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> Cheap Practise Amp Meets Pro Cabinet, What happens when...
Darius Wave
post Mar 5 2015, 11:14 AM
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So...what happens when You plug Your cheap, solid state practise amp, to a professional 2x12"cabinet. IT simply prooves how important is a role of Your cabinet in Your overall tone. I have to admit that the tone was quite acceptable even for a pro recording. The reason poeple say bad things on thos "little boxes" is because of the small size and low quality of the built-in speaker. Making simple mod (split power amp and speaker connection + make 2 jack slots to be able to reconnect to an external cab) gives to ability to try how much the preamp and power amp sections are worth itself wink.gif

I had some fun doing demo of my beloved practice combo, plugged to a DL 2x12" cab (V30)





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klasaine
post Mar 5 2015, 03:37 PM
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+1

Speakers and the actual cabinet (wood and construction method) have a HUGE impact on sound.
IMO it cannot be overstated.


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Chris S.
post Mar 5 2015, 04:00 PM
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I agree.

My first amp was a Squier 10W Sidekick - hated it!

About a year or two after I sold it I saw a video online of a guy who converted it into a head and played it through a cab - I was blown away!

Too bad I sold it. rolleyes.gif

This post has been edited by Chris S.: Mar 5 2015, 04:01 PM


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Mertay
post Mar 5 2015, 04:36 PM
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hehe awesome! biggrin.gif

Edit; Shared this video on a local big-ish forum where lots of equipment talk and trading happens. Not a lot of replies (I'm sure they're shocked biggrin.gif ) but 50 views in 3 hours is a good number for that forum smile.gif

This post has been edited by Mertay: Mar 5 2015, 07:12 PM


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Todd Simpson
post Mar 5 2015, 10:43 PM
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+2! smile.gif Soooooo much of the tone depends on the speaker/cab. For example, if you put a $3,000 all tube head through a 5 inch crap speaker, it's gonna sound like crap. But if you take a $150 orange micro head and put it through a nice 2x12 or 4x12 it can sound quite spiff!

I did this test myself by putting the little orange micro through a huge orange 4x12 and it sounded great!

So something like the rig in this picture would work pretty well smile.gif
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QUOTE (klasaine @ Mar 5 2015, 10:37 AM) *
+1

Speakers and the actual cabinet (wood and construction method) have a HUGE impact on sound.
IMO it cannot be overstated.


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jstcrsn
post Mar 6 2015, 02:58 AM
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so many of these small amps would sound so much better with a closed back speaker design, but if there small cheap ones sounded to good, why would you buy a big expensive one wink.gif
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Darius Wave
post Mar 6 2015, 07:22 PM
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Ha ha smile.gif That's right. There is no point of making practice amp bigger and more expensive smile.gif Nobody says You can't have a Mesa DR as a practice amp smile.gif But...who would care that piece of gear with You to Your flat on a 4th floor (in my case) smile.gif

I was only struggling on how people say "that amp sounds poor" while it's rather "this amp sounds poor with it's built-in speaker" smile.gif


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Jim S.
post Mar 6 2015, 11:29 PM
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QUOTE (Darius Wave @ Mar 6 2015, 01:22 PM) *
Ha ha smile.gif That's right. There is no point of making practice amp bigger and more expensive smile.gif Nobody says You can't have a Mesa DR as a practice amp smile.gif But...who would care that piece of gear with You to Your flat on a 4th floor (in my case) smile.gif

I was only struggling on how people say "that amp sounds poor" while it's rather "this amp sounds poor with it's built-in speaker" smile.gif


Darius this is so funny. I recently pulled out a little Crate practice amp and was very impressed on how it sounded at a medium practice level. It has a 6" or 8" speaker and honestly felt that if it was 20x louder with the similar tone that it would be a beast. I just may bring it to the practice space and hook it to a 4x12 cab just for fun.



How about matching OT with cab? How could you calculate the rating and can you damage the amp if mismatched?
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jstcrsn
post Mar 6 2015, 11:54 PM
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QUOTE (Jim S. @ Mar 6 2015, 11:29 PM) *
Darius this is so funny. I recently pulled out a little Crate practice amp and was very impressed on how it sounded at a medium practice level. It has a 6" or 8" speaker and honestly felt that if it was 20x louder with the similar tone that it would be a beast. I just may bring it to the practice space and hook it to a 4x12 cab just for fun.



How about matching OT with cab? How could you calculate the rating and can you damage the amp if mismatched?

usually one speaker is set up for an 8 ohm load and a 4/12 is set up for a 8 ohm load. The back of your amp should say what the ohm ratting is, with a small amp I would not run speakers with a lower ohm ( ex. 8 ohm amp -4 ohm speaker) if it is the other way around it wound not hurt the amp , but it might decrease sound quality
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Jim S.
post Mar 7 2015, 12:43 AM
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QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Mar 6 2015, 05:54 PM) *
usually one speaker is set up for an 8 ohm load and a 4/12 is set up for a 8 ohm load. The back of your amp should say what the ohm ratting is, with a small amp I would not run speakers with a lower ohm ( ex. 8 ohm amp -4 ohm speaker) if it is the other way around it wound not hurt the amp , but it might decrease sound quality


Yeah I would never seriously play through that setup but it would be funny to test. I have a 4/10 cab at 4 ohm too. Are you saying the 4 or 8ohm can would work?
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Darius Wave
post Mar 7 2015, 04:23 PM
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You might be very surprised not only with the tone difference but with the volume as well. Multiple speakers cabinets have a higher sensitivity - correct me if I'm wrong but it can be even to 3dB's more when comparing 4x12" cabinet to 1x12" cabinet at the same amp settings...of course when we compare the same speaker model in both cases. There is also a sensitivity difference between built-in speaker and a Celestion V30 for example. V30 has a really high sensitivity - around 100 dB. This fact itself makes You feel that cabinet on V30 is louder comparing to You built-in speaker.


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Kristofer Dahl
post Mar 7 2015, 05:00 PM
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Great illustration Darius.

I have also come to the conclusion that the speaker probably is the most important component in the sound chain (guitarist excepted! tongue.gif )


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Darius Wave
post Mar 7 2015, 05:26 PM
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Ha ha! Maybe we should plug directly into the speaker ?biggrin.gif No amp in chain ?biggrin.gif


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Kristofer Dahl
post Mar 7 2015, 05:57 PM
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QUOTE (Darius Wave @ Mar 7 2015, 05:26 PM) *
Ha ha! Maybe we should plug directly into the speaker ?biggrin.gif No amp in chain ?biggrin.gif


Yes let's plug in a bodypart of choice into the speaker, then let's rub our knees to generate some serious voltage! Could you please demo this? laugh.gif


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Todd Simpson
post Mar 7 2015, 08:54 PM
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Well said! The speaker is often overlooked it seems and it really is the most important bit in the chain as it determines the characteristics of the sound to a large degree.

To wit, I've noticed many folks using "Full Range" speaker systems with their processors (AXE FX etc.) to get the most tonal range possible.

Vendors are making full range speakers that look like guitar cabs smile.gif But really are essentially P.A. cabs doing guitar duty.

Here is one from MATRIX AMPLIFICATION. THey are the guys that make the "it" amp of the moment that is often paired with Axe FX/etc. They started making P.A. amps/cabs and now they do guitar specific stuff that's not that different from their P.A. line smile.gif

http://usa.matrixamplification.com/fr212-passive.html

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I have a killer Genz Benz 2x12 that has more bass response than any cab I've ever tried including MESA/ORANGE/etc. But it doesn't handle top end as well as I'd like, but no guitar cab does that I've found. As a result, I find myself going direct to my P.A. speakers for full range sound or just going direct to my mixing monitors.

I'm going to sell my Genz Benz cab as I just don't use it much anymore.
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Mar 7 2015, 12:00 PM) *
Great illustration Darius.

I have also come to the conclusion that the speaker probably is the most important component in the sound chain (guitarist excepted! tongue.gif )


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Darius Wave
post Mar 10 2015, 10:57 AM
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It's a similar situation as with POD. People started to buil full range cabs for all those simulation stuff. I do agree with that. Plugging something that is filtering the tone to another thing that does similar filtering seems wrong. A riend of mine used AER for acoustic + POD for the same amp to use electric guitars (the low budget gigs) It really does the job. Even a small cheap RP55 multiple effect seems to sound much better on the Fishman acoustic amp, than on a real guitar tube amp smile.gif


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