Song Writing! |
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Song Writing! |
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Jul 18 2007, 12:55 PM |
I'm fumbeling in the dark here but I think I have an idea for a lesson or a little bigger measure.
I'd like to learn how to write a descent song. Made my tries but can't seem to make them interesting enough. It's usualy Intro verse chorus verse (copy paste of first verse) bridge chorus (copy paste of first chorus) and copy & past it until it's at the least 3-4 minutes. The result is usualy a song thats not so exciting since it sounds as if it repears itself... which it infact does. So my idea here is to take a bigger grip around "how to write a song" with the help of teachers here. The first example lesson could be, since we're guitarists, to add a rhythm guitar and solo to a predefined track and we'd run it as a project. I'm dropping some names as example. The project group decides on a genre and a brief description of the song - Rock, 120 bpm Song build up as Intro, verse chorus verse bridge chorus chorus outro - length 2 minutes Someone contributes with a text. When all the basics for the song was set maybe Pavel could sontribute with a drum track suitable for the arrangement. Someone adds a bass Next, Luciana adds vocals (not the order I'd do it but for the lesson maybe neccessary) Andrew suggests appropriate theory lessons if possible. And then we get to work, each of us with our own backing track so to say, we keep a thread for discussions on how to proceed, what to tink about, suggestions, tips, tricks etc We have out freedom to make whatever we can in order to make a good and interesting song. Afterwards we present the result to instructors or publicly in the tread to recieve critisism on what to improve. Maybe we should stick to critisism on what to improve in order not to make it an admire-thread, it's an all skills are welcome lesson, of course, and noone should feel that some get positive response, others nothing and others only critisism on what to improve. The final result could be moved to another thread for adminration The point is to learn how to write songs and to make them interesting with enough variation for someone to enjoy a full length song. Would aquire a computer and a sequencer (Reaper is free) + soundcard where you can connect a mike or guitar. And I see how this could expose people when posting their songs in public, so maybe we should strictly keep these threads in the private forum so everyone feel they can take part. As a first step everything is served on a silver plate, drums, bass and vocals. Coming lessons could leave for us to add drums, bass and vocals ourselves. I understand this takes some effort from Kris to arrange this with the teachers but I'm confident that's managable. Does anyone but me think this is doable? And fun too maybe? I'm sure we all could benefit a lot from learning how to write songs. Perhaps not exactly the way I suggested but with a discussion I'm positive we can come to a final concept that works. -------------------- My bands homepage
All time favourites: B. Streisand - Woman in Love, M. Hopkin - Those were the days, L. Richie - Hello |
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Jul 18 2007, 01:21 PM |
Hmm.. the list, that you have written is basicly just normal song Just change lyrics in 1st and 2nd verse, put there some crazy solo. If you add some interesting outro, you have solid song Main thing, behind a hitmaking, is some crazy and powerful chorus. Something, that just goes to your head and you just MUST sing it. (CHIHUAHUA, know, what I mean? ) Be it strong lyrics, melody or just the fact, that "it sounds good!".
Btw. just take a look on Collection of sins and its form Its killer song, and it has this standart form This Intro,verse1,chorus,verse2,chorus,solo,chorus,outro is standart, which is used by almost all mainstream, pop, rock, heavy, trash, speed.... metal bands (with only a few exceptions), so there is nothing bad, to write song like this. However, your first songs (same for everyone...) should be like that - you have an easy-to-follow guidelines and you can concentrate more, to make killer lyrics, riffs, and make it interesting. Later, you can start thinking about some unordinary and original way, how to compose songs ) Anyway, 95% of todays songs are unoriginal so... you dont have to worry ------------------------------------------------- And now to your idea:) You have my full support, and if anybody wants, I can surely create some lyrics:) In the end, every member of GMC, will have to add this song to his first CD:-P As I said, we may want to create song from standart form or we can make something original:) (think of ballads... they usually dont go like start/verse/chorus/verse/chorus/verse/chorus/end...) PS: Hope, that my post does at least a bit of sense I was on party last night, so I am not fully conscious Ow... my stomach... :-! Phoenix This post has been edited by Jakub Luptovec: Jul 18 2007, 01:24 PM -------------------- my youtube account with riffs and ideas: https://www.youtube.com/user/Phoenygzus
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Jul 18 2007, 04:14 PM |
Great idea The challenge is to get it to work well. I would suspect that this would work best if it was split into several sub projects with someone taking the lead on each. Maybe we have a thread, or even a new board in which potential leaders can pitch their idea, so that others of a like mind can join in:
Pitch - Death Metal, 190bpm, Shredding, Advanced Pitch - Blues Shuffle, 90 bpm, intermediate Pitch - Classical, Nylon acoustic Etc - now part of the fun would be in picking a genre that you have little experience in so you can learn more. Each sub project would need maybe 4 - 5 people with the appropriate talents between them. Then there would be the recording logistics - that's a hard one because it involves shipping large amounts of data over the net - potentially many 100s of megabytes for a finished song. There are ways around that which we can get into (I wrote a magazine article on this in fact and I'm awaiting acceptance for publishing). Does that sound workable, does anyone have a different idea? And on a different subject, Kaneda, I would be very interested in your proposed posts about composition, I think they would add a lot to GMC - a kind of practical theory, something we don't have covered as you said. If you wrote a series, I for one would be reading it avidly! -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ... My Stuff: Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab |
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Jul 18 2007, 05:32 PM |
sounds like a really fresh idea i really need help wit my songwritin
-------------------- Ibanez sa260 (hell ya)
Ibanez 10 watt amp (hell no) |
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Jul 18 2007, 06:21 PM |
I would like to subscribe as lyricswriter and singing melody maker for deathmetal song:-D And globaly subscribe to death metal project:-P Though i am not advanced.. :-P
-------------------- my youtube account with riffs and ideas: https://www.youtube.com/user/Phoenygzus
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Jul 20 2007, 02:31 PM |
Ok, so far a lot of indians and no chiefs ....
We need a couple of people to kick this off or it won't happen - who wants to take a lead? I suggest that each project gets a new thread, put them in the Masterclass forum for now, I'm sure Kris will give us a new board if we get a lot of activity. I suggest we proceed like this: Post a thread with a title like: GMC Collaboration - "Blades of Death" (Blades of Death is meant to represent thie title of the piece ) In the subtitle, describe it, like this: Metal 120bpm Intermediate And in the first post explain what you are hoping to create, and what collaborators you want and lets see if we can get something going! Volounteers can discuss their contributions on the thread and planning of the song can start! When we get to that point we can figure out logistics of sharing files etc - I think the leader should be responsible for collating all parts and mixing them, and posting updates. It will be fun to see if we can get this to work Any other ideas on how to progress this? This post has been edited by Andrew Cockburn: Jul 20 2007, 02:33 PM -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ... My Stuff: Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab |
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Jul 20 2007, 03:08 PM |
Ok, so far a lot of indians and no chiefs .... We need a couple of people to kick this off or it won't happen - who wants to take a lead? ´ Uhm, as the originator of this thread and thereby causing work for lots of people I have to say - I'm sorry! Nah, but my situation right now is that I'm pretty occupied extending the house (on my vacation) and also falling behind in my project at work so I have to cut one week off of the holiday. So I can't take the lead anywhere and maybe not even take part in this first round. However, more input from one of the "indians". What is it that we all want to do? Record the guitar. So I think we should try to reuse as much material as possible. Like lyrics f.ex can be used in several projects. Maybe also drums can be reused. Some people can record their own bass, live or with a plugin. So I take it sharing the material among us is important. And most sequencers I guess can import wav files so if the temp is always the same it (singing, bass, drums) should fit right in. So we'd be sharing inbetween projects to make things easier. With 100 guitarists and one lyrics writer the guitasrist would steam from all the wait and the writer would likely get a stroke from all work and die. Anyone posting a thread on the new board (that Andrew suggested but for now the "guitar uploads" may work the best - not all that frequently used so threads won't disappear) owns the project and drives it forward. And I urge lyric writers, singers and bass players to be a member of several projects. ...I realise I all of a sudden made bass players sought for and popular. That's a first. j/k, we love you bass players! -------------------- My bands homepage
All time favourites: B. Streisand - Woman in Love, M. Hopkin - Those were the days, L. Richie - Hello |
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Jul 20 2007, 03:25 PM |
Anyone posting a thread on the new board (that Andrew suggested but for now the "guitar uploads" may work the best - Yes, good idea! And MickeM, seriously ... work and home improvements ahead of guitar??? You just need a roof that doesn't leak, the rest is gravy -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ... My Stuff: Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab |
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Jul 20 2007, 04:31 PM |
Yes, good idea! And MickeM, seriously ... work and home improvements ahead of guitar??? You just need a roof that doesn't leak, the rest is gravy I know, I have to get my priorities straight. Right now there's no roof, only foundation put in place today. But hey, if I wear a tarpaulin(?) over my head I'm (and my guitar are) well protected. -------------------- My bands homepage
All time favourites: B. Streisand - Woman in Love, M. Hopkin - Those were the days, L. Richie - Hello |
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Jul 20 2007, 04:52 PM |
I know, I have to get my priorities straight. Right now there's no roof, only foundation put in place today. But hey, if I wear a tarpaulin(?) over my head I'm (and my guitar are) well protected. There ya go! A couple of hours work with a crate of beer and a tarpaulin and you'll be set -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ... My Stuff: Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab |
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Jul 20 2007, 09:01 PM |
Andrew, I'd love to start a thread like this but I really dont know how to upload .wav files into my posts, nor wat program to use. I'd be happy to get the ball rolling, I would just need some help on the tech stuff. If we started a bulletin thread on the tech aspect of how to get this started, everyone could read it and projects would start shooting up in no time! Eventually we would need a new board however because this could get very popular. Just think, looking at pages worth of GMCer projects (as if you were looking at the album reviews page) and being able to click on a project, add a riff or something, and watch the "GMC soundtrack" grow! Lol I think this could be really fun. Go ahead and start a thread - the technical stuff will come later, and as the fisrt thread yours will be the one where we work out all the details If we think about this for too long it wont happen so lets get some momentum going! -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ... My Stuff: Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab |
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