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> Hone Your Tone - Gmc Workshop!, Let's work together towards your dream sound!
Sensible Jones
post Apr 23 2015, 03:25 PM
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Raised up in the mix a touch and some delay added. If you think there's still too much treble I may have to adjust my Monitors as it's sounding OK at home.
smile.gif
https://soundcloud.com/neilwaller/tonehone-3

Plus, my fractured finger is getting better too!
smile.gif

This post has been edited by Sensible Jones: Apr 23 2015, 06:07 PM


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fzalfa
post Apr 23 2015, 07:08 PM
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https://soundcloud.com/laurent-dizy/hone-your-tone

a fast tryout, i'm sick as a dog (a bad flu 39.2° now), and i just get up (yes at 8pm....)

i take my medicine and return to bed..... mellow.gif

about the tone, it's a cool preset from GR5, and i put between my FA66 and the guitar(greg bennett RL5 in this case) an ART lamp pre-amp

Laurent

edit: at 0.48 i didn't kick my cat ! meeoowww !!! bad bend....
edit: i do not have a cat.

This post has been edited by fzalfa: Apr 23 2015, 07:20 PM


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Kristofer Dahl
post Apr 23 2015, 09:18 PM
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QUOTE (Sensible Jones @ Apr 23 2015, 04:25 PM) *
Raised up in the mix a touch and some delay added. If you think there's still too much treble I may have to adjust my Monitors as it's sounding OK at home.
smile.gif
https://soundcloud.com/neilwaller/tonehone-3

Plus, my fractured finger is getting better too!
smile.gif

Well this is pretty cool - to me it sounds like you now have a completely new palette of musical ideas to choose from - with this new sound.

I sounds warmer than anything I have heard from you - very very well done!

The rest is just a matter of taste. I would still turn down treble some more simply because this backing doesn't require much treble. I would probably also lower the delay mix. Btw can you tell me what more effects you are using?

I can't wait to hear you in the next collab, I think you have shown us some serious sound tweaking progress here! biggrin.gif

QUOTE (fzalfa @ Apr 23 2015, 08:08 PM) *
https://soundcloud.com/laurent-dizy/hone-your-tone

a fast tryout, i'm sick as a dog (a bad flu 39.2° now), and i just get up (yes at 8pm....)

i take my medicine and return to bed..... mellow.gif

about the tone, it's a cool preset from GR5, and i put between my FA66 and the guitar(greg bennett RL5 in this case) an ART lamp pre-amp

Laurent

edit: at 0.48 i didn't kick my cat ! meeoowww !!! bad bend....
edit: i do not have a cat.

But do you have a dog?! laugh.gif

No seriously - this first take is a bit different from many other in the sense that the EQ balance matches my taste very well. Lots of body and not too much treble.

You probably have slightly too much of the bottom low end (~100Hz and lower), I would try applying a soft "high pass" filter here. Or simply dial out a little bit of bass in GR5.

I would probably lower the gain a little bit to allow your expressive phrases to come though with more dynamics.

To better glue you take in the mix - I suggest lowering volume of your take, and maybe experiment with delay a little bit.

Also your take seems to be panned left, there is no reason for that as there are not other lead instruments in the backing. I think it should be centered.

As you probably can I hear I think this is pretty good - with a bunch of smaller tweaks you'll have a killer tone.


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BTW those of you relying on software - might consider an inexpensive tube pre-amp such as Behringer Mic100 or ART tube MP. They can be a great way to get some additional warmth in the signal chain, and get a signal hot enough to hit your software with some power.


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Sensible Jones
post Apr 24 2015, 11:13 AM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Apr 23 2015, 09:18 PM) *
Well this is pretty cool - to me it sounds like you now have a completely new palette of musical ideas to choose from - with this new sound.

I sounds warmer than anything I have heard from you - very very well done!

The rest is just a matter of taste. I would still turn down treble some more simply because this backing doesn't require much treble. I would probably also lower the delay mix. Btw can you tell me what more effects you are using?

I can't wait to hear you in the next collab, I think you have shown us some serious sound tweaking progress here! biggrin.gif

Thanks Kris! smile.gif
It's been useful using someone else's ears! Especially as now I've tweaked my Monitor settings I should now be hearing something very similar to how you would be hearing it.
As for effects, none more than I mentioned, just Amp Sim, Speaker Sim and then the Delay afterwards. Amp and Speaker sim from the standard Acmebargig and the Delay was the Sonitus one from Cakewalk.
smile.gif smile.gif


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Kristofer Dahl
post Apr 24 2015, 07:17 PM
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@Sensible,

Good point about monitoring. It is quite common for people to have bass problems in their listening environments, in other words bass frequencies get amplified and therefor people dial in less bass and their mixes end up sounding thin/bright.

If you listen to a pro production and it sounds boomy, then you might have problems with your room.

One cure to this problem is reference listening through headphones: start by listening to a pro production and then tweak your sound/mix.


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Phil66
post Apr 24 2015, 08:59 PM
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How about some tips on those mysterious things called compressors, limiters and noise gates please smile.gif

I'm studying the Pop Rock Solo and find that I can't get the big long bends to sustain so they fade away, someone told me I need to use a compressor unsure.gif

Cheers

Phil


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Sensible Jones
post Apr 24 2015, 09:17 PM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Apr 24 2015, 07:17 PM) *
@Sensible,

Good point about monitoring. It is quite common for people to have bass problems in their listening environments, in other words bass frequencies get amplified and therefor people dial in less bass and their mixes end up sounding thin/bright.

If you listen to a pro production and it sounds boomy, then you might have problems with your room.

One cure to this problem is reference listening through headphones: start by listening to a pro production and then tweak your sound/mix.

That's exactly what I did when I said I'd been tweaking my monitors!! I do own a pair of very good quality Headphones to use as a reference. I think I have them just about perfect (or as perfect as they'll ever be) now!
Thanks again for all the input Kris, it's very much appreciated!
smile.gif smile.gif


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Kristofer Dahl
post Apr 24 2015, 10:22 PM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Apr 24 2015, 09:59 PM) *
How about some tips on those mysterious things called compressors, limiters and noise gates please smile.gif

I'm studying the Pop Rock Solo and find that I can't get the big long bends to sustain so they fade away, someone told me I need to use a compressor unsure.gif

Cheers

Phil


Yes these are more or less important tools. And when working with a mix, compressors are crucial.

For a guitar sound - they are especially useful for clean tones. Are you referring to this lesson?
https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/ls/Pop-Rock-Solo-Beginner/

Stephane uses overdrive. One of the effects of distortion/overdrive is compression, so by adding overdrive you are automatically also adding compression.

So the most straightforward way for you try and gets Steph's tone and sustain, would be to find an overdrive sound that reminds of his. Listen to the clearly audible distortion at 00:15 when he plays a double stop.

Many different factors affect sustain, one of them being the guitar's bridge. Tele's have a fixed bridge and therefore typically sustain better than guitars with a floating bridge (for example strats).

So if dialing in overdrive (from amp/pedal, analog/software) doesn't help, you can also add compression. Typically you want to add it before the amp, since compression of a distorted tone in most cases is not desirable (there are always exceptions).

Guitar compressors usually don't have many knobs, so I recommend trial and error until you find a setting that gives you some sustain without completely squashing (=flattening out all dynamics) the tone.

PS Playing technique also affects sustain, so a relaxed fretting hand with the fretting finger(s) positioned right before the fret wire is the way to go.

This post has been edited by Kristofer Dahl: Apr 24 2015, 11:08 PM
Reason for edit: Unfortunate typos


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Phil66
post Apr 24 2015, 10:49 PM
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I am totally discombobulated unsure.gif blink.gif laugh.gif biggrin.gif


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Mertay
post Apr 24 2015, 10:54 PM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Apr 24 2015, 07:59 PM) *
How about some tips on those mysterious things called compressors, limiters and noise gates please smile.gif

I'm studying the Pop Rock Solo and find that I can't get the big long bends to sustain so they fade away, someone told me I need to use a compressor unsure.gif

Cheers

Phil


It helps but usually doesn't catch expectations, they're better used for getting a vibe in a mix. Among many things, I highly suggests making your frets super clean and shiny.


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Kristofer Dahl
post Apr 24 2015, 11:12 PM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Apr 24 2015, 11:49 PM) *
I am totally discombobulated unsure.gif blink.gif laugh.gif biggrin.gif

Hey Bob that word is not even on google translate! tongue.gif

Sorry i think my attempt to explain was way complex? The simple answer is to just add overdrive.


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Phil66
post Apr 25 2015, 07:08 AM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Apr 24 2015, 11:12 PM) *
Hey Bob that word is not even on google translate! tongue.gif

Sorry i think my attempt to explain was way complex? The simple answer is to just add overdrive.


LOOK tongue.gif


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Phil66
post Apr 25 2015, 07:59 PM
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Just tried a compressor but I found that it really made the sound of the pick hitting the string very obvious sad.gif


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Mertay
post Apr 25 2015, 08:15 PM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Apr 25 2015, 06:59 PM) *
Just tried a compressor but I found that it really made the sound of the pick hitting the string very obvious sad.gif


Non-organic approaches (fx) has their limit. The more you force it with fx, the more you'll bump into other problems such as noise or unpleasant character of guitar.

I'd use overdrive and if still not enough use eq before overdrive (add mid-to-high freq.s) but this or more will affect tone.

How is your vibrato? thats a great way to add musical sustain but it might take practice to perfect.


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Phil66
post Apr 25 2015, 08:32 PM
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Well in the lesson, the teacher isn't using vibrato (that I can see) to make the big bent notes sing out. He may have had his amp up loud though. Watch here from the 42 second mark.

Thanks

Phil


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Mertay
post Apr 25 2015, 09:14 PM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Apr 25 2015, 07:32 PM) *
Well in the lesson, the teacher isn't using vibrato (that I can see) to make the big bent notes sing out. He may have had his amp up loud though. Watch here from the 42 second mark.

Thanks

Phil


hmmm thats not a long sustain at all, does your guitar mute the moment you do that bend?


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Phil66
post Apr 25 2015, 10:09 PM
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No. The string isn't getting choked it just fades real quick. I was thinking of having the all volume up much louder but keeping it low and using a volume pedal to bring it up as the note fades. wink.gif

cool.gif


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Mertay
post Apr 25 2015, 11:23 PM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Apr 25 2015, 09:09 PM) *
No. The string isn't getting choked it just fades real quick. I was thinking of having the all volume up much louder but keeping it low and using a volume pedal to bring it up as the note fades. wink.gif

cool.gif


Still thats a pretty quick fade, what about the noise gate? can you try canceling it?


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Kristofer Dahl
post Apr 26 2015, 09:46 PM
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Phil I saw your take here: https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/guitar_fo...c=54260&hl=

Your sound is much cleaner than Steph's and it will not help for sustain. So as mentioned, the first step is for you to use some kind of booster in the beginning of the chain (so between you guitar and the amp).

Typically Fulltone OCD, Xotic BB preamp, tube screamer etc. Software booster will work as well.

Secondly I see your guitar has lots of pickups, if those pickups are too close to the strings - their magnetic power will completely kill sustain. I adjusted pickup height on my ltd, and all of a sudden sustain was comparable to my les paul.

Beware that when you back off the pickups you get less output, but personally I don't see this a problem since I almost always use a booster pedal in front of the amp.

Let me know if this make sense? (or is Bob back? wink.gif )


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Phil66
post Apr 26 2015, 10:46 PM
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Thanks Kris,
It all makes sense this time biggrin.gif I've tried experimenting with software gain but can't get it right. Next step is to put my Boss ME80 signal chain. When I first heard Steph's tone I thought the input signal was clean and the distortion was from the speaker. This tone chasing is a skill all on its own rolleyes.gif
Cheers
Phil


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