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guybrush
post Jul 20 2007, 04:36 AM
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I everybody, I have a question for you! I will first excuse myself for my english, it's not my first language.

So, my problem is that i'm not able to record my guitar with my computer, without a microphone. I would like to plug my guitar directly in my computer to record myself.

I had try to plug my korg ax3000G in my line-in of my computer, but it doesn't work. ( my program to record is cool edit pro 2.0)

Can you help me ?
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Igorrr
post Jul 20 2007, 07:30 PM
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Hmmm.... actually there exist 325325436543 factors that could be the reason that it is not working...

You are actually saying that when you plug into your sound card via the Mic input you get sound but not when using the Line In?

Did you check in the Mixer (Start -> Programs -> Accessories -> Entertainment -> Volume Control) under Options -> Recording if your line input is select for recording. Most standard sound cards (e.g. AC97) can only record from one source at a time, meaning if you Mic Input is active you line input will be muted (and vice versa).

Hope this helps you
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guybrush
post Jul 22 2007, 12:07 AM
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I get not sound when I using my Mic Input and my Line In.

My volume control are all ok !!

I don't know what is the problem !!
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Saoirse O'Shea
post Jul 22 2007, 05:09 AM
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A couple of possibilities for not getting sound:

1) An electric guitar's output is considerably lower than, for instance, a keyboard synth. Anything that you plug the electric guitar's jack into needs to be a hi-z input (high impedance). If you plug the guitar into a non hi-z input you will get little, if any, sound. If you don't have a hi-z input then you either need to take a line out from an amp, mixing desk or some other external device ie line6 podxt.

If I remember correctly Cooledit/Audition has a test playback file. First check whether or not you can hear this playback through your speakers (if you haven't got it than import any other mp3/wave file). If you can't hear it you need to check your i/o.

If you can hear the test file on playback but not your guitar can you see a wave file created at all when you record the guitar? If you can't see a wave at all then you have an input problem. If you can see a wave but it's low signal strength then you need to increase your gain (cf 1) above). If you can see the wave being generated and the gain is ok but there's no sound then it's an output problem. Possible i/o issues:

2) I think Cooledit/Audition uses WDM drivers rather than MME or ASIO. Make sure that you have enabled and installed the correct drivers in the Cooledit/audition preferences. (Sorry can't point you to where it is as I don't have Cooledit).

3) You might need to set the soundcard you use as a preference device in CoolEdit for i/o.

4) You may also need to enable direct monitoring in Cooledit.

5)To record - you may need to arm the track first to be able to monitor (ie enable record).

Hope this helps you resolve the issue.

Cheers,
Tony


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guybrush
post Jul 28 2007, 05:11 AM
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So, I try a couple of thing...

If I record with my program (Cool Edit Pro), and using a mic near of my amp, it's work! But I don't like it because the sound is not really good.

So I know Cool Edit Pro is working!

But when I plug my guitar into line in or mic input, from my AX3000G korg or my preamp output of my Behringer Europower PMX2000, and I try to record... no sound...

Maybe it's the program... I don't know!

If someone have an idea, please tell me !!
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Sergeant_Ant
post Jul 28 2007, 05:12 AM
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i actually bought a cable from target or walmart to just test out that had a little sound card built in and works great for me, you might want somethin a little better like a pre-amp or somethin... but thats what i use smile.gif


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guybrush
post Jul 28 2007, 05:24 AM
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Maybe If I buy a Line 6 Toneport... ???
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Muris Varajic
post Jul 28 2007, 08:48 AM
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QUOTE (guybrush @ Jul 28 2007, 06:24 AM) *
Maybe If I buy a Line 6 Toneport... ???


It's cool unit for sure,but why don't you try to use software like Cubase or som?
Maybe that'll solve your problem and give you more options as well?
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guybrush
post Jul 29 2007, 05:56 AM
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But, my question is.... Line 6 TonePort UX1, it's a good purchase if a want good recording??
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Andrew Cockburn
post Jul 29 2007, 01:33 PM
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QUOTE (guybrush @ Jul 29 2007, 12:56 AM) *
But, my question is.... Line 6 TonePort UX1, it's a good purchase if a want good recording??


All the line6 products are great for recording (with the exception of the pocket pod) - so pick one in yur price range and you wilkl be set!

Then as Muris said, yoiu need to think of sequencing/recording software. CUbase is a good but expensive option - I used that for a while. Now I am using Reaper which is a lot cheaper ($40 if you want to pay the licensingfee, free otherwise), mostly as good and better in some areas.


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Jul 29 2007, 01:55 PM
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+ for reaper.

If you want to go with a more 'professional' and 'developed' piece though Muris' recomendation of CUbase is, IMO, also +1. (Not saying Reaper isn't properly developed but Cubase has been round the block quite a lot and so many of its teething issues have been worked through. One example - I can slave rewire Melodyne with Cubase but not Reaper (opens ok but...).)

It is possible to get a 'lite' version of Cubase though free as part of a software package if you buy particular soundcards/hardware. A full version of Cubase 4 however is @900 Euros, the slightly less 'all singing all dancing' studio 4 version (limits the number of tracks to 64 I think and also doesn't include all the vsts etc) is much cheaper at @400 Euros. You can almost certainly get a good deal at present on Cubase SX/SL versions 2 or 3 which would allow for a paid upgrade to version 4.

One thing - if you go Cubase, or indeed any of the big commercial recoding sequencers ie SONAR, Sequioia, Protools etc., you should think about how well your pc meets the minimum and the recommended hardware. As an example I use Cubase SX3, freeze tracks routinely and can run out of RAM if I open too many instances of Spectrasonics Atmosphere (as an example) and that is despite having 2G of ram blink.gif . If your focus is just to record yourself and friends playing in real time rather than instrumental composition though this might be much less of an issue.

So before investing think about how and what you want to use the sequencer for.

BTW - reading through your posts again guybrush I still think you have an impedence/level issue. ie the level you are feeding into your pc has not got enough gain for your soundcard. Maybe try to increase the level out from your Korg AX300 or feed it into a HiZ input on your desk/soundcard - not a line input but a specific HiZ unput .



Cheers,
Tony


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Andrew Cockburn
post Jul 29 2007, 02:20 PM
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I looked at Cubase vs Reaper in a lot of detail when I was faced with a costly upgrade to get the newest Cubase.

For what I did I just couldn't justify it, since Reaper does everything I need. Cubase is a more developed program, but the gap is closing day by day (literally as repaer releases a couple of versions a week). For the price it is absolutely unbeatable. I also find it more pleasant to use.

There are a couple of areas in which Cubase is clearly superior - its midi support is far better, and VSTs and VSTis are always tested by their manufactirers with Cubase, never with reaper, so one or 2 plugins don't work.

But, Reaper has a good community and feels a lot like open source software ... I had a problem with one of my plugins and the lead developer worked with me to fix it over an entire sunday, within 24 hours I had a fix. Reaper also has far superior routing options, including real sidechaining. For instance, a lot is made of Cubases new studio section - it allows you to setup monitor mixes for up to 4 musicians and is a cool feature. I was dissapointed that reaper didn't have this until I investigated its routing matrix a little - long story short, in reaper you can also set up as many monitor mixes as you want (not limited to 4) - they didn;t add this as a studio feature specifically, but the way the basic sound engine is designed made this easy to do - its that sort of versatility I love in reaper. A few other highlights:

- Unlimited entries in your effects chain
- You can reorder them at will (I think you can finally do this in cubase 4)
- Unlimited Sends
- Tabbed/Dock interface makes screen management a lot easier
- Track templates for saving and restoring your facourite track setups, VSTs etc (again I think Cubase gets this in v4)
- Tooless interface makes editing a lot more intuitive

If I sound like a convert then its because I am - I just don't think it can be beaten for the price, and in a year it will in all likelehood be better than Cubase - I think the day of the expensive DAW is done, and reaper is making it a commodity, which is great news for guys like us!

Ok, I'll stop evangelising. Truth of the matter is that Reaper or Cubase are more than good enough to lay down a backing track and record some lead. Reaper IS the new kid on the block and has the occasional problem exactly as Tony said, the flip side is that Cubase is very expensive, and not clearly worth the difference in price.

So either way go for it, and get recoring, its a heck of a lot of fun!

BTW Tony, did you try Melodyne Bridge with reaper yet? I had a lot of trouble with that in Cubase, haven't tried it in reaper yet ...

OH, and excellent advice in the PC spec department - you can never have too much of anything. I Have an Athlon 64 4000+ and 4G of ram, and its sometimes still not enough for some of the stuff I do. Sadly Windows XP can only handle up to 3G of RAM per program, which is one reason I will need to shoft to Vista, but not until they get it sorted out ...

This post has been edited by Andrew Cockburn: Jul 29 2007, 02:22 PM


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Jul 29 2007, 04:24 PM
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Hi Andrew (and everyone else),

agree with most, perhaps all your points btw, Reaper/Cubase its arguably a case of horses and courses.

However I came to Cubase a long time ago and so have been up the upgrade path and have a lot of time (and too many projects) invested. Nonetheless I've stuck at SX3 and for me I didn't see the upgrade to 4 as worth the cost. In particular I don't see the scenes as worth it and I don't need yet another sampler or softsynth... (Did I really say that ohmy.gif ?)

I actually think Reaper's patch matrix to be a lot better than Cubase and routinely Reaper works fine on my pc and with my hardware. However some people are still reporting some hardware issues albeit that they get sorted out very quickly (and tbh each iteration of Cubase ends in reported incompatibility issues - its all part and parcel of developing and coding such a complicated program. I have friends involved in coding and beta testing Audacity - so I've some awareness of what an issue it all is blink.gif .) I also find the Reaper community nicer and more helpful than the official Cubase forum.

At present I'm running Reaper (and Plogue Bidle) concurrent with Cubase and Ableton Live. Interestingly enough I find that I'm turning more and more to Reaper and Live to do stuff - starting to find both easier and more intuitive to get around. I am however waiting to see what happens to Reaper come the impending v2 which is one reason why I haven't jumped ship entirely.

About rewire/melodyne bridge. I can't get reaper to properly run rewire either as host or slave. Seems to generate some i/o issue for me and a lockup/crash to desktop: I haven't, as yet, worked out why. Odd bit - that's with the stand alone version of Melodyne, it's sort of ok with the new vst plug but that then goes into a different device error after a few minutes with Reaper. All of this works fine with Live (not tried the vst with Cubase though). Also rewire is fine with Live/Reaper as slave/host and vice versa - only Melodyne.

Melodyne bridge opens the slave ok but no audio -not even a signal showing on my RME card's i/o matrix. Don't think this is a giant killer issue as its almost certainly just a patching/routing one - especially as Bridge makes you manually set the route.

BTW for midi on Reaper I use midiyoke. Also use it in Live for my software sampler (Kontakt) as a connection to some of the more complicated sample articulations. Great program if you haven't got it - software virtual midi patcher.

Last bits - PC wise as Andrew says stick with XP until Vista is sorted and properly implemented. At the mo it's more trouble then it's worth. Also on PCs, if you haven't got lots of RAM you might be able to network several computers (I do but this is not easy and latency becomes an issue) by ethernet/midi/firewire etc and so run one as sequencer, one as sampler and so on... Apart from RAM (and as much as you can get). Other two bits - cooling for silent running and, hard disk size (partition, partition, partition, and size matters wink.gif. I so love multiple SATA. ) and speed (particularly if you get into streaming samples/audio) 7200 rpm hard disc spin and up is the way to go if you can. Note for laptops, many come with a HD of 5400 rpm, try to get a 7200 OR use an external USB2?/Firewire 800 drive to stream.

Cheers,
Tony


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guybrush
post Jul 30 2007, 02:28 AM
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Thanks you guys... you are really great!!!
That was really helpful!

I think I will be ok!!

Oh, Tony, you talk about Ableton Live.
I want to know what do you think (or anyone else) about that program more in detail!!

Thanks you!
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Muris Varajic
post Jul 30 2007, 03:07 AM
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QUOTE (guybrush @ Jul 30 2007, 03:28 AM) *
Thanks you guys... you are really great!!!
That was really helpful!

I think I will be ok!!

Oh, Tony, you talk about Ableton Live.
I want to know what do you think (or anyone else) about that program more in detail!!

Thanks you!


I use Ableton in rewire mode with Cubase and Reason.
It has many features but I'm using it only for audio drum loops.
Awesome for changing bpm without having click in sound.


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Jul 31 2007, 01:36 AM
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Difficult question about Live guybrush.

Upto about 12/18 months ago I would have said that you chose the software according to what you mainly wanted to do. That is sequencer/record instruments = Cubase/Sequoia/Protools/Logic/Sonar; using recorded music files/clips = Live/Acid etc; Video based audio recording/syncing = Premier/Nuendo; and so on. However over the last 18-12 months theres arguably been more of a convergence so that a traditional sequencer can do video work, a loop mangler can record and so on. What to me are now important is the feature set of the software and the workflow.


So what makes Live! v6 good for me - sequencer is more than good enough and the routing is fine. I find the workflow more intuitive for me and so I can get around it more quickly and be more productive. I find the freeze ability really good and so not max out my pc and crash it. I love the ability to drag a music file and be able to warp/maintain or change its tempo so that it fits the overall song I'm working on. Getting loops/clips rythmically synced is a doddle. Manipulating/changing/sound editing recorded loops/clips is easy. I love rewire so that I can synch Live! to Native Instruments Reason: I use Live to record into and then Reason acts as a rack of instruments and effects for beat and sound manipulation in sync with Live!

A lot of this is true of any of the big name sequencers etc (Cubase/Sonar etc) but it's the workflow that makes it for me. I spend far less time routing and more time developing/recording music. I find Live!'s file handling/search far better than Cubase SX3 (though I believe V4 is supposed to have a different file handling routine...)

Downside - Live!6 mixer isn't as sophisticated as Cubase: on the few occasions when I'm dealing with lots of tracks in multitrack (like orchestra score work) I use Cubase still. Free VSTs and VSTIs in Live! are ok but not as varied/good as Cubase. (this isn't a big thing for me as I have enough separate VSTs and VSTIs anyway.) Cubase is still seen as a more developed commercial recording studio piece of software and as such I'm more likely to be able to take a Cubase file in to a studio and find they can open it to work on.

To repeat though I think personally that the key thing is workflow. As such to get an understanding of whether Live! or Cubase or Sonar or whatever is best for you really means that you need to try them first hand. Fortunately you can often get a demo copy of most of the big commercial bits of software and if not GOOD music retailers will demonstrate them to you. At the end of the day all of these are complicated and sophisticated pieces of software with lots of features and so you really need to try them out. What works for me might not for you and so on.

One thing to be very aware of, full versions of the software packages that Muris, Pavel, Andrew and I (and anyone else I've missed - sorry if I have) are not cheap. Live 6!, Cubase 4, are about 700-1000euros; Sonar is a bit cheaper Producer version is about 5-600 euros; Reason is about 4-500 euros and so. Ones like Nuendo/Premier and so are over 1500 euros. Upgrades of the various packages can range from 99 euros to 200 euros. It's all professional, and thus expensive software and so you need to think about how you want to spend your money and make sure its good for you before you commit. If you have never used these sorts of packages before you might well be better of looking first at a cut down/lite version. I'm not meaning to be patronising here but you need to be aware that this sort of software costs - money to buy and time to get to know and learn how to use.

On the cost issue as has been mentioned quite a bit Cuckoo's Reaper is unlimited and cheap shareware. With Reaper you can try out all the features etc at little financial cost: all you use up is your own time getting to know it. As such you might want to download it and try it before/instead of looking towards a commercial package?

Cheers,
Tony


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Andrew Cockburn
post Jul 31 2007, 03:28 AM
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QUOTE (tonymiro @ Jul 30 2007, 08:36 PM) *
On the cost issue as has been mentioned quite a bit Cuckoo's Reaper is unlimited and cheap shareware. With Reaper you can try out all the features etc at little financial cost: all you use up is your own time getting to know it. As such you might want to download it and try it before/instead of looking towards a commercial package?

Cheers,
Tony


Yes, excellent point! (Its Cockos by the way not Cockoo's - I know you knew that but wanted to point out the typo to avoid confusion). The great thing about Reaper is it does pretty much what the others do, so you can figure out your workflow, what kind of things you do a lot of then make a more educated decision (or even stick with Reaper if it does all you want). Reaper is a great way of getting your recording feet wet.


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guybrush
post Aug 1 2007, 12:21 AM
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Thank you !!

I think i have all I wanted to know!
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