheorghev...
post Dec 29 2014, 02:13 PM
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QUOTE (Darius Wave @ Dec 29 2014, 11:36 AM) *
EXACTLY!
smile.gif

Fortunately we are not scientists who argue about the earth to be square or round biggrin.gif

Let's be clear. DeGroot is at the skills level where he doesn't need that much straight technical care from us and at this level our help becomes more and more subjective. We start to talk more about our personal feelings on his takes than a obvious mistkes in playing smile.gif Really cool idea to let him and students decide smile.gif

I'm glad we have that situation here because it simnply prooves something very important smile.gif You know what I mean Monica? smile.gif

Haha......definitely biggrin.gif For me this kind of situation helped me to clarify some things (again) smile.gif You have right, when it doesn't exist technical mistakes it remain just a matter of taste wink.gif
That's why I truly believe (even if I said my opinion about how I would like to mix Joe's takes) after instructors opinion, the best decision is what the player feel. It's his music, his interpretation and his work. I will enjoy any of his choice because both takes has Joe's style and I always liked his playing smile.gif
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Sensible Jones
post Dec 29 2014, 02:17 PM
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Here's mine:-
https://soundcloud.com/neilwaller/krismas-full

https://soundcloud.com/neilwaller/krismas-nbt
I hope you like it.


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Phil66
post Dec 29 2014, 02:29 PM
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Hello all,

I'll be having another go later today, it will be my last try until Friday as I'm going away for new year celebrations biggrin.gif
Any tips on my take I posted yesterday?

Cheers

Phil


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Kristofer Dahl
post Dec 29 2014, 03:03 PM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Dec 28 2014, 09:31 PM) *
Ok everyone,

Another try. The very last lick feels like a big sigh of despair as the lonely old person closes their eyes. Bloody hell this has brought some darkness out in me unsure.gif

[attachment=40339:Crimbo_c...g_take_5.wav]

[attachment=40340:Crimbo_c...g_take_5.wav]
I don't know if it's classed as cheating but I only recorded the last 5 bars at the end. I can play it all the way through but I think the first part is ok so to save time I just did the last 5 bars.
Playing it back I think the bend at :29 is off, shame I didn't hear it when playing as I have run out of time now. Back tomorrow.

IMPORTANT NOTE BELOW

If anyone downloaded the files above before 20:30 GMT there was an error. Please download again. Sorry folks, I'm still learning how to record properly.

Cheers all.

Phil


Cool Phil, I think this sounds good!

To me the only thing lacking is a more powerful ending. However your phrase at 00:28 is pretty suitable. So again I think the easiest way out would be to have one or more dubs (additional guitar track) here. You don't need to play a harmony, you could just play the exact same thing - and it will fatten up the sound and give the push needed for the 'grand finale'.

Another option is to re-record the phrase playing it a bit more aggressively, hitting it harder and applying aggressive vibrato. This can be tricky to do though, if you don't have the required control yet.

Yet an option is to not do anything, and maybe Darius won't be able to refrain himself from playing a harmony over that part in the final mix. ph34r.gif




QUOTE (Nick6373 @ Dec 29 2014, 09:01 AM) *
Hey guys! First post ever just got membership!
Here's my attempts (I couldn't decide which one I liked more so I'm post both of them):

#1 https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-one-w-backing

#1 No Backing Track: https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-one-no-backing


#2 https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-2-w-backing

#2 No Backing Track: https://soundcloud.com/nick-peacock-7/attempt-two-no-backing


Welcome to GMC Nick! biggrin.gif

I agree with all Darius said. If you can get rid of the tuning/intonation problem it will immediately raise your takes to a new level - as that is the #1 problem. Take 2 had less tuning problems. As Darius said there are cool ideas in there, that can lead to a strong solo - and as soon as tuning problem is fixed you can start doing the polishing.

If you are unsure how to deal with the tuning problem please let us know.




QUOTE (Sensible Jones @ Dec 29 2014, 02:17 PM) *


Very cool Jones, the double stops, interesting rhythmical ideas, and the über neat sound makes this a very fresh take. With some mixing, this will sound really good.

Here are some places that caught my attention, which you could deal with now or have in mind for future recordings:

* 0:21 sustain dies immediately. This is not super bad, but I still get the impression this was not what you intended (given how cool the sustained note at 00:17 sounds). By thinking about having super relaxed hands/arms you might be able to fix this. To tell you exactly what technical mistake is causing this, we probably need a video of you playing this.

* 00:23 this vibrato is a bit too Kirk Hamm:ish for my taste. I would recommend a wider vibrato, try using more of your whole arm - or use a more circular type of vibrato motion. Alternatively just think "slow bend" instead of "vibrato".

* 00:28. This note sounds out of pitch, not sure what could be causing it.

If you can fix these and keep the rest of your playing intact, you have a 'winner' take! biggrin.gif

QUOTE (Darius Wave @ Dec 29 2014, 12:36 PM) *
Fortunately we are not scientists who argue about the earth to be square or round biggrin.gif


'tis flat, i'm tellin' ya!! tongue.gif


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Sensible Jones
post Dec 29 2014, 03:56 PM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Dec 29 2014, 03:03 PM) *
Very cool Jones, the double stops, interesting rhythmical ideas, and the über neat sound makes this a very fresh take. With some mixing, this will sound really good.

Here are some places that caught my attention, which you could deal with now or have in mind for future recordings:

* 0:21 sustain dies immediately. This is not super bad, but I still get the impression this was not what you intended (given how cool the sustained note at 00:17 sounds). By thinking about having super relaxed hands/arms you might be able to fix this. To tell you exactly what technical mistake is causing this, we probably need a video of you playing this.

* 00:23 this vibrato is a bit too Kirk Hamm:ish for my taste. I would recommend a wider vibrato, try using more of your whole arm - or use a more circular type of vibrato motion. Alternatively just think "slow bend" instead of "vibrato".

* 00:28. This note sounds out of pitch, not sure what could be causing it.

If you can fix these and keep the rest of your playing intact, you have a 'winner' take! biggrin.gif

I'll go work on it now Kris!!
biggrin.gif
I changed the second part very slightly.
https://soundcloud.com/neilwaller/krismas-pt-2-nbt

This post has been edited by Sensible Jones: Dec 29 2014, 04:48 PM


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Darius Wave
post Dec 29 2014, 07:04 PM
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QUOTE (Sensible Jones @ Dec 29 2014, 01:17 PM) *



What a nice Timmons/Mayer tone! smile.gif Cool phrasing Neil. Unfortunately (I know I know...it's alwasy something...tongue.gif ) There is sort of "wrong direction" in tension build. I think I would leave the first half (truly love it) under one condition - it simply begs for delay in the background if those breaks have to stay there smile.gif I would think about the second part because it does not inscrease the tension. It like a negative - You get more relax while the solo goes on and it's an opposite direction to what we need to make, to create proper tension build through the track.


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Sensible Jones
post Dec 29 2014, 09:50 PM
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QUOTE (Darius Wave @ Dec 29 2014, 07:04 PM) *
What a nice Timmons/Mayer tone! smile.gif Cool phrasing Neil. Unfortunately (I know I know...it's alwasy something...tongue.gif ) There is sort of "wrong direction" in tension build. I think I would leave the first half (truly love it) under one condition - it simply begs for delay in the background if those breaks have to stay there smile.gif I would think about the second part because it does not inscrease the tension. It like a negative - You get more relax while the solo goes on and it's an opposite direction to what we need to make, to create proper tension build through the track.

Thanks for the input Darius!
Here's it with the 2nd part re-done a bit.
https://soundcloud.com/neilwaller/krismas-final
https://soundcloud.com/neilwaller/krismas-final-nbt
I didn't want to put too much delay/reverb on it as I thought this gave you guys problems in the final mix?
smile.gif


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Nick6373
post Dec 29 2014, 10:01 PM
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Thanks for the advice guys!
I'll work on getting some more concrete ideas into my solo. The one problem I don't really know how to deal with is my intonation issue. Any advice?

Thanks!
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Phil66
post Dec 29 2014, 10:10 PM
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Ok take 6. I've changed the bit before the ending then I've over layered the ending. Hope this is what you meant.

[attachment=40354:Crimbo_c...g_take_6.wav]

[attachment=40355:Crimbo_c...g_take_6.wav]

Cheers

QUOTE (Nick6373 @ Dec 29 2014, 10:01 PM) *
Thanks for the advice guys!
I'll work on getting some more concrete ideas into my solo. The one problem I don't really know how to deal with is my intonation issue. Any advice?

Thanks!


Take it to a tech mate. If you're not confident don't mess. If it's a fixed bridge it's not too hard but a floating trem can take a long time. There are many pages about intonation adjustment on the internet, I do my own fixed bridges but don't have the patience for a floating trem.

Again, if you aren't confident don't try it. Get a full setup from a tech.

Phil


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Nick6373
post Dec 29 2014, 10:30 PM
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Thanks Phil, I'll do that. I like your solo by the way.
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Jim S.
post Dec 30 2014, 02:13 AM
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I've taken a fresh look at my lick that gave me trouble and I found that hybrid picking with a little string skipping made it come to life a little bit. I'm taking just this idea and keep playing it until my fingers get used to crossing. My hands were burning after just 10 min.

When I rec. my final take I'd like it to be live in front of a giant amplifier.




Darius I'm not sure why I thought those were the chords. I feel pretty silly...

Degroot thanks for breaking that down for me I like all those details.

This post has been edited by Jim S.: Dec 30 2014, 05:59 AM
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Phil66
post Dec 30 2014, 11:16 AM
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QUOTE (Nick6373 @ Dec 29 2014, 10:30 PM) *
Thanks Phil, I'll do that. I like your solo by the way.


Thanks Nick, I like yours too, have to agree with Darius though, it does sound a little unstructured but hey, who am I to say, I'm merely a beginner that's had guitars for years. I can't comment on the intonation as my ear isn't that good yet but as you know I have commented on how to go about it.

Get a mentor mate, I'm with Cosmin, all the guys on here are good.

Phil


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Darius Wave
post Dec 30 2014, 02:25 PM
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QUOTE (Sensible Jones @ Dec 29 2014, 08:50 PM) *
Thanks for the input Darius!
Here's it with the 2nd part re-done a bit.
https://soundcloud.com/neilwaller/krismas-final
https://soundcloud.com/neilwaller/krismas-final-nbt
I didn't want to put too much delay/reverb on it as I thought this gave you guys problems in the final mix?
smile.gif



Sure man! I understand! - yes You can make a delay on Your take preview and make the opposite in the files You send me. You completely right - I will add You a delay in the final mix and it would be matched to the track and the mix smile.gif You can give it here to simply make us more pleasure while listening to a preview smile.gif

Around 0:22 there is a gap that somehow feels like You might find a better solution but decide on your own smile.gif


QUOTE (Nick6373 @ Dec 29 2014, 09:01 PM) *
Thanks for the advice guys!
I'll work on getting some more concrete ideas into my solo. The one problem I don't really know how to deal with is my intonation issue. Any advice?

Thanks!


Thanx for response smile.gif Before going into details simply check some basics:

1. Old strings do not keep proper intonation. If Yours are older than 3-4 weeks it might be the reason of issue
2. Play a few notes on the fretboard and check on the tuner - maybe Your open strings are a bit off comparing to fretted notes


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Darius Wave
post Dec 30 2014, 08:38 PM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Dec 29 2014, 09:10 PM) *
Ok take 6. I've changed the bit before the ending then I've over layered the ending. Hope this is what you meant.

[attachment=40354:Crimbo_c...g_take_6.wav]

[attachment=40355:Crimbo_c...g_take_6.wav]

Cheers



Take it to a tech mate. If you're not confident don't mess. If it's a fixed bridge it's not too hard but a floating trem can take a long time. There are many pages about intonation adjustment on the internet, I do my own fixed bridges but don't have the patience for a floating trem.

Again, if you aren't confident don't try it. Get a full setup from a tech.

Phil


Now let me simply ask You how do You feel about Your take comparing to the very first version? Last few times You asked us about our feedback, now it's time to ask same questions to Yourself nad aprove the solo or make any absolutely tiny details. I think Your solo has got a chill out mood and it leads somewhere - to next solo fox example. If You're satisfied with it, we can leave it this way smile.gif


QUOTE (Jim S. @ Dec 30 2014, 01:13 AM) *
I've taken a fresh look at my lick that gave me trouble and I found that hybrid picking with a little string skipping made it come to life a little bit. I'm taking just this idea and keep playing it until my fingers get used to crossing. My hands were burning after just 10 min.

When I rec. my final take I'd like it to be live in front of a giant amplifier.




Darius I'm not sure why I thought those were the chords. I feel pretty silly...

Degroot thanks for breaking that down for me I like all those details.


Don't worry Jim - it happens wink.gif Now You're sure about the harmony and have some time to recheck everything smile.gif As for the lick in the video I would really like to hear how it sits with the backing now. Sometimes our precision problems comes from us not being 100% confident about the rhtythm in the lick and how it should fit to the backing track. You can post just an audio example smile.gif


QUOTE (Phil66 @ Dec 30 2014, 10:16 AM) *
Thanks Nick, I like yours too, have to agree with Darius though, it does sound a little unstructured but hey, who am I to say, I'm merely a beginner that's had guitars for years. I can't comment on the intonation as my ear isn't that good yet but as you know I have commented on how to go about it.

Get a mentor mate, I'm with Cosmin, all the guys on here are good.

Phil


No matter what is Your playing skills level - everyone here is wellcome to share his thoughts smile.gif I'm glad You did it. It helps to confirm or deny some conclusions that might be subjective smile.gif


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Kristofer Dahl
post Dec 30 2014, 10:12 PM
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QUOTE (Sensible Jones @ Dec 29 2014, 09:50 PM) *
Thanks for the input Darius!
Here's it with the 2nd part re-done a bit.
https://soundcloud.com/neilwaller/krismas-final
https://soundcloud.com/neilwaller/krismas-final-nbt
I didn't want to put too much delay/reverb on it as I thought this gave you guys problems in the final mix?
smile.gif


Cool, I think you have worked your way around all the things I commented on. When looking at your take as a whole, I preferred your first one as it had a lot of cool details. For example 0:11 in your first take - don't know what you did there but it sounds amazing!

However that one had some very obvious mistakes and this one doesn't. Also you guitar is a bit too loud and this drags down the impression of your take, so we can expect a better sounding take in Darius' final mix.

I think it's completely up to you how you want to proceed. I work just the same, my first takes are usually the best - after that it goes downhill. So I would probably try to save your first take by throwing in some dubs (extra guitar takes) to try and mask the mistakes.


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Kristofer Dahl
post Dec 30 2014, 11:29 PM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Dec 29 2014, 10:10 PM) *
Ok take 6. I've changed the bit before the ending then I've over layered the ending. Hope this is what you meant.

[attachment=40354:Crimbo_c...g_take_6.wav]

[attachment=40355:Crimbo_c...g_take_6.wav]

Cheers


Cool, the extra layer definitely gave that push in th ending we were looking for! I think we can settle for this one, very well done! cool.gif


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Chris S.
post Dec 31 2014, 05:54 AM
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Hey guys!

So I think this is going to be my final take:

https://soundcloud.com/stortzmusic/xmas-collab-final

If it seems legit - I'll work on the video.

I changed a few things and tried adding some new concepts - a trill and a bit of a swing feel at the end.


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Cosmin Lupu
post Dec 31 2014, 08:34 AM
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Hey Chris smile.gif

I followd your conversation with Kris and Darius and I have to mention that in my opinion, you could still reduce the volume of the guitar in the mix. Now, for the actual take, I like the way it begins - a steady flow of 16th notes building a melody. Around 0:12, that bend is a bit too weak and the note one which you conclude at 0:16 leaves the take in the air somehow, not giving it a sense of direction - you need to select a note that creates movement - a note that links this phrase with the next, or a note that ends the phrase clearly.

0:20 - great one! This phrase sounds very tasty and nicely interpreted, but the note at 0:24 sounds a bit off tune while at 0:27 the vibrato could be wider and more in pitch and timing could be better for that particular note.

I tried to stick to technical aspects, in order to allow your concept to shape up as you intended, but making it shine brighter smile.gif


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