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Mertay
post Dec 19 2015, 11:05 PM
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Whoa, that tone is burning! and the playing not so bad either biggrin.gif

The earbender is definitly an aggressive-friendly overdrive, not a lot of overdrives can sound so amp-like without jumping to distortion territory. For example, fulltones OCD is very famous for being aggresive but to my ears when its pushed the character turns to distortion. The earbender however is still amp-like.

And yeah both sides working is a bit extreme, but still usable!! Don't mind the added noise you'll never know when you'll want that smashed sound. Fuzz always reminds me of the peak of an instrumental blues ballad, no song specific but maybe its something I hear in my head that would work with big chords and orchestration.

Fuzz has a giant feel to it, I strongly advise using it for distorted+soulful melodic solos for future GMC recordings. Since you're still developing your techniq and not doing fast scale run stuff (as far as I know), it will help you for melodic impact when needed. For anything else that needs distortion seems the ear bender alone can do alot smile.gif

As for the modes being subtle, its really a guitar or amp (and how the amp is setuped) thing that might make the difference. I mean if we'd used it on someone elses amp+guitar it would sound a lot different. Also it doesn't always have to be obvious, sometimes its the little things that makes the difference.

The tough thing about the setting such a pedal is even when you memorise by ear what each knobs do, they also react to each others settings also. I mean on one setting where the mid knob is lowered might be awesome but when mid knob is increased might not be so good.

But what we can do is since you regularly record for lessons, collab.s etc. most helpful would be sharing your tone (with or without backing track) with me or any member here. Best questions/ideas always comes from real-world usage situations, you seem to already started figuring out the pedal so probably the most helpful think would be is getting into detail for usage.


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Phil66
post Dec 19 2015, 11:48 PM
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Thanks Mertay,
Very informative. I love this pedal and I think its potential is huge. Whatever you want me to record with this pedal just let me know. It's very very versatile and I think you (Mertay) will get some good knowledge from my recordings even though the playing is terrible. rolleyes.gif


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Mertay
post Dec 20 2015, 12:00 AM
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eheh cool smile.gif yeah and you should feel free to share experiments here too when you feel like recording smile.gif

It really takes time, I have my friends jd9 next to me now and it took me 2 full days (with lots of amp software) to sqeeze it enough to feel I have total control over it. And that pedal only has 4 knobs, if I had something like a hotbird probably friends would start knocking at my door to check if I'm still alive biggrin.gif


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Phil66
post Dec 20 2015, 12:21 AM
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laugh.gif Mertay,
I think even though it's not cheap, this pedal is awesome, it does the job of at least three other pedals.
Let me know what settings you would like and I'll turn the knobs for you wink.gif
Cheers

This post has been edited by Phil66: Dec 20 2015, 10:15 AM


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Phil66
post Dec 20 2015, 02:05 PM
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Hello,

I've done a quick reference test for you. I've recorded some noodling on the fuzz channel, no compression, fuzz at 12 o clock, TOP at 11 o clock.
The first is on the Blackstar with fairly clean setting and the second is on a Vox Lil Night Train with similar settings but I used the "thick" channel which cuts out the EQ. No reverb on the amp so I didn't add any afterwards. Played on a Mexican HSH Strat on single coil bridge setting.

I've also found a neat little trick. I don't like recording to a backing track using my amp as the mic'd sound comes through the speakers and it bugs me. I had my GT-001 in tuner mode with output muted, this is great, it still allows the mic'd sound to be recorded but it doesn't come through the monitors smile.gif I couldn't find a way to do this in Reaper so it's a great discovery, maybe some other can try with their interfaces wink.gif

First of each pair is without the Hotbird so you can hear the different way the Hotbird interacts with the amp.

https://soundcloud.com/gmcphil-1/random-sunday-noodling-blackstar-no-pedal

https://soundcloud.com/gmcphil-1/random-sunday-noodling-blackstar



https://soundcloud.com/gmcphil-1/random-sunday-noodling-vox-no-pedal

https://soundcloud.com/gmcphil-1/random-sunday-noodling-vox


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Mertay
post Dec 20 2015, 03:01 PM
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Yeah when there is a second sound source in the room either you must divide the backing and guitar (like you did) or use isolating headphones and listen everything from computer. Good that you maganed to mute reaper, the headphone trick woks well but isn't comfortable on the long run and the better isolating headphones can be expensive.

The tones you get feels familiar to me that I can't put my finger on but this is a strong indication for me as whats going on is good smile.gif still though the blackstar sounds a bit bright to me and could use a little bottom end (the vox sounded more balanced). How does the blackstar sound in the room compared to mic.ed?



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Phil66
post Dec 20 2015, 04:02 PM
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Thanks Mertay,
I'll have a listen later at the recorded and room difference.
For some reason the "Vox no pedal" SoundCloud hasn't embedded but the link is there, did you listen to it?
I think it's strange that setting the GT-001 to mute still allows the guitar to be recorded. If you are using the GT-001 as effects it doesn't send a signal to Reaper. I'm not complaining but it seems odd. It has actually put me off getting a new interface in case I can't do that because I don't really like headphones.
When you say " more balanced " in what way do you mean "balanced"?
Thank you for your continued help Mertay smile.gif


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Mertay
post Dec 20 2015, 04:30 PM
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I'll check into reaper later to see what buttons needed to be pushed, maybe inserting a plug-in (like an eq but only using it to decrease volume) that mutes the sound can work?

Yeah I did notice the link, as for balance its a frequency thing (both lows and highs can be heard) but instead of going technical ( biggrin.gif ) lets say this reflects to how individual strings can be heard as you strum. Like, I can hear the low E string much better on the vox compared to the blackstar but the vox isn't muddy.


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Phil66
post Dec 20 2015, 08:41 PM
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I've just listened to the Blackstar, it's not far off the same in the room as it is mic'ed, I think it is a little more trebly through the mic. My ears and tone memory aren't that good yet, I tend to forget how it sounded pretty much right away unsure.gif biggrin.gif Pluse I'm hearing it through two 4x8 cabs in the room and only some Tannoy 402 like THIS from the PC.

What I'm going to do next, is actually play something I can remember rather than noodling and then play it back through the monitors while I play it on the amp just to see how close it is. At least if it is close to the sound of the source we have a good reference point.

FYI, the thick channel on the Vox is less sparkly than the bright channel by quite a bit.

Anyway, got to practice now, I'm falling way behind with my lessons for Gab but at least this isn't a waste of time, it's good stuff to learn and I enjoy going through the amp more than the PC smile.gif

We haven't even looked at the "drive" knob on the PreSonus yet blink.gif

Thank you Mertay, I really appreciate your help.


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Mertay
post Dec 20 2015, 08:58 PM
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hehee yeah listening from one source to another can need some getting used to smile.gif

Sometimes cause of the room reflections a sound source can sound more bassy, thats why its better to use headphones for quick referencing how the mic. is picking the sound. Even though the blackstar has no eq and if mic. placement won't be enough don't worry worst case I'll prepare a plug-in eq preset for you and it should solve any balance issue's.

Yeah I have a feeling you might like that drive knob on the presonus with subtle setting, I use something like that on software which is barely noticeable but has a nice feel thing going on. No need to rush though things are already sounding better and better as you share smile.gif


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Phil66
post Dec 20 2015, 09:06 PM
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I'm starting to really like the Earbender now smile.gif I'm thinking, I might try to put the recorded sound back through the Cab, I think the cables for the monitors are the same type. This might tell me more about the reproduction in real terms. I guess it's hard anyway because everyone's monitors are different rolleyes.gif
There is some buzzing on this track, I'm not sure if it is the cone or something else but I've put it here anyway smile.gif

https://soundcloud.com/gmcphil-1/doo-doo-da-da-da-dah-dah

This post has been edited by Phil66: Dec 20 2015, 09:12 PM


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Mertay
post Dec 20 2015, 10:38 PM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Dec 20 2015, 08:06 PM) *
I'm starting to really like the Earbender now smile.gif I'm thinking, I might try to put the recorded sound back through the Cab, I think the cables for the monitors are the same type. This might tell me more about the reproduction in real terms. I guess it's hard anyway because everyone's monitors are different rolleyes.gif
There is some buzzing on this track, I'm not sure if it is the cone or something else but I've put it here anyway smile.gif

https://soundcloud.com/gmcphil-1/doo-doo-da-da-da-dah-dah


That won't work smile.gif cause cab.s though are speakers are very colored speakers and an important aspect of amp tone. It will be like you'll re-color the sound even more hwere speakers/headphones are flat/neutral.

Which amp is that?


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Phil66
post Dec 21 2015, 08:09 AM
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Thanks Mertay,
That's the Blackstar wink.gif
Cheers


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Mertay
post Dec 21 2015, 10:37 AM
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QUOTE (Phil66 @ Dec 21 2015, 07:09 AM) *
Thanks Mertay,
That's the Blackstar wink.gif
Cheers


It sounds more balanced, maybe its the tone knob on the pedal affecting it. When you have the time, why not share short recordings of tone all right-middle-all left settings?

With my pedals the tone knob is always the least touched. I adjust it to my amp then use eq's on amp instead of the pedals tone knob, maybe we need to find a sweetspot for it.


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Todd Simpson
post Dec 21 2015, 07:49 PM
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Keep in mind that it's a 4x8 and not a 4x12 so it's going to struggle a bit on bass, especially when close mic'ed. if you like the "room tone" you can always add a "room mic" as the room itself may be creating bass reflections that are not present directly in front of the cone. This is common trick in recording studios but a bit tougher at home as it requires two mics (one on the cone and one in the room) and at least two channels of input on your audio interface.

Todd

QUOTE (Phil66 @ Dec 21 2015, 03:09 AM) *
Thanks Mertay,
That's the Blackstar wink.gif
Cheers



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Mertay
post Dec 21 2015, 09:09 PM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Dec 21 2015, 06:49 PM) *
Keep in mind that it's a 4x8 and not a 4x12...


Good point, adding bass is hard and probably not comfortable for Phil at this point (worst case I'll make an eq preset) so to balance things tameing the high freq.s makes the most sense for now.


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Phil66
post Dec 21 2015, 10:11 PM
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Thank you gentlemen smile.gif

If you want to hear someone who can play go through the same head and cab as me you can watch this, I don't know what the Anderton's boys had been drinking beforehand but it may give you a better idea of the cab and head capabilities. I know YouTube sound isn't the best for reference but it may help relatively smile.gif

Cheers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VSDsUw4Sc4


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcMT67VFy1Y



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Mertay
post Dec 21 2015, 11:26 PM
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Cool it did help smile.gif

When mixing guitars on albums its quite common to cut the lowest freq.s not only to open room for kick, bass guitar to fit but also musically get rid of unwanted rumble. These cab.s seem to do this for you which is good...

They also have highest highs which is cool so say a clean fender can sound sparkly or pinch harmonics on distortion can be noticed, but in return the mian thing to be careful is to keep it still warm sounding.

My guess is when mic.ed you don't have to worry much about adding bass from the amp eq as the cab.s character will balance it easily but you have to be careful to keep the highs warm enough.

With the pedal the earbenders "top" and the afterburners "tone" is your friend for this. After you setup the amp clean (from clean or drive channel...simply your desired cleanest sound), arrange the drive amounths from pedal then decrease their highs to get a fuller sound.

As you decrease highs always adjust the output as the more you warmup the sound a little more you'll have to increase the pedals output. Give it a try when you're avalible smile.gif

This post has been edited by Mertay: Dec 21 2015, 11:31 PM


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Todd Simpson
post Dec 22 2015, 07:26 AM
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Well said smile.gif You can also push the mic out from the center of the cone and angle it toward the edge of the speaker and it will pickup more bass. You will lose some definition and some mid, but it will cheat the bass up. Also, the louder you can push it, the more chance you have of getting everything out of the speakers.

I realize this is tough as it can get really loud and make everyone angry including people you live with smile.gif But recording small speakers at low volume, you will have to cheat a bit (e.g. using a room mic, angle the close mic towward the endge of the speaker, etc. ) in order to get the "room sound" recorded smile.gif

Without buying new gear, that's what I'd suggest smile.gif

Speaking of gear, that head will easily push a real cab, e.g a 2x12 or 4x12 that will have wads more bass and sound more like a full sized rig. The 4x8 stack is more of a practice amp than a recording amp. so a cab swap may fix what is wrong in one change. smile.gif

Todd

QUOTE (Mertay @ Dec 21 2015, 06:26 PM) *
Cool it did help smile.gif

When mixing guitars on albums its quite common to cut the lowest freq.s not only to open room for kick, bass guitar to fit but also musically get rid of unwanted rumble. These cab.s seem to do this for you which is good...

They also have highest highs which is cool so say a clean fender can sound sparkly or pinch harmonics on distortion can be noticed, but in return the mian thing to be careful is to keep it still warm sounding.

My guess is when mic.ed you don't have to worry much about adding bass from the amp eq as the cab.s character will balance it easily but you have to be careful to keep the highs warm enough.

With the pedal the earbenders "top" and the afterburners "tone" is your friend for this. After you setup the amp clean (from clean or drive channel...simply your desired cleanest sound), arrange the drive amounths from pedal then decrease their highs to get a fuller sound.

As you decrease highs always adjust the output as the more you warmup the sound a little more you'll have to increase the pedals output. Give it a try when you're avalible smile.gif



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Phil66
post Dec 22 2015, 11:57 AM
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Thank you gentlemen,

This is all very interesting stuff smile.gif I find this topic enthralling smile.gif

I think a 4x12 would be too big in my room (see below) and ££££s, and my OCD won't allow the non-square cab of a 2x12 rolleyes.gif but I have been thinking, as you're only mic'ing one cone, would a 1x12 be ok? I could swap one 4x8 for a 1x12 (I think they would be about the same size) and then mic that up.

What do you reckon?

Cheers

Phil





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